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OT: Leaking roof

post #1 of 22
5/12/08 at 7:33am
Thread Starter 
Grrrr. So the three inches of rainfall we got yesterday caused a leak to develop. It was dripping down the inside wall during the heaviest of the rainfall last night. This morning the drippage stopped, even though it's still raining. This isn't the first time this has happened. The spot you see on the ceiling first appeared after a nasty rain storm with high winds earlier this year. But it's been dry since, well up to yesterday.



Since the water was running down the wall I rigged up a way to get the water in the bucket... got to love duct-tape!



I suspect the issue has something to do with the piece of flashing that runs across the roof right above the wet spot. It's possible that when the volume of water is high enough, it seeps up and under one of the tiles. The roof is only a few years old, so besides reroofing the entire section, and other possible solutions? Do they may roofing patch tar that works when it's wet?




I'm also wondering if I should remove the drywall. We plan on repainting the room later this summer, but with the bum arm I can't do any drywall repair and painting for a couple more months. It's been my experience that I'm as likely to find the drip spot as not. For all I know it's coming from another spot and just running down the wood sheeting until that particular spot. And I'd hate to have a hole in the drywall for several weeks. Suggestions?
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post #2 of 22
5/12/08 at 7:53am
I had a similar leak in my front room over the piano. I was able to go up in the attic and trace it back: it was coming from a spot 20' away (further up the roof), running down a hip joist and dripping down the wall. It turned out three shingles had blown off up there...

If the drywall hasn't deformed, it will likely dry out just fine and you can just texture/paint it. If it starts to deform a bit, brace a piece of wood against it to keep it in shape.

The real question is what's going on in the wall. That leak may not be new, it may just have gotten bad enough during the last storm to show through the drywall. I had an upstairs plumbing leak into a downstairs bathroom. When I ripped out the drywall, it turned out it had been slow dripping for quite a while (I'm guessing years...). I ended up gutting half the bathroom.

If it's a recent leak, you might get away with just opening up a hole in the wall to let it dry out quickly. Make the hole the size of a junction box and you just slap an empty old-work box in there with a blank cover plate and not need to do drywall repairs.
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post #3 of 22
5/12/08 at 8:31am
I'm thinking that upper gutter to the right of the skylight is the culprit.



That pile of leaves suggests that it is clogged, overflowed and got into the crease between the vertical dormer and the roof.

Have you gone in the attic to try to figure it out?
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post #4 of 22
5/12/08 at 8:36am
Thread Starter 
Unfortunately there isn't an attic above that particular part of the house. Whatever the cause, the leak is only present during the truly heavy rain fall where one is likely to get gutter or up-flow related type issues. I strongly suspect it's an issue with that flashing piece. The flashing is directly over the drip spot. Wind may have pried a shingle loose or something. Last house we had we managed to patch the roof with some tar like substance. I may give that a shot. I'll also inspect the roof just in case I can spot some issue further up the roof line.

DC- You are right in that it looks like I may have a gutter issue there too. I'll clean it out. Odd thing is that that particular gutter doesn't have a run off. Not sure I understand where the water is to flow out...
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post #5 of 22
5/12/08 at 8:39am
Unclog your gutters. Keep them clearer.

You roof looks decent for sure.
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post #6 of 22
5/12/08 at 9:37am
Thread Starter 
Talk about crappy weather for climbing on the roof.

Looks like that gutter was clogged. Water may have been running over the flashing as a result. We'll see if that clears up the issue. For now I think I may put a very small hole in the drywall so that I can more easily tell if that area is dry or not now.



As you can see the previous owner put in some basic gutter guards. I may price out just having some real after market caps put in. We live in a heavily wooded area so leaves and stuff are definitely issues.

Thanks for the helps guys.
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post #7 of 22
5/12/08 at 10:23am
You are not going to believe what they charge for those metal permanent gutter covers. I would be embarrassed to tell you what I paid. I can also tell you that since it is a VERY HIGH profit margin business that all prices are negotiable. I'm talking 30-40% off first quote.

It also helps for you to have a preliminary measurement of the linear ft of gutters on your house before they show up so that you can keep them honest.

All my gutter related problems ended when I had them installed. I don't regret the decision one bit because there is no way I plan on doing any work up on my roof.
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post #8 of 22
5/12/08 at 10:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathan View Post

Odd thing is that that particular gutter doesn't have a run off. Not sure I understand where the water is to flow out...

This is one cause of your problem. At a minimum you should have a down spout attached that directs the water onto a portion of the roof that empties into another gutter.
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post #9 of 22
5/12/08 at 10:32am
Bummer, dude.

Can't believe you climbed up there with a bad wing.

Quote:


Unfortunately there isn't an attic above that particular part of the house.

I'd be willing to bet there IS an attic, it just doesn't have an access panel. In my house, even with the cathedral ceiling in the bedroom. there is about a foot or so between the top of ceiling rafters and the actual roof rafters. I found that out when I was trying to figure out how to run a coax cable up there to get to the other bedrooms.

Come on, put your DIY man-belt on and go create an access!
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post #10 of 22
5/12/08 at 10:32am
agree with BIG. Even if the leaves are emptied, if there is no downspout to the lower roof, its just going to continue. Also I must say you are right this weather stinks! I feel like I should postpone my theater for an ark...
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post #11 of 22
5/12/08 at 10:33am
Quote:


You are not going to believe what they charge for those metal permanent gutter covers. I would be embarrassed to tell you what I paid.

Not the BPE (Ball Park Estimte) of 30K I hope!
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post #12 of 22
5/12/08 at 10:36am
If I remember correctly $11-13 linear ft installed with "lifetime" warranty.
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post #13 of 22
5/12/08 at 10:49am
Mine did the same thing over 7 years ago.. I regularly clear out the leaves now. (once or twice per year and I have not had it happen since)
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post #14 of 22
5/12/08 at 11:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post

This is one cause of your problem. At a minimum you should have a down spout attached that directs the water onto a portion of the roof that empties into another gutter.

Exactly. It looks like any water that does get in there ends up flowing backwards out of the gutter and up the roof. A really heavy rain probalby has 4 inches of water or more at the spot in the valley where the gutter just ends.

At minimum, you should cap the end off and put an a downspout in a foot or so back. You can also slip some flashing in below where the downspout would drop onto the roof. A better way would be to remove the gutter, install the cap, then re-hang the gutter with forward slope (toward the camer on most of the shots) and install a downspout at the front going to teh otehr gutter or the ground if possible.

It would be helpful to see other pictures of the rest of the roof. Maybe the same shots but soomed out a little.
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post #15 of 22
5/12/08 at 11:44am
I hear gutter filters are better.
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgu...%3D1%26hl%3Den
The gutter helmets still tend to get debris in them from what I understand.
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post #16 of 22
5/12/08 at 12:05pm
I wonder how bad those gutter filters would degrade in the sunlight, they seem to be just foam inserts.
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post #17 of 22
5/12/08 at 12:26pm
I was recently at a Harvey Industries contractor supply store, they had a similar product on display, it was more like a vynil mesh. This particular product might be different but it makes reference about the sunlight in it's description. I came up with it from a quick google search but there are similar options available at different gutter shops online.
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post #18 of 22
5/12/08 at 12:27pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post

This is one cause of your problem. At a minimum you should have a down spout attached that directs the water onto a portion of the roof that empties into another gutter.

Once I cleared out the debris I saw that the gutter run about an inch short of the roof that it's directly over and just spills out. I'd take a photo, but no way in hell am I going back up there today. I nearly toppled the a-frame ladder when trying to get back down. I would have been stuck until a neighbor got home.

I agree with the suggestion about capping and rehanging that gutter. It should have been installed so that it runs towards the roof edge, down a downspout and into that smaller gutter right by the edge.

Quote:


'd be willing to bet there IS an attic, it just doesn't have an access panel. In my house, even with the cathedral ceiling in the bedroom. there is about a foot or so between the top of ceiling rafters and the actual roof rafters. I found that out when I was trying to figure out how to run a coax cable up there to get to the other bedrooms.

You're right that there has to be. Here a photo looking out that skylight. That's like a good 16" clearance between the drywall and actual roof. Plenty of room to go crawling around in...



You can also see where a downspout should have been installed.

DC - $13 per linear foot...no clue how many linear feet of gutter I have. I'd guess less then 250'.
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post #19 of 22
5/12/08 at 12:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by oman321 View Post

The gutter helmets still tend to get debris in them from what I understand.

Not in the 7 years I've had mine.

Every spring I do a visual inspection during a good daytime downpour (with an umbrella) to make sure all the gutters are free flowing. This thread just reminded me to do it again.
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post #20 of 22
5/12/08 at 12:37pm
Michael:



is that gutter sloped away from the house?

Also it looks like the end is recessed into the roof?????
or is it just an optical illusion?

I just had another thought. If you have any other homes in your development with the same model you might want to check them out. I'm not certain you need a gutter at all in that location. It might be causing more problems then it solves. Once removed it looks like all the runoff would fall onto the roof below and then be carried away.
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post #21 of 22
5/12/08 at 12:56pm
Thread Starter 
Reading reviews and it looks like even the expensive gutterguard systems have problems with the spring time debris. That's the stuff I had clogging my system.

Now the filter stuff looks interesting: http://www.gutterfiller.com/gutter_protection_00.asp

I could get the whole house done for under a grand. Hmmm...need to read some more.
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post #22 of 22
5/12/08 at 1:00pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post

Michael:


is that gutter sloped away from the house?

Also it looks like the end is recessed into the roof?????
or is it just an optical illusion?

I just had another thought. If you have any other homes in your development with the same model you might want to check them out. I'm not certain you need a gutter at all in that location. It might be causing more problems then it solves. Once removed it looks like all the runoff would fall onto the roof below and then be carried away.

The gutter slopes towards the roof. There is about an inch gap between the end of the gutter and the roof. It's a completely asinine design. And yes, I most likely can ditch that gutter as it would just fall onto the roof below.


A good thread on the subject here : http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load...050224523.html
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