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The Three 1280x800 LED Clones

66K views 428 replies 58 participants last post by  DLPProjectorfan 
#1 ·
It appears that coming August/September we'll be able to get three clones of the same native 1280x800 "Pico" LED projector spec'ed at 500 lumens : the Optoma ML-500, the Viewsonic PLED-W500 and the Acer K330.

From the pictures i've seen, the Optoma and the Viewsonic have the same inputs/outputs - detachable AC power cord, HDMI, USB, Mini USB, VGA, Composite Video, S-Video, A/V IN, Audio Out - with the control buttons located on top of case to its left (as seen from behind) and offering different designs; Aesthetically speaking, i thought the design of the control buttons on the Viewsonic PLED-W500 looked better than the "diagonal" look of the same set of controls on the Optoma ML-500 and both cases look shiny black.

On the lookalike Acer K330 the S-Video Input has been taken away and the same set of controls described above has been moved toward the center rear of the case (as seen from behind), displaying a smaller rectangular design look of "silver-metal buttons control station" completely surrounded by combination of glossy/flat black case, giving it a much nicer look, i thought.

Interesting enough, Acer claims a contrast ratio of 5.000:1 while the other two manufacturers state 2.000:1 for their products, so i think that's hyperbole from Acer.

The Optoma msrp is $700 while the Viewsonic and Acer appear to be $650.

The Acer is supposed to be available in August and the other two in September.
 
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#228 ·
blee0120 >>> Can't wait to read your comments on the Optoma ML500 vs. JVC RS40, specifically for onscreen brightness, colors, overall contrast and whether or not that "wow" effect would apply here.

As soon as you have the ML500 all set up properly, could you also give us your impressions of its ability to properly scale native HD 720P content, if there is any noticeable impact on video images that is detectable by your eyes from the use of a "diamond-shaped" pixel structure, the unit's thermal condition and how it feels to the human touch, etc ? Thanks a lot...

JackB >>> I would venture to say that if you mate any of these pjs, including the LG HW300T, to a 92" diagonal 2.8 gain HP screen in a darkened room you will be very satisfied with the results; I'd imagine you would be surprised by the amount of onscreen brightness, satisfied with native contrast and shocked by those LED colors and their amazing gamut, even if those colors are considered oversaturated by current standards; My take on these LED colors is : if images displaying at least two "shades" of human skin appear correct to my eyesight then i don't really care if the rest of the image is still technically described as oversaturated; I gladly take that deep/deep color gamut any time.

The reason i've been harping on the LG HW300T is because at least it offers almost complete CMS and full grey-scale tracking adjustments, which the other pjs do not, however the ACER K330 offers almost three times the lumen output, excellent ANSI contrast, very good FO/FO contrast and, according to the same site, 100% NTSC color saturation.

Based on test reports i read and the fact that i've owned two inexpensive pjs that use these LED chipsets, uncalibrated grey-scale need only minor cuts by using standard color saturation controls while color "points" on a NTSC chart, although being oversaturated, are located within specs, meaning they do not veer noticeably and visibly toward cyan, magenta and yellow "secondary color points".
 
#229 ·
"The reason i've been harping on the LG HW300T is because at least it offers almost complete CMS and full grey-scale tracking adjustments, which the other pjs do not, however the ACER K330 offers almost three times the lumen output, excellent ANSI contrast, very good FO/FO contrast and, according to the same site, 100% NTSC color saturation"

Too bad we can't get at least the LG and one of the clones in the same room side-by-side to see just how much difference there is in brightness. One thing we all have learned is that you can't trust the mfg's claims. Also, is it not true that the same thing is so with contrast? Can a CMS affect contrast? If so again, then the LG may end up having the best contrast by a significant margin.
"uncalibrated grey-scale need only minor cuts by using standard color saturation controls while color "points" on a NTSC chart, although being oversaturated, are located within specs, meaning they do not veer noticeably and visibly toward cyan, magenta and yellow "secondary color points"."


Are you saying here that on the non-CMS clone you can adjust the saturation and hue to get a very close to calibrated color presentation for movies? That would be good.
 
#230 ·
I'd imagine that FULL CMS with controls for saturation, hue and brightness could have some effect on overall contrast level but these LG pjs don't have the option for CMS brightness adjustment which would have the most impact on contrast.

My experience with the LG HX300G/CMS/calibration blu-ray disc has been that the pj only needed very/very small cuts on red/blue CMS to bring it inline, but i wasn't using any calibration equipment.
 
#231 ·
Guess what, guys ? We can now add a fourth clone to this list, the NEC L50W LED projector, 500 lumens, 1280x800 HD Pico chip, yada, yada, yada...!

However, ZOL.com has tested one unit, describing it as prototype although the pj has already its own product video at Youtube, and the test results were rather encouraging.

Maximum Brightness : 332 lumens

ANSI Brightness : 312 lumens

ANSI Contrast : 218:1

FO/FO Contrast : 2.990:1

I added these figures to the comparison table on page 4 of this thread and i am including some pics of the unit; Please note the very stylish sliding lens cover and that tiny remote control which unfortunately seem to use wristwatch cell batteries.




 
#232 ·
#235 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by eat meat /forum/post/20886297


because it has a built in speaker,most using it for ht use will out put bluray to a/v receiver.

Maybe, but I doubt the built-in speaker is very usable so it would still be nice to have

Quote:
Originally Posted by eat meat /forum/post/20886297


I would rather have the s vid for a cheap tuner.

I'd rather have the audio out, but I don't see why it can't have both. At least it's not the NEC, which appears to have neither.
 
#237 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raine0 /forum/post/20893295


Can't read the review cuz at work. MCaugusto, generally speaking with the numbers and review, how does the NEC compare to the Acer?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The NEC L50W turned out to have a best-in-class Full-ON/Full-Off contrast ratio of 2.990:1 versus the ACER K330 at 2.291:1, however ANSI contrast ratio was lower, 218:1 vs. 276:1.

ANSI brightness was 312 lumens for the NEC and 294 for the ACER and all other specs for color/brightness + center/corner uniformity were comparable; NTSC color saturation for the NEC was 105.0% and 99.0% for the ACER, although the reviewer pointed out that R/G/B colors on the NEC were closer to specs.

One thing that caught my eyes was the fact that the NEC appears to run hotter than the other pjs with its maximum air exhaust port temperature of almost 70 degrees Celsius vs. 62 degrees for the ACER but interesting enough, from the thermal testing picture posted, the highest temperature on the Viewsonic W500 was located on the port right next to the lens whereas on the NEC it was located on the other air vent exhaust port located on the left side of pj, away from lens !

Unfortunately the review for the ACER K330 was deleted from the ZOL.com site (?!) and i could not check out the location of its port with highest temperature.

I am rather surprised seeing the amount of variance in FO/FO contrast ratio numbers between these four clones with the NEC apparently having twice the contrast ratio of the Viewsonic W500.

Hmm, again, decisions, decisions, decisions...

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Marcos
 
#239 ·
Thx MCaugusto for the informative reading.


The review was funny translated through google. Especially when it gets to show Twilight, mentioning "For the pale guy, L50W + that there is no difficulty, for the muscular tough guy, L50W + can be left in peace."



Anyways, question goes again... does this beat the Acer?
 
#241 ·
Manamb >>> How exactly did you arrive to the conclusion that according to those numbers the NEC comes second to the Acer for HT applications ?

The NEC has higher FO/FO contrast and ANSI lumen output, whereas the Acer has higher ANSI contrast; Colors from both pjs should look similar onscreen, however the reviewer did point out the excellence of colors from the NEC.

From my point of view, the NEC slightly edges out the Acer pj performancewise, keeping in mind the fact that it appears to run somewhat hotter than the Acer and has a msrp of $800 vs. $700.

BTW guys, i downloaded the NEC L50W product sheet from the company's website and when i noticed the spec for "contrast ratio 2.500:1" i had to smirk and think how refreshing, for a change, to see a spec that is actually too conservative according to an external test reporting of the product ?
 
#245 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by MCaugusto /forum/post/20896818


Manamb >>> How exactly did you arrive to the conclusion that according to those numbers the NEC comes second to the Acer for HT applications ?

The NEC has higher FO/FO contrast and ANSI lumen output, whereas the Acer has higher ANSI contrast; Colors from both pjs should look similar onscreen, however the reviewer did point out the excellence of colors from the NEC.

From my point of view, the NEC slightly edges out the Acer pj performancewise, keeping in mind the fact that it appears to run somewhat hotter than the Acer and has a msrp of $800 vs. $700.

BTW guys, i downloaded the NEC L50W product sheet from the company's website and when i noticed the spec for "contrast ratio 2.500:1" i had to smirk and think how refreshing, for a change, to see a spec that is actually too conservative according to an external test reporting of the product ?

Well, IMHO between brightness, color uniformity and saturation figures it could be either the Acer or the NEC, even with the big step up on the FOFO for the NEC, I believe that the brightness, ansi contrast and operation temperature that "could" translate into Fan noise are important characteristics for an HT setup that tips the scale towards the Acer.
 
#247 ·
I believe this will be decide until we get our hands on them, being everything so close it is very difficult to decide only based on these figures which one would be the best for our individual needs and preferences. I guess is still anybody's game. Regardless, thank you for gathering all this valuable information.
 
#249 ·
Optoma ML500 already being sold from 6 sellers and in stock for 650$

http://www.amazon.com/Optomas-ML500-...4988539&sr=8-1


The 29DB ACER K330 and 38DB ML500 is enough to make me wait for the Acer

Different in noise level is huge imo


in case you guys didn't know each extra 10db~ is equal to "twice as loud" of the previous DB, so in short ML500 is almost about twice as loud as the acer k330


Some people already bought the ML500 so I'm waiting for their opinions about the ML500 Noise and image quality
 
#250 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by seph22 /forum/post/20898288


Optoma ML500 already being sold from 6 sellers and in stock for 650$

http://www.amazon.com/Optomas-ML500-...4988539&sr=8-1


The 29DB ACER K330 and 38DB ML500 is enough to make me wait for the Acer

Different in noise level is huge imo


in case you guys didn't know each extra 10db~ is equal to "twice as loud" of the previous DB, so in short ML500 is almost about twice as loud as the acer k330


Some people already bought the ML500 so I'm waiting for their opinions about the ML500 Noise and image quality

Are those 38dB of the ML500 in Brigth or Eco mode? becasue the Acer in Bright mode is 35 dB.
 
#251 ·
It looks like the difference between the Acer and the NEC is pretty marginal as far as picture is concerned. If that's the case, I won't bother waiting and paying the extra and I will proceed with the Acer. I think the unit looks better as well so far.
Don't like the business look of the NEC.


Things I'm looking out for and are deal breakers with the Acer, is the noise factor and if there's any start up focus issues ala Qumi.
 
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