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Official Denon AVP-A1HD/AVP-A1HDCI and POA-A1HD/POA-A1HDCI owners thread. - Page 824

post #24691 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsr View Post

It's a Marantz that shares a lot of DNA with the Denon AVR-4520CI.

Very interesting.
post #24692 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikey mo View Post

Sorry, add another to the list of disappointed. I am happy with the 3D pass through. Otherwise, I'm sorry I spent the money. No S-Video input and no Owner's Manual. I don't consider that God Awful CD an Owner's Manual. No provision for Denon Link HD.

I must give credit for the SACD playback with the DVD A1 via Denon Link. Best audio playback when compared to the OPOO 95 and 103.

If your S-video doesn't work, you should have it repaired. That's not a consequence of the 3D upgrade.
post #24693 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

If that helps you keep the Denon longer , keep telling yourself that. biggrin.gif



The Marantz is a very nice unit as long as your happy with it that's the main thing. It's not a competition there is no winner. What I find quite funny is how members go out of there way never owning an AVP or have a so called friend having one and commenting how bad it is. What there aiming to achieve is beyond me I guess it's why there called Trolls.
post #24694 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsr View Post

if you really want a print out, it's pretty easy to print the manual.

My point is that I shouldn't have to. I think a grand spent deserves a dedicated printed easily referenced manual, and not some CD that is also applicable to a second separate product. I'm sure cost did not enter into Denon's decision to forgo a printed manual, rather, they just wanted to "save a tree".

I'm sorry to be so negative as I am actually generally very well pleased with my AVP. I just feel "taken" by the upgrade.
post #24695 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikey mo View Post

My point is that I shouldn't have to. I think a grand spent deserves a dedicated printed easily referenced manual, and not some CD that is also applicable to a second separate product. I'm sure cost did not enter into Denon's decision to forgo a printed manual, rather, they just wanted to "save a tree".

.

What they did for us here in Australia they actually had the manual printed and then binded. Very nice professional all the way.
post #24696 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Franin View Post

The Marantz is a very nice unit as long as your happy with it that's the main thing. It's not a competition there is no winner. What I find quite funny is how members go out of there way never owning an AVP or have a so called friend having one and commenting how bad it is. What there aiming to achieve is beyond me I guess it's why there called Trolls.

I have nothing but love for Denon and have had many wonderful pieces in my setup and I'm sure the AVP is all you guys say it is but as the 8801 is my first ever Marantz product I'll defend its reputation against subjective opinions. I'm even more flattered to own it simply because some AVP owners even consider it for replacement as there are supposedly better pre/pro's , that says alot! but to just call it something its not is bashing a well designed unit!

And if your happy with your gear you win wink.gif
post #24697 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikey mo View Post

My point is that I shouldn't have to. I think a grand spent deserves a dedicated printed easily referenced manual, and not some CD that is also applicable to a second separate product. I'm sure cost did not enter into Denon's decision to forgo a printed manual, rather, they just wanted to "save a tree".

I'm sorry to be so negative as I am actually generally very well pleased with my AVP. I just feel "taken" by the upgrade.

Welcome to 2013. I don't think any Denon AVR has come with a printed manual in 2 years.
post #24698 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

8801 is my first ever Marantz product I'll defend its reputation against subjective opinions.

Oh you will be especially where they jump into the Marantz thread and scrutinize it( its what we had endure on this thread ). Wont happen yet as its new but it will happen. The gate gets unlocked and the trolls come out to play.
Quote:
I'm even more flattered to own it simply because some AVP owners even consider it for replacement as there are supposedly better pre/pro's

I know if my AVP broke down I would look at it. Ive learnt the hard way I used to think gear comes first but actually it was the room and a professionally calibration.

Quote:
And if your happy with your gear you win wink.gif

I personally believe if you achieved your goals in sq then yes your a winner regardless what you have.
post #24699 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by WillyJ View Post

Not sure how the upgrade process was handled in Italy or the ROTW but here in the US, we dealt with an authorized Denon service company to handle the upgrade. In my case, I placed my order with the service company who then ordered the kit from Denon. The kit arrived approx. 10 days after the the service center ordered from Denon. When the kit arrived, I arranged to bring my AVP in and have the work done in the same day. If this process was similar in Italy, it sounds like your problem was with the service center not getting the kit from Denon in a prompt manner. That could be Denon or it could be the service center. Since 6 months has gone by before you were notified, it sounds to me like someone didn't follow-up and make sure the kit was on it's way. I would have been sweating it after 1 month much less 6 months.

You can still contact Denon directly and see if anything can be done because it sounds like there was a breakdown somewhere.

That's exactly what happened. The service for Denon Italy doesn't hold the update (too expensive, only ordered by request). After months of wait they told me that Denon Germany who is the authorized seller of the update says is no longer available.
I would like to contact some Denon Europe "boss" but i really don't know who and how.
If someone can help i will appreciate. Thanks, Luigi
post #24700 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by locutus2k View Post

That's exactly what happened. The service for Denon Italy doesn't hold the update (too expensive, only ordered by request). After months of wait they told me that Denon Germany who is the authorized seller of the update says is no longer available.
I would like to contact some Denon Europe "boss" but i really don't know who and how.
If someone can help i will appreciate. Thanks, Luigi

Daniel might know, haven't heard from him in awhile.
post #24701 of 25955
I just checked with Denon Headquarters in Mahwah NJ and they only have three kits left - in NJ where they keep the kits for distribution.

Get your orders and requests in NOW.
Edited by Digione - 3/14/13 at 12:21pm
post #24702 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by locutus2k View Post

That's exactly what happened. The service for Denon Italy doesn't hold the update (too expensive, only ordered by request). After months of wait they told me that Denon Germany who is the authorized seller of the update says is no longer available.
I would like to contact some Denon Europe "boss" but i really don't know who and how.
If someone can help i will appreciate. Thanks, Luigi

I can only tell you an e-mail address of a German authorized service center, I brought my AVP for the update: Info (khk-elektronik.de) info@khk-elektronik.de. I also checked the German web pages of Denon, but couldn't find any e-mail for you. It seems they only allow you to ask questions when you registered at their customers center.
As I wrote here before, the upgrade has vanished from the Denon web pages where it was always available until January. I wish you good luck and my account at Denon seems to be disabled. I have to enable it again and may be I can find an e-mail address for you there.

Good luck!
post #24703 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

I have nothing but love for Denon and have had many wonderful pieces in my setup and I'm sure the AVP is all you guys say it is but as the 8801 is my first ever Marantz product I'll defend its reputation against subjective opinions. I'm even more flattered to own it simply because some AVP owners even consider it for replacement as there are supposedly better pre/pro's , that says alot! but to just call it something its not is bashing a well designed unit!

And if your happy with your gear you win wink.gif

Well, I own both and I'm happy with both of them! smile.gif
post #24704 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

I have nothing but love for Denon and have had many wonderful pieces in my setup and I'm sure the AVP is all you guys say it is but as the 8801 is my first ever Marantz product I'll defend its reputation against subjective opinions. I'm even more flattered to own it simply because some AVP owners even consider it for replacement as there are supposedly better pre/pro's , that says alot! but to just call it something its not is bashing a well designed unit!

And if your happy with your gear you win wink.gif
Keep in mind that none of us were dissing the Marantz by saying that it shares a fair amount of the design with the Denon 4520. And when I say that, I don't mean that it's just a 4520 with the amps removed as I realize that there's more to it than that. I've also heard / seen the 8801 in action as a friend with Revel Salons (the original Salons, not the Salon 2's) owns an 8801 which he upgraded to from an Onkyo pre-pro. He's pretty happy with it and at the price point, I think it's the best choice out there, but I wouldn't trade my Denon AVP for it unless I needed the new features that the AVP just doesn't have.
post #24705 of 25955
Denon's Danish distributor hifiklubben.dk no longer have the AVP (or AVC) on their website, but they still have the 3D upgrade for 8,900 Danish kroner.

Al J.
post #24706 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by SJHT View Post

Well, I own both and I'm happy with both of them! smile.gif

Cant get better than that. smile.gif
post #24707 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by SJHT View Post

Well, I own both and I'm happy with both of them! smile.gif

Is your AVP upgraded? In an A/B comparison, how would you describe the 8801 sound qualities?
post #24708 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsr View Post

Keep in mind that none of us were dissing the Marantz by saying that it shares a fair amount of the design with the Denon 4520. And when I say that, I don't mean that it's just a 4520 with the amps removed as I realize that there's more to it than that. I've also heard / seen the 8801 in action as a friend with Revel Salons (the original Salons, not the Salon 2's) owns an 8801 which he upgraded to from an Onkyo pre-pro. He's pretty happy with it and at the price point, I think it's the best choice out there, but I wouldn't trade my Denon AVP for it unless I needed the new features that the AVP just doesn't have.

Again, I couldn't agree more. I completely share your opinion and motivation to keep the AVP. I haven't heard or tested the 4520 nor the 8801, but believe that they are both very good units which can make their owner happy - as you wrote gsr.

Before buying and also upgrading from an Onkyo PR-SC5509, I was thinking about buying the 8801. But I had the chance to buy the AVP for the same price as the AV 8801 for new. That was a no-brainer for me, because I read so many excellent reviews about the AVP, which I can confirm now and the 8801 has no features, I really need or can use currently.
Also, as we all have experienced already, the main stream AVRs and pre-pros, don't last this long whereas the AVP is something different, in my understanding.

I can only talk for myself but I wish all 4520 and 8801 owners a lot of fun with their new equipment.

But for me, I love my AVP and will keep it, as long as it will last and there is not a new feature that I really want to have and which will push me to upgrade. However, currently I don't see such kind of feature coming up and also 9.1 or 11.1 is - IMO - nice-to-have, not more.
post #24709 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ganymed4 View Post


I can only talk for myself but I wish all 4520 and 8801 owners a lot of fun with their new equipment.

Exactly!
post #24710 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ganymed4 View Post

I can only talk for myself but I wish all 4520 and 8801 owners a lot of fun with their new equipment.
Absolutely, and I have no doubts that they're both excellent products. I've got an AVR-4311CI in my bedroom system (just running that one with 2 speakers, not a full surround system) that I'm very happy with and the 4520 / 8801 should be an improvement over the 4311.
post #24711 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Franin View Post

I know if my AVP broke down I would look at it. Ive learnt the hard way I used to think gear comes first but actually it was the room and a professionally calibration..

Yup, I agree.

The only other option I'd look at would be if NAD were to put XT32 in their Master Series unit.
post #24712 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post


Yup, I agree.

The only other option I'd look at would be if NAD were to put XT32 in their Master Series unit.

Very true know that was a good unit. I regret selling that.
post #24713 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by dahlgren View Post

Is your AVP upgraded? In an A/B comparison, how would you describe the 8801 sound qualities?
Yes my AVP is upgraded. Read my previous posts. No real AB type comparison done. SJ
post #24714 of 25955
With my AVP functioning well since the 3D upgrade many moons ago I have found little reason to visit this thread for a while, but I think I need more help from the experts. When playing SACDs in multichannel from the DVD-A1UD in pure direct mode and using just the D-Link I seem to be getting no sound from the sub. The speaker settings are for LFE-Main, all 5 surround channels are set to small and the sub channel is on. The Pure-Direct setting is for Audyssey ON. Switching to video feeds (DVD and BD) the sub is active as usual. Can anyone trigger me into remembering a setting long forgotten because I used to get full 5.1, now it seems to be just 5.0.
post #24715 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJB of Poole View Post

With my AVP functioning well since the 3D upgrade many moons ago I have found little reason to visit this thread for a while, but I think I need more help from the experts. When playing SACDs in multichannel from the DVD-A1UD in pure direct mode and using just the D-Link I seem to be getting no sound from the sub. The speaker settings are for LFE-Main, all 5 surround channels are set to small and the sub channel is on. The Pure-Direct setting is for Audyssey ON. Switching to video feeds (DVD and BD) the sub is active as usual. Can anyone trigger me into remembering a setting long forgotten because I used to get full 5.1, now it seems to be just 5.0.

As far as I know the bass management is deactivated in pure direct. If you are talking about the AVP and not the A1-UD. I have the same effect, if I play stereo sources in direct mode. I have to use a DSP program like 'Stereo' that my sub-woofers are working. Please check your output display on the AVP, it usually shows on which channels output is generated. If the sub-woofers are not high-lighted, please try a DSP program.

Hope it helps.
Edited by Ganymed4 - 3/16/13 at 3:14pm
post #24716 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ganymed4 View Post

As far as I know the bass management is deactivated in pure direct. If you are talking about the AVP and not the A1-UD. I have the same effect, if I play stereo sources in direct mode. I have to use a DSP program like 'Stereo' that my sub-woofers are working. Please check your output display on the AVP, it usually shows on which channels output is generated. If the sub-woofers are not high-lighted, please try a DSP program.

Hope it helps.

Thanks for the response Ganymed4.

The sub channel does show on the AVP display - but the sub itself is not making any sound at all even during bass heavy music. I've tried the obvious noise checks to make sure it is functional - and it is. I suppose if bass management is deactivated, as you suggest, then the sub will only respond if the SACD is 5.1 - and most classical issues are not, they are largely 5.0. I set the option for the sub channel to be LFE+main to cover this. I use Quad 2905 L/R and 2805 C so I do want the deep bass filtered to the SW to protect the panels from excess!
post #24717 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJB of Poole View Post

Thanks for the response Ganymed4.

The sub channel does show on the AVP display - but the sub itself is not making any sound at all even during bass heavy music. I've tried the obvious noise checks to make sure it is functional - and it is. I suppose if bass management is deactivated, as you suggest, then the sub will only respond if the SACD is 5.1 - and most classical issues are not, they are largely 5.0. I set the option for the sub channel to be LFE+main to cover this. I use Quad 2905 L/R and 2805 C so I do want the deep bass filtered to the SW to protect the panels from excess!

Well, I understand your problem very well and you did - as far as I can judge - at least from logical point of view, the right thing. May be you can try to set the LFE channel back to LFE only and use this with a stereo CD and the 'Stereo' DSP program. Then the subwoofer should be active.
Sounds not very logical, but the DSP does the trick in this case. I also checked the manual and it says "Select "LFE+Main" if you want the bass signals to always be produced from the subwoofer". Well, this should work but in your case it doesn't. Even a 5.0 track should be output from the subwoofer using this setting.

Hmmmm :rolleyes:It must be some setting in the AVP. The last thing which come to my mind is the "Pure Direct" setting. But please try the CD and the "Direct" setting in the AVP. With "LFE+Main" it should send a signal to the subwoofer. If not, I would propose to switch the subwoofer to THX and try the same with 'Direct' and 'Stereo' setting and see what happens.
You should also try the 5.0 SACD signal with 'Dolby PLIIx" or another DSP setting. I mean this is not pure direct and may change the sound quite a bit. However, the AVP is this good in my understanding that the differences are bearable - I hope. This depends on you and your listening habits.

After thinking it through, it might be the combination of "Pure Direct" and "LFE+Main" which is not working. I will check it for you.

PS: Page 82/83 of the original manual shows the "Surround Modes and Parameters" and shows for 'Pure Direct' that the subwoofer is "turned on or off by speaker configuration", that must be the "LFE+Main" and that the LFE is on "when playing DD, DTS DVDA and SACD". May be your setting is right then. I am using 'THX' for the subwoofer and I don't get any sound from it using "Direct".
Edited by Ganymed4 - 3/17/13 at 7:08am
post #24718 of 25955
I have a POA-A1HDCI hooked up to an AVR-5308CI(A) and would like to replace the AVR-5308CI with a AVP-A1HDCI(A) and a second POA-A1HDCI but am tentative about the pre-amp as new products are coming out to support 4k video and 11.x surround. I already have an AVR-4520CI for the sun room and kinda like the idea of having both front wides and front wides instead of an either/or situation. Does anyone know if a replacement is planned for the AVP? Maybe an AVP-A1HDCI(B)?
post #24719 of 25955
I don't recall any talk of a new AVP. It might be a one-of.

I think in your case the decision is technology vs sound quality, IMO the latter is less important as the amount of channels go up. So if you do a lot of music, like Blu Ray, SACD etc., along with stereo the AVP might be worth giving up technology for. But if you're mostly movies, then stick to a flagship receiver and get the corresponding technology.
post #24720 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJB of Poole View Post

Thanks for the response Ganymed4.

The sub channel does show on the AVP display - but the sub itself is not making any sound at all even during bass heavy music. I've tried the obvious noise checks to make sure it is functional - and it is. I suppose if bass management is deactivated, as you suggest, then the sub will only respond if the SACD is 5.1 - and most classical issues are not, they are largely 5.0. I set the option for the sub channel to be LFE+main to cover this. I use Quad 2905 L/R and 2805 C so I do want the deep bass filtered to the SW to protect the panels from excess!

Meanwhile I tested for you. It is as I wrote. I have about seven multichannel classical FLAC files two are 5.1, five are 5.0 - as you wrote. I can see that if I use 'Multichannel Direct' that in the input there are only five channels but the output shows 6, plus the subwoofer. However, there is no sound from the subwoofer. Exactly as you wrote.

But if I switch to DTS Neo:X or Dolby PLIIx I get the subwoofer. Sounds great this surround classical music. Really an experience with the AVP. I am playing from my Windows 2012 essentials server with DLNA, via my Oppo 103 via HDMI to the AVP. Works fine.
Well, it works well, if you are using a DSP program. Also, one of the big advantages of the Denon for me: The DSP programs are not deteriorating the sound as much as other AVRs does. The AVP is the first pre-pro, I like to listen with DSP activated and not only straight decoding of the tracks.
This is since I have excellent Audionet power-amps. Since then, and with my Onkyo before, only the straight decoding was how I wanted to listen to Blu-Rays. Any DSP would really make the sound worse. I can hear this effect a little bit with the AVP. But it is not this strong anymore, may be 95% less.
I mean, you may think different but I guess there is no way then to get the subwoofer running, even it should with "LFE+Main" in my understanding. I didn't change my setting from 'THX' and didn't test this. Don't want to interfere too much with the settings from the Audyssey Pro measurement.
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