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post #421 of 580
I just don't understand why I have to go to a solution some guy makes in his garage. Why doesn't logitech (or somebody big enough to have an actual relationship with Sony) make a BT remote?
post #422 of 580
Logitech doesn't because the Xbox 360 and PS2 are still very popular and they don't use bleutooth. So rather than switching to bluetooth for their PS3 stuff they use the same RF chips they use in their Xbox and PS2 controllers, and just make you put a dongle in your PS3, just like you have to for your Xbox and PS2.

I would guess that once the PS2 dies off, or if Microsoft switches to bluetooth, then we will see companies like Logitech, and Psyclone switch to using bluetooth.

As far as why haven't most home electronics switched to bluetooth, this is exactly the reason. If Samsung suddenly started only allowing bluetooth control of their stuff, all the people with older IR controlled receivers, vcrs, dvd players etc, would throw a fit because they can't control everything with the same remote. Not to many people upgrade their whole system at the same time.

Another reason is that bluetooth is limited to having a network of 7 devices. I don't know about you guys but I have more than 7 devices in my home theater. There are ways around this but it means a much more expensive bluetooth networking part. Also, the people in charge of bluetooth are supposedly working on bluetooth profile 3.0, which will allow for more than 7 devices. Once that happens we might see more stuff switch to bluetooth.
post #423 of 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beerstalker View Post

Another reason is that bluetooth is limited to having a network of 7 devices. I don't know about you guys but I have more than 7 devices in my home theater. There are ways around this but it means a much more expensive bluetooth networking part. Also, the people in charge of bluetooth are supposedly working on bluetooth profile 3.0, which will allow for more than 7 devices. Once that happens we might see more stuff switch to bluetooth.

well I was thinking more along the lines of BT and IR. it will be decades before we can get rid of IR completely and by then I will be too busy with my flying car to care.

now that I think of it It seems odd that sony doesn't just ad IR to the PS3 remote so it can turn my amp and my tv on.
post #424 of 580
Maybe Sony left IR out to leave at least one advantage to their stand-alone players.
post #425 of 580
when these get flashed or what ever whats to stop sony from making another update to make them not work properly?
post #426 of 580
The folks who make them believe they are now set up so that Sony can't make random changes to their BlueTooth stuff that will kill the IR2BT without also killing their own, Sony, optional BlueTooth Blu-Ray remote. Whether that is true or not, only time will tell.
--Bob
post #427 of 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by swarm87 View Post

...whats to stop sony from making another update to make them not work properly?

Bingo. My thoughts exactly.
post #428 of 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundsGood View Post

Bingo. My thoughts exactly.

did you read Bob's comment? Or post #314? Or any of the info at the IR2BT site?
post #429 of 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by swarm87 View Post

when these get flashed or what ever whats to stop sony from making another update to make them not work properly?

The IR4PS3, PS3Toothfairy, and PS3IR-Pro all use the same bluetooth chip as the Sony Bluetooth remote. It would be nearly impossible for Sony to diasable them without also disabling their own remote.

Bruce admitted that he took shortcuts in his early IR2BT design, and that it did not pair with the PS3 exactly the same as the Sony Bluetooth remote. It worked so he called it good enough and started shipping them. This is what caused his problem. He has now changed his programming to more closely match the pairing of the Sony remote, and it appears to have fixed the issue. He is not using the same bluetooth chip as the Sony Remote, so their is a little higher chance that his device might have troubles again in the future. I do not believe that it will happen though.

I have said this elsewhere but I'll say it again. I find it very hard to believe that Sony specifically tried to disable the IR2BT. Sony has sold approx 13 million PS3s. I would estimate the total number of IR2BT, PS3IR-Pro, PS3Toothfairy and IR4PS3s sold to be somewhere around 6000 (2500 of which are IR2BTs). That means less than 0.05% of the people with a PS3 are using these products (less than 0.02% using an IR2BT). Sony is not going to put the R&D time and money into trying to disable something with that small of a penetration. These devices are only costing them a few sales of their own bluetooth remote, and I'd be willing to bet that these devices have actually allowed Sony to sell more PS3s than they would have if they didn't exist. So Sony would be forfieting PS3 sales in order to sell more Bluetooth Remotes? I doubt that. I think this was just a side effect of Sony tightening up their Bluetooth code.
post #430 of 580
thanks for the more detailed explanition
post #431 of 580
Any news when we can send the old ones to get reflashed so they can work with the new firmware for the PS3?
post #432 of 580
Nope. The latest news was posted in here back a bit -- basically saying, "stay tuned". We're expecting an announcement from them on the procedure any day now.
--Bob
post #433 of 580
From 7/10:

Quote:
Originally Posted by oman321 View Post

Also got notice of shipped, 1313.


Anyone else get a shipping notification lately? I'm thinking I should get one in the next two days (#1554), but not sure where they're currently at.
post #434 of 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beerstalker View Post

The IR4PS3, PS3Toothfairy, and PS3IR-Pro all use the same bluetooth chip as the Sony Bluetooth remote. It would be nearly impossible for Sony to diasable them without also disabling their own remote.

Bruce admitted that he took shortcuts in his early IR2BT design, and that it did not pair with the PS3 exactly the same as the Sony Bluetooth remote. It worked so he called it good enough and started shipping them. This is what caused his problem. He has now changed his programming to more closely match the pairing of the Sony remote, and it appears to have fixed the issue. He is not using the same bluetooth chip as the Sony Remote, so their is a little higher chance that his device might have troubles again in the future. I do not believe that it will happen though.

I have said this elsewhere but I'll say it again. I find it very hard to believe that Sony specifically tried to disable the IR2BT. Sony has sold approx 13 million PS3s. I would estimate the total number of IR2BT, PS3IR-Pro, PS3Toothfairy and IR4PS3s sold to be somewhere around 6000 (2500 of which are IR2BTs). That means less than 0.05% of the people with a PS3 are using these products (less than 0.02% using an IR2BT). Sony is not going to put the R&D time and money into trying to disable something with that small of a penetration. These devices are only costing them a few sales of their own bluetooth remote, and I'd be willing to bet that these devices have actually allowed Sony to sell more PS3s than they would have if they didn't exist. So Sony would be forfieting PS3 sales in order to sell more Bluetooth Remotes? I doubt that. I think this was just a side effect of Sony tightening up their Bluetooth code.

I know from a very high up source that Sony is not happy about sales of PS3s for playback of Bluray only. PS3s cost much more to make than the sale price. IBM processors etc.
Whether they would try to change firmware to increase the difficulty is another story? The fact that it is Bluetooth only is a seemingly small attempt to make it somewhat more inconvenient to use as a player only.
post #435 of 580
I don't think you'll be "soon". I'm in the 1450-1460 range for my order and still have not received a shipping notification. I think the IR2BT guys are a bit behind their initial estimate. There's a forum on the site where people can post their shipping dates, although I'm not sure why the company can't just give out a daily status or something.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stew4msu View Post

From 7/10:




Anyone else get a shipping notification lately? I'm thinking I should get one in the next two days (#1554), but not sure where they're currently at.
post #436 of 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddingle View Post

I know from a very high up source that Sony is not happy about sales of PS3s for playback of Bluray only. PS3s cost much more to make than the sale price. IBM processors etc.
Whether they would try to change firmware to increase the difficulty is another story? The fact that it is Bluetooth only is a seemingly small attempt to make it somewhat more inconvenient to use as a player only.

You should name your sources or not rely on them to bolster your arguments.
post #437 of 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sven26 View Post

I don't think you'll be "soon". I'm in the 1450-1460 range for my order and still have not received a shipping notification. I think the IR2BT guys are a bit behind their initial estimate. There's a forum on the site where people can post their shipping dates, although I'm not sure why the company can't just give out a daily status or something.

Dang, you're right. the second batch of 50 didn't ship until yesterday. Looks like the third batch shipped today though. You could probably be tomorrow Sven. Since I'm going on Vacation Saturday for a week, I guess there's no chance it'll get here before I leave, but it should be waiting for me when I return.
post #438 of 580
Pardon my ignorance but that's the reason I have to pay others to install my stuff...

My installer set up my IR2BT to function with a Crestron unit. It worked great until I innocently downloaded the PS3 2.40 update. Now I have to send the IR2BT back in to be reflashed.

Will the Crestron have to be reprogrammed as well?

Thanks.

C.
post #439 of 580
It shouldn't have to be Chas
post #440 of 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddingle View Post

I know from a very high up source that Sony is not happy about sales of PS3s for playback of Bluray only. PS3s cost much more to make than the sale price. IBM processors etc.
Whether they would try to change firmware to increase the difficulty is another story? The fact that it is Bluetooth only is a seemingly small attempt to make it somewhat more inconvenient to use as a player only.


Well as someone who initially bought the PS3 for Blu-ray, I now have a small collection of PS2 and PS3 titles. If Sony and third party developers also concentrate on the casual gamer market, then the PS3 becomes even that much more desirable.

I think the biggest help for the console so far has been the built-in BD drive. Watching the G4 coverage of E3, the hosts even said that more people they know have bought the PS3 primarily for the Blu-ray capability, but those same people after they bought it started buying PS3 games.

Again the PS brand is moving beyond just games to becoming an all around entertainment brand. The PS3 and the 360 were designed to be trojan horses into the living room.
post #441 of 580
Chas,
No changes will be needed in the Crestron, but the IR2BT box you get back after it is reprogrammed will need to be newly "paired" with your PS3 again. This tells the PS3 it is OK to listen to that box as a BlueTooth (radio) remote control.

This is an easy process that requires several steps. The only trick is to do the last 2 steps quickly enough, and you have to know how to find the Settings portion of the PS3's menus (the XMB).

1) Remove power from the IR2BT box -- remove the batteries if you are using batteries or remove power from the USB cord if that's how you are powering it.

2) Attach the original PS3 game controller to the PS3 and use it to power up the PS3 (by pressing its PS button).

3) Use the Crestron to turn on the rest of your system so that you can see the PS3's menus (the XMB) on your TV. If necessary, now switch the Crestron to a page that lets you send a "2" key command to the PS3 as if getting ready to type in a number.

2) Using the original PS3 game controller, find and select the option in the PS3's Settings for pairing a new Blu-Ray controller. This will replace the pairing already in there that was set up for the original IR2BT (the PS3 remembers only one such Blu-Ray controller pairing at a time). You now have about 30 seconds to complete the rest of this process or you will have to select this Settings option again.

3) Immediately restore power to the IR2BT. Make sure the IR2BT is positioned so that it can see the IR command light coming from the Crestron. Your installer likely placed a little IR emitter near where the IR2BT was set up, perhaps even taped to the IR window of the IR2BT itself.

4) Within 15 seconds press and hold down the "2" key on your Crestron until the TV screen changes to indicate that the PS3 is now registering a new Blu-Ray controller. The "pairing" is now complete.

NOTE 1: The IR2BT will treat a long "2" command as a re-pairing command like this only during the first 15 seconds each time it is given power. If you don't send the long "2" command to it fast enough you will need to remove power from the IR2BT and start over -- and by this point you will also likely need to re-select the Settings option in the PS3 itself (using the original PS3 game controller) to initiate a new pairing again.

NOTE 2: The PS3 will put up a message saying to press a different key combo for pairing. Those are the instructions for pairing Sony's optional BlueTooth Blu-Ray controller. To pair the IR2BT, use the long "2" key command as described here instead.

Place your IR2BT where you would like it for normal use. Make sure it can still see the IR emitter coming from the Crestron.

That's it! The pairing will be remembered from here on out even if you turn off the PS3 or if the IR2BT loses power.
--Bob
post #442 of 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddingle View Post

I know from a very high up source that Sony is not happy about sales of PS3s for playback of Bluray only. PS3s cost much more to make than the sale price. IBM processors etc.
Whether they would try to change firmware to increase the difficulty is another story? The fact that it is Bluetooth only is a seemingly small attempt to make it somewhat more inconvenient to use as a player only.

Dang! I bet they fired the guy that made the decision to sell Sony's own BlueTooth Blu-Ray controller then! Boy did HE screw up! Imagine! Making it easier for those idiot customers to actually play Blu-Ray discs!

I love a good conspiracy theory as much as the next guy, but this one just doesn't hold any water at all. Sony has been completely up front with the financial community about their plans for making console sales cash positive and NONE of that has to do with crippling the use of the PS3 as a Blu-Ray player. Sony would not have won the battle against HD-DVD except for the fact that the PS3 is far and away the dominant Blu-Ray player out there.
--Bob
post #443 of 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddingle View Post

I know from a very high up source that Sony is not happy about sales of PS3s for playback of Bluray only. PS3s cost much more to make than the sale price. IBM processors etc.
Whether they would try to change firmware to increase the difficulty is another story? The fact that it is Bluetooth only is a seemingly small attempt to make it somewhat more inconvenient to use as a player only.

I have heard this, but I don't buy it. Sony is invested in Blu Ray and needed it to win. If it wasn't for the PS3 it very well might not have. I can't believe that they would really be upset that the people that won the format war for them bought PS3s.

Not to mention Sony gets royalties on Blu Ray movie sales also, so they are still making money off people that are using the PS3 as a Blu Ray player. Especially if people are buying movies from Sony Pictures. Sure the gaming division might take a little hit, but it is still helping the company as a whole.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Dang! I bet they fired the guy that made the decision to sell Sony's own BlueTooth Blu-Ray controller then! Boy did HE screw up! Imagine! Making it easier for those idiot customers to actually play Blu-Ray discs!

I love a good conspiracy theory as much as the next guy, but this one just doesn't hold any water at all. Sony has been completely up front with the financial community about their plans for making console sales cash positive and NONE of that has to do with crippling the use of the PS3 as a Blu-Ray player. Sony would not have won the battle against HD-DVD except for the fact that the PS3 is far and away the dominant Blu-Ray player out there.
--Bob

Exactly, if they didn't want people to keep buying the PS3 to use as a Blu Ray player, then why do they keep making it better and better. There is no reason for them to add DTS HD MA & DTS ES decoding, Profile 2.0 compatibility etc, unless they want to keep the PS3 as one of the best Blu Ray players on the market, and help sales of the unit.
post #444 of 580
I heard there's actually a virus in the PS3. Once Sony feels that the average consumer has purchased 20 - 30 Blu Ray movies, they will activate the virus and disable the PS3's ability to play Blu Ray movies. This will force consumers to buy a stand alone Player.
post #445 of 580
Only disable the PS3? I want it to try to screw up the REST of the stuff on my WiFi network too so I can sue the pants off them! I've got my firewall keeping a close eye on it right now!

Dang! I guess I'll have to go back to buying Lotto tickets...



-------------------------------

Seriously, though, there's going to come a point when folks find out they HAVE TO periodically upgrade the software in EVERY Blu-Ray player to get the newly minted licensing keys which enable playback of newly produced Blu-Ray titles. Try explaining THAT to grandpa and grandma.

"Sure gramps, you just have to download new firmware and burn a CD, and.... No, not in the fireplace, gramps! Oh heck, just hook it up through your wifi network. Settle down gramps; I did NOT just say that gramma is whiffy...."
--Bob
post #446 of 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stew4msu View Post

I heard there's actually a virus in the PS3. Once Sony feels that the average consumer has purchased 20 - 30 Blu Ray movies, they will activate the virus and disable the PS3's ability to play Blu Ray movies. This will force consumers to buy a stand alone Player.

This is true but if you wrap your PS3 in tinfoil the virus will be disabled.
post #447 of 580
good to know Will, thanks.
post #448 of 580
Bruce just posted a forum response on the IR2BT site saying that he expects the mail-back instructions for reprogramming IR2BT units to be available later today. He's finalizing the details now.

[I marvel at the sob stories coming in over there. Some of them just have to be fake. ]
--Bob
post #449 of 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Chas,
No changes will be needed in the Crestron, but the IR2BT box you get back after it is reprogrammed will need to be newly "paired" with your PS3 again. This tells the PS3 it is OK to listen to that box as a BlueTooth (radio) remote control.

This is an easy process that requires several steps. The only trick is to do the last 2 steps quickly enough, and you have to know how to find the Settings portion of the PS3's menus (the XMB).

1) Remove power from the IR2BT box -- remove the batteries if you are using batteries or remove power from the USB cord if that's how you are powering it.

2) Attach the original PS3 game controller to the PS3 and use it to power up the PS3 (by pressing its PS button).

3) Use the Crestron to turn on the rest of your system so that you can see the PS3's menus (the XMB) on your TV. If necessary, now switch the Crestron to a page that lets you send a "2" key command to the PS3 as if getting ready to type in a number.

2) Using the original PS3 game controller, find and select the option in the PS3's Settings for pairing a new Blu-Ray controller. This will replace the pairing already in there that was set up for the original IR2BT (the PS3 remembers only one such Blu-Ray controller pairing at a time). You now have about 30 seconds to complete the rest of this process or you will have to select this Settings option again.

3) Immediately restore power to the IR2BT. Make sure the IR2BT is positioned so that it can see the IR command light coming from the Crestron. Your installer likely placed a little IR emitter near where the IR2BT was set up, perhaps even taped to the IR window of the IR2BT itself.

4) Within 15 seconds press and hold down the "2" key on your Crestron until the TV screen changes to indicate that the PS3 is now registering a new Blu-Ray controller. The "pairing" is now complete.

NOTE 1: The IR2BT will treat a long "2" command as a re-pairing command like this only during the first 15 seconds each time it is given power. If you don't send the long "2" command to it fast enough you will need to remove power from the IR2BT and start over -- and by this point you will also likely need to re-select the Settings option in the PS3 itself (using the original PS3 game controller) to initiate a new pairing again.

NOTE 2: The PS3 will put up a message saying to press a different key combo for pairing. Those are the instructions for pairing Sony's optional BlueTooth Blu-Ray controller. To pair the IR2BT, use the long "2" key command as described here instead.

Place your IR2BT where you would like it for normal use. Make sure it can still see the IR emitter coming from the Crestron.

That's it! The pairing will be remembered from here on out even if you turn off the PS3 or if the IR2BT loses power.
--Bob

Thanks, Bob. I hope this advice works as well as your advice in the Anthem D2 forum...

C.
post #450 of 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by chas View Post

Thanks, Bob. I hope this advice works as well as your advice in the Anthem D2 forum...

C.

It comes with my usual, Money Back Guarantee: "Return the unused portion of our advice, and we will return the unspent portion of your money."



Really, it's not tough. The only way I can think of for you to run into trouble here is if you can't figure out how to power up the IR2BT and re-position it fast enough so that it can see the IR emitter from the Crestron.

The Crestron has to be programmed to allow a "press and hold" of the "2" key (i.e., where holding it sends a code indicating the button is being held), but since your Crestron installer already paired your current IR2BT to your PS3 that's presumably already been done.
--Bob
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