Official Denon AVP-A1HD/AVP-A1HDCI and POA-A1HD/POA-A1HDCI owners thread. - Page 775

It depends on how the processor is used an how it is designed. If you tell the AVR that you have a speaker setup that has only 3 front speakers, and if the AV processor so informs the PLIIx decoder, then it will use an embedded 3-ch mode that prevents removing the strong surround cues from the front channels.

If the decoder is operating in 5.1 or 7.1 mode, and you mute the rear speakers, then there may be cases where surround effects are reduced or lost.

Easiest way to tell is to play a 2-ch surround test signal that has rear encoding.
Assuming you turn off the wides in the speaker setup menu or in the surround mode controls, it will not discard any information.
That might only be offered when the speaker setup is 5.1. Sometimes the name remains PLIIx even in that case for ease of U/I design.
If a surround decoder steers dialog to the center speaker, but the speaker is disconnected, is it not losing "true" information?

Nope, I did not test PCM. As I posted the BluRays both featured wonderful DTS HD soundtracks. I always bitstreamed everything from the Oppo. I had already established for myself that bitstream always sounded slightly better sent to any of my several Denon AVRs . So it never occurred to me to do a shootout of DL vs PCM.

Thanks for the feedback SoM. Yes, Bitstreamed packetized codecs like DTS MA rock when handled by processors like our AVP.

I am blown away by how coherent a soundfield I get from BluRay discs like Grace for Drowning (Steven Wilson) or Storm Corrosion (yet again, SW), the layering and instrument positioning is astounding when totally handled within the AVP.

The question concerned going from 7.2 to 5.2. As you correctly pointed out, the spatial psychoacoustic effect will change, depending on which speakers you have turned off, the dialogue itself will not be altered in any way.

OK - I will do some testing myself to see if I can notice anything by simply 12v triggering off the back surrounds. Gotta find a good 2 channel source to use now as my test material.

Regarding PLII and PLIIx, now that I have run Audyssey and told the AVP that I have back surrounds, I don't think I will see the PLII option any longer on the AVP unless I go back in and change the setup - something I don't want to do because I need the back surrounds for movies. So, I think my choice is either PLIIx (7.x) or THX Home Cinema with the Pro Logic option (5.x). I wish I knew what that THX Pro Logic mode is all about. If it is based on the original PL (circa 1970's?) then I should probably avoid it but as I posted before, it is hard to believe something that old would still be bundled in a product like the AVP. Perhaps it is some kind of morphed THX mode based on PLII?

Thanks!

Jonathan - have you listened to the Tom Petty Damn The Torpedoes DTS MA track from the BluRay release through the AVP? There is a night and day difference between it and any other version out there - much better than even the hi res stereo download from HD Tracks.

I like some Tom Petty, but not a 'fan', so very little of it in the collection so I've not heard this one yet, but thanks for the heads up. I'll get that ordered, as I also need more varied 'demo' material. Progrock fans seem to be a small subset of the population

I am blown away by the SQ on those discs as well, but I'm also blown away by the heavy metal distortion pretty much every SW song transforms into all too soon. It's just unlistenable for me. Mebbe I should do a SW "mix tape", fading from the beautiful beginning of one song to the beautiful beginning of the next, eliminating the loud headbanging crap.

BTW, I have found many great suggestions for demo material on the "most recent hires purchases thread". Although some of my fav Stereo demo stuff is not HiRes but well-recorded RBCD or DVD.
Edited by SoundofMind - 8/21/12 at 6:15am

I completely concur, DTS-HD MA & TrueHD live concert tracks are some of the best I've experienced. There's a lot to choose from, but for demo purposes my favorite recording is Pat Metheny's "The Way Up Live". It's a jazz ensemble, and what makes it an exceptional demo disc is not only the recording quality but the sheer amount of different instruments and sounds on it. Even though I'm not a huge jazz fan, it's usually the first disc I throw on after calibrating my system.

I had a friend bring The Police live and that sounded amazing.

Ya, that is a demo disc. It gets a little compressed during some songs, but the bass can be absolutely incredible.

Review of upgrade by Audioholics website.
http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/receivers/denon-avr-5308ci-avp-a1hdci-update-video

Why do they say the upgrade includes "a new HDMI board that gets installed"?

I believe the new board allows 3D signals to pass though? I don't use it personally because of routing video to a Lumagen XE3D. Others probably have better feedback. SJ

Because he didn't research it enough and assumed several things, The review itself seems more about his own ego and 'views' then anything else. One question that popped into my mind watching is that we don't really know how many 5308 vs avp's (even in %) and how many have upgraded my guess is way more avp owners upgraded than 5308 owners since the price and value makes more sense.

Daniel.

I agree Daniel.

Well like JonFo i registered and added some more info. audioholics is a nice site and the guy has a style of his own (thats fine) the good news is these days at most sites you can post comments instead of yelling at the TV expecting something to happen

Daniel.
Edited by danielo - 8/22/12 at 3:32am

My point was, there is no new HDMI board as part of the upgrade. 3D support is handled via firmware update, a la the PS3.

Indeed i made a comment on the site about what happend. I do think that just calling it 'software' is a bit tricky because of the fpga's involved but clearly the hdmi board was not replaced. Missing that the brain (in many ways) was replaced the 3 DSP's instead is a big deal also in relation of the price.

Daniel.

+1

I didn't watch the video since the written text is merely outputting a few generality's about DSX and DTS neo:X. No mentioning that the upgrade only allows Height or Wide playback, not both simultaneously, for example.

To bad most of you folks don't understand some German, because the Lars Mette video on the AVP upgrade was a great watch. You gotta give the Germans this: grundlichkeit is embedded into their vains! BTW, that guy actually owns two AVP's. One is upgraded by CineMike. Hard to grasp how anybody could "upgrade" the pinnacle of surround preamplification though...

I will keep my eyes open for purchasing a used AVP. But the prices remain real high (fair enough) every time I checked. And now some proper 11.2 pre-pro's are behind the horizon, I got the Marantz AV8801 on the radar. I know this is little more than a denon 4520 sans amps in a copper casing, but it will be cheaper also. Pre-pro's are obsolete after about four years (I assume the upgraded AVP adds another four years) so the investment has to be written of over four years. That's about 2 euro / day in case of the Marantz and 3 euro / day for a used upgraded AVP. I am not saying the thing should be binned after 4 years, but by then you know you're behind.

You might also want to edit your comment suggesting readers come to this thread if they want more information/feedback from actual owners that have purchased the upgrade.

I wish he had subtitles I would of love to know what he had said.

OK. Got it. Since I never intended to pass 3D through I didn't pay much attention. Thanks for clarifying. SJ

I rather not since i don't like to point from Forum to Forum, Gene and his team put time and money into creating audioholics and i find reroutinng people not nice. Gene has been very nice in the past and he is a owner of a avp/poa himself. Again its not the worst review in the world and i am sure people who want to know more about the avp or the upgrade will find us quickly using google its hard to avoid this thread when seatching for avp or poa.

Daniel.

If you want, I can watch it again while taking notes and post them here. As long as you don't aspect 100% correct translation. I am not a German, not official and not by character . The only thing German about me is my name my folks gave me because my uncle's name is also Erwin....

If you're willing to take the time to do this, I think a number of us would appreciate it.

I have that one too, it's very good but there's only so much you can get out of a three piece band as far as taking a system for a ride. Copeland steals that show, and the drum recording helps make it obvious IMO.
Don't want to derail this thread too much but Jeff Beck Live At Ronnie Scott's is another BD that is really well done and there's a good variety of instruments and vocals on it as well.

I would definitely appreciate it. The most critical things would be the ones related to Video Direct feature, and maybe any details they share on the new SHARC decoders and how they're integrated into the existing board. Basically, anything we don't know/discuss here already!

I agree, it's not really a review, it's more like an information piece with a touch of bias regarding the cost of the upgrade rather than a review of the upgrdades' performance. From watching it he doesn't say the upgrade includes a new HDMI board, but rather that it requires an upgrade to the HDMI board.

For what it is worth if they plan to keep adding daughter boards to add features they may aswell look at a complete redesign and make a complete board otherwise you end up with a half working processor instead of a fall working 1...


as for the % maps no-1 truly know who's using what, the reality is it is likely the same board with a high price markup,,,


only a true idiot would compare an AVR to Processor...


then again compare 2 denon power amps either 5 xpa-2's or 9 xpa-1's in a ht context of sound and see which sounds better to your ears...

just my opinion i think emo amps would wipe the floor with denon amp when you start to compare output ratings..


and no i'm not a fan of emotiva, just stating fact of the white papers is all.. when you compare power ratings..