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Official Denon AVP-A1HD/AVP-A1HDCI and POA-A1HD/POA-A1HDCI owners thread. - Page 831

post #24901 of 25955
Excuse me posting this love letter about the AVP, especially with somebody a bit unhappy about giving his away.

This is about my very own and personal experience with the AVP. I am a relatively new owner of a used AVP since December 2012. I guess most of you own it already for a longer period of time.

A bit on the background: As many of us - I guess, I am also infected by the HT virus. Always improving this and tweaking that. My current starting point was a Marantz MM8803 and Onkyo PR-SC5507. There was other gear before but I don't want to write an endless story here.
The 5507 is a pre/pro with Audyssey XT, Then I changed to the 5509 with XT 32 - an overall improvement. Then I changed the MM8803 into one Audionet AMP V - may be not so well known outside of Germany her is a link to the English pages, just for those interested http://www.audionet.de/main/zuhause/page.html?L=en
This was an 'ear-opener' and as a result, I bought an additional AMP VII to have nine channels. That was a really big improvement, compared to the Marantz.. Well, the price difference is huge, you can buy more than seven Marantz MM8003 for these two power amps.
Another thing is, that my HT room is not acoustically treated - I can't because it is our living room and I thought my speakers are inferior, even this is a 7.2 THX U2 system. But I got some doubts that they may be not so inferior, because I could always hear the improvement in the electronics.
I kept all this for several months in the respective new configuration after changing something again. Made several listening tests which various material.
The last change was now the AVP and boy, how did this improve the sound. The sound is now free floating in front of the speakers and became so precise, that I am always amazed how good this sounds listening to music or film. Well, music is the weak point of my THX U2 set, but I don't expect miracles regarding music from THX speakers.
However, the AVP together with the Audionet amps did unlock the full potential of the speakers and I couldn't be happier. I will keep the AVP until it dies.
Regarding the room acoustics and the speakers, I would say, there is not more which can be done to improve the sound.

I am also writing this, because many people say, that instead of investing money into better electronics you should invest in better speakers. However, my example showed me, that this is not always true and that you can also improve the sound by better electronics. I would say that both should somehow match and that also room acoustics play a big role.

I hope I didn't bother or bored you with the long story and it is just my personal, true experience.
post #24902 of 25955
Thanks for sharing!
post #24903 of 25955
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Franin View Post

Let us know how you go with the Audyssey XT32, how it sounds.

Hey there Frank!smile.gif

I did a first run of Audyssey today, just to see what it was going to do. As far as speaker distance placement, the results were almost spot on. As far as the other things, it set the crossovers at:

Front 40Hz
Center 60Hz
Surround 60Hz
Surround Back 80Hz

And the Levels at:

Front L - 3.0db
Front R - 2.5db
Center 0.0db
Subwoofer 1 - 10db
Subwoofer 2 - 10db

When it did the first mic placement calibration, it told me my subs were set too high and needed to be lowered. It mentioned something about sub leveling, and had an option to select that. I did, and it said to lower the subwoofer volume knob until it showed 75db. I did this, but in order to reach that db I had to lower the volume knob down to 2 (it goes from 0-10) on sub 1 and down to 4 on sub 2. The channel level it set for LFE was -10 for both subs.

At these settings the bass output is pathetic! I can fart with more bass than this!Lol!tongue.gif Nearly non existent bass with it set at these levels and settings. So what do you guys recommend? Should I set my subs volume control up to the 12 O clock position (half point), and just go past the sub leveling option? I want bass!smile.gif

Thanks in advance guys.wink.gif


Seth
Edited by ohyeah32 - 4/10/13 at 11:15pm
post #24904 of 25955
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Waboman View Post

Hey there, amigo.

There's a new beta firmware update to our 103's. One of the issues addressed is sync adjustments. You may want to update your player and try it with your AVP. Then you can return the Marantz and all will be right in the HT world.wink.gif

Very very interesting! When I called Oppo some weeks back about the ability to adjust audio sync in the player, I was told no it does not do that...but! an upcoming firmware will offer a lip sync correction function. At that point he didn't mention as to when it would be available. I am very tempted to try the beta version now available, but being that it is a beta version, there could still be a few kinks that need to be worked out before they do an official release. So I will most likely wait until that gets released.

Once it does (which hopefully is soon), I will give it a go with my AVP and see what happens. If it does indeed work, then there will be no need to keep the 8801. I've only had the 8801 for a week, so I have a good chance to return it if the official update is available this week or next.

The 8801 is by no means a poor performer, and if I had to stay with it, I'd be happy. But if I really had my rathers, I'd use the AVP, as its flexibility is simply the best!

Once the firmware update is officially released I'll let you know how it goes, and if it corrects the audio sync with 3D Blu-ray's.
post #24905 of 25955
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsr View Post

I suspect that wouldn't help him as the setting is global - it can't be tweaked differently for 2D and 3D output, for example. In Seth's case, he was only having the issue with 3D, so he'd have to adjust the setting every time he switches from 2D to 3D or vice versa. Given his results so far using a single HDMI connection through the 8801, I'm pretty confident that upgrading his AVP to get 3D passthrough also would have resolved the issue.

While I don't own two Oppo 103's, I do own an Oppo 93. "If" the 103 firmware update allows me to adjust enough to correct the sync on 3D Blu-ray's, then I can use my 93 for all 2D Blu-ray's. I wonder if Oppo is also releasing a firmware update for the 93 that allows for lip sync adjustment? If they do, that would be nice, as that way I could use the 93 for 3D and the 103 for all 2D. Reason being is that my 103 is an all region player (hardware modified), and I have a ton of region B locked 2D Blu-ray's. If the update is strictly for the 103, then I would have to change the lip sync adjustment every time I want to see a region B Blu-ray, which would kinda suck.

And there is no guarantee that getting my AVP upgraded will correct the audio sync issue. The Marantz that I have now initially didn't correct the sync issue on its own by just connecting the Oppo 103 directly to the 8801, and then to the TV. I had to manually adjust the audio delay to 197 ms in order for it to sync up. On my AVP I went from 0 ms all the way to 200 ms, and it had no effect at all! So even with 3D pass-through, there is no way to know if the audio delay adjustment will work correctly.
post #24906 of 25955
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielo View Post

I think he made a mistake not to upgrade the AVP and would still try to find a upgrade kit if i would be him for one thing it will up the value of his AVP. But if he needs 2 different delays why not get 2 103's seems like a small deal compared to having less sound. Within the limited time i had with the 8801 + xt32 compared to the AVP + xt32 on music it was not the same. Not saying it sounded bad but it missed the same amount of focus, placement and that some songs just came into the room and hit you on the head.

Its a pity my playtime with a attached 8801 was so short, i can and probably will play with it some more with the headphones no way ill connect it to the POA again.

Daniel.

Believe me, if there had been a place that was close enough to me that was doing the upgrade, I would have had my AVP upgraded a year ago. Being that I don't live anywhere near one, I would have to either drive a very long distance to personally deliver it, or ship it out of state via freight, which in itself could be a very expensive option.

And I have a 103 and a 93 (plus a Denon A1UD and Denon 2500BT). So I have no shortage of 2D Blu-ray players to use.smile.gif
post #24907 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohyeah32 View Post

Hey there Frank!smile.gif


At these settings the bass output is pathetic! I can fart with more bass than this!Lol!tongue.gif Nearly non existent bass with it set at these levels and settings. So what do you guys recommend? Should I set my subs volume control up to the 12 O clock position (half point), and just go past the sub leveling option? I want bass!smile.gif

Thanks in advance guys.wink.gif

Seth

Weird, as some might know by now i have the habit to document things smile.gif. So when i calibrated the 8801 i took screenshots of the result. I didn't change my settings on the sub from the avp and the result came in about the same (if you take the non-bridging into account).

During the calibration process it didn't complain and was painless, the method changes a little with the 'pre-check' for the subs but this is also the case with a AVP-3D now. I only had about 2 hours but the differences between audyssey on/off where there and a step up. The bass to me didn't sound off base on the few things i got to test before the 8801 gave up the ghost.

Maybe you pressed yes on the question to turn Dynamic Volume on by default ?

my results :



Daniel.
post #24908 of 25955
By the way does the Marantz ping the subs all together?
post #24909 of 25955
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielo View Post

Weird, as some might know by now i have the habit to document things smile.gif. So when i calibrated the 8801 i took screenshots of the result. I didn't change my settings on the sub from the avp and the result came in about the same (if you take the non-bridging into account).

During the calibration process it didn't complain and was painless, the method changes a little with the 'pre-check' for the subs but this is also the case with a AVP-3D now. I only had about 2 hours but the differences between audyssey on/off where there and a step up. The bass to me didn't sound off base on the few things i got to test before the 8801 gave up the ghost.

Maybe you pressed yes on the question to turn Dynamic Volume on by default ?

my results :



Daniel.

Very cool that when you ran Audyssey on the 8801 that it set the levels at pretty much the same as the way they were set on your AVP. I did press yes for it to turn on Dynamic Volume, as it was something I always had turned on with my AVP.
post #24910 of 25955
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Franin View Post

By the way does the Marantz ping the subs all together?

Hi, Frank,

From what I saw, it pinged each sub separately and then together on mic position 1. On each subsequent position, it did them together if I remember correctly. How does it do it on the upgraded AVP?

I went ahead and did another Audyssey run today, as I wasn't overly happy with the way the first one sounded (the left rear and left surround output was a tad higher than I liked). So I did a tighter mic placement arrangement and the results were much more pleasing. After I got out of the menu for Audyssey, I gave it a listen. Good but a bit too aggressive in the surrounds. On my Denon AVP I always used Dynamic Volume set to day, and I loved the sound with it engaged. So I did the same with this one, only instead of day, it has it as light.

I gave it a listen again (using the Blu-ray of Rush Hour 3), and this time it sounded really good. I did have to bump up the subs a good bit (approx 7db), but now the LFE on movies sounds very nice.smile.gif And the Buttkickers in the HT seats are actually a lot more active now, as the increase in sub level also increased the amount of LFE going out via the RCA subwoofer pre-outs (which I use to connect the Buttkicker amp). I'm going to leave it all set this way for a week and see how I like it. If it sounds really good with a variety of material, it's going to stay this way.

I watched The Losers on Blu-ray, and the sound was pretty amazing.smile.gif Can't say that it bests the sound I was getting from my Denon AVP, but so far I like what I'm hearing.smile.gif
post #24911 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohyeah32 View Post

Hi, Frank,

From what I saw, it pinged each sub separately and then together on mic position 1. On each subsequent position, it did them together if I remember correctly. How does it do it on the upgraded AVP?

I went ahead and did another Audyssey run today, as I wasn't overly happy with the way the first one sounded (the left rear and left surround output was a tad higher than I liked). So I did a tighter mic placement arrangement and the results were much more pleasing. After I got out of the menu for Audyssey, I gave it a listen. Good but a bit too aggressive in the surrounds. On my Denon AVP I always used Dynamic Volume set to day, and I loved the sound with it engaged. So I did the same with this one, only instead of day, it has it as light.

I gave it a listen again (using the Blu-ray of Rush Hour 3), and this time it sounded really good. I did have to bump up the subs a good bit (approx 7db), but now the LFE on movies sounds very nice.smile.gif And the Buttkickers in the HT seats are actually a lot more active now, as the increase in sub level also increased the amount of LFE going out via the RCA subwoofer pre-outs (which I use to connect the Buttkicker amp). I'm going to leave it all set this way for a week and see how I like it. If it sounds really good with a variety of material, it's going to stay this way.

I watched The Losers on Blu-ray, and the sound was pretty amazing.smile.gif Can't say that it bests the sound I was getting from my Denon AVP, but so far I like what I'm hearing.smile.gif

Its good to read your getting there smile.gif
post #24912 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohyeah32 View Post


When it did the first mic placement calibration, it told me my subs were set too high and needed to be lowered. It mentioned something about sub leveling, and had an option to select that. I did, and it said to lower the subwoofer volume knob until it showed 75db. I did this, but in order to reach that db I had to lower the volume knob down to 2 (it goes from 0-10) on sub 1 and down to 4 on sub 2. The channel level it set for LFE was -10 for both subs.

At these settings the bass output is pathetic! I can fart with more bass than this!Lol!tongue.gif Nearly non existent bass with it set at these levels and settings. So what do you guys recommend? Should I set my subs volume control up to the 12 O clock position (half point), and just go past the sub leveling option? I want bass!smile.gif

Thanks in advance guys.wink.gif


Seth

This is exactly the same effect, I discovered when using XT32 with my former Onkyo. Really exactly the same. This kind of measurement is the SubEQ HT function - one time separate, all subsequent together - which was not ''wanted' by Denon for the AVP, as Chris from Audyssey told me.
When I switched from the Onkyo to upgraded AVP, the leveling of the subs was different. I could turn the sub volume knobs up to aprrox. 11 o'clock. Before that with the Onkyo about 9 o'clock.
This kind of quite different behavior made me ask Chris from Audyssey if there could be a difference in the implementation or the code they give to the manufacturers for implementing Audyssey, but he denied. They all get the same code and 75 dB is 75 dB. I am still puzzled why there is such big difference and have no answer...

PS: I have moved from the Onkyo 5507 with XT - twelve o'clock - to the 5509 with XT32 - sub level 75 dB and 8 to 9 o'clock - to the AVP - sub level 75 dB and 11 to 12 o'clock. I have no explanation.
Edited by Ganymed4 - 4/12/13 at 1:31pm
post #24913 of 25955
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ganymed4 View Post

This is exactly the same effect, I discovered when using XT32 with my former Onkyo. Really exactly the same. This kind of measurement is the SubEQ HT function - one time separate, all subsequent together - which was not ''wanted' by Denon for the AVP, as Chris from Audyssey told me.
When I switched from the Onkyo to upgraded AVP, the leveling of the subs was different. I could turn the sub volume knobs up to aprrox. 11 o'clock. Before that with the Onkyo about 9 o'clock.
This kind of quite different behavior made me ask Chris from Audyssey if there could be a difference in the implementation or the code they give to the manufacturers for implementing Audyssey, but he denied. They all get the same code and 75 dB is 75 dB. I am still puzzled why there is such big difference and have no answer...

PS: I have moved from the Onkyo 5507 with XT - twelve o'clock - to the 5509 with XT32 - sub level 75 dB and 8 to 9 o'clock - to the AVP - sub level 75 dB and 11 to 12 o'clock. I have no explanation.

That is very interesting! I'm curious, how does the Denon AVP do the sub calibration with XT32?
post #24914 of 25955
The Denon AVP does it without SubEQ-HT, which means that each sub is calibrated on it's own. Each cycle measures each sub, if you have more than one.

However, this doesn't explain the 75 dB setting to me to be so different. I used it with the Pro-Kit and it was nearly the same as without.
post #24915 of 25955
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ganymed4 View Post

The Denon AVP does it without SubEQ-HT, which means that each sub is calibrated on it's own. Each cycle measures each sub, if you have more than one.

However, this doesn't explain the 75 dB setting to me to be so different. I used it with the Pro-Kit and it was nearly the same as without.

Interesting. I knew that Denon wanted the implementation different, I just didn't know how it was different. Thanks.
post #24916 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohyeah32 View Post

Interesting. I knew that Denon wanted the implementation different, I just didn't know how it was different. Thanks.

You are very welcome and this issue was already discussed some pages before. I got the information from Chris from Audyssey and I had the Onkyo 5509 before, which also had SubEQ HT. The main difference seems to be that if you have two or more subwoofer they are measured separately in the first cycle and for all subsequent measurements together.
But it seems, the algorithms are not changed. This is only an assumption, because Denon did not use the SubEQHT option for their XT32 implementation, which could also cause the low subwoofer levels. I am just guessing. If SubEQ HT would be much better, I guess that Denon would also implemented it. I don't think, they would not use it because of the cost. This can't be the reason in my understanding. It must be something about quality when they tested it and decided not to use SubEQ HT.

From the sound point of view, I didn't recognize any dramatic differences. But I didn't compare them side by side.
Edited by Ganymed4 - 4/15/13 at 12:06pm
post #24917 of 25955
A lot of talk on the Marantz AV8801 thread about downsampling when Audyssey is running. Does the AVP downsample to 48Khz?

"According to this review published yesterday on Anthem's Room Correction system (ARC) by Dr. David A. Rich on Secrets of Home Theater and High Fidelity's website, the AV8801 down-samples high-resolution signals to 48KHz/sec when applying Audyssey MultEQ XT32."
post #24918 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by dahlgren View Post

A lot of talk on the Marantz AV8801 thread about downsampling when Audyssey is running. Does the AVP downsample to 48Khz?

"According to this review published yesterday on Anthem's Room Correction system (ARC) by Dr. David A. Rich on Secrets of Home Theater and High Fidelity's website, the AV8801 down-samples high-resolution signals to 48KHz/sec when applying Audyssey MultEQ XT32."

Interesting. Here is the link to the relevant part of the article: http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/audio-calibration/audio-calibration-reviews/anthem-room-correction-arc-system-part-1/page-9-room-gain.html

The upgraded AVP uses the exact same three 4th generation Analog Devices ADSP21487 DSPs as the 8801. So it would not be totally irrational to assume it has the same behavior.
post #24919 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by xjr100 View Post

I've replaced my Denon AVC-A1SRA with AVP-A1HDA and found the following:
AVP accepts all kind of stereo signals 16/44.1, 20/44.1(HDCD), 24/88.2, 24/96, 24/192, and outputs them to preout, so, you can hear it,
but recording outputs are silent for hi-res stereo. So, no sound if you feed it with 24/96 or 24/192.

I've been adviced by Denon to do hard reset. I've saved my configuration, it took some time and saved file, but AVP alwas go to "saving" and do not restart itself as written on WEB controlling.
Another bad thing - I cannot load my configuration back - it shows "loading" and WEB says

Load Not Completed
Please retr:y again .

Waiting for 15-20-30min: still "loading" eek.gif

What could be the problem?

It was serios mistake to do hard reset before trying loading configuration. So, awaiting help from community....
post #24920 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by xjr100 View Post

I've been adviced by Denon to do hard reset. I've saved my configuration, it took some time and saved file, but AVP alwas go to "saving" and do not restart itself as written on WEB controlling.
Another bad thing - I cannot load my configuration back - it shows "loading" and WEB says

Load Not Completed
Please retr:y again .

Waiting for 15-20-30min: still "loading" eek.gif

What could be the problem?

It was serios mistake to do hard reset before trying loading configuration. So, awaiting help from community....

I have hard reset and saved and loaded many .dat files using Firefox on my MAC, you cannot use Safari. A PC and Internet Explorer works fine to. It takes about 10 minutes to save and 15 minutes to load and has always restarted as expected after a save or load.

Please check that you have saved a valid .dat file, it should be about 745KB. It is not uncommon for the AVP to create and save an empty .dat file. You can open it using a simple text editor to make sure that it is full of a lot of text at the head that defines the various input names and then a large amount of random data should fill most of the remaining file. If it is empty then sorry, you will have to program your AVP all over again. Also make sure that you are using a hardwired connection and that the network radio is not running.

Hope that this helps.
post #24921 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Digione View Post

I have hard reset and saved and loaded many .dat files using Firefox on my MAC, you cannot use Safari. A PC and Internet Explorer works fine to. It takes about 10 minutes to save and 15 minutes to load and has always restarted as expected after a save or load.

Please check that you have saved a valid .dat file, it should be about 745KB. It is not uncommon for the AVP to create and save an empty .dat file. You can open it using a simple text editor to make sure that it is full of a lot of text at the head that defines the various input names and then a large amount of random data should fill most of the remaining file. If it is empty then sorry, you will have to program your AVP all over again. Also make sure that you are using a hardwired connection and that the network radio is not running.

Hope that this helps.
Thanks for advice - my config.dat is 512kb and with "NULL"s inside. mad.gif

Initial problem is with saving then. I used both - IE and Mozila - made 2 backups, but they are identical - 512kb and empty.

What could be my problem with saving config?
post #24922 of 25955
Although I've written the below for the lower Denon models ,, the tips still likley apply with the AVP as well (aside from file size) ...

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1334369/the-official-denon-avr-xx12-model-owners-thread/0_100#user_E10
post #24923 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam S View Post

Interesting. Here is the link to the relevant part of the article: http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/audio-calibration/audio-calibration-reviews/anthem-room-correction-arc-system-part-1/page-9-room-gain.html

The upgraded AVP uses the exact same three 4th generation Analog Devices ADSP21487 DSPs as the 8801. So it would not be totally irrational to assume it has the same behavior.

Thank you all for this information. Really interesting, however, I have my doubts that this kind of measurement really can prove that downsampling takes place. Also, this is coming from a competitor.
But what you are writing is absolutely reasonable.

But I have some doubts, that the measurement method is correct to allow the conclusion that downsampling is used in the AVR. This could also only mean that the AVR is not able to output signals over 20 kHz or in the ultrasonic range.
Downsampling itself would require an additional piece of hardware or software. The latter would also need some processing power and I have my doubts, this would make sense.

However, it could be true and I asked Audyssey about this issue. When I have an answer, I will post it here.
Edited by Ganymed4 - 4/18/13 at 6:42am
post #24924 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Although I've written the below for the lower Denon models ,, the tips still likley apply with the AVP as well (aside from file size) ...

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1334369/the-official-denon-avr-xx12-model-owners-thread/0_100#user_E10
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Although I've written the below for the lower Denon models ,, the tips still likley apply with the AVP as well (aside from file size) ...

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1334369/the-official-denon-avr-xx12-model-owners-thread/0_100#user_E10
Tried your tips with Power Saving ON and OFF, and after trying to save confg - all times I get 512kb with NULLs. Moreover, it just resetted itself to default and lost calibration again.

Any ideas what could be wrong?
post #24925 of 25955
Double post deleted
post #24926 of 25955
OK, here is the answer from Audyssey.

John Hager, Apr 18 09:55 am (PDT):
Hello
I could not answer how each AVR processes sampling rates as this is not an Audyssey issue. Our algorithms can work at any sampling rate if we are given sufficient processing resources. It is up to each manufacturer how they are used.
But as to whether this really matters, let's also look at some facts:
1. Speakers are limited on the high frequency end by the upper limit of the tweeter. Even with the questionable use of super tweeters one would have a hard time delivering anything above 30 kHz in the room
2. Microphones rarely have a usable response out there, but some do
So, even in the most extreme case the maximum sampling rate needed to process the measured acoustical responses in a room is 60 kHz (I am being generous here).
Content, on the other hand, can be converted from analog to digital using any sampling rate one can find. I can certainly see the marketing reasons behind "more is better" in this industry as they exist in almost every industry. However, the internal representation of the data on a disk or in a file has little to do with acoustics.
So, it would be a complete and utter waste of perfectly good processing power to start applying MultEQ XT32 filters at 192 kHz. What would there be to correct acoustically at half that frequency? Silence from the speaker and silence from the mic signal…
Let's use the processing power for something useful instead: more channels. That revolution is just starting and there is much more to come in the home.
________________________________________

Apr 18 05:15 am (PDT):
Dear Sirs and Madams,
I found this link on AVS forum: http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/audio-calibration/audio-calibration-reviews/anthem-room-correction-arc-system-part-1/page-9-room-gain.html
It is about the missing processor capacity in a Marantz AV8801 and the need to down sample hires signals to 48 kHz to be processed by Audyssey.
I understand that it was just measured - as the article states – by sending a 30 kHz signal sampled with 96k through the AVR and it was checked, whether it will appear at the outputs or not.
As far as my knowledge goes, I doubt if this an indication for down-sampling in the AVR or not and I can clearly see who was writing this article.
My question now is: Is this true and does it apply e.g. to an Denon AVP A1 3D?
Thank you in advance for answering my question.
post #24927 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by xjr100 View Post


Tried your tips with Power Saving ON and OFF, and after trying to save confg - all times I get 512kb with NULLs. Moreover, it just resetted itself to default and lost calibration again.

Any ideas what could be wrong?

You need to start from scratch from a hard reset, I know that this is painful but you have already lost all your data. eek.gif Does your AVP hard reset correctly, do you get the 1 sec flashing display intervals on the front display?

A null file is exactly what my AVP will create if the Internet radio is turned on or selected. Did you make sure that the internet radio is off? That means STOPPING and selected station, NOT just selecting another input. Power savings should be OFF.

The final size of the file depends upon whether you have height and or wide speakers selected and whether you have accomplished an Audyssey EQ run. It just should not be full of nulls.

This issue is known by Denon and I have reported it as a bug together with a DL4 bug, neither has yet been fixed. The null file can even occur when everything is apparently OK and I have recorded several such files and sent them to Denon. That is why you MUST check them once saved.

I assume that you can log into the AVP using your browser and select the save function. What does the browser web application show when it is saving the file? My network monitor shows consist bursts of up and down data speeds of 3.2KB/s for most of the 10/15 minute process. Does the AVP display show saving and then reboot after the web interface says completed? This shows that the web interface and save routine is working properly. Also when the AVP goes into save mode you should hear a relay click inside the AVP, (can't remember for load). If the AVP does not reboot after the save you may have a firmware/hardware problem and you need to check to see if you have all the latest firmware using the update feature.

What computer are you using?

Please let me know how things progress, sorry for your pain and frustration.
Edited by Digione - 4/18/13 at 12:07pm
post #24928 of 25955
Digione, PC is Fujitsu S7110 with WinXP Pro and IE8 + Mozila.
AVP shows that Firmware is latest.

The bahavior is the following: with browser after pressing "save" it goes to black screen with clicks and "Saving", it thinks for 30-60sec, then prompt for file download with 512K. After I select file name and press "save" file download starts - maybe another minute or so .

1, Press "Save Config" button.
OK
2, FL display "Saving" after POWER LED lit red.
OK
3, Please wait about 5 minutes.
30-60sec, OK
4, Select "save" in File Download dialog. Please use alphanumeric, do not use "space".
ex. C:\DENON\config.dat
OK
5, Save is completed after file is downloaded.
OK
and here is black screen on TV and "saving" on AVP
6, AV AMP is restarted automatically.
No, even after 20min of waiting.

Behavior is same - no matter which browser is used.

I do not use internet radio, hard reset done 3 times sequentially with waiting each time at least 5 frontlid flashes. If after hard reset inetradio somehow work as background process - let me know how to disable it.

Connectivity is quite simple:
SAT -> HDMI
Dune HD Base 3.0 -> HDMI
Denon DVD-2930 -> HDMI + DLink
Sony SA5ES -> Analog
LX5090H -> Optical
AVP -> LX5090H HDMI
AVP -> D-Link DIR-300 RJ45
PC- > D-Link DIR-300 Wireless
post #24929 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by xjr100 View Post

Digione, PC is Fujitsu S7110 with WinXP Pro and IE8 + Mozila.
AVP shows that Firmware is latest.

The bahavior is the following: with browser after pressing "save" it goes to black screen with clicks and "Saving", it thinks for 30-60sec, then prompt for file download with 512K. After I select file name and press "save" file download starts - maybe another minute or so .

You can only turn the internet radio off, if it is on, by selecting Network as your source, selecting the radio station and pressing stop on your remote. However, after a hard reboot no internet streams should be running.

There should be very little delay after you have asked to save the file through the web GUI, it should happen almost instantly with "Saving" appearing in the AVP window.

It sounds like you are doing all the correct operations but if the AVP does not reboot after the save command then I have to assume that there is something wrong with it, hence the empty .dat files.

Just to confirm that you are using a hard wired network connection to your PC, not wireless correct? Remember that if you have both copper and wireless connectivity available at the same time to the AVP it will normally default to hard wired, make sure that it has.

I think that it may be time to contact Denon service unless another AVP owner can help out here.

Good luck.
post #24930 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by dahlgren View Post

A lot of talk on the Marantz AV8801 thread about downsampling when Audyssey is running. Does the AVP downsample to 48Khz?

"According to this review published yesterday on Anthem's Room Correction system (ARC) by Dr. David A. Rich on Secrets of Home Theater and High Fidelity's website, the AV8801 down-samples high-resolution signals to 48KHz/sec when applying Audyssey MultEQ XT32."

Since the 8801 is a 4520 from the digital side and we know the hardware layout between the upgrade card and the 3 dsp's on the 4520 are the same its a good guess they are doing the same level of computation on them. Now the 8801 can have more channels so not 100% sure but still.

The tricky point here is almost analog thinking vs digital. Many people from the analog side would argue that any limiting is bad and only the purest signal is best in your room so making something 'pure' from 0hz to 100khz is always the best. Coming from the digital side its always a compromise you KNOW that converting analog to digital will gain you options (either to reduce size, make it more resilient, apply room eq) but it comes at a cost always. Digital people are much more realistic they know that they only have so much mips (computing power) available and will optimise where it makes most sense for the end result. Say they feel audyssey will improve sound in 80% of the rooms by 20% vs loosing some signal above 24khz that has less or no effect on most people they will not even think about it and make the compromise.

I was working in the tv/radio space years ago when the analog vs digital for storage was a big deal (and for long time storage not a bad discussion) and it had the same weird logic if scanning video or audio to digital was a good idea. Yes converting it from analog came at a loss but to me it sounded much better than the reality of the day where they had to hire people who's job it was to check analog tapes/prints and throw them away when they went bad and having content lost forever. The reality is anything encoded at that time period in mpeg2 was saved forever and people will be happy to play it in 40 years.

Daniel.
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