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MSI 7411 Motherboard Sneak Peek (share your thoughts!) - Page 114

post #3391 of 3490
Almost made it to two years!

The subwoofer on my idle Live Diva HTPC starting making a fluttering noise. I rebooted it, and instead of the three thumps I got a whole lot of thumping. Then the subwoofer started fluttering again once the desktop appeared but the rest of the audio was OK. I rebooted again and all audio was completely out, but the PC booted up OK. The amp card no longer appeared in the audio control panel.

I took it apart and the inside of the case smelled a little burnt. The D50 diode looked suspect. My system runs pretty cool--I have a 65 W 905e and two Seagate Green hard disks. So maybe that's why it lasted this long?

The HTPC still boots OK. Once I removed the amp card, I was able to install the RealTek audio drivers and put sound out the HDMI to the speakers in my TV.

I am debating getting a receiver in the hopes that the SPDIF still works (should it?), since there is no other motherboard that I can replace this one with that has an onboard amp.

My other alternative is to RMA it to MSI. Apparently there is a 3 year warranty, but it looks like the serial number is on the underside of the board. Grrr.. I still have till October no matter what I guess.

Is MSI still giving people replacement boards on RMA? Nobody seems to have the Live Diva in stock any more. I'd rather have a refund once I get the receiver.
post #3392 of 3490
My first board hasn't had a problem. My second and third boards were both returned for repair; one of them twice. Every time it was a MOSFET on the board.

It is too bad a company hasn't pursued audio amplifier technology in a PC. A small form factor PC with a E350, DAE-3 and integrated amplifier would have an attractive price point. And a reliable motherboard that does not limit the choice of GPUs would allow gamers to benefit from the technology.

To RMA board(s), use your "local" MSI web site and fill out the RMA form. If this is not the first time you are requesting an RMA for the board be sure to complete the information to indicate this on the form. You should do this because a repeat request on a board for a RMA seems to be factored into MSI's authorization process. You will receive an email with an RMA or that an RMA will not be issued.

I have not been refused a RMA.
post #3393 of 3490
Hello,

I sold my DIVA with the amp card and the recipient just told me he can't get any video to display on his TV. The owner said that the system appears to be powering up fine, but with no video. All I know so far is that he used a 55" LCD TV as the display (Vizio E552VL).

This DIVA has worked without fail (both audio and video) for the entire time I've owned it (~ 3 years) with very little use over the period. It displayed video properly on my 58" 1080P plasma and 21" LCD 1080P monitor just prior to packing. Though anything is possible, I would think it unlikely that it failed in route to the owner.

What I've asked him to do so far:
  • Confirm that his TV can accept the video the DIVA was configured to send: 1080P, 60hz via HDMI. (It can-this was before I know the make and model of his TV)
  • Check for proper input on his TV (he said he did this)
  • Swap HDMI cable (he said he swapped it to another source and it works fine)
  • Try VGA and Component cables (he tried this-still no video)
  • Try and at least get in to BIOS and see video (he said he tried this and there is no evidence of POST)
  • Try another 1080p display (he said he only has a 720P and will try it)

The only other thing I thought of that I did not suggest yet is plugging in a keyboard if he did not do so. Will a DIVA boot and show video without a keyboard?

Can you think of anything else he should try?

Thanks.
post #3394 of 3490
Not showing video is a common problem with the MB. Did you ask him to connect to a regular monitor via VGA?
post #3395 of 3490
Yes. He said he tried VGA with a monitor and got no video. He's going to have a local (to him) PC tech take a look at it tomorrow. As you might imagine I'll be very interested in the diagnosis.
post #3396 of 3490
If he has added a video card to his configuration it is possible that the BIOS is set to boot using the on-board video.

He should try using the motherboard HDMI connection. If this doesn't work he should remove any video cards and reset the BIOS using the instructions in the manual. He should also respect the warning in the manual regarding resetting the BIOS.

After resetting the BIOS he should test the board without any video board installed. Change primary display setting in the BIOS before adding a video card.

Also, even if he has not been using an added video card he should reset the BIOS and try the TV afterwards.

I am assuming because he has an amplified card he is not using an AVR.

Hope this helps.
post #3397 of 3490
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonTHB View Post

It is too bad a company hasn't pursued audio amplifier technology in a PC. A small form factor PC with a E350, DAE-3 and integrated amplifier would have an attractive price point. And a reliable motherboard that does not limit the choice of GPUs would allow gamers to benefit from the technology.

Yeah it's a tragedy of epic proportions...
It's just madness to me that no one will run with this tech.
I figured Asus would be the perfect torch bearer.
What with their Xonar range of soundcards nowadays.
post #3398 of 3490
I built my DIVA system in December of 2008. After 16 months, the board died. I RMA'd it and the "repaired" board lasted about 60 seconds before dying. I RMA'd again and received a different board with a bad video section. I worked around that problem by adding a Sapphire Radeon HD4550 PCI-Express Video Card. This system has been running for about a year but was crashing about once a week. Surprisingly, the crashes have been becoming less frequent lately. A while back, I built a replacement system using a GIGABYTE GA-MA785GM-US2H motherboard anticipating that the DIVA system would die. Since the GIGABYTE system will require a separate amp, I'm finding the crippled DIVA system preferable. Like others, I have a hard time understanding why some other company doesn't run with this technology. I'd buy it!
post #3399 of 3490
Asus already picked their audio tech. I had thought it more likely that company like DFI when it was producing consumer motherboards or even Gigabyte would be more likely to pick up the technology. I think the poor quality reputation that MSI generated spread to the technology itself. This essentially multiplied the commercial risk companies perceived in producing boards using the D2 Audio technology.

We still don't know for sure the source of the problems. The first board I purchased has never given me trouble the second and third have been RMA'd. It is bit ironic since I bought them to back up the first one.

If a reputable board maker produces an up-to-date board using the original DAE-3 I would buy them to replace the two RMA'd MSI boards. If my experience with them are good, I would recommend them to others.

So, yes I too wish some company would embrace the possibilities of integrated amplified audio in a PC.
post #3400 of 3490
cooked my 2nd board, was watching x-men 2 and after siren screamed all the high audio was no longer being sent to the center channel. Mid and woof was being sent but the highs are no longer.

I verified it by checking it with a different speaker.
post #3401 of 3490
3rd board is OK after 2 ½ years Keeping my fingers crossed.
post #3402 of 3490
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonTHB View Post

Asus already picked their audio tech.

They did? I'm not aware of them adopting anything like DAE-3.
You're right about MSI increasing the "perceived risk".
I too think that is what has happened...

If only it had gotten off to a less shaky start...
Asus/Gb would've done some epic implementations of the tech!
post #3403 of 3490
Asus picked CMedia's chips for their Xonar line of audio cards. They developed their own drivers for that line of chips. These are the "AV100" and "AV200".

MSI many years ago had some very daring audio designs including a motherboard that had a tube preamplifier. It was mostly a gimmick according to most reviewers, but it did acknowledge that motherboard audio needed work.
post #3404 of 3490
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonTHB View Post

Asus picked CMedia's chips for their Xonar line of audio cards. They developed their own drivers for that line of chips. These are the "AV100" and "AV200".

Oh yeah I know that...
But AFAIK they've not delved into anything like DAE-3 tech.

Quote:


MSI many years ago had some very daring audio designs including a motherboard that had a tube preamplifier. It was mostly a gimmick according to most reviewers, but it did acknowledge that motherboard audio needed work.

Good point.
It's brave risks like that, that gets everyone else thinking about how they can improve audio on MB's.
post #3405 of 3490
I am not aware of any motherboard manufacturer other than MSI that has brought internal amplification to PCs. However, AMD could make a chipset that would make amplified PCIe cards available to any motherboard with extended PCIe functionality:

AMD could add to their chipsets the capability to turn off bus emulation to make communication between devices use the point-to-point switching capabilities of PCI Express.

This would make point-to-point communications over this extended PCIe a non-user accessible bus and allow PCIe amplified cards that could decode or deliver decoded DTS-MA or Dolby TrueHD. Any motherboard with this chipset could deliver a Maui like solution and would not need to have a DSP chip like the DAE-3, on the motherboard because this PCIe chipset would be required to provide the Protected Audio Path over PCIe. The DSP would be in PCIe card itself. And the card could be installed in any slot.

This could also make for simpler video cards because only decryption and final use of HDCP would be required for video. Of course, if all "discrete" video is going into the CPU, then presumably some of this processing could be used for audio too. If all the processing gets done in the CPU than protected video and audio paths are no longer necessary.

The usefulness of such a chipset to AMD would depend on how long AM3+ lasts.
post #3406 of 3490
I don't really use my 7411 system, I was going to offer the board and amp card for sale, but after seeing the ebay prices I think it might be worth it to find another use for it here. Until it dies.
post #3407 of 3490
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonTHB View Post

I am not aware of any motherboard manufacturer other than MSI that has brought internal amplification to PCs. However, AMD could make a chipset that would make amplified PCIe cards available to any motherboard with extended PCIe functionality:

AMD could add to their chipsets the capability to turn off bus emulation to make communication between devices use the point-to-point switching capabilities of PCI Express.

This would make point-to-point communications over this extended PCIe a non-user accessible bus and allow PCIe amplified cards that could decode or deliver decoded DTS-MA or Dolby TrueHD. Any motherboard with this chipset could deliver a Maui like solution and would not need to have a DSP chip like the DAE-3, on the motherboard because this PCIe chipset would be required to provide the Protected Audio Path over PCIe. The DSP would be in PCIe card itself. And the card could be installed in any slot.

This could also make for simpler video cards because only decryption and final use of HDCP would be required for video. Of course, if all "discrete" video is going into the CPU, then presumably some of this processing could be used for audio too. If all the processing gets done in the CPU than protected video and audio paths are no longer necessary.

The usefulness of such a chipset to AMD would depend on how long AM3+ lasts.

Sparkle had a DAE based amp integrated entirely into a PCI card.
That was my preferred form-factor...
Although Sparkle's implementation had some clear limitations.
Plus I don't think they ever brought it to market, I could never find it for sale.
If Asus had done something similar...
They'd have done a far better job, & it would be "available"
post #3408 of 3490
So my board died after about two years of solid service. Bought a replacement from ebay and everything was fine and dandy until I tried to update the Bios.

Downloaded the file from MSI servers and installed, utility said everything went fine, but upon reboot I get CMOS checksum bad error. Tried reupdating the BIOS using ctrl+home at startup several times with all of the different BIOS versions provided on MSI web page, every time update seems to be fine and then upon restart CMOS Checksum bad error.

Ive tried resetting the CMOS with the jumper and going into the setup utility and choosing load failsafe defaults neither does anything to remove the error. Im hoping someone here will be able to help me out either with an idea on how to fix the problem or perhaps with a copy of a working BIOS file that I can try. Thanks anyone for any help.
post #3409 of 3490
Even though I've only owned it for two years, it turns out my rev 1.1 motherboard was made in August of 2008, so I was lucky (?) that it failed last month within the three year span. I RMAd it to MSI and they turned it around in less than two weeks. They fixed my old board--it looks like by replacing the D50 diode (the new diode has bigger packaging). I can't tell if anything else was done.

I reassembled it and everything seems to work A-OK. So kudos to MSI.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FijiBill View Post

Almost made it to two years!

The subwoofer on my idle Live Diva HTPC starting making a fluttering noise. I rebooted it, and instead of the three thumps I got a whole lot of thumping. Then the subwoofer started fluttering again once the desktop appeared but the rest of the audio was OK. I rebooted again and all audio was completely out, but the PC booted up OK. The amp card no longer appeared in the audio control panel.

I took it apart and the inside of the case smelled a little burnt. The D50 diode looked suspect. My system runs pretty cool--I have a 65 W 905e and two Seagate Green hard disks. So maybe that's why it lasted this long?

The HTPC still boots OK. Once I removed the amp card, I was able to install the RealTek audio drivers and put sound out the HDMI to the speakers in my TV.

I am debating getting a receiver in the hopes that the SPDIF still works (should it?), since there is no other motherboard that I can replace this one with that has an onboard amp.

My other alternative is to RMA it to MSI. Apparently there is a 3 year warranty, but it looks like the serial number is on the underside of the board. Grrr.. I still have till October no matter what I guess.

Is MSI still giving people replacement boards on RMA? Nobody seems to have the Live Diva in stock any more. I'd rather have a refund once I get the receiver.
post #3410 of 3490
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jezreel View Post

So my board died after about two years of solid service. Bought a replacement from ebay and everything was fine and dandy until I tried to update the Bios.

Downloaded the file from MSI servers and installed, utility said everything went fine, but upon reboot I get CMOS checksum bad error...

Ive tried resetting the CMOS with the jumper and going into the setup utility and choosing load failsafe defaults neither does anything to remove the error.

While the computer has power (e.g. off but plugged in) the configuration usually holds. You need to replace the battery that preserves the BIOS configuration (not the BIOS itself) in CMOS memory. If this doesn't solve the problem you should send your original board into MSI for RMA. I don't have experience elsewhere, but if you are located in the USA, I would recommend calling tech support at MSI USA and tell them what happened to your non-white box board to get an RMA on it.

I recently applied, on-line, to RMA for a third time, the third board I purchased retail. On-line, the request was refused, but tech support approved it and I recently got an email from MSI that it is on its way to me. One week from when I mailed it. If it IS repaired, I may reconsider my decision not to buy MSI again. I'll see if ground shipping was a waste very soon.

Jalyst, yes. I didn't include the Sparkle board because I think it never reached retail, not because it wasn't a motherboard feature.
post #3411 of 3490
Bugger

After almost 3 years i had the exact same issue below although my board is still working fine but am now using the HDMI connection for sound via the TV.

I assume the card is the faulty part and am undecided weather to try and find a replacement or just get a separate receiver?

Quote:
Originally Posted by momeijer View Post

Hi,

Just wanted to share that my MSI Media Live board died (again). :-(
First one was DOA and now after 4 months operating normally the volume turned very loud suddenly, few hours later the AMP card dissappeared from Device Manager so I turned it off in the evening. The next morning it wouldn't turn on again. No POST, nothing...

Removed all the cards including the AMP but without result. I am really dissappointed because I love this hardware setup but have no choice for another manufacter with this specific AMP.

:-(
post #3412 of 3490
I think you should try applying for an RMA on-line and if it is refused, try calling tech support. If the board has been RMA'd before your chances only increase on getting the RMA.

This worked for me. I am going to test the board probably this weekend, if not before.

Even without receiving a RMA, you (and anyone else with a MS-7411) would be actively voicing your interest in the platform. It didn't take very long getting connected to a support representative either.

Good luck, everyone.
post #3413 of 3490
I completed my build two weeks ago with the replacement board which I got approx. two years ago. The first one didn't even survive the installation of windows. Was too busy to build and maybe hoping for some magic fix for the issues.
Now the replacement board hangs almost every time after a cold boot. Restarting thereafter does work but I noticed that at least six capacitors are domed. All of them are of the brand shown in the first picture(ATWY). Again, this board was in use for only two weeks, and not intensively either. I did also constantly monitor the temperatures, being 40C at the maximum. The first attached foto shows some of the caps.
At least I was prepared for all of this and have bought another, newer board with the bigger heatsink. Apparantly MSI did switch from ATWY(Koshin Togyo) to KZG (Chemicon) for all of the caps in question (second picture).
My first thought was: 'oh great, they realized the issue and fixed it'. But as I don't know much about capacitors I searched the web and found a site called badcaps.net. And from what I read there it seems that these newer caps are just as unreliable as the old ones.
Neverthless I am not yet ready to ditch this concept and I would like to ask for your opinions. I wasn't expecting that there is still some activity in this thread, but I'm glad that I am not the only one still trying...
Does someone maybe have some advice if the capacitors could be replaced altogether?
LL
LL
post #3414 of 3490
^ badcaps is a great little site...
You'll get some better pointers there for a DIY caps repair job.
Assuming they're the "root cause" of your problems.

Best of luck.
post #3415 of 3490
My MSI Live Diva has been working two years.

Now, it wont make a sound: and the windows high definition audio device can only be configured as Stereo. At boot, it does not do the distinctive boum boum boum. Any ideas?
post #3416 of 3490
When the DAE based HD audio device disappears from the device manager the first thing to check is D50. It's near the sound card slot. The original part is undersized for the about of current the sound chip is drawing and will eventually fail.

I replaced mine when it failed with a 2amp Schottky diode and have had no problems for over a year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lelou View Post

My MSI Live Diva has been working two years.

Now, it wont make a sound: and the windows high definition audio device can only be configured as Stereo. At boot, it does not do the distinctive boum boum boum. Any ideas?
post #3417 of 3490
Most of my failures were a result of failed MOSFETS. However, if you could provide us with the specs of the diode and how you replaced it those who no longer have warranty coverage will have a chance to repair their boards.
post #3418 of 3490
I would also like to urge everybody to share their experience concerning possible repairs for those still interested in this platform.
post #3419 of 3490
Quote:
Originally Posted by lelou View Post

My MSI Live Diva has been working two years.

Now, it wont make a sound: and the windows high definition audio device can only be configured as Stereo. At boot, it does not do the distinctive boum boum boum. Any ideas?

That was yesterday. Today, I don't get to the POST - all video outputs trigger the monitor's auto power off.
post #3420 of 3490
Could anybody recommend what to get after? I had a Live Diva before I moved in, basically from another country, so I would appreciate advice on what to get to have a Live Diva set-up without the MSI 7411 board. I was happy with the setup, but now I have 8 ohm speakers with wires fed through the attic, a powered sub woofer, disk drives (optical and hard) an Antec Fusion case with the remote, a TV card, 5050e AMD processor, 2 sticks of 2 Gb DDR2 memory, a Radeon 5450 graphics card, Windows 7 OEM 32 bit and an unhappy wife as we cannot watch movies anymore. I must find everything we need to get the stuff working again, and we have very little room in the living room to put the new things. I was hoping I could find a car stereo sized amp with 6 inputs and the 5+1 ouputs that will work with the speakers and sub.
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