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Channel Master CM-7000 Digital to Analog Converter

post #1 of 1459
3/6/08 at 6:36am
Thread Starter 
Channel Master is rolling out a Digital to Analog TV converter which apparently is not CECB-certified. The web site indicates that "the CM-7000 Digital to Analog Converter is currently in production and will be available soon at your local electronics retailer."

CM certainly has a reputation for providing top-notch OTA products. However, I am concerned about the box's front branding as "HDTV Compatible" and "HD" (see picture on the information sheet).

Nothing indicates this box provides High Definition 720 or 1080 output. It should correctly bear the SDTV logo, not the HDTV logo with the legalistic phrase "compatible" in small print. I am also a bit disappointed that the product info sheet didn't provide ATSC reception specifications.

Anyone have more knowledge about this product, and why they have labeled this SD-only box as "HDTV" and "HD"?
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post #2 of 1459
3/6/08 at 7:17am
True, they could have chosen better wording for the front of the box, or left it blank. However the average Joe makes no distinction between SDTV and HDTV digital signals. Maybe this is CM target crowd, those who don't know much about HDTV who are also willing to pay a premium for their CECB.
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post #3 of 1459
3/6/08 at 6:55pm
Thread Starter 
I actually was hoping that the CM-7000 - which as of this writing is not CECB certified - would be a "no-compromise" converter box offering the features forbidden by the NTIA - i.e. clear QAM, 720 and 1080 output, et al.

It will be interesting to see if a non-CECB-crippled CM box will be launched, given the lack of current High Definition OTA box choices using sixth-generation chips.
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post #4 of 1459
3/6/08 at 7:44pm
There is no smart Antenna on the back as far as I can see. The Maxmedia has the same features plus the Smart antenna. Am I correct? How is this box better?

How much is this box?

Someone posted Maxmedia box $58.99 for 1 and $54.99 for 2

After coupon that is $15 per if you buy 2

Unless this box offers way more. Does it?
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post #5 of 1459
3/8/08 at 7:17am
Thread Starter 
The CM-7000 offers an S-Video interface but, Strangely for a box coming from Channel Master,no Smart Antenna interface.

At this time, the CM-7000 is not CECB-eligible for purchase with the $40 coupon. Video output format is limited to 480i, therefore the CM website's advertising claim "Get Free HDTV without monthly fees" is inaccurate.
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post #6 of 1459
3/8/08 at 8:39am
Yes it's total false advertising to use the HDTV logo. Even the way they say "get free HDTV" You're not getting free HD, you're getting free SD! Booo to CM if this is the case.
Seatacboy-are you sure the box does not output HD? IMO it would make no sense to make a SD non eligible CB at this point. What would be the point? I mean CECB's can have S-out? Very odd box indeed.
Note I would be willing to purchase this box, even if not CE and HD, IF it was great build quality and had the features I wanted, namely a good functioning VCR type program scheduler(not the PCIP type). But I'm not sure this box looks any better than the $39.99 free Echostar TR-40.......I guess time will tell.
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post #7 of 1459
3/8/08 at 8:49am
Thread Starter 
The specifications on page 2 of the information sheet:
Demodulator input for 1080i, 720p, 480i, and 480.
Video output is 480i ONLY.

480i is Standard Definition DTV only. The CM-7000's claim to "Get Free HDTV Without Monthly Fees" is inaccurate.

What annoys me is that many folks who bought tunerless "HD-Ready" Monitors would really like a state-of-the-art STB which incorporates sixth-generation ATSC decoding for 1080i and 720p as well as 480i output. The new CECBs appear to outperform earlier ATSC tuners in terms of RF sensitivity and overall reception quality, but are "dumbed down" to 480 or 480i output.

Channel Master should offer a best-in-breed STB with genuine HDTV output capability, rather than peddling a non-CECB-eligible SD-only DTV box.

Maybe their real plans are to sell the CM-7000 in Canada, where there is no $40 coupon program being offered. I would be curious about the build quality of this unit.
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post #8 of 1459
3/8/08 at 8:55am
The Channel Master CM-7000 box has a S-Video Output and a Coaxial (RCA) Digital Audio Output, according to their PDF brochure at Channel Master's site.

This box will be perfect for my 1996 Sony KV-32XBR45 and my Dolby Digital 5.1 Surround Amplifier!
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post #9 of 1459
3/8/08 at 9:13am
Thanks for the link, I didn't catch it before.
This box sure sounds like a CECB, and if it's true that the Coax Digital audio out is not a limitation to be CE, I don't see why it's not CE, maybe there just pending the certification? And I whole heartedly agree with your build quality statement. I can't say I'm really impressed with the CECB's I've seen so far. After all I'd like the box to last longer than the old TV I'm hooking it up to.
Maybe if the box does not get coupon certification they'll make it fully HD, include the Component and HDMI outs and be done with it. Here's hoping anyway.
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post #10 of 1459
3/8/08 at 10:19am
Quote:
Originally Posted by seatacboy View Post

The new CECBs appear to outperform earlier ATSC tuners in terms of RF sensitivity and overall reception quality, but are "dumbed down" to 480 or 480i output.

My Insignia (Zenith LG clone) does not outperform my Samsung DTB-H260F in terms of reception quality. Close, but not quite.
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post #11 of 1459
3/8/08 at 11:07am
Does anyone know what chipset the Channel Master uses. Would be nice if it was a LG or ATI. Also, is the EPG a full matrix 7-day?
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post #12 of 1459
3/8/08 at 1:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjeff View Post

This box sure sounds like a CECB, and if it's true that the Coax Digital audio out is not a limitation to be CE, I don't see why it's not CE, maybe there just pending the certification?

According to solidsignal, "This unit is awaiting certification and will be on the NTIA CECB (coupon eligible converter box) list."
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post #13 of 1459
3/8/08 at 11:53pm
Thread Starter 
Channel Master's unit reportedly has been submitted to NTIA and MIGHT be approved for the NTIA CECB list. The stripped features on this unit should qualify it, but I'm skeptical.

Channel Master's inaccurate "HDTV" and "HD" labeling on the CM-7000 and its information sheet suggests that their U.S. distributor is ignorant/misinformed about Federal Trade Commission regulations regarding consumer product labeling. Channel Master be similarly be ignorant/misinformed about the "letter of the law" requirements to obtain CECB certification from the FCC/NTIA.
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post #14 of 1459
3/10/08 at 7:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whidbey View Post

My Insignia (Zenith LG clone) does not outperform my Samsung DTB-H260F in terms of reception quality. Close, but not quite.

What are your specific observations? some of us in the ATSC converter box comparison thread http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=980052

...are wondering.

Is the zenith equal or worse with distant stations for you?
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post #15 of 1459
3/12/08 at 8:06am
Thread Starter 
My local Frys carried several CM-7000 boxes on the shelf as of yesterday. The boxes have no labeling as to $40 coupon eligibility. Price was $79.99.
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post #16 of 1459
3/12/08 at 1:02pm
Also $79.99 at www.frys.com & no mention of NTIA, CECB or coupons...

Says it outputs S-Video & composite video.
Only audio output mentioned is "RCA".
Digital Audio (Coax/Optical) is notably absent from feature list...
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post #17 of 1459
3/16/08 at 11:19am
They are on ad today in the Oregonian at Fry's for $59.99. The ad does not state coupon eligibility.
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post #18 of 1459
3/16/08 at 11:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by holl_ands View Post

...Digital Audio (Coax/Optical) is notably absent from feature list...

Sad, I was afraid of something like this. Doesn't look like DD5.1 will be offered in any CECB even if it's not a disqualifying feature.
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post #19 of 1459
3/16/08 at 11:38am
http://www.pctinternational.com/chan...2A_200801b.pdf

Look at the "flyer". It specifically lists an RCA COAX out. And, while it's not clearly shown, there is a Black RCA connector on the back, below the yellow composite RCA jack.
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post #20 of 1459
3/16/08 at 12:25pm
Which is why we're waiting for someone to "bite" and let us know for sure....

I looked at the outside of the box at Frys, but no features list....
And no open boxes. (But that's what gives Frys its special charm....)
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post #21 of 1459
3/16/08 at 12:43pm
not used
http://www.summitsource.com/images/p...d71e29f775e6f4
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post #22 of 1459
3/16/08 at 6:35pm
Picked up a CM-7000 at Fry's at the sale price. They took my 40$ coupon without question, though they probably spent 10 minutes figuring out how to enter the coupon into their system. I sure hope it gets NTIA approval :<). Hooked it up to my old JVC crt TV, gets a much better picture in my suburban Chicago location than analog reception. It has a nice program guide (one channel at a time), but you can move between channels to see what's coming up. It has four picture modes: letterbox (good for widescreen), full (4 x 3), zoom 1 (cropped widescreen), and zoom 2 (haven't figured out a really good use for it yet). It uses Pioneer cable box remote codes, so I can turn it on/off and change channels using a universal remote control. It claims to support digital 1-4 closed captioning as well as analog CC-1 and CC-2. Does not appear that's there's any way to upgrade software (no USB or RS-232 port), and the black RCA output jack is labeled "No connection", haven't had a chance to see if there's any kind of output. It has a four hour shutoff, which can be disabled from the setup menu, although it claims that it won't shut off during the "current program". The manual is pretty sparse, appears to be a translation from some other language. The remote has several "unused" keys
(option, page up, page down, and text). On the whole, it seems to work pretty well, especially for the $20 net, but I've noticed a low buzz which is a little annoying. I've hooked it up through a Philips automatic switch, which may be a contributing factor. So far, so good.
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post #23 of 1459
3/16/08 at 7:05pm
Thanks for the review DJ. Doesn't sound quite as great as I thought it would be. I wonder why they removed so many options last minute? That black RCA jack was supposed to be digital audio out. And what's with all the "unused" buttons on the remote? Did they just take a remote from another model and throw it in?
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post #24 of 1459
3/16/08 at 7:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ99 View Post

Picked up a CM-7000 at Fry's at the sale price. They took my 40$ coupon without question, though they probably spent 10 minutes figuring out how to enter the coupon into their system. I sure hope it gets NTIA approval :<). Hooked it up to my old JVC crt TV, gets a much better picture in my suburban Chicago location than analog reception. It has a nice program guide (one channel at a time), but you can move between channels to see what's coming up. It has four picture modes: letterbox (good for widescreen), full (4 x 3), zoom 1 (cropped widescreen), and zoom 2 (haven't figured out a really good use for it yet). It uses Pioneer cable box remote codes, so I can turn it on/off and change channels using a universal remote control. It claims to support digital 1-4 closed captioning as well as analog CC-1 and CC-2. Does not appear that's there's any way to upgrade software (no USB or RS-232 port), and the black RCA output jack is labeled "No connection", haven't had a chance to see if there's any kind of output. It has a four hour shutoff, which can be disabled from the setup menu, although it claims that it won't shut off during the "current program". The manual is pretty sparse, appears to be a translation from some other language. The remote has several "unused" keys
(option, page up, page down, and text). On the whole, it seems to work pretty well, especially for the $20 net, but I've noticed a low buzz which is a little annoying. I've hooked it up through a Philips automatic switch, which may be a contributing factor. So far, so good.


Questions pls

1) does this box have Analog pass through?

2) Can you turn off tv with the BOX remote? OR you have to use your T remote?

3) Did the low hum go away?

4) can you take pictures on the on-screen display?

thanks
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post #25 of 1459
3/16/08 at 8:40pm
5) Can you readily add a station via either directly entering the real RF (not virtual)
channel number....or a rescan without wiping out previous results?

6) Does the Coax Digital Audio output work?

7) How many hours/days of programs displayed in EPG?
Photos of primary EPG screens would be appreciated....

8) Does it have both an Antenna Level and a Signal Quality/Level meter display?

9) Perhaps pop the cover and let us know numbers for the big chips and "tin-can" tuner???
Maybe even some interior macro photography??
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post #26 of 1459
3/17/08 at 7:43am
1) does this box have Analog pass through?
No, neither when it's powered on or off. I tried to see if it passes Stereo on the RF output (ch3 or 4), appears that it does NOT.

2) Can you turn off tv with the BOX remote? OR you have to use your T remote? No, the remote only supports the CM-7000

3) Did the low hum go away?
Haven't had a chance to experiment

4) can you take pictures on the on-screen display?

Wilco
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post #27 of 1459
3/17/08 at 7:48am
5) Can you readily add a station via either directly entering the real RF (not virtual) channel number....or a rescan without wiping out previous results?
You can rescan to add channels, haven't found a way to direct tune a station.

6) Does the Coax Digital Audio output work?
Haven't tried, but wouldn't that make it coupon ineligible?

7) How many hours/days of programs displayed in EPG?
Photos of primary EPG screens would be appreciated....
Will post a photo when I'm home, but it looks like 24 hours. Curiously I had to set the time (it has autotime function as well as manual) before it would allow me to display the guide.

8) Does it have both an Antenna Level and a Signal Quality/Level meter display? (Signal strength only, will post a picture)

9) Perhaps pop the cover and let us know numbers for the big chips and "tin-can" tuner??? Wilco
Maybe even some interior macro photography??
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post #28 of 1459
3/17/08 at 7:52am
10) Does the S-Video Output jack work, too?
Yes, I'm using it.

How does it compare to the composite output?
Maybe a little better on fine details, I haven't tried to do a side by side comparison because this is my oldest TV (10 years) and it only has one video input (S or composite but not both simultaneously). That's why I'm using the Philips switcher.
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post #29 of 1459
3/17/08 at 8:04am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Symbios View Post

Thanks for the review DJ. Doesn't sound quite as great as I thought it would be. I wonder why they removed so many options last minute? That black RCA jack was supposed to be digital audio out. And what's with all the "unused" buttons on the remote? Did they just take a remote from another model and throw it in?

I'm thinking the same thing. If I'd paid retail price, I wouldn't be happy. Except for the S-video output, it doesn't seem very different than the cheaper boxes. I'm guessing that whoever makes the box for them used whatever remote shell they had available and it just had extra buttons.

One button isn't even labeled and it doesn't do anything that I can find. On the whole, this one doesn't seem up to Channel Master's reputation. It shows signs of not being fully baked. The manual is pretty short on detail, just a few pictures and very generalized instructions, almost as if it was written before they had a working model to try out. No specifics on RF output, just shows the switch on the back in a drawing of the box. (No actual picture of the box or any actual screen shots) Given that coupons start expiring before too long (mine expire in May), I can understand why they wanted to get something to market in time to cash in on the coupon program.
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post #30 of 1459
3/17/08 at 10:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ99 View Post

Picked up a CM-7000 at Fry's at the sale price. They took my 40$ coupon without question, though they probably spent 10 minutes figuring out how to enter the coupon into their system. I sure hope it gets NTIA approval :<).

What happens if the box doesn't get approved? Does that mean your coupon card is still good for $40 off another box?
Maybe you should take the card to CC or BB and see if it will still work. In that case the only loser is Fry's for giving you a $40 discount.
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