Two channel music is lackluster in my dedicated room?

You should consider absorption too; you can experiment with several rolls of fiberglass placed in some of the corners. Making it pretty is another matter. Adding more diffusion will also help, particularly at reflection points and the back wall. And get a retractable screen to avoid reflections; I have noticed Rives often uses a curved acoustic reflector behind speakers in some of their installs. You might want to call Rives and discuss a consultation.

Your room is a bit narrow so you need a speaker with good frequency response off axis. Stereophile usually comments on this aspect of a loudspeaker's performance. You may also try placing speakers on the long wall but will probably end up sitting too close to the speakers and/or have them too close to the back wall. I say this because I have a narrow room (11.5 feet) and its a definite problem (fortunately temporary).

You may also want to experiment with pre amps and sources- looks like that may be the weakest link in your system (from the standpoint of analog output stages) outside of the room.

Speakers- I like what I have heard from Usher (although limited) and think that might be a good path. A pair of used revel Studio/Salons might also be a good fit too. There is an older Theil speaker (before the coax driver) that is allegedly very accurate but needs lots of power. I have heard some nice Thiel set-ups using the more recent speakers. And I heard the sophia in a 300k+ demo room and it sounded great. i'm using the Infinity MTS and its well engineered and accurate- but I'll probably upgrade in a few years.

Finally, read this thread- Zissou has really done his homework:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...highlight=avp2

What is lacking in the sound that you are seeking to improve?

I would remove the glass from the first reflection points. For 2 channel, you want dispersion, not absorption there. Not sure what frequencies are attenuated by 2" but it's going to be a specific range and likely one "bad" for stereo imaging. Might b killing the ambience and naturalness. For 5 or 7 channel, the rooms can be pretty "dead" and the approach works well. But channel doesn't do well in predominantly dead rooms. This is a conundrum if you want to serve both 2 Ch and 5/7 Ch.
I bias my system towards 2 channel. And I would probably invest in a killer center before sacrificing the RT 60 time required by stereo but killed with a "dead" room w/ uniform/heavy absorption.

Go look at those Rives rooms - they have pictures on their website; you can learn a lot from just looking at them. Give them a call- the prices are pretty resonable and they really know what they are doing. You can't see the absorption/resonance control for modes under 2-3 hundred hertz- the fiberglass rolls are a cheap way to experiment here. But you can see the methods they employ to optimize 2 Ch. Diffusion at the back; reflector behind speakers that are generously offset from the front wall. Cloud or tray diffusors strategically located w/ built-in absorption for specific purposes

Anyway, I ramble. Pull those glass panels off the walls and stick some RPG diffusers there (or book cases). Put some diffusers above your listening position too. Put some book cases in the back of the room and fill them with books. Buy the fiberglass rolls and figure out where they work the best for those monster VTf3's. Then figure out how to make them pretty.

Cheers,

Generally the best way to get soundstage depth is to pull the speakers out as far as possible from the wall. You need that delay time to create the sense of depth.

You need to find the culprit first, then solve it. Bass traps, absorption etc. might be good, but might be bad as well. It is important to try everything you can to assess as cheaply and easily as possible to first improve your understanding of your room and to avoid useless spending.

First, try toeing your speakers out more than shown in the photos and note how that changes the image size.

Or it could be overall room dimensions. You could try one of the room modelling software packages like Cara to assess room dimensions but it sounds like you have good ears.

Try moving your speakers way out and in from the side walls to see what that does for 2-channel listening.

You might also try turning your room. I know you don't want to do that permanently, but get yourself some really long speaker wire and move speakers to the long wall and turn your chair temporarily just to learn how the sound changes.

Try walking around your room clapping, listening carefully for timbral or reflective problems that you hear while listening to music then try to listen to where those come from.

Once you've figured out what the problem is, you can try to address it with the proper room treatment. Around here you'll get advice to put up lots of absorption which is home theatre advice, not 2-channel. Increased absorption will generally decrease image size for 2-channel listening, as you seem to already understand.

I agree w/ Harrypt except on the absorption- I mean absorption under 200 Hz and not broadband abssorption, which is generally bad for 2 Channel. I have a friend that implemented this LF absorption in their basement studio and the improvement was striking. He also added a homemade cloud diffusor above the listening position. He's running older, top notch equipment and his system has scary resolution. He has more overall room volume than you do but the dimensions are similar (long rectangle) and he has his speakers on the long wall. I think that's worth a try before doing anything else.

I don't agree w/ damping 1'st reflection points but if it sounds good to you, go for it. RPG makes a panel product that absorbs and diffuses and it might work here.

Those Hsu subs have impressive output- my brother has one. A small room like yours will have significant LF modes that probably need to be tamed. You should download the mode calculator available on Stereophile's (or Ultimate AV's site)

To do LF absorption correctly, you will need a PC, some measurement software, an audio interface and a Mic. And lots of time for trial and error. If you don't have this stuff call in one of the consultants.

Cheers,

Instead of getting all of this "advice" from people who may be or may not be in the know, talk to the people who do this every day - Ethan Winer at Real Traps, Glenn Kuras or Bryan (forgot last name) with GIK Acoustics, or the people at Rives.

All you are getting here is preferences and subjective opinions and not the real solution for your problems.

Nathan,

I would first make sure you have 30" open behind the speaker if you can, and at least 20" from the side wall. I would then point the speakers almost straight ahead. I would toe them in only as much as needed to get a voice int he middle of the stage, focused.

I would put the listening position at about the same distance from the front speakers, as the speakers are from each other.

This combo usually will provide a wide, deep soundstage. Deadening the front wall will help too with B&W 800 series speakers.

I have had several of the 700 and 800 speakers and this layout has worked well for me, especialy regarding the toe-in.

Darrell

I am not sure it is possible to turn a room like that into a really good stereo room - too narrow, and with extremely limited speaker placement options. Sorry, just MO.