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Official Pioneer SC-09TX/SC-LX90 Owner's Thread - Page 5

post #121 of 5375
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by George Omoregie View Post

Hi all:

I thank everyone for taking the time to share past knowledge of phono and receiver setup. I am at a cross road on this one....If any Sc09tx owners do have access to any turntable, please test.
Maybe Pioneer forgot to do something or it is a bug.

Again, thanks all for your inputs.

George T. Omoregie.

George,

I just plugged in my 80's vintage Dual TT into SC-09 phono inputs, set the SC-09 for Phono & it works fine. I have an Audio Technica cartridge that is 2.7 mv output. Yours is over 3 mv so should be bit louder.

I am getting great volume but have to set the SC-09's volume control at "-6 db" for typical "rock" listening level. I would say "-10 db" would be the min limit to try. I used Auto Surround, Direct & Pure direct. Pure Direct has a very slightly lower volume due to MCACC being dis-engaged so no bass freq boost, but is still "rock" level volume without touching the volume control.

Maybe try a different phono cable & check to make sure all your cartridge wires are still tight & haven't slipped off their connections. And that the TT's wiring is intact.

Also, I know my first Dual 1229 TT had a removable headshell & every yr or so I had to take a pencil eraser to the headshell connectors to remove oxide film...I could always tell the connection was oxided from intemittent or low channel dropouts. This may not apply to the Pioneer TT you are using. I'm not familiar with it.

Hope this gives you the assurance that the problem is not a bug in the design. I guess it's possible that the connection from the board the phono preamp is on came loose in shipping, but it has pretty robust contruction, so it's probably not likely.
post #122 of 5375
Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

^^
Great news, Tim. I haven't jumped into the world of HTPC yet. Which Sony PC do u have & how well does it do DVR & other functions?

Enjoying it this AM as I write...listening to a "blast from the past" - Best of Cream on LP to try to help George out.

It's a Sony® VAIO® VGX-XL1 Digital Living System™, which I admit I don't use that much. It has the large DVD changer via... iLink... (haven't tried it direct and doubt it would work).

We need to get George operational!

Good speaking with you.
post #123 of 5375
SC-09TX.

Today, I took down the PL-L1000A replace the Stanton 680 EL with a Shure M95HE. I connected to Phono input, no sound also. I then connected to Aux, I heard Bob James Album sounded nice, but only one speaker.. Left was working.
I swapped the input to SACD just for testing purpose. Same sound on one speaker.

I have an Elite A-71, connected it to the phono, no sound at all, then use "line" input, it gave me sound from only left speaker.

I then went back to the original Stanton cartridge, set it on Phono, no sound on the 9TX, then moved the input to Aux, then I got sound also from left speaker. Then did same setup on the A71, no sound on phono, used line input, got sound.
I then connected it back to the SC-09TX, I got sound on Phono this time, but only on left speaker.
Right channel not working.
I am beginning to suspect the cartridge may be the fault, or the turntable. But last time I used the phono, it worked great.
I will either wait for Pioneer to let me know the exact type of Cartridge/Stylus for this receiver. I do not think the TT is defective.
Other testing:
I played back my Minidisc collections, worked great. I also played back CD from the yamaha CDR/CD player, no problem.

Thanks to everybody.
George T. Omoregie.
post #124 of 5375
Thread Starter 
George,
It sounds like you're making some progress at least. We hope you can figure it out soon & that it turns out to be on the TT side & not the SC-09.

FYI all - just been xperimenting with MCACC settings & phase control on music. The phase control does do something subtle to the sound at least with the speakers I use.

Magnepan deliberately wires the mid-bass panels out-of-phase with the tweeters on 3.6R's to enhance the illusion of soundfield depth. Usually the highs coming directly from the outside tweeters are forward with the centerfield somewhat recessed.

With phase control engaged, the soundfield seems more forward with vocals in the center moving forward. Not engaged, it returns to slightly recessed between the speakers. Maybe some with conventional speakers can post their thoughts on how well it works for them.....

So I have to conclude it works as advertised to time align the drivers. In most cases I think this will be a benefit for those with conventional box speakers. But with dipolar planar & electrostatic types, the effect may not be an improvement depending on your preferences. I know when I do serious music listening, I will turn Phase Control off most of time to preserve the "Maggie sound". At this point, I'll have to do more listening to see if I how much I like it with movies, but I think it'll enhance movie sound by making the soundfield more cohesive. The Patriot sounded awesome last weekend

Just like the 59TXI, I the way MCACC handles room EQ. It's not fussy & just seems to work.

Everyone will have to determine how these effects work for them with their speakers & room. Tweakers can have a field day with the SC-09!!

ss9001
post #125 of 5375
They even put a rf demodulator inside this receiver. Is there anybody using it for dd laserdiscs?
post #126 of 5375
Quote:
Originally Posted by rudolpht View Post

I agree with the sound, even on night setting, Golden Compass Blu-ray blew me away. I am only getting PCM so I need to see how to get bit streaming back.

rudolph, great to see you up and going here and enjoying the fruits. lovely projector too

ps re bitstream not sure your pio you have will do it for hdaudio the 95hd will though or unless yoru considering one of the new pios to come. would be a nice match for the SC-09 I imagine
post #127 of 5375
Quote:
Originally Posted by rudolpht View Post

Still working on computer into AVR directly. First attempt didn't work.


I will be very interested to hear about your experience with the computer interface to the AVR as that is one of the reasons I am considering purchasing an SC-09TX. I would also be interested to know if anyone has information in regards to the "Network GUI" which is referenced in the brochure, but I can find no mention of in the manual.
post #128 of 5375
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kemiza View Post

They even put a rf demodulator inside this receiver. Is there anybody using it for dd laserdiscs?

Yes, I have about a dozen LD's with DD. So, the RF input is useful. I used it on the previous flagship, the 59TXI, and it sounded great, very robust soundtrack. No reason not to think it will sound equally good on the SC-09.
post #129 of 5375
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by alebonau View Post

rudolph, great to see you up and going here and enjoying the fruits. lovely projector too

ps re bitstream not sure your pio you have will do it for hdaudio the 95hd will though or unless yoru considering one of the new pios to come. would be a nice match for the SC-09 I imagine

I know I have to upgrade to a new BD player. The Panny I have doesn't do DTS-MA decode or bitstream, being it was 1st gen. I'm seriously thinking of the new Pio -05.

alebonau, not to get off-track, but what's your thoughts on the -05 vs. the upcoming Panny BD50? I was going to go with the Panny being profile 2, but now thinking the Pio may have the better video from the chatter in the BD thread.
post #130 of 5375
Quote:
Originally Posted by retate View Post

I will be very interested to hear about your experience with the computer interface to the AVR as that is one of the reasons I am considering purchasing an SC-09TX. I would also be interested to know if anyone has information in regards to the "Network GUI" which is referenced in the brochure, but I can find no mention of in the manual.

..and speaking of computers; does it handle FLAC files or is it just MP3, WAV, WMA and AAC? The manual doesn't mention FLAC but I have seen indications that it would support it.
post #131 of 5375
Thread Starter 
Watched an HD-DVD last night in PCM. Sounded great, altho not as bombastic a soundtrack as Patriot. When Dolby TrueHD didn't show up on the -09, I remembered I needed to upgrade the XA2 firmware to 2.7 to get bitstream.

Felt like NASA today hoping the Mars lander doesn't crash, since Toshiba FW upgrades sometimes intro new bugs & problems. Post 2.7 upgrade, HDMI connection still intact & now a pretty Dolby TrueHD appears on the SC-09's display
post #132 of 5375
Quote:
Originally Posted by retate View Post

I will be very interested to hear about your experience with the computer interface to the AVR as that is one of the reasons I am considering purchasing an SC-09TX. I would also be interested to know if anyone has information in regards to the "Network GUI" which is referenced in the brochure, but I can find no mention of in the manual.

See post 122.
post #133 of 5375
Quote:
Originally Posted by alebonau View Post

rudolph, great to see you up and going here and enjoying the fruits. lovely projector too

ps re bitstream not sure your pio you have will do it for hdaudio the 95hd will though or unless yoru considering one of the new pios to come. would be a nice match for the SC-09 I imagine

Excellent point. I am waiting for the new Pio Profile 2.0 BD Player (hopefully before Christmas). The BDP has been a terrific workhorse and no need to upgrade while Pio is still supporting (I think there will be 3 interim models).

Unlike Steve I had 2.7 on my XA2, but I was using Adventures of Robin Hood during setup up. A great movie, but not a HD surround demo.

Elizabeth the Golden age comes up in Dolby TrueHD. It's amazing how ALL that text can come up on the screen vs infinitesimal like logos.
post #134 of 5375
This is an update on my PL-L1000 TT, with Sc-09TX.
It worked on left channel with the Stanton cartridge/Stylus, after a few minutes, nothing was heard from that same speakers.
I hope it is the TT cartridge/stylus, which can be easily discarded.
I am waiting to hear from Pioneer tech support. Besides this minor setback, everything I connected to worked flawlessly, minidisc, CD, CDR,, hopefully my Kenwood duo will be here by next week, will test 8.1 multi channel set up.

Two of the Kenwood DV-5900M have been mated with the SC-09TX, just waiting for the third unit to show up and see how it will handle the Kenwood Entre(set up as a server) with the SC-09TX.

At the moment, I checked the network GUI, nothing much, but I know Sc-09TX was quick at grabbing a static IP address ...194 which I had intended for it anyway.

But I can not tell yet until the Main, Sub1, sub2 units are all tied together.

Take care, everyone and thanks for helping out.

George T. Omoregie.
post #135 of 5375
Well life in legacy land trials and tribulations continue. My D30000U D-VHS unit put out great sound and upconverted picture on The Day After (pre-recordered D-Theater, then decided not to eject the tape). Hooked up the JVC D5HU and it works but not via HDMI (it never worked well via HDMI, but works fine upconverted on component). Actually the opening The Phantom Menace Queen's startcraft explosion sounds (and looks) pretty damn cool on the SC09-TX
post #136 of 5375
Sorry, to hear of your little problem with the JVC unit. I will test my Sc-09TX with JVC SR-VD400U, which is the upgraded version of the unit you have, very soon. I do not have a tv with YBR or firewire at this time.
I have already done most of the connecting with this JVC and with all other hardwares, just waiting for a big screen with more interfaces.
I did experience problem ejecting some minidisc from my Sony Mini player. What I did to get the disc to eject, is to grab the power extension cord it is connected to, remove the AC plug and pressing the power button on the unit. It works for me each time I have a failure in the ejecting mechanism.

George T. Omoregie.
post #137 of 5375
Thread Starter 
Tim,
I also have the D5HU and it works on HDMI, but I had rez set to No Convert and was only passing std def @ 480i. I have not tried it with DTheater tape yet. Maybe try another input on the -09? I have mine plugged into HDMI 3.

ss9001
Steve
post #138 of 5375
Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

Tim,
I also have the D5HU and it works on HDMI, but I had rez set to No Convert and was only passing std def @ 480i. I have not tried it with DTheater tape yet. Maybe try another input on the -09? I have mine plugged into HDMI 3.

ss9001
Steve

Steve,

For the little I could get picture (I may have a bad unit, it hasn't worked well with any AVR on HDMI), it looks much better 1080i converted by the Qdeo than straight HDMI. This is what I was hoping to happen, so I'm pretty jazzed the 1080i-> 1080p looks so good, HDMI be damned.

As a side note I have pulled out my Zektor high end 5x DVI switch, 4x HDMI switch, and Zektor 4x2 component + digital sound switch. Unfortunately I haven't pulled all the dozens of cables out, so I'm actually using poorer quality cables for component connections (but short runs). If I actually do some cleanup, it may actually help
post #139 of 5375
For those who may be interested in this piece who live in the Boston area, The Tweeter store in Burlington, MA has the SC-09TX hooked up in one of their sound rooms. I spent some time checking it out yesterday. Wow! What a beautiful piece of gear. I mentioned to the salesman that an owner was having difficulty with the phono input so he hooked up a Sony TT and played a Coltrane record and it worked flawlessly as it should.

I really want to get one of these but there are too many other things that I need to use my money for right now.

One question. Does anyone know if future firmware updates will be offered as downloads?
post #140 of 5375
Quote:
Originally Posted by bootstew View Post

For those who may be interested in this piece who live in the Boston area, The Tweeter store in Burlington, MA has the SC-09TX hooked up in one of their sound rooms. I spent some time checking it out yesterday. Wow! What a beautiful piece of gear. I mentioned to the salesman that an owner was having difficulty with the phono input so he hooked up a Sony TT and played a Coltrane record and it worked flawlessly as it should.

I really want to get one of these but there are too many other things that I need to use my money for right now.

One question. Does anyone know if future firmware updates will be offered as downloads?

Why I can not get the phono to work, I do not know. I finished hooking up all devices except a big screen. Even a cassette tape I made 25+ years ago, played very well. My wife was astonished at the sound it produced.
I am still waiting for Pioneer to offer suggestion. Pioneer will probably suggest to get a phono amp or use another type of cartridge.

George T. Omoregie.
post #141 of 5375
I'm getting the "Call because of complexity" answer to emails to Pio regarding conversion of HDMI sources. Have not called back.

Tips & Tricks for setup.

Though default source one is named DVD, use this for an LD player if you have one in your system. The S ins are not assignable to every input and using this device for LDs is easiest approach. I moved my 59DVi to VCR2 and everything works fine.
post #142 of 5375
A question for everyone that owns the SC-09, but wouldn't it be better to connect most of your sources (such as cable box, VCR) using the lowest quality signal (RCA, S-Video), then have the SC-09 upscale it as the scaler should be better then the actual sending and receiving device? Shouldn't it give you a better picture than connecting via Component or HDMI?

If purchasing a Video Scaler, that would most likely be the logic.

Any comments?
post #143 of 5375
Quote:
Originally Posted by bgarner View Post

A question for everyone that owns the SC-09, but wouldn't it be better to connect most of your sources (such as cable box, VCR) using the lowest quality signal (RCA, S-Video), then have the SC-09 upscale it as the scaler should be better then the actual sending and receiving device? Shouldn't it give you a better picture than connecting via Component or HDMI?

If purchasing a Video Scaler, that would most likely be the logic.

Any comments?

I would slightly modify the statement to say send the native rate of the output then upconvert appropriately.

For example LD is composite or S (depends on comb filter as to choice). D-VHS is 1080i component so you would send that and get best scaling/deinterlacing vs HDMI which is basically passed through. Most DVRs (eg HD Tivo) should pass native rate over component (or Standard Def over S and HD over component) to get best scaling deinterlacing.

On DVRs it is typically a myth based on testing that 1080i over HDMI is better than component (and the digital audio is truly identical) but some folks default to HDMI despite typical DVR & cable box flaky HDMI implementations - same quality + more problems (could be a beer commercial).
post #144 of 5375
Thread Starter 
Another setup option for someone with LD & DVD players is to use the analog vid BD inputs for the DVD player, assigning the DVD player's component vid to BD, and leave HDMI inputs all un-assigned for the real BD, HD-DVD & DVHS players. I'll eventually re-name the HDMI inputs to identify what input # is what source. Makes it a little easier for the wife

I have nothing real exciting to add so far this week, other than I'm finally enjoying Dolby 5.1 for HD cable box & DVR recordings. I ran out of dig audio inputs on the 59TXI so could only use 2 ch analog with the TV speakers . This may not be a gee-wiz SC-09 feature to brag on, but it made a big difference in my setup!
post #145 of 5375
Hi guys , im interested in this new unit. How is the sound quality on this? Is it totally different sounding. Compared to PRE/PROs
post #146 of 5375
Quote:
Originally Posted by baddgsx View Post

Hi guys , im interested in this new unit. How is the sound quality on this? Is it totally different sounding. Compared to PRE/PROs

Baddgsx,

the sound quality is very impressive. I played a 22 year old cassette tape on it, wooooo.

gto.
post #147 of 5375
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by baddgsx View Post

Hi guys , im interested in this new unit. How is the sound quality on this? Is it totally different sounding. Compared to PRE/PROs

George said it all.

It is very clear, and any differences between its amps & conventional class A/B amps are very subtle at best. I have a higher powered external amp I use for my fronts & I would rate it as -

#1 SC-09 amps very close to the external amp, with the -09 a bit clearer sounding & focused imaging & the external amp a bit more oomph due to its higher power

#2 the built-in amps with the older Pioneer flagship, the 59TXi

No sign of bright harshness or problems with the highs. My center channel is now clearer with the new receiver with higher volume. With the 59TXi, the center level was maxed, and it still sounded a bit thin and lower in volume. With the SC-09, its better matched in level with the fronts.

Analog audio played with no processing sounds excellent. Multichannel SACD's/DVD-A's also sound great, can't say I noticed any deficiencies with my 59TXi, but certainly they sound equally as good.

I haven't done a movie with DTS master audio yet, but PCM & Dolby TrueHD can be a big step up from std. DD. Of course it depends on the movie.

I'm very pleased with its sound.
Tim has had separate prepros so maybe he can chime in.
post #148 of 5375
Like Steve, I had a number of the Pio flagships, ending in the 59TXi before moving to pre-pros.

I started with an Anthem AVM-50 and Anthem PVA7 amp. I went to Anthem primarily for the Video solution (you'll see a videophile vs audiophile trend, so take my opinion for what it's worth).
I moved to a Yamaha Z-11 because of stability issues with Anthem. While the Yammie had a great holographic sound with the extra 4 effects speaker. The sound was "tighter" but not as full, if that makes sense.
I moved to the Onkyo 885 paired with the PVA7 amp (a good amp but not a hugely powerful amp). Here the multichannel sound was very good. Pristine, but still immersive, I would say on things like 3:10 to Yuma in high def sound.
The SC09-TX IMHO takes all the good qualities above with no negative trade offs. The sound is tight w/o being analytically so. Clean but full. Powerful w/o being boomy. SACD sounds great. Even old school analog stereo sounds fantastic. I agree the center, and I have a slight imbalance of speakers with a Magnepan CC3 center eating power, is a very "compelling" sound field that really smooths my room dynamics (lots of movie memorabilia, props, desk, etc.) and really puts you IN the movie.

I hope that makes sense. More qualitative/subjective than quantitative/metrics-based, but I love the SC09-TX sound. .
post #149 of 5375
I've been reading through the thread, paying close attention to posts like the one above. Do the ice amps still produce that pioneer warm sound? Or has it become more harsh?
post #150 of 5375
Thread Starter 
^^
Still the same warmish full sound. Not harsh at all. The class D amps are not doing anything harmful to Pioneer's trademark sound which is still Air Studios tuned. Even with MCACC EQ turned off, the sound does not seem overly bright.
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