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Official Denon AVP-A1HD/AVP-A1HDCI and POA-A1HD/POA-A1HDCI owners thread. - Page 104

post #3091 of 25955
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post


Here's the boom boom in my room;


Wow that is one amazing setup! I'll bet it sounds awesome! That photo would look very much at home on our AVP/POA owners system photo gallery thread.


Seth
post #3092 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohyeah32 View Post

Wow that is one amazing setup! I'll bet it sounds awesome! That photo would look very much at home on our AVP/POA owners system photo gallery thread.


Seth

Thanks Seth, it does sound awsome, to me anyways. I plan to post pics there once my AVP arrives.
post #3093 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Franin View Post

Mate Im crossing my fingers for you and I know how you will be feeiling at the moment.Hope it sorts itself quickly because at that price it should not of happened.

+1 Yeah, I really hope they get this resolved quickly for you, Stenvik. It's such a huge buzz-kill when your great new (expensive) piece of equipment has a problem like this. It's kind of like that first dent in your new car.... it just sucks. Well, it looks like you have another cool consumer benefit that could work to your advantage here* (replacement if repair takes more than 8 days), so I'm hoping you just end up with a brand-spanking new unit soon. Ideally, one that already has all the latest firmware!

* Here's my reasoning, which has no basis whatsoever: These units are so new, there probably aren't a lot of replacement parts floating around yet. Ergo, they can replace the whole AVP much faster than they can get just a video board.... Sounds good anyway.
post #3094 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by stenvik View Post

I have tested this cec feature with mine new pioneer plasma. I know there are some avp owners with pioneer/elite gen 2 kuro/gen 9 owners. Have they tested cec option of their avp - pioneer/elite ?

Mine little experience about this is -> turned it off.... silly thing about this:
I'm listening to music, turn on tv, avp changes to tv source.. Not something I want at all

I haven't tested this feature with my new Pioneer yet, but I turned it off after weird behavior with my Sony. I didn't even realize it was turned on, and all the sudden inputs were getting changed automatically when we didn't want it. I just turned the whole HDMI control feature off. Considering the way we program our remotes to do everything anyway, I'm not clear what advantage it even offers. I'd be curious to hear from someone who actually uses it whether it really does offer anything our remotes don't.
post #3095 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Franin View Post

regardless I still thinks this needs to be done so if we ever get a screwey update we should have the option to go back until they fix it without having to send back the unit to fix a firmware problem.

I think you're right, Frank. These things are basically specific-application computers, and I would never buy a computer without having a copy of the original operating system handy. Twenty-five years of experience with computers tells me that EVERY computer can fail at some point, and you need to have a way to restore it to its original state and start over. I hadn't thought of it before you mentioned it, Frank, but you're absolutely right: the AVP should ship with a disc or USB dongle that contains the factory firmware. That would save users, and Denon, a lot of hassle.
post #3096 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Franin View Post

BTW it would be nice to find out what caused it too fail.

I think I just had a faulty unit from day one.

Can't say whether firmware updates caused the problems. My guess is the updates did not.

When I get my new AVP, hopefully I won't have the same problems.
post #3097 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahr34 View Post

I think I just had a faulty unit from day one. Can't say whether firmware updates caused the problems. My guess is the updates did not. When I get my new AVP, hopefully I won't have the same problems.

When we spend $7K we should expect to get great quality but that is the problem with mass manufacturing.

I had the same problem with a Classe piece had to send it back after a week!! But I got a new piece right away and customer service was outstanding
post #3098 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by wse View Post

When we spend $7K we should expect to get great quality but that is the problem with mass manufacturing.

I had the same problem with a Classe piece had to send it back after a week!! But I got a new piece right away and customer service was outstanding

We should and do expect great quality at $7K, and I think most here believe we get it. Any product, no matter what it is, is going to have an occasional unit that leaves the factory with some unseen flaw. Unfortunately, it looks like Stenvik ended up with one. But he seems to have a lot of consumer protections where he lives so I think we're all hoping he just gets a replacement soon. Sounds like ahr34 is getting a new one as well, so it's good to know the customer support lives up to the price.
post #3099 of 25955
I started exploring the nooks and crannies of the AVP, so I hooked up the AM and FM antennas, and switched to tuner. AVP switched inputs, but nothing came up, and it was unresponsive to all controls, couldn't switch FM/AM, tune it, etc. Same with the web interface.

So then I tried HD-Radio. Moved the FM antenna. All worked as expected! Able to tune in AM and FM, both HD and non-HD radio stations.

Switched back to Tuner, still non-responsive.

Anyone seen anything like this, or have any ideas? Considering my last pre/pro didn't have a tuner, this isn't a big deal, but it's got me curious.Thanks!

eric
post #3100 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricBergan View Post

I started exploring the nooks and crannies of the AVP, so I hooked up the AM and FM antennas, and switched to tuner. AVP switched inputs, but nothing came up, and it was unresponsive to all controls, couldn't switch FM/AM, tune it, etc. Same with the web interface.

So then I tried HD-Radio. Moved the FM antenna. All worked as expected! Able to tune in AM and FM, both HD and non-HD radio stations.

Switched back to Tuner, still non-responsive.

Anyone seen anything like this, or have any ideas? Considering my last pre/pro didn't have a tuner, this isn't a big deal, but it's got me curious.Thanks!

eric

I tested all the tuner functions in mine not long after I got it (i.e., before any firmware updates), and they all worked fine. Haven't gotten around to attaching the antennas since I moved the AVP into the HT, so I can't say whether it all still works since the latest firmware changes. I did really like the HD tuner so my plan was to use only that. But I'll find the antennas and try them this afternoon to make sure it all still works. I'll report back on what I find.
post #3101 of 25955
Wow that combo is a monster.

Has anyone compared the sound of these pieces with the Statement D2. Aside from Denon's PREAMP being more feature laiden (latest sound formats, etc)....how does it sound. Has anyone made a change from the D2 to the Denon? I have the D2 with Bryston AMPS and it sounds terrific with the ARC Room Correction. But this beast, the PREAMP at least, is tempting.

Anybody running the PREAMP with other AMPS..if so, which and how does it sound?
post #3102 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by tassop View Post

For everyone else experiencing download problems, Denon should really make the firmware available on its website provided that it is capable of being updated via USB ( I have assumed it could). It has proven to be unreliable in some cases and it must also be very inconvenient for others.

It would be nice to see Denon host the the Updates on their site so we can do it via USB/CD Laptop in some way. Everything else i own i am able to do it this way (besides PS3) so why not the AVP. My feeling why not is that once the firmware is out in the WILD is that people with some skills will start to play with the Firmware eg. Someone will no doubt be able to re-jig to get the Audyssey Dynamic Volume, especially if they are going to charge for it and that is probably the first problem.

Then you will no doubt get a lot more AVP's being bricked by people doing the F/W updates themselves, either due to lack of knowledge or just plain missing a step somewhere. Also it does appear that most if not all of the D/L problems are from the unfortunate people that look to have something wrong with their units (NOT COOL).

I myself stuffed my 1st Toshiba HD-XE1 and it turned out for some reason when i D/L it, it was missing 1byte of info, yes that is just 1byte of info (a couple of letters in other words) luckily i was able to swap it for another one (within 7-14 days of purchase) and got the D/L correctly and all was again. On the same note wasn't there problems with Onkyo firmware being out in the wild causing problems also, with people getting it from the wrong region etc. and bricking the units, Denon i guess would be scared of this also.

Cheers

Scott
post #3103 of 25955
OK, I have updated my picture, in the Denen AVP pictures thread (on the 1st page). It now shows the new setup, including the Classe CA-M400s.

Darrell
post #3104 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by MStanic View Post

Wow that combo is a monster.

Has anyone compared the sound of these pieces with the Statement D2. Aside from Denon's PREAMP being more feature laiden (latest sound formats, etc)....how does it sound. Has anyone made a change from the D2 to the Denon? I have the D2 with Bryston AMPS and it sounds terrific with the ARC Room Correction. But this beast, the PREAMP at least, is tempting.

Anybody running the PREAMP with other AMPS..if so, which and how does it sound?

If you search this thread for "D2," I think you'll find plenty of comments from those who owned D2s before. As for amps, I use the Anthem Statement A series with my AVP and I think it sounds amazing. I really love it.
post #3105 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSTI View Post

.....Also it does appear that most if not all of the D/L problems are from the unfortunate people that look to have something wrong with their units (NOT COOL).
.....

Cheers

Scott

Could you elaborate a little? Maybe I'm misunderstanding your meaning, but I am quite certain the people on this thread are not "looking" to have something wrong with their AVPs.
post #3106 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodSonics View Post

OK, I have updated my picture, in the Denen AVP pictures thread (on the 1st page). It now shows the new setup, including the Classe CA-M400s.

Darrell

Hey Darrell, it took me awhile, but I finally found your new pics. Very nice! I love the look of those Classe amps. They have that kind of style that says to anyone who walks in to the room and doesn't know what they are, "If you don't already know, you probably shouldn't bother to ask...."

Hey, is that a PS DLIII sitting next to the Sonos? I've been researching Sonos upgrades of late and trying to decide which will give me the most bang for the buck.
post #3107 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSTI View Post


Also it does appear that most if not all of the D/L problems are from the unfortunate people that look to have something wrong with their units (NOT COOL).


Cheers

Scott

What kind of comment is that?

I have had nothing but praise for the Denon AVP. I ran the firmware update (as I have 2 times previously). I fully expected it to go perfectly, without issue. It went smoothly the two times before.

After the update, I tried to listen to some music off my music server, and I found that the wireless didn't work any longer.

Where is the "kick the schmuck in the nads" emoticon when you need it?

Darrell
post #3108 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by progprog View Post

Hey Darrell, it took me awhile, but I finally found your new pics. Very nice! I love the look of those Classe amps. They have that kind of style that says to anyone who walks in to the room and doesn't know what they are, "If you don't already know, you probably shouldn't bother to ask...."

Hey, is that a PS DLIII sitting next to the Sonos? I've been researching Sonos upgrades of late and trying to decide which will give me the most bang for the buck.

Prog,

Yes, that is a PS DLIII, that has been Cullen modified Level 3. I picked it up used so it was a great bang for the buck.

The Sonos needs something inline to reduce the jitter. Plugged directly into the AVP, it is so-so from a sound quality perspective. There are a few jitter reduction options, to consider.

For $225, you can get a Monarchy DIP, or my Genesis Digital Lens (PM me if interested).

For $550, you can get other Genesis Digital Lens, or you can have Cullen modify the Sonos.

For $1200, you can get the Empirical mod.

All the solutions above, basically reduce jitter. Each uses different methods. It is hard to rate their effectiveness against the others though.

Another option is to get a DAC, that does a good job of jitter reduction (some do, some don't). Since you have good DACs in the Denon AVP, this route only makes sense if you plan to get a nice DAC, which provides better results than the AVP. To get better DACs than the AVP, I think you need to look in the $1000+ price range (even used).

So, I guess you need to decide if you want to reduce jitter on the Sonos, or spring for a $1000+ DAC that does good jitter reduction. The best bang for the buck will definetly be to just reduce the jitter, and use the AVP's DACs.

Darrell
post #3109 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by progprog View Post

Could you elaborate a little? I'm not sure what you mean, but I am quite certain the people on this thread are not "looking" to have something wrong with their AVPs.

It CAN be firmware problem that has caused these problems.... there is no proof for the one or other... we just know that firmware update doesn't fix problem, and update process should have detected errors when not beeing able to update realta chip or surround board chip. So there are some functions that is missing in update process. avp has posted zero errors.

1: Should had two steps, first download file(s), when done with download, avp should ask , execute firmware installation: yes/no. Easier to debug where problem is.

2: Firmware update process could run diagnostic tool to verify that all system is ok on AVP _BEFORE_ download process starts.

3: AVP should after download post byte size of file, checksum or something that we could compare with denon web page that all bits has successfully been downloaded.

4: Web gui should be closed while doing firmware update ?
post #3110 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSTI View Post

It would be nice to see Denon host the the Updates on their site so we can do it via USB/CD Laptop in some way. Everything else i own i am able to do it this way (besides PS3) so why not the AVP. My feeling why not is that once the firmware is out in the WILD is that people with some skills will start to play with the Firmware eg. Someone will no doubt be able to re-jig to get the Audyssey Dynamic Volume, especially if they are going to charge for it and that is probably the first problem.

Then you will no doubt get a lot more AVP's being bricked by people doing the F/W updates themselves, either due to lack of knowledge or just plain missing a step somewhere. Also it does appear that most if not all of the D/L problems are from the unfortunate people that look to have something wrong with their units (NOT COOL).

I myself stuffed my 1st Toshiba HD-XE1 and it turned out for some reason when i D/L it, it was missing 1byte of info, yes that is just 1byte of info (a couple of letters in other words) luckily i was able to swap it for another one (within 7-14 days of purchase) and got the D/L correctly and all was again. On the same note wasn't there problems with Onkyo firmware being out in the wild causing problems also, with people getting it from the wrong region etc. and bricking the units, Denon i guess would be scared of this also.

Cheers

Scott

Hmm denon has made this firmware update process sooooo easy that one doesn't need education to update... just do wired net connection push start ... if it fails it's not users that make em brick but denon technologi that isn't failsafe enough.
post #3111 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodSonics View Post

Prog,

Yes, that is a PS DLIII, that has been Cullen modified Level 3. I picked it up used so it was a great bang for the buck.

The Sonos needs something inline to reduce the jitter. Plugged directly into the AVP, it is so-so from a sound quality perspective. There are a few jitter reduction options, to consider.

For $225, you can get a Monarchy DIP, or my Genesis Digital Lens (PM me if interested).

For $550, you can get other Genesis Digital Lens, or you can have Cullen modify the Sonos.

For $1200, you can get the Empirical mod.

All the solutions above, basically reduce jitter. Each uses different methods. It is hard to rate their effectiveness against the others though.

Another option is to get a DAC, that does a good job of jitter reduction (some do, some don't). Since you have good DACs in the Denon AVP, this route only makes sense if you plan to get a nice DAC, which provides better results than the AVP. To get better DACs than the AVP, I think you need to look in the $1000+ price range (even used).

So, I guess you need to decide if you want to reduce jitter on the Sonos, or spring for a $1000+ DAC that does good jitter reduction. The best bang for the buck will definetly be to just reduce the jitter, and use the AVP's DACs.

Darrell

Thanks much for that summary. So you went from the Genesis Digital Lens to the Cullen-mod DLIII. How do you feel those two options compare? I assume they are both a noticeable step up from the Sonos alone, but how do they compare to one another?

P.S. I want that "kick the schmuck in the nads" emoticon too!! Where do we get it
post #3112 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by stenvik View Post

Hmm denon has made this firmware update process sooooo easy that one doesn't need education to update... just do wired net connection push start ... if it fails it's not users that make em brick but denon technologi that isn't failsafe enough.

Good point, stenvik.
post #3113 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSTI View Post

It would be nice to see Denon host the the Updates on their site so we can do it via USB/CD Laptop in some way. Everything else i own i am able to do it this way (besides PS3) so why not the AVP. My feeling why not is that once the firmware is out in the WILD is that people with some skills will start to play with the Firmware eg. Someone will no doubt be able to re-jig to get the Audyssey Dynamic Volume, especially if they are going to charge for it and that is probably the first problem.

Then you will no doubt get a lot more AVP's being bricked by people doing the F/W updates themselves, either due to lack of knowledge or just plain missing a step somewhere. Also it does appear that most if not all of the D/L problems are from the unfortunate people that look to have something wrong with their units (NOT COOL).

I myself stuffed my 1st Toshiba HD-XE1 and it turned out for some reason when i D/L it, it was missing 1byte of info, yes that is just 1byte of info (a couple of letters in other words) luckily i was able to swap it for another one (within 7-14 days of purchase) and got the D/L correctly and all was again. On the same note wasn't there problems with Onkyo firmware being out in the wild causing problems also, with people getting it from the wrong region etc. and bricking the units, Denon i guess would be scared of this also.

Cheers

Scott

IF denon would do it by usb memory stick update process with downloading firmware ++ It would be sure that only dealer/shops only that could do this update process and users had to carry units to shop for update process. If people did choose to update firmware by themself and it fails denon can claim that users has done it on their own risk and might loose their avp. Some may say firmware update would be more safe if send unit to shop, but remove lot of cables, loosing setup if shop reset processor before update ++ lot work to rig it down rig it back up and so on... so I guess people prefer web update process than bring avp to shop/dealer/service point every time new firmware is posted.
post #3114 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by progprog View Post

Thanks much for that summary. So you went from the Genesis Digital Lens to the Cullen-mod DLIII. How do you feel those two options compare? I assume they are both a noticeable step up from the Sonos alone, but how do they compare to one another?

Prog,

The Genesis Digital Lens (GDL) does a great job of reducing jitter. It has a good sized buffer that reduces the jitter, without modifying the signal itself. This is what makes it different from the Monarchy DIP.

The GDL brought out more of the bass, let more of the detail through, and in general, reduced a layer of have in the sound. It was a noticeable and welcome improvement.

The DSIII DAC (Cullen Modified), is an excellent DAC, and also reduces jitter. I think the GDL reduces more of the jitter than the DSII (subjective opinion), but the DL III DAC is better than the AVP DACs, so it brings other sound improvements. Overall, the DL III improved the bass, improved the clarity, and removed some over all haze.

The main improvement I hear over the GDL is that the upper midrange and high frequencies have better detail and separation.

Darrell
post #3115 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by progprog View Post

I tested all the tuner functions in mine not long after I got it (i.e., before any firmware updates), and they all worked fine. Haven't gotten around to attaching the antennas since I moved the AVP into the HT, so I can't say whether it all still works since the latest firmware changes. I did really like the HD tuner so my plan was to use only that. But I'll find the antennas and try them this afternoon to make sure it all still works. I'll report back on what I find.


Found the problem.

Some how, my AVP had Tuner set to Ext. In., rather than Analog. Don't know if it was that way from the factory, something I did by accident when mucking with other things, or something about a firmware upgrade.

Even though I have almost no use for it, it just kept nagging at me...

eric
post #3116 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodSonics View Post

Prog,

The Genesis Digital Lens (GDL) does a great job of reducing jitter. It has a good sized buffer that reduces the jitter, without modifying the signal itself. This is what makes it different from the Monarchy DIP.

The GDL brought out more of the bass, let more of the detail through, and in general, reduced a layer of have in the sound. It was a noticeable and welcome improvement.

The DSIII DAC (Cullen Modified), is an excellent DAC, and also reduces jitter. I think the GDL reduces more of the jitter than the DSII (subjective opinion), but the DL III DAC is better than the AVP DACs, so it brings other sound improvements. Overall, the DL III improved the bass, improved the clarity, and removed some over all haze.

The main improvement I hear over the GDL is that the upper midrange and high frequencies have better detail and separation.

Darrell

Thanks Darrell. I've been leaning toward the Cullen ZP80 mod. As I'm sure you're aware, any forums (here, Sonos, Audiogon...) that discuss this have tons of people asking about the Cullen mod, but hardly anybody who's actually done it and describes the difference. So I guess I'll be a bit of a guinea pig: I have two ZP80s, so I'll send one in for the mod and then really compare the two.
post #3117 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricBergan View Post

Found the problem.

Some how, my AVP had Tuner set to Ext. In., rather than Analog. Don't know if it was that way from the factory, something I did by accident when mucking with other things, or something about a firmware upgrade.

Even though I have almost no use for it, it just kept nagging at me...

eric

Glad you got it worked out. I know how that is- I don't plan to use it, but I want it to work, dammit!! It's the principle of the thing...
post #3118 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by progprog View Post

Glad you got it worked out. I know how that is- I don't plan to use it, but I want it to work, dammit!! It's the principle of the thing...

Nailed it in one!

eric
post #3119 of 25955
Hey cool dow guys. I think you definately miss understood me thats for sure. It looks like my wording of it has been greatly missunderstood. I'll try again.

What i am saying (in response to proprog) is that it seems that most of the F/W update problems ie. Having troubles doing the actual Update's, is form the "Poor Unfortunate People That Have Something Wrong With Their AVP". It is not saying that people are "POOR" it means they are "UNFORTUNATE" to have problems with their AVP's.

As for the actual updateing process and Denon allowing us to do it ourselves via USB/PC/CD etc. I would like to be able to do this myself, but as has been seen with alot of other equipment out there, too many problems arise. So as people have mentioned DENON really need to pick their game up in Updating via the net.

I really do apologise if people miss understood what i meant, as this is such a helpful Thread and it's the lastthing i want to do, as I myself will be owning one of these units and will need help myself.

Kind Regards,

Edit - After reading some of the other posts again, it could have been the actual update process that fried/damaged peoples AVP's and this would be a bad thing on Denon's part. I am not knocking the AVP in anyway at all as it has been said, there is nothing but praise for the product. The process as it is at the moment is pretty foolproof, s stevenik mentioned, plugg in Ethernet and away you go, Denon does the rest. It just seems that some have had problems with certain parts of their AVP's and that is not a good feeling for something this expensice. Again sorry for any misunderstanding guys, no insults/bagging or otherwise was meant OK.

Scott
post #3120 of 25955
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSTI View Post

Hey cool dow guys. I think you definately miss understood me thats for sure. It looks like my wording of it has been greatly missunderstood. I'll try again.
...........................
I really do apologise if people miss understood what i meant, as this is such a helpful Thread and it's the lastthing i want to do, as I myself will be owning one of these units and will need help myself.
............................
Again sorry for any misunderstanding guys, no insults/bagging or otherwise was meant OK.

Scott

Okay, I think I see the problem, and it was a misunderstanding. We read the line below as saying that those owners with download problems were looking for something wrong, i.e., it was their fault or in their heads or something. Now I see that you must have meant that it looks like their AVPs already had something wrong. Big difference.

Don't worry about it Scott. No harm, no foul.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSTI View Post

"Also it does appear that most if not all of the D/L problems are from the unfortunate people that look to have something wrong with their units (NOT COOL).
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