Dish DTVPal / Echostar TR40 digital to analog converter - Page 24

No, I meant the captions and the text on the menus, not anything that was overlayed on them afterwards by Scott or the site.

They don't seem anywhere near as blurry as the PQ.

Are we looking at the same images? It all looks bad.

I can assure you, the PQ won't look anything like those images when connected to a TV.

'Course, when he says it looks great he's looking at it on a small, 19" computer screen.

And the pictures were taken from that, too.

yes, that caught my eye when I scanned the review...something I've sometimes wanted in other contexts...

I wonder if it means they end up in a different order in the EPG, since that was why I wanted to rename them (actually renumber...it was a cable box thing at my fathers...why have all those worthless channels in the guide, which can be avoided by renumbering so your favorites are at the top OR - as it is in the TV Guide displays - where you can put things in any order you want anyway!)

That caught my eye as well. I doubt that it will allow you to reorder channels. My assumption is that it will allow you to change the text associated with the channel from something like KDVR-DT to something like FOX.

Since there was so much interest in my original post, I had a DTVPal unit shipped here and filmed the unboxing and setup this AM. If I sound a little sluggish, it's because I did this unrehearsed and right after I woke up but before my Starbucks. The guide and features look pretty good for $20 (assuming the final price is $60, which I don't know). As you'll see from the videos I'm not quite sure what the guide data situation is - there's an option to toggle it, but I'm not clear what it gives me (and I haven't looked at the manual yet). The video quality looked decent stretched on my 16:9 32" HDTV, though I wasn't able to immediately tune NBC (4) - I'll futz with the antenna and unit later to see if my results improve.

Unboxing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJU4N_QpGaY

Setup, Part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CZftKSCSPE

Setup, Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qUqIzPj1r-U

If you have questions or requests, leave comments on the YouTube videos or on my blog here - I doubt I'll be able to keep up with this thread.

Yep, you're correct - I've just confirmed it.

They would say that, wouldn't they? It sounds like now that Dish no longer plans to compete on price, they're going to compete by trashing the competitors. Just a guess, but someone named "satellite guys" is probably not going to give unbiased "reviews"

Dave, if that's real frequency channel 4 you are looking for, you need your rabbit ears fully extended and horizontal (Terk's instructions for low VHF). If it's virtual frequency channel 4 you want, based on how other boxes do it, I'm guessing they are looking for you to enter real frequency in the "add channel" menu. But hey, you're the guy with the instruction manual...

davezatz,

Watched the Youtube videos... I assume from your first video that you already have an HDTV tuner in the "test" TV? If so it'd be nice to see how the two tuners compare (DTVPal vs HDTV). Hopefully it can pull NBC (if you haven't already found it) and narrow any Antenna vs Tuner related concerns.

Not having much experience with a Dish UI. A bit of Manual reading would seem helpful... but your "quick" setup wouldn't be bad for most users.

Compared to the converters I've seen in action, I was impressed with the DTVPal's "quick" tuning. I was expecting a small lag when changing channels. I also was impressed with the Guide and Search. Reminds me of my DVR service which would give me up to 14 days of info. but wouldn't populate the first 24 hours nearly as fast as the Pal seemed to do.

Any product that needs a manual is flawed. I'm finally getting my Starbucks now. When I get home I'll try extending the rabbit ears horizontally and see what happens. I suppose I'll have to explore the manual at some point, although it looks like the TV Guide stuff has already been somewhat explained earlier in this thread. I did play a bit with the CC and the various levels of zoom/aspect ratio - maybe I'll shoot another video. Any other requests?

This TV doesn't have an ATSC tuner, though my living room plasma does. I'll check it for comparison. Also, that TiVo Series3 has an ATSC tuner - but configuring it might be a pain. I'll try the antenna suggestions above to see if it resolves the issue.

I agree changing/tuning channels was quick - I didn't even stop to think about it until now.

I was amused that I needed a manual for rabbit ears. In the good old days we just moved them around until things got better. The Terk is horribly unstable with rabbit ears extended. Mine crashed to the floor at least once. I will be glad when my RF Ch. 4 goes away in Feb.

davezatz can you comment if it looks like it has any heat problems.
Does the box seem like it is hot to touch.

It looks like there is no ventilation holes for the box.

Also, THANK YOU for doing all of this.

The box is warm, but I wouldn't call it hot and it hasn't concerned me. It's certainly cooler than some of my other devices.

How much interest would it take to have a DTVPal unit shipped HERE?

Is the DTVPal only available online? What stores are selling it other than online sites?

It's a marketing snooze zone. DishNetwork's official site for the product, dtvpal.com, is remarkably silent about who will be selling them. I don't know of any online store selling them with coupon as of today. Freedtvshop has sold out the preorder.

Satellite Guys say June 19th is the release date. Online stores say in stock week of 6/16. dtvpal says "late June."

NBC (KNTV-DT) is not actually at channel 4. On analog, it used to be ch4 when the NBC affiliate was KRON, but that changed when KRON got greedy and NBC switched to KNTV.

It is at ch12 and is PSIP virtual channel mapped to ch11. You would use ch12 to tune it and once it came in, the PSIP would map it to ch11 for user interactions.

The likely reason it doesn't come in that well is because it is in VHF channel range and it is coming from San Jose transmitter (Mt. San Bruno) while the bulk of the other channels are coming from South San Francisco (Sutro Tower). Many people need to use VHF/UHF antenna instead of just UHF antenna and also have to align the VHF antenna to the south instead of north for the UHF antenna.

I'm sure the external power supply (wall wart) allows the box to run cooler than some of the competitors.

yes, NBC for the SF area is channel 11 KTVN. But its transmitter on San Bruno Mountain is South San Francisco, and Sutro Tower is in San Francisco itself...

KTVN's transmitter was originally much further south, now it's not all that far from Sutro Tower, where the bulk of the Bay area transmitters are.

(KRON, channel 4, is now a somewhat marginal station, still coming from Sutro...)

I'm on the east coast, but the scenario you're describing is probably similar to what's going on here in the DC region.

FYI I did manage to tune NBC both with the bulky Terk and with a smaller antenna.

I posted two more videos, covering that plus CC and aspect ratio:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pE1p2HeD8rQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wrejps3bUdI

WRC NBC is channel 48 mapped to channel 4. Maybe the dtvpal will recognize it on channel 48.

Edit: Oops, look like we crossposted.

In an exercise in complete and total futility I called a representative sample (generally, one of each kind) of the officially blessed retailers that turn up in a 50-mile search. Even WalMart, RiteAid, and Kmart which went as one would expect (although Kmart was out to lunch so I guess I could call again). I had a little hope for the Sears because it's an independent franchisee. And 3 RadioShacks because they may or may not also be independent.

How do they expect to sell any if no one sells them?

I'm very disappointed to hear this...may have to order one online next week or whenever it finally becomes available, though I HATE to order new electronics that way because returns are a nightmare, especially in the context of something like this coupon program...

(the only consolation is we're not talking about big bucks in any case...more of a problem with $500 items...)

These days stores don't know what their Buyers order until it shows up at the store. If I had to look locally, I would start with DishNetwork stores, next Wednesday. I bet "Wilmington, NC - first in digital" will see them locally next week.

right about what the individual stores know

what is a DishNetwork store? you don't mean, like, Radio Shack?

In January E* was talking about distributing through Sling and Dish stores. If E* had used Sling, there would be a lot of CECB certified stores already. On the Dish side, RS and Sears are the only recognizable Dish stores in my area with CECB status. If my preorder falls through, it's that or call headquarters and bug them for names. What is it with these companies, that they don't have marketing, PR, press releases, or a reporter contact.

maybe something public will happen next week

Woops, I got brainwashed into associating sling with Foster City.

Anyway, you can go on antennaweb.org and enter your zip code.

http://www.antennaweb.org/aw/Address.aspx

It will give you a list of all the channels with their physical and display/virtual channel #s.

For analog TV, the physical channel # is the same as the display #.

For digital TV, there is a physical channel # and then there is usually meta-data called PSIP, a portion of which provides a "display/virtual" channel #. If the PSIP is missing, then the virtual channel # is the same as the physical channel #.

For many UI you can use the physical or the virtual channel # to tune, so if NBC is normally display/virtual 4-1 but the physical channel is UHF 48, you could enter 4 or 48 and it should go to the same channel.

It looks like on the setup screens DTVPal only takes the physical channel #s and doesn't give an indication (on those screens) of what the virtual channel #s are.

On the antennaweb.org site, the "channel" is the display/virtual channel # and the "frequency assignment" is the physical channel #. It also indicates UHF or VHF in the first column so you can see which type of antenna will be more appropriate. If you are in an area with strong signal with little multipath (not too many tall buildings or mountains) most reasonable antennas will pick up all the UHF and VHF channels.\\

Big thanks for taking the time to run through the product and giving us a taste.