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Yep...Yep...Yep! Won't be long before O&A are on the soup line. - Page 4

post #91 of 122
3/24/09 at 12:11pm
JetsMets, Very well said.
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post #92 of 122
3/24/09 at 12:56pm
Terrestrial radio is a mess. The Internet and Ipod's have put a beating on AM oand FM radio..But I agree Stern is probably one of the few personalities that could still be successful on terrestrial radio.

BUT let's be honest. Stern's trip to satellite radio hasn't been successful. He was paid 500 million to save satellite radio, to specifically save Sirius. That was a failure. Sirius came within a frog hair of failing last month. If it wasn't for Liberty stepping in and bailing SXM out by now there's a good chance there would no longer be satellite radio, Stern or O&A.

Those little Ipod's are changing everything.
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post #93 of 122
3/24/09 at 1:39pm
Yeah, Howard's been so unsuccessful at Satellite Radio, I'm sure they are going to fire him any minute, like CBS did with O&A. At the very least, they are never going to try to get him to sign another contract.
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post #94 of 122
3/24/09 at 2:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jgatie View Post

Yeah, Howard's been so unsuccessful at Satellite Radio, I'm sure they are going to fire him any minute, like CBS did with O&A. At the very least, they are never going to try to get him to sign another contract.

After 150 years of being in business The Rocky Mountain News closed their doors last month. Every one of Philadelphia's Newspapers recently filed for bankruptcy. Newspapers all over the country are closing down, terrestrial radio is hurting all over the country.

Spin it any way you want. But the fact is those little Ipod's and the Internet have affected every part of the media, including Stern.

SXM can't fire Stern, he's under contract. But I'd be more then shocked if they re-up his 500 million $ contract. That'll never happen.

I have no dog in this fight. I don't listen to either O&A, or Stern. So this isn't the usual O&A vs. Stern pissing match. I don't care if either stay or go.

My post is just stating the fact that the Ipod and Internet and now the economy is raining on many types of media's parade, and that's not going to change anytime soon.
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post #95 of 122
3/24/09 at 3:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by barbie845 View Post

SXM can't fire Stern, he's under contract. But I'd be more then shocked if they re-up his 500 million $ contract. That'll never happen.

1) O&A were under contract too.

2) His contract is not $500 million. That figure is the entire operating budget for 5 years, including construction of his multi-million dollar studio and all staff salaries, overhead, bonuses, prizes, etc. Stern's actual contract has never been released.

3) Mel has already approached him about reupping.
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post #96 of 122
3/24/09 at 3:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jgatie View Post

1) O&A were under contract too.

2) His contract is not $500 million. That figure is the entire operating budget for 5 years, including construction of his multi-million dollar studio and all staff salaries, overhead, bonuses, prizes, etc. Stern's actual contract has never been released.

3) Mel has already approached him about reupping.

1- They were fired from XM?

2- name a price then. Again I don't care, 20 mil a year? 10?

3- Mel has to worry about his own job 1st. I don't think you realize just how close SXM was to going out of business. This is not a criticism, but if you were just getting your news about SXM financial troubles and possible bankruptcy news from Stern, then I'm guessing you were getting the watered down, rosy picture. Which is to be expected. I would hope Stern, and all the SXM personalities would be optimistic. But the reality was SXM came within HOURS of filing for Chapter 11. Within HOURS.

So if you are still getting your SXM news from Stern, IMO you are not getting the whole story.
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post #97 of 122
3/24/09 at 3:46pm
Most of the posts in this thread have been well argued, but you're falling a little short here.

Stern's contract is $500m. I think everyone understands that is his operating budget. They can fire him any time they want, but he still gets the $100m per year budget, or presumably a high % of that.

There is no doubt that Howard Stern is a reason why Sirius became popular and is still in business. He's huge and nobody is doubting that. That being said, Sirius STILL almost went out of business. The same way these FM stations are basically going "out of business" and trying to re-invent themselves by going Top 40, country, etc. I mean cmon, Sirius was probably 6 hours from filing bankruptcy (edit: barbie already said this above).

So people can say that O&A failed, and to a certain extent they are acorrect. But Howard has sort of failed his company in almost the same way. FM stations hired O&A to save them. O&A didn't save them. Sirius hired Stern to get the company going and make them huge. He got the company going, but after that first year or so of subscriptions, he hasn't been able to do much to keep it going strong. Stern has a lot of his fans there, and they will never leave him. But he didn't do enough to keep the company alive. It's obviously not all on his shoulders, but you can't really consider Stern a huge success on satellite.
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post #98 of 122
3/24/09 at 3:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by barbie845 View Post

1- They were fired from XM?

2- name a price then. Again I don't care, 20 mil a year? 10?

3- Mel has to worry about his own job 1st. I don't think you realize just how close SXM was to going out of business. This is not a criticism, but if you were just getting your news about SXM financial troubles and possible bankruptcy news from Stern, then I'm guessing you were getting the watered down, rosy picture. Which is to be expected. I would hope Stern, and all the SXM personalities would be optimistic. But the reality was SXM came within HOURS of filing for Chapter 11. Within HOURS.

So if you are still getting your SXM news from Stern, IMO you are not getting the whole story.

O&A were fired from FM, where they had a contract.

And contrary to what Pat may think, I'm a little more sophisicated than someone who gets financial news from Howard. anyone who does that is a moron. I realize Sirius XM was on the brink, but tell me this - Do you think they could have secured the loans without the guaranteed subs that Howard brings in? If they were suddenly free of Howard's contract and the income he brings in, would they be better off?

I say no. Even at 100 million per year, he's 8.3 million per month. At a very conservative 2 million listeners (the absolute lowest estimate of the subs he brought), that's 26 million a month coming in. Is Sirius XM ready to lose 18 million per month?

PS - Chapter 11 is not "out of business." That's Chapter 7.
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post #99 of 122
3/24/09 at 4:03pm
The 4th quarters subscription additions for both company's is huge. In past years combined it's usually over 1 million subs.

The 4th quarter of 2008 SiriusXM COMBINED sub total was 82,000. That's it, that's all. 82k. And when we think of the freebies, and the way they were giving months away for free or reduce rates the net gain was probably actually not a gain but a negative.

So anyway, JetsMets point:

Quote:


but after that first year or so of subscriptions, he hasn't been able to do much to keep it going strong.

is dead on... Was this huge drop Stern's fault? No, not at all. The economy, the Ipods, MP3 players and the rest hurt a lot too. But as I already said the whole media business is changing and many medias are taking a beating. And SXM is really taking a beating now.

Because of Liberty's bailout SXM now has about 1 year of breathing room. Which is good. But for SXM to survive the next few quarters sub numbers will be very interesting. Another 1 or 2 quarters of 80k sub additions, and with or without Liberty Media SXM will be out of business in a year or so. There's no way they can survive without any growth.
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post #100 of 122
3/24/09 at 4:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jgatie View Post

O&A were fired from FM, where they had a contract.

And contrary to what Pat may think, I'm a little more sophisicated than someone who gets financial news from Howard. anyone who does that is a moron. I realize Sirius XM was on the brink, but tell me this - Do you think they could have secured the loans without the guaranteed subs that Howard brings in? If they were suddenly free of Howard's contract and the income he brings in, would they be better off?

I say no. Even at 100 million per year, he's 8.3 million per month. At a very conservative 2 million listeners (the absolute lowest estimate of the subs he brought), that's 26 million a month coming in. Is Sirius XM ready to lose 18 million per month?

PS - Chapter 11 is not "out of business." That's Chapter 7.

I know what Chapter 11 is.. It also means the Court would be making the decisions on who stays, who goes, who gets paid, not Mel.

So anyway please read my post above this. NO ONE brought in the subs in 2008, NO ONE. Sorry, that's the fact.

Would they be better off without Stern? I don't know. Obviously they would lose subs, best guess is they would lose a million, probably more. But if they shed all their big contracts, like Ophrah and the NFL( which costs them 40 mil this year) and the MLB( which costs the 65 mil this year) and on and on they would lose subs, but their costs would be much lower too.

So I don't know if a trimmer, slimmer, cheaper service would be better or worse then the bloated mess they have now.
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post #101 of 122
3/24/09 at 5:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JetsMets77 View Post

Most of the posts in this thread have been well argued, but you're falling a little short here.

Stern's contract is $500m. I think everyone understands that is his operating budget. They can fire him any time they want, but he still gets the $100m per year budget, or presumably a high % of that.

There is no doubt that Howard Stern is a reason why Sirius became popular and is still in business. He's huge and nobody is doubting that. That being said, Sirius STILL almost went out of business. The same way these FM stations are basically going "out of business" and trying to re-invent themselves by going Top 40, country, etc. I mean cmon, Sirius was probably 6 hours from filing bankruptcy (edit: barbie already said this above).

So people can say that O&A failed, and to a certain extent they are acorrect. But Howard has sort of failed his company in almost the same way. FM stations hired O&A to save them. O&A didn't save them. Sirius hired Stern to get the company going and make them huge. He got the company going, but after that first year or so of subscriptions, he hasn't been able to do much to keep it going strong. Stern has a lot of his fans there, and they will never leave him. But he didn't do enough to keep the company alive. It's obviously not all on his shoulders, but you can't really consider Stern a huge success on satellite.


Id argue that Stern saved Sirius and also destroyed FM radio when he left.
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post #102 of 122
3/24/09 at 5:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mercury View Post

Id argue that Stern saved Sirius and also destroyed FM radio when he left.

The Ipods, streaming Cell phones, USB drives, Mp3 players, Internet etc. didn't kill FM and drive other media formats to the edge of bankruptcy. It was just one man?

Yep, you're a fan..
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post #103 of 122
3/24/09 at 6:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by barbie845 View Post

The Ipods, streaming Cell phones, USB drives, Mp3 players, Internet etc. didn't kill FM and drive other media formats to the edge of bankruptcy. It was just one man?

Yep, you're a fan..


Maybe i should have said destroyed Infinity broadcasting or any other affiliate he left.

they have still yet to recover.

anyone remember jack fm penn and teller david lee and now O&A.

lol...
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post #104 of 122
3/24/09 at 6:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mercury View Post

Maybe i should have said destroyed Infinity broadcasting or any other affiliate he left.

they have still yet to recover.

anyone remember jack fm penn and teller david lee and now O&A.

lol...

Howard saw the writing on the wall. He knew that iPods and the internet would start killing FM. He bailed. Give Howard some credit for that, he was smart as all hell.

Would FM be doing better with him still in it? Probably. But it would still be on a downward spiral, perhaps just slightly less so. Stern knew he really only has 5 or so years left, so for him to make a decision to leave a dying medium for a huge payday (with a chance to pioneer a new medium) was a no-brainer.

Howard is not THE reason why FM radio is in the state that it is. He's a contributing factor, sure. But FM radio was on it's way down well before he left. For anyone to think that Howard Stern is THE definitive reason for the downfall of FM Radio...holy crap...that's the very definition of blind loyalty.

Howard's plan seems to have 3 phases:

1) Recognize a dying medium (FM Talk Radio) - success
2) Get a huge payday in his final years - success
3) Pioneer a new medium - 50/50
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post #105 of 122
3/24/09 at 7:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mercury View Post

Maybe i should have said destroyed Infinity broadcasting or any other affiliate he left.

they have still yet to recover.

anyone remember jack fm penn and teller david lee and now O&A.

lol...

That I'll agree with.

All I'm saying here, and I think JetsMets is saying the same thing. Times are a changing, and all the 'old' rules and 'old' media formats are in trouble. And IMO no one person, or one medium can save these 'old' formats. Newspapers and magazines are history. Nothing will save them. The Internet and other news sources have killed the print media for good ..

FM has to find a 'niche' like AM did. In the 70's when FM was getting popular everyone thought that would mean the death of AM, AM found talk radio and that saved it..

FM needs something like that. If it doesn't find it no one or nothing will save it.

In my car I have XM, my Slacker G2 Internet radio, and I can hook-up my Zune or a Mp3 player. I haven't turned on FM in months, hell maybe more then a year.
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post #106 of 122
3/24/09 at 7:14pm
I used to be an FM fiend, and I haven't turned it on in a year or two. Howard is a radio God. I'm not debating that. The dude is legendary.

But yeah, times are fricking changing. Unfortunately I'm not smart enough to figure out what FM can do to survive. I highly doubt that anyone in FM radio right now is smart enough either. Right now there is some guy or gal sitting in a 3rd year college course that will figure this out.

By the way, is there an off-topic section on this forum?
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post #107 of 122
3/24/09 at 7:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JetsMets77 View Post

I used to be an FM fiend, and I haven't turned it on in a year or two. Howard is a radio God. I'm not debating that. The dude is legendary.

But yeah, times are fricking changing. Unfortunately I'm not smart enough to figure out what FM can do to survive. I highly doubt that anyone in FM radio right now is smart enough either. Right now there is some guy or gal sitting in a 3rd year college course that will figure this out.

By the way, is there an off-topic section on this forum?

Yeah, right here..

Seriously in the past we have strayed waaaaaaaaaay off-topic here in the XM/Sirius section and the Mods usually let us stray. As long as it doesn't get nasty and there isn't any name calling they usually give us pretty good leeway here.

But an official Off-Topic section here? I don't think so.
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post #108 of 122
3/25/09 at 5:03am
who cares about stern or o&a....

RILEY MARTIN IS THE KING OF ALL MEDIA!!!!
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post #109 of 122
3/25/09 at 3:17pm
Technically the Biavians are the kings of everything.
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post #110 of 122
3/26/09 at 8:28pm
The lawyers and censorship have had a great influence in killing terrestrial radio. Jocks can't do the same bits they were able to even 10 years ago. Instead of us becoming more progressive we are going backwards and everyone has to worry about what others are going to hear instead of changing the channel if you don't like it.
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post #111 of 122
3/27/09 at 9:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bubbaba View Post

The lawyers and censorship have had a great influence in killing terrestrial radio. Jocks can't do the same bits they were able to even 10 years ago. Instead of us becoming more progressive we are going backwards and everyone has to worry about what others are going to hear instead of changing the channel if you don't like it.

They are killing the "shock jocks", yes, but not radio.

It all of the outside forces that are killing radio. I mean the Slacker G2 alone, with it's much better sound that SiriusXM can't remotely reproduce, is a good example.

For around $210(including tax), you can get the unit, and then download all the music you want to hear for FREE. You could sign up for a few dollars a month to get more features, but the key here is free/sound quality/convenience.

Content alone won't be able to save satellite radio, unfortunately.

Hell, I just got into streaming Netflix to my Samsung 2500 Blu-Ray player.

I had no need for a Blu-Ray player, nor did I want one. But I "stole" it at a local Circuit City a few weeks back during their liquidation, updated it, and now I get all the streaming I want(for now), plus an 1-month/unlimited amount of Blu-Ray's/DVD's all for $10.69/month.

And I can quit whenever the heck I want. Once you start streaming, you will never stop(they need too add more content IMHO, and they are constantly working on that).

It is like TIVO(or a DVR with a HDD) IMHO. I don't know how the heck I lived without it all these years.

This will mean certain death to all Video stores. No doubt. I can get what I want, and don't even have to leave the house.
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post #112 of 122
3/27/09 at 9:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by raven56706 View Post

riley martin is the king of all media!!!!


ohh quan tange gin wan!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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post #113 of 122
3/27/09 at 11:54am
Quote:


This will mean certain death to all Video stores. No doubt. I can get what I want, and don't even have to leave the house.

Awhile back I posted an article that had the 12 companies most likely to go bankrupt in 2009. I posted that article here because SXM was on that list. So was Blockbuster.
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post #114 of 122
3/27/09 at 12:27pm
I've never even heard of Slacker. I don't listen to any radio stations, though, so sounds of no use to me.
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post #115 of 122
3/27/09 at 1:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JetsMets77 View Post

I've never even heard of Slacker. I don't listen to any radio stations, though, so sounds of no use to me.

Slacker is INTERNET radio. Not AM/FM terrestrial radio.

Give it a listen, they have an on-line player, and it's 100% free.
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post #116 of 122
4/1/09 at 5:27pm
A thread that was started almost a year ago is still being debated? Seriously guys, there's nothing worse than fanboys arguing over things like this. Stern has his listeners and O&A obviously have there's. Terrestrial radio is dying and broadcasts can only afford to pay local Dick and Jane's for their breakfast morning radio shows. O&A didn't get dumped off of Sirius/XM so what is everyone arguing about?
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post #117 of 122
4/1/09 at 6:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDKing View Post

A thread that was started almost a year ago is still being debated? Seriously guys, there's nothing worse than fanboys arguing over things like this. Stern has his listeners and O&A obviously have there's. Terrestrial radio is dying and broadcasts can only afford to pay local Dick and Jane's for their breakfast morning radio shows. O&A didn't get dumped off of Sirius/XM so what is everyone arguing about?

You come into a thread five days after the last post to complain the thread is still going? Heal thyself.
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post #118 of 122
4/3/09 at 11:41am
There is a shock jock out there getting new stations every month it seems. But i guess the reason for his success is he does not pick little girls who had nothing to do with radio except that there daddy could support and grow bad radio stations. waw
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post #119 of 122
4/3/09 at 4:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by chester aldrid View Post

But i guess the reason for his success is he does not pick little girls who had nothing to do with radio except that there daddy could support and grow bad radio stations. waw

I have no idea what that means
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post #120 of 122
4/3/09 at 5:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JetsMets77 View Post

I have no idea what that means

I'm glad I'm not the only one.
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