Official Denon AVP-A1HD/AVP-A1HDCI and POA-A1HD/POA-A1HDCI owners thread. - Page 747

Originally Posted by danielo


Yes it was (probably already clear from my last post), Keep in mind this was a place that does tuning/modding and these types of places are always very passionate about hardware unlike repear shops who consider it work.

Came in around 11:00, dropped the avp of at the work area so one person could start working on it. We then moved to a very nice full surround setup with a matching visual setup (130ish screen driven by a sim2 3 chipper). A different client (who turned out to be a designer/engineer for bmw) was listening to a avp/poa/a1ud sacd's and we joined the session for about a hour.

Then we went to lunch and left them to work on the unit, went to nice picture perfect place called Monshau :

Returned about 15:00, work was done and they moved my avp into the theater after a coffee they hooked it up to test it while i was present. The bad news was we found a problem so they had to take apart again i watched a little of this in the workshop they didn't mind. Once that was fixed back to the theater and do a rundown test of all the channels, videosystem and some of the basics.

Last part of the day was more about comparing my avp with their avp (that has been tuned) this was also nice because they used my own avp so it was a second shakedown test before i left. Ill talk more about the tuning later since that was not really part of the upgrade.

But as you can see a totally different experience then you had, next time i need to upgrade something or repear a brand they support i know where ill ask first. So for people locally to this place http://www.cinemike.de/ is a good place to get your 3d upgrade (is plugging like this allowed ?).

Daniel.

Originally Posted by jdsmoothie


I had reported in the thread last fall that Denon Mgt indicated that due to the expected shortage of parts by this spring, Denon would no longer be able to mfr either the AVP or the 5308CI and that both models would be discontinued. However, the 3D upgrade kit will still be available for some time.

Originally Posted by danielo


Well for anyone in germany or the netherlands i guess i can advice the place i went today. For one thing it will probably be the only time you will see avp's and poa all over the place . It was about a 2.5hour drive back and i just got in and did a basic setup and its fine.

I have now seen both the avp (including mine) and poa in several stages of undress. When i came in they had a poa 100% stripped by the time i left it was almost looking normal again (still without the covers).

We did run into a small problem that ill post about tomorrow and as a result they had to take it apart again but for the rest it went very smooth.

The amount of avp's/poa's they have gives me reason to think they have a good inside track to some information so here it goes :

The avp/poa is discontinued, they picked up the 3 last avp's in germany for future sales to clients (i guess with their tuning). He didn't expect denon to even consider to make a new one (marantz is it seems) because of the bad state D&M is in now. The new lineup will be announced end of the month and it will show the merging of the brands in D&M at the component level.

On the upgrade kits, they do many upgrades. Including mine they had 5 new kits and all where spoken for. The batch that just came into europe was 100kits and his info was that denon will do 1 more run for europe with 50kits and that will be it.

More on the tuning/upgrade tomorrow kind of tired and doubt i am making sense .

Daniel.

Originally Posted by orologio


It's sad that Denon is in trouble.

Even today, after several years of ownership of the avp I can't think of any replacement still. Well, I did look around a while back because I needed a feature that the avp lacks, and couldn't find anything worth the price or the feauture I was looking for.

Originally Posted by Franin

Being that Denon is in trouble and parts becoming hard to get, im hoping my Denon hangs in there for at least another 5 years.

Originally Posted by orologio

It's sad that Denon is in trouble.

Even today, after several years of ownership of the avp I can't think of any replacement still. Well, I did look around a while back because I needed a feature that the avp lacks, and couldn't find anything worth the price or the feauture I was looking for.

Originally Posted by danielo


Well let me not be the one to say they are in danger i don't think they are. Its a big holding but the numbers are out there for anyone to read if they want. Its clear that a few years ago denon had a solid grip on things like the receiver market and they lost it over the last 3 years to 2 other brands a refocus is needed and being proud that all your brands are doing their own R&D just doesn't make any sense for example.

The talk i had with the tuning people only confirmed my view on the avp and poa (that they feel has its limits). We talked about several other pre/pro's we all know and probably have considered when the time it came out and they feel the basic engineering is on a whole other level and it was the only logical option for people with complex systems within the price range. On the future we talked about why they feel putting more money into it (tuning) makes sense on a 4 year old machine they are also clear the base engineering is still some of the best they have seen and they don't expect anyone to release something close in the next 2 years. There is a market for high end pre/pro's no doubt but not the way denon did it they are more of the less is more method i guess. Now they are clearly fans of the products they use like all of us but the fact they are buying up avp's if they can find them looked convincing.

As tuners they do feel there is room to improve and the avp was designed to a price point (probably aimed at the lexicon back then) and he gave a example of the dac boards where the original design calls for parts that the production runs of the avp doesn't have but there is room for on the boards. They just use better parts and fill in the already designed parts denon decided didn't add enough to the end result.

They had different brands they tuned but the avp was their top-pick and what they use themselves. The one they also liked since its still available and a nice base to work from is the new marantz pre/pro thats popular now but thats a different price class. Same for the a1ud vs the oppo's for example they also both tune.

Don't want this thread to turn into a tuning discussion but its a good way to get some more insight into some of these design issues. Like i stated before for a technical person (like most of us are) its always nice to talk to technical people who have a passion for real design vs name/brand or vague claims that you can confuse with 1 semi technical question that results in answers involving the color purple and unicorns.

Daniel.

Originally Posted by Waboman

Franins post about keeping the AVP for another 5 years got me thinking. I'd love to get 5 or more years out of my AVP. So I started mulling over the upgrade. Is it worth it? I call the first Denon service center in my area. I gave the model number to the guy who answered the phone. His response, "is that a tv or something?"

I then call the second Denon service center listed. They have heard of it and even said their technician is highly trained and has done a couple upgrades already. Not sure if I want to risk it or even if it's worth it. I don't have a lot of faith in Denon's service centers.

Originally Posted by Waboman

Franins post about keeping the AVP for another 5 years got me thinking. I'd love to get 5 or more years out of my AVP. So I started mulling over the upgrade. Is it worth it? I call the first Denon service center in my area. I gave the model number to the guy who answered the phone. His response, "is that a tv or something?"

I then call the second Denon service center listed. They have heard of it and even said their technician is highly trained and has done a couple upgrades already. Not sure if I want to risk it or even if it's worth it. I don't have a lot of faith in Denon's service centers.

Originally Posted by DoctorO

This discontinued and part-unavailable stuff is pretty scary considering we just got our AVP a couple of months ago! There's always a savvy tech somewhere that can keep things working, right?

Originally Posted by danielo

...On the future we talked about why they feel putting more money into it (tuning) makes sense on a 4 year old machine they are also clear the base engineering is still some of the best they have seen and they don't expect anyone to release something close in the next 2 years. There is a market for high end pre/pro's no doubt but not the way denon did it they are more of the less is more method i guess. Now they are clearly fans of the products they use like all of us but the fact they are buying up avp's if they can find them looked convincing.

They had different brands they tuned but the avp was their top-pick and what they use themselves. The one they also liked since its still available and a nice base to work from is the new marantz pre/pro thats popular now but thats a different price class. Same for the a1ud vs the oppo's for example they also both tune...

Originally Posted by gsr


Assuming you can locate a competent service center, the upgrade is WELL worth the effort.

Originally Posted by orologio

That's my dilemma now...anyone's positive experience in NYC?

Originally Posted by danielo


I would just call D&M holdings directly and explain/ask them. If there is one thing they can do for avp owners is help you find a good upgrade place they had to upgrade their own avp's no .

Daniel.

Originally Posted by gsr

Assuming you can locate a competent service center, the upgrade is WELL worth the effort.

Originally Posted by Franin

What scares me waboman is I take it to my centre and the guys mess it up.

Originally Posted by Waboman



You and me both, Franin. The service center tech thought the AVP-A1HDCI was a tv.

Originally Posted by mystic_sniper28

more like idiots working at a registed repair agent though not actually certified by denon to actaully work on denon's gear..

Originally Posted by Franin


Well that's not exactly what you want to hear.

Originally Posted by Waboman

It's too bad the upgrade isn't a la carte. The main reason for me is for the XT32. Assuming it's not smoke & mirrors.

Originally Posted by Waboman

It certainly doesn't instill confidence in handing over your flagship pre/pro and then giving them a $1k on top of it. Do you have any plans doing the upgrade?

Originally Posted by Waboman


It's too bad the upgrade isn't a la carte. The main reason for me is for the XT32. Assuming it's not smoke & mirrors. My front speakers are nearly 6' tall. I won't need the height channels. Also, I just don't have the room for them.

You and me both, Franin. The service center tech thought the AVP-A1HDCI was a tv. C'mon, man! Seems Denon is giving out licenses to any Joe-the-rag-man in a van down by the river.

Originally Posted by Waboman


It certainly doesn't instill confidence in handing over your flagship pre/pro and then giving them a $1k on top of it. Do you have any plans doing the upgrade?

Originally Posted by alebonau

pity some service centres out there sounds like a bunch of cowboys. in oz I can tell you done by official denon service centre it went very smoothly. guys even if not doing it for 3D the benefits are there for audio with xt32 processor etc this upgrade brings. do grab this while still available. I think be something regret not getting down the track.

frank have a chat to agp about your local service centre. as I know they wont just anyone do it in oz. give you some sense of confidence. otherwise could ship it to apg but then theres costs for that and risk of damage in transit etc.

Originally Posted by orologio

You said it...

at Denon's main service center (north east) , I inquired about the upgrade, twice, and in both circumstances the answer was: "we don't suggest the upgrade because if you don't care for 3D it's not needed".
I explained that despite my lack of interest in 3D I would like to upgrade to audyssey xt32. The answer was: "no, that it about 3D sound and you need more speakers for that...". I tried to explain again that I was talking about the higher resolution of the calibration process... but he kept on saying that the upgrade is only about 3d sound with speakers all over .... I gave up