Quote:
Originally Posted by KakimotoRift 
Interesting~
The only chance of getting a washed out picture is mismatched Reference Level.
[]RGB still uses information of 16~235. "Full" or "Expanded" which is just the "Dynamic Range". There is no Blacker than Black & Whiter than White informations.
* "0" <-[Maps to] "16" ~ "235" [Maps to]-> "255"
[]YCC uses 16~235 + Blacker than Black & Whiter than White informations that utilizes Limited Dynamic Range.
* "0~15" + 16~235 + "236~255"
and
[]xvYCC uses 16~235 + Blacker than Black & Whiter than White informations that utilizes Full Dynamic Range.
* "0~15" + 16~235 + "236~255"
Why does this kind of basic understanding have to be repeated over and over agian
YCC > RGB
PS: There is no such thing as YCB. Oh and BTW, I calibrated under YCC, so ofcourse that I would recommend people to use YCC, but I never command people or order people to do anything other than their desire on their own likings. Oh and, for example, measure say white at 100% calibrated to a desire level on a YCC vs RGB white 100% calibrated to a desire level. End of story, you don't get any benefit from RGB and you also miss out the Blacker than Black and Whiter than White informations. Sorry, from my experience, YCC looks much better and smoother color. And if you like the Dynamic Range mapping of RGB then you might as well use TV's Dynamic Contrast and Black Level instead. Dynamic Contrast and Black Adjust also maps the white and black to something higher than original and this result Black end of gamma to have higher Gamma value and White end of gamma to have lower Gamma value. The gamma graph will look diagonalled instead of desired flat.
And by comparing YCC and RGB there is no such thing as one will wash out one will not.
Both calibrated Limited Dynamic Range of RGB and Full Dynamic Range of RGB, there is no such thing as one will wash out and one don't. I doubt you can tell the difference both calibrated.
There is no such thing as Dynamic Range in YCC when talking YCC alone.
When talking about YCC, it should only be compared with xvYCC in regard with Dynamic Range and Wider/Extended Colorspace.
HDTV follows REC709 standard.
Most of HDTVs or TVs are designed to use YCC. Most of Computer monitors are designed to use RGB. Doesn't mean they cant use other format, but that's how it is. Pure computer purpose and computer games I will leave it as RGB. Video games and Movies I will stick with YCC. But actually for my computer monitor I still calibrate it to use YCC instead.
*Component native for YCC (TV/Video Favor)
*RGB native for RGB (Computer Favor)
*DVI native for RGB (Computer Favor)
*HDMI native for YCC (TV/Video Favor)
I used to be in the RGB camp but after long term experiments, I prefer YCC over RGB. I am now YCC forever camp.
No offense but saying that I am wrong and game using YCC is horrible is ignorant.
It is also ignorant to say YCC with proper setup of reference level will wash out too.
By changing YCC and RGB formats back and forth if one can, you will not get washed out or unwashed colors.
You will only get washed out and unwashed out colors when your reference level is or is not setup correctly.
Why does Xbox360 connected to a pure computer monitor wash out? that's because of reference level mismatching, not because of color format problem.
Xbox360 don't used to support Expanded Reference Level but only Standard as is. Why does it wash out on a PC monitor? Because Reference Level Mismatch. And Xbox360 is not originally designed for computer monitors but HDTVs, "Video Games" so that's why it originally only support as is "Standard" Reference level. PS3 is also "default" as Limited Range because it is originally designed for HDTVs, Video Games in mind. Full Dynamic Range is for people, really, that is using a PC Monitor.
Additional: For people who desired the RGB format should stick with Full Dynamic Range. For people who desired YCC should allow BtB and WtW to pass.
RGB native = Full Dynamic Range
Xbox360 YCC709 allows BtB and WtW
BD80 YCC allows BtB and WtW
PS3 YCC allows BtB and WtW
Most of my calibrations are done with YCC as indicated above each calibration settings/reports.
For PS3 if you want to game, you should stick it with Limited if you are using my calibrations. My latest calibrations are never done under RGB Full Dynamic Range. All under YCC.
Please only comments when you've fully read and understand my calibration settings, reports, and knowledges of colors and calibrations.
How can one say that one has washed out colors when one has calibrated with colormeter with best deep black level performance and color accuracy especially with latest version ver.090926v1 which I have used my latest developed technic to accurately work out the correct white and black combination to achieve best black and white performance and no loss of details. This new most accurate technic requires more time on Contrast and Brightness calibration with colormeter ofcourse.
Latest most accurate technic is only used on ver.090926v1 and future releases.
I will put up the difference between my latest technic I called KakiColor Accuracy Technic = KAT Certified, against the ver.090913v1.
So the example of the comparison will be the KakiColor ver.090913v1_BD80 vs ver.090926v1_BD80 (KAT Certified).
Xbox360 ver.090926v1 is KAT Certified too.
Not only you get the blackest black, you also get the best black level details too and ofcourse any others else well.
Example of Gamma Value:
High = 2.5
Original Desired = 2.22
Low = 1.8
Interesting~
The only chance of getting a washed out picture is mismatched Reference Level.
[]RGB still uses information of 16~235. "Full" or "Expanded" which is just the "Dynamic Range". There is no Blacker than Black & Whiter than White informations.
* "0" <-[Maps to] "16" ~ "235" [Maps to]-> "255"
[]YCC uses 16~235 + Blacker than Black & Whiter than White informations that utilizes Limited Dynamic Range.
* "0~15" + 16~235 + "236~255"
and
[]xvYCC uses 16~235 + Blacker than Black & Whiter than White informations that utilizes Full Dynamic Range.
* "0~15" + 16~235 + "236~255"
Why does this kind of basic understanding have to be repeated over and over agian
YCC > RGB
PS: There is no such thing as YCB. Oh and BTW, I calibrated under YCC, so ofcourse that I would recommend people to use YCC, but I never command people or order people to do anything other than their desire on their own likings. Oh and, for example, measure say white at 100% calibrated to a desire level on a YCC vs RGB white 100% calibrated to a desire level. End of story, you don't get any benefit from RGB and you also miss out the Blacker than Black and Whiter than White informations. Sorry, from my experience, YCC looks much better and smoother color. And if you like the Dynamic Range mapping of RGB then you might as well use TV's Dynamic Contrast and Black Level instead. Dynamic Contrast and Black Adjust also maps the white and black to something higher than original and this result Black end of gamma to have higher Gamma value and White end of gamma to have lower Gamma value. The gamma graph will look diagonalled instead of desired flat.
And by comparing YCC and RGB there is no such thing as one will wash out one will not.
Both calibrated Limited Dynamic Range of RGB and Full Dynamic Range of RGB, there is no such thing as one will wash out and one don't. I doubt you can tell the difference both calibrated.
There is no such thing as Dynamic Range in YCC when talking YCC alone.
When talking about YCC, it should only be compared with xvYCC in regard with Dynamic Range and Wider/Extended Colorspace.
HDTV follows REC709 standard.
Most of HDTVs or TVs are designed to use YCC. Most of Computer monitors are designed to use RGB. Doesn't mean they cant use other format, but that's how it is. Pure computer purpose and computer games I will leave it as RGB. Video games and Movies I will stick with YCC. But actually for my computer monitor I still calibrate it to use YCC instead.
*Component native for YCC (TV/Video Favor)
*RGB native for RGB (Computer Favor)
*DVI native for RGB (Computer Favor)
*HDMI native for YCC (TV/Video Favor)
I used to be in the RGB camp but after long term experiments, I prefer YCC over RGB. I am now YCC forever camp.
No offense but saying that I am wrong and game using YCC is horrible is ignorant.
It is also ignorant to say YCC with proper setup of reference level will wash out too.
By changing YCC and RGB formats back and forth if one can, you will not get washed out or unwashed colors.
You will only get washed out and unwashed out colors when your reference level is or is not setup correctly.
Why does Xbox360 connected to a pure computer monitor wash out? that's because of reference level mismatching, not because of color format problem.
Xbox360 don't used to support Expanded Reference Level but only Standard as is. Why does it wash out on a PC monitor? Because Reference Level Mismatch. And Xbox360 is not originally designed for computer monitors but HDTVs, "Video Games" so that's why it originally only support as is "Standard" Reference level. PS3 is also "default" as Limited Range because it is originally designed for HDTVs, Video Games in mind. Full Dynamic Range is for people, really, that is using a PC Monitor.
Additional: For people who desired the RGB format should stick with Full Dynamic Range. For people who desired YCC should allow BtB and WtW to pass.
RGB native = Full Dynamic Range
Xbox360 YCC709 allows BtB and WtW
BD80 YCC allows BtB and WtW
PS3 YCC allows BtB and WtW
Most of my calibrations are done with YCC as indicated above each calibration settings/reports.
For PS3 if you want to game, you should stick it with Limited if you are using my calibrations. My latest calibrations are never done under RGB Full Dynamic Range. All under YCC.
Please only comments when you've fully read and understand my calibration settings, reports, and knowledges of colors and calibrations.
How can one say that one has washed out colors when one has calibrated with colormeter with best deep black level performance and color accuracy especially with latest version ver.090926v1 which I have used my latest developed technic to accurately work out the correct white and black combination to achieve best black and white performance and no loss of details. This new most accurate technic requires more time on Contrast and Brightness calibration with colormeter ofcourse.
Latest most accurate technic is only used on ver.090926v1 and future releases.
I will put up the difference between my latest technic I called KakiColor Accuracy Technic = KAT Certified, against the ver.090913v1.
So the example of the comparison will be the KakiColor ver.090913v1_BD80 vs ver.090926v1_BD80 (KAT Certified).
Xbox360 ver.090926v1 is KAT Certified too.
Not only you get the blackest black, you also get the best black level details too and ofcourse any others else well.
Example of Gamma Value:
High = 2.5
Original Desired = 2.22
Low = 1.8
U got any new settings for the PS3? that you calibrated with your new technique?
??? Did u compare your BD-80 player with the new settings for it versus your PS3 with the latest PS3 settings he has? If your just using the bd-80 player settings on a PS3 then you can't say it's worse than the PS3 for blu-ray playback.
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