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2008 Mitsubishi Owners Thread (735/736 and diamond) - Page 87

post #2581 of 3012
3/17/09 at 6:50pm
At 1/30, you definitely shouldn't see "half" of a frame. You should see four halves. I'd have it looked at.
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post #2582 of 3012
3/17/09 at 7:11pm
Thanks Darin,

I'll call up for a servic call, I just hope they dont say it's ok and not to stand so close to it

Jeff
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post #2583 of 3012
3/17/09 at 7:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by tekkie1958 View Post

I just hope they dont say it's ok and not to stand so close to it

If so, my response would be: "Is the warehouse I bought it from far enough away?"
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post #2584 of 3012
3/17/09 at 7:46pm
Darin,

Would you have a clue as to why my old Mitsu ws65813 easily accepted Component video from my PC ATI videocard but the new wd65835/ wd73735 won't accept component, only Dvi/Hdmi

jeff
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post #2585 of 3012
3/17/09 at 7:48pm
I would be willing to bet your set is not outputting at its full resolution based on the screen shots. this should be something a tech can test for in determining if the set is working right.
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post #2586 of 3012
3/17/09 at 8:48pm
As crazy as this might seem, after owining the 65835 for 72 hours the Screendoor effect seems tonight to be a bit less prounounced.

Any chance of breaking it in where minor glitches correct themselves?

Jeff
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post #2587 of 3012
3/18/09 at 5:43am
The oscillation of the wobulation mirror is a mechanical process, so it's possible that the issue is intermittent, and I suppose it could even have been "stuck" and now somehow free.
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post #2588 of 3012
3/18/09 at 6:57am
Service manager just called, they're coming Saturday, if they can't fix it, they'll give me another one
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post #2589 of 3012
3/18/09 at 11:10am
Mitsubishi finally got back to my repair guy. According to Mits the ghosting me and mikemav are seeing is normal.

I see it on all inputs and all sources. I can't believe it is normal and there are only two of us that are complaining about it.

This wobulation crap is BS. It was a way for TI and all DLP manufacturers to save money. Granted DLPs are much cheaper now, but how much extra could the chip cost to give us a mirror per pixel. The silicon area may be worth $100. I'd gladly pay a couple hundred over the $1000 my 60" costs than the $4000 a similar sized Plasma or LCD costs.

I have a another issue with my tv that is definitely not normal. White horizontal lines flash at random every couple of seconds on progressive scan content via components. I'll at least get that fixed before I'll rest, but I think I'll be saving for a 65" LCD.
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post #2590 of 3012
3/18/09 at 11:38am
why is wobulation bull? I like its implementation on theses sets. I want the most film like presentation as possible and the lack of any pixel structure that these sets provide gives me just that. With a full resolution DLP chip there would be visible pixel structure. and the image would as a result be less smooth.

I don't see ghosting now that my contrast is set to 35 FTL.
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post #2591 of 3012
3/18/09 at 11:49am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdwk View Post

According to Mits the ghosting me and mikemav are seeing is normal. I see it on all inputs and all sources. I can't believe it is normal and there are only two of us that are complaining about it. This wobulation crap is BS.

Not that it really helps you any, but I don't think the ghosting issue you are experiencing is due to wobulation. The screen caps you've posted show the "ghost" to be several pixels apart. Although I don't experience anything near to the extent that you've posted, I've played with mine trying to get the sharpness setting right, and there does seem to be mild ringing present regardless of what you do (although mine doesn't seem to be spaced so far apart like yours is). On most brands, setting sharpness to 0 eliminates any (additional) ringing from being introduced by the display. On the Mits, going up or down from 32 seems to reduce or increase it, and switch it from a "positive" ring to a "negative" one, but it seems to always be present to a very slight degree. Fortunately on mine it's not something that is noticeable from normal viewing distances... I have to put up more "artificial" test sources, like from my PC, and get up close to the screen to see it. But it is there. I'd be curious to see if the Diamond sets have any processing differences that prevent this.
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post #2592 of 3012
3/18/09 at 12:29pm
No significant ringing on my wd-65835. I tested with my eye right up to the set with a test pattern for adjusting sharpness and there's almost a hint of it but its so slight that I cant even be sure its there or if I'm imagining it.

As you said, there is a positive or negative ringing that is introduced when I deviate from the default 31 sharpness setting.
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post #2593 of 3012
3/18/09 at 12:41pm
Where I'm able to see it is when I'm set to my PC input... my desktop is set to a neutral gray (which makes it possible to see the ringing regardless of whether it's brighter or darker), then when I look at sharp boundaries, like the edge of my mouse pointer, I can see a very faint (if at 31) halo. The halo becomes more pronounced as I move further away from 31. It's odd... moving in one direction removes the halo in at some points around the pointer, but introduces it at others. It's just that there isn't any setting that completely eliminates it at all points. But fortunately, it's minor enough that it's not noticeable with normal material, nor at normal distances.
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post #2594 of 3012
3/18/09 at 1:06pm
well I am not running a PC as a source so I wonder if the ringing is more pronounced with a PC than a true video source.
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post #2595 of 3012
3/18/09 at 2:00pm
I would think it would be, simply because "normal" video sources don't tend to have straight lines with "perfect" high contrast pixel boundaries that make the issue so apparent.
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post #2596 of 3012
3/18/09 at 2:06pm
With the menu button selected does anyone see a bit of screendoor effect when standing within 12-18 inches front of the screen when smooth 120 is selected VS. when it's not selected?

Jeff
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post #2597 of 3012
3/18/09 at 2:32pm
So my third set got brought out this morning (first was a 736 that had terrible black levels, the second was an upgrade to the 835-but it was the store's floor model until the new one arrived, and finally today the new set).

After about twenty minutes, the set just shuts off. No warning message... nothing. Won't come back on for another couple of minutes. Turn it back on and after 15-20... off again!

WHAT'S GOING ON!!!! Two out of three Mits TVs I had in my home were bad. Are these televisions really this horrible?
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post #2598 of 3012
3/18/09 at 2:50pm
I remember with my New WS 65813 in 2004 it turned off shortly after being turned on.

Mitsubishi back then told me the power transformer was being burnt in, soon afterwards the problem went away until a couple years later with bad capacitors on the power supply circuitboard that needed to be replaced

jeff
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post #2599 of 3012
3/19/09 at 5:14am
I initially posted this in the AMP, Receiver, Processor section because I thought my pre/pro was the culprit but as you can see from below I am now leaning towards the problem being 736 related. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

______________________

Hey guys,

I recently got my second HDMI device and have now come across a problem switching between my HDMI sources. Below is my equipment all connected via HDMI.

PS3 and HR10 (D*) ---> Marantz AV8500 pre/pro ---> Mistu 73736 DLP

I can switch from the HR10 to the PS3 with no problem at all. But when it comes time to change back to the HR10 I get issues... Sound always switches correctly but the video switching is random, what I mean by random is occasionally it will come on but most of the time I just get the default Mistu Blue screen which means no signal...

What have I tried to get the video to work? Turning the HR10 off then on, turning the AV8500 off then on, turning the Mistu off then on, changing the input on the Mistu... Occasionally one of these actions will work... I have also tried leaving the PS3 on before switching and then off before switching inputs on the AV8500... Lastly the thing that seem to work most often but by no means all the time, changing the input on the AV8500 to a non digital, not used/connected source like VCR and then back to TV (HR10).


Let me also say that I had no problem switching when my inputs were the HR10 via HDMI and a Mitsu DVD (DD8049) via component and tos, the display was a Sony GWII rear pro LCD... With this config I still just used one HDMI (with an adapter to DVI) from the AV8500 to the TV

Currently I am leaning towards the AV8500 as my problem area and am going bring down my LCD from the bedroom down to rule out the TV... But any help would be greatly appreciated.


UPDATE

I ran an HDMI from my 8500 to my LCD in the bedroom and it switch perfectly between the PS3 and HR10... So I guess my problem is more with the TV than that 8500?
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post #2600 of 3012
3/19/09 at 5:39am
It's hard to say. I have both an HR10 and a PS3 (among other things), the only difference is I have an Onkyo 875 in between instead of the Marantz you have. And I don't have the issue. I do also have an HDMI splitter between my receiver and display, so that HDMI signal also goes to other TVs in the house. When I do anything in the signal that forces a re-synch (not just changing inputs, but also just changing resolution on the input), my Mits 736 does take a long time (maybe 10 secs?) to re-synch back up, but I get a black screen until it syncs, not the blue "no signal" screen. And it does always sync, it just takes a long time.

But I feel your pain. One of the displays (a Samsung plasma) I have connected to that HDMI splitter does not want to sync up if I turn it on after the system in my main room is up and running. If I do, I get an "signal out of range" error, or something to that effect. If I then change inputs on my receiver, then back, the Samsung syncs up. The Samsung didn't do this with my previous 2-way splitter, and my old Sony CRT that is also connected to the splitter doesn't have the slow sync of the Mits, nor the non-sync of the Samsung.

You know what they say... HDMI is a fickle b*tch.
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post #2601 of 3012
3/19/09 at 7:13am
Darin,

I should say when I switch back to the HR10 I get blue screen for about 1 sec, then it goes black for 3-4 seconds then back to blue and does not change... So it looks like its try to connect but fails...

What are some of the steps that people take to resolve this kind of issue? Would an HDMI signal booster help?

I guess if worst came to worst I could always run a second HDMI from the PS3 to the 736 and run TOS to the Marantz, but I really don't want to do that... Oh that's a thought, does HR10 and D* support DTS HD or Dolby True HD? If not I could use TOS for the HR10 and leave the PS3 running through the pre/pro?

again thanks for any help
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post #2602 of 3012
3/19/09 at 7:14am
Quote:
I would think it would be, simply because "normal" video sources don't tend to have straight lines with "perfect" high contrast pixel boundaries that make the issue so apparent.

That may be true but I used test patterns to test for this that are full of high resolution high contrast "on/off" boundaries and dont have any ringing.
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post #2603 of 3012
3/19/09 at 8:13am
Quote:
Originally Posted by vivid View Post

Oh that's a thought, does HR10 and D* support DTS HD or Dolby True HD? If not I could use TOS for the HR10 and leave the PS3 running through the pre/pro?

No, DirecTV does Dolby Digital, nothing better. The user interface is different, but you might want to consider switching to one of the newer DirecTV DVR's that can handle the new MPEG4 HD channels. For HDMI sources, I've got a HR10-250, 3 HR21 Pro's, PS3, XBox Elite, Denon 3930CI DVD player, and a HTPC in my system. The 4 DVR's go through a Parasound zHD HDMI switch, to a Denon AVP-A1HDCI, and finally to my WD-65835. I haven't experienced any problems switching between HDMI sources.
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post #2604 of 3012
3/19/09 at 8:22am
gsr,

I miss quoted when I said I had an HR10, I actually have an HR21... I do still have an older HR10 but its in a closet collecting dust.

But thanks for you ans... So i could then run my HR21 via HDMI to the TV and TOS to the pre/pro and lose nothing at all? One more noob qu, what if I just dumped the HDMI altogether for the HR21 and ran component and tos to the receiver and then ran one HDMI to the TV for video only? would there be any harm in doing it this way?
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post #2605 of 3012
3/19/09 at 8:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by vivid View Post

So i could then run my HR21 via HDMI to the TV and TOS to the pre/pro and lose nothing at all? One more noob qu, what if I just dumped the HDMI altogether for the HR21 and ran component and tos to the receiver and then ran one HDMI to the TV for video only? would there be any harm in doing it this way?

You could use either approach without losing any functionality. You ~might~ notice a loss in picture quality using component video instead of HDMI, but there's no harm in giving it a try. If you don't notice any difference in picture quality, I'd probably be inclined to go with the 2nd option to simplify switching sources (you'd only have to switch inputs on the receiver - the TV would always stay on the same input).
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post #2606 of 3012
3/19/09 at 2:35pm
OMG I am about to pull my hair out... spent a lot of time on the phone with Marantz who went through several logical steps... I called Mistu and once I was told that 5 cable component (RGB and L&R) would give the same audio quality I could not continue with them...

what works with stemless switching

PS3 and HR21 via hdmi ---> Marantz 8003 via HDMI ---> Sharp LCD in bedroom.
Mitsu DVD (DD8049) via component + tos and HR21 via hdmi ---> Marantz 8003 via HDMI ---> Mitsu 73736
HR21 via hdmi ---> Marantz 8003 via HDMI ---> Mitsu 73736


Here is what does not work... IE will not switch back to the HR21

PS3 HDMI and HR21 hdmi ---> Marantz 8003 via HDMI ---> Mistu 73736.
PS3 HDMI and HR21 via component ---> Marantz 8003 via HDMI ---> Mistu 73736.


I am completely lost as to what to try... Essentially add the PS3 to the 736 and forget switching back (brilliant plan by Sony to monopolize the market ) I thought for sure that using the HR21 with components would work but no, same damn problem...

The Marantz guys asked me to see if my TV had the latest firmware because they thought the issue has to be with the TV.... Where do I find the firmware and what is the most recent number?

Any other suggestions would be welcome.
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post #2607 of 3012
3/20/09 at 8:35am
A shot in the dark.......
Could it be a tug-of-war with HDMI-CEC implementation between the TV and the AVR?
Menu options in the TV allow you to turn off HDMI-CEC.
Worth a try if you haven't gone this route yet.
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post #2608 of 3012
3/20/09 at 11:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by vivid View Post

I initially posted this in the AMP, Receiver, Processor section because I thought my pre/pro was the culprit but as you can see from below I am now leaning towards the problem being 736 related. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

______________________

Hey guys,

I recently got my second HDMI device and have now come across a problem switching between my HDMI sources. Below is my equipment all connected via HDMI.

PS3 and HR10 (D*) ---> Marantz AV8500 pre/pro ---> Mistu 73736 DLP

I can switch from the HR10 to the PS3 with no problem at all. But when it comes time to change back to the HR10 I get issues... Sound always switches correctly but the video switching is random, what I mean by random is occasionally it will come on but most of the time I just get the default Mistu Blue screen which means no signal...

What have I tried to get the video to work? Turning the HR10 off then on, turning the AV8500 off then on, turning the Mistu off then on, changing the input on the Mistu... Occasionally one of these actions will work... I have also tried leaving the PS3 on before switching and then off before switching inputs on the AV8500... Lastly the thing that seem to work most often but by no means all the time, changing the input on the AV8500 to a non digital, not used/connected source like VCR and then back to TV (HR10).


Let me also say that I had no problem switching when my inputs were the HR10 via HDMI and a Mitsu DVD (DD8049) via component and tos, the display was a Sony GWII rear pro LCD... With this config I still just used one HDMI (with an adapter to DVI) from the AV8500 to the TV

Currently I am leaning towards the AV8500 as my problem area and am going bring down my LCD from the bedroom down to rule out the TV... But any help would be greatly appreciated.


UPDATE

I ran an HDMI from my 8500 to my LCD in the bedroom and it switch perfectly between the PS3 and HR10... So I guess my problem is more with the TV than that 8500?

have you already done a reset? press menu then 123.
At least this will start you back to the normal start point and delete any corrupted or conflicting information that the TV may have retained from various CEC connections.
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post #2609 of 3012
3/21/09 at 6:42am
I reset the input, reset the TV and still the problem persists... well sort of...

a $30 25ft HDMI cable (AV equ is in a closet), a $20 wire fishing line and a few hrs of time and I now have the the system working perfectly, although not how it should be hooked up...

HR21 hooked up to the AVR via TOS and directly to the 736 to HDMI 1...
PS3 is hooked up via HDMI to the AVR then to HDMI 2



thanks for all you help guys... Hopefully soon all this HDPC handshake stuff will be sorted out.
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post #2610 of 3012
3/21/09 at 9:25am
My service tech came just now to analyze my complaint that my 65835 has screen door ESPECIALLY when smooth 120 is on.

Does anyone have artifacts around letterring or on a solid color background when smooth 120 is on?

On my wd73735 it is nonexistent.

I suppose i can ask them for a 65735 (a step down without smooth 120) or perhaps another 73735.

he agreed with my complaint and said i have amazing eyes, though when he asked me to read the serial number off the back I struggled LOL

Thanks,

jeff
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