What CECB is the best? And worst. Vote here. Updated tally 7/24/10 - Page 11

bought two coship brand at heb for 40.00 less coupon, total cost free
hooked them up to a couple of tv sets from the 80's, the kind that only get 13 channels. amazing the stuff i am getting in the atascocita area. using the rabbitt ears from the tv sets.
getting 2-1,2,3, 11-1-2, 13-1-2-3, 14-1-2-3-4-5, 20, 26, 39, 45, 47, 61, 67. (houston, texas area)

called 8, 49, and 55, they all told me they are in low power until feb and i may need a real antenna even then. happy with my free boxes, but not sure yet how well they will work when hooked up to my generator during the next hurricane. probably still be better than my neighbors who had cable (or rather, did not have cable, after Ike.)

ZENITH
the remote is a lot better (than tivax) , it works without having to point it directly at the eye in the converter box. PQ is great and the tuner (no better or worse than tivax) itself pulls in the available stations and holds them very well. zoom function for individual channels is a great feature.

BOTH
both boxes have "add scan" feature so you can add channels after the initial scan. both have a signal strength meter, the zenith's is a horizontal bar with "beep" tone and the tivax is horizontal bar with a numerical % sign.

TIVAX
I preferred the guide on the tivax, it can show what's coming on for the next several hours (about 1~12) if the data is available. the zenith will only display the current show and what's next. perhaps a firmware update would give me the tivax guide on the zenith box, that would make the zenith perfect for me.

In the end the zoom feature on the zenith is more usefull to me. when you apply the "cropped" format to the 16:9 channels no blackbars will appear. this is ideal for 4:3 tv sets. the zenith also works pretty well on widescreen tv's that are as large as 40 inches, it has aspect ratio setting in the menu that allows you to set the output to 16-9 or 4-3. its a great feature for EDTVs and HD monitors without a digital tuner.

I have a dumb question here and I'm new..so sorry. I have one NON digital tv and 3 NON digital DVD recorders.. I can get Digital on all the TVs but the one that is NON digital. SOO would a box allow me to watch digital stations on the non-digital station? Oops sorry.. I have cable not OTA. See dumb huh? Any help would be appreciated. Also: will I be able to record with the non digital DVD recorders? Thanks so much
Casey

If you are on cable and get all your viewing through the cable system, the CECB's discussed within this forum, will not do you any good.

Keep your eyes open for mailings from your cable company next March through June. They *may* offer a one time no-cost cable box for subscribers such as yourself. If they do, read the fine print, if any, and consider getting one of those.

Your non-digital DVD recorders have analog tuners. Your cable-ready coaxial connection provides analog signals and digital or analog cable converters have analog outputs that will allow you to continue to record from cable with your DVD recorders just as you do now. The need for a cable company digital to analog converter may arise as your cable company transitions channels to a digital tier of service.

Should you wish to record OTA digital broadcast signals simply set up an antenna connected to a government approved converter box connected to the yellow "composite video," white and red audio inputs on a DVD recorder. Your DVD recorders do not need to rescan the channels to record from the line inputs.

The government approved converter boxes do not work with a cable company connection.

Cable is also going to provide phone banks for questions regarding the transition. I'm sure they will be more than helpful when it comes to antennas and converters.

Zenith / Insignia - 1 positive vote
DTVPal (F106) - 1 positive vote

So far from all the research here and other places, this is what I had wrote up for family members to decide. Hoping this might help others, I posted the writeup below. Personally I have a Zenith June 2008 build and a DTVPal F106 version and both have been good and problem free. On some days I have noticed the audio seems to skip on the Zenith and it is a unit that has the latest build with audio fix so not sure why it does this sometimes as I have not investigated it much since its in the kids room.

WHAT ARE THE BEST DTV CONVERTERS:

Most people and reviewers have prefered the Zenith DTT901 or DTT900 and Insignia NS-DXA1. Both units are same hardware inside but just different brand labels. I have one and can attest that it is a very nice and well functioning unit.

1. Channel Master ATSC Digital Converter Box CM-7000 ($50-60 Frys, online: www.summitsource.com )
- 6th generation DTV tuner
- one of the few conversion boxes that have an S-VIDEO OUTPUT!
- 12 hour program episode guide
- excellent build quality and reputable manufacturer
- will not find in stores (maybe Frys), can get online: www.summitsource.com

2. Apex DT502 ($40-55 TigerDirect, Best Buy)
- 6th generation DTV tuner
- full 14 day episode guide
- one of the few conversion boxes that have an S-VIDEO OUTPUT!
- cons: poor remote - bad range and bad design, propensity to lock up, freeze, and require a reboot
- con2: some report very slight green tint on S-Video

If you are not going to use these above units for S-Video output or your TV does not have an S-Video input, then just get the Zenith/Insignia below. Or if your TV is a smaller less then 32" then also just go with the Zenith/Insignia below.

2. Zenith DTT901 or DTT900 ($50-60 Radio Shack, Best Buy, Kmart)
Insignia NS-DXA1

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=948767
- 6th generation DTV tuner
- both Zenith and Insignia are same hardware inside and just labeled as different brand
- most popular unit and best reviews
- reported to have best PQ (Picture Quality) of any of the non S-Video units
- now/next episode guide only
- known audio issue in older models so try and get an April 2008 build date or later (build date is labeled on box)

Popular Boxes with Major Issues:
DTVPal (people with older builds of these units are experiencing lockups and other issues). I have an F106 build, the latest and it seems to be okay but I have not had it very long. Unit does get very hot and has no ventalation spots. Event timer is finicky in all software versions and some say it just does not work. If you really need event timers, Zinwell is an alternative for that feature.

VERDICT:
Zenith in most cases, CM7000 if using on larger TV (36" or greater) and rooftop antenna and using its S-Video, If can't live without onscreen TVGuide then CM7000 or a DTVPal (F106 software version).

SPECIAL NOTE: If you use the CC often (Closed Captioning feature) the read below:

Evaluating Digital to Analog Converter Boxes for Users of Captioning
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...8#post13165078

So far, all the CECBs that are sold in the brick and mortar stores appear to support digital closed captioning, but there are significant differences in the appearance and quality of the closed captions

Insignia NS-DXA1 (Same as the Zenith DTT900) (Best Buy - $20 after coupon)
As of May 7th, the Insignia/Zenith CECBs appear to be the only CECBs I know of which can provide digital captions larger than the analog captions provided by my TV. They are very readable using font0 or font7.

CC Pictures here:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...8#post13165078

You forgot, "If you need a dependable timer feature: forget about the Pal completely and get the Zinwell". You were honest about the Pal's timers, but it might've been a good idea to follow that up with mentioning the Zinwell as a dependable alternative for that feature.

Plus, if you really want more of a guide, I still might choose the CM over the Zenith, even when using composite or RF. The PQ's probably about equal (I don't know what you mean by "weak signal areas", but my CM is more sensitive than any other box I've tried, including the Zenith. Multipath might be a different story, but that's not a "weak signal" If you mean multipath, then you should probably change that - but in no way is the Zenith more sensitive than the CM. Close, maybe, but not quite. I suppose YM could somehow V, but it's hard for me to see how. But the guide on the CM is considerably better in most people's opinion, and that's the main comparison I'm focusing on here).

Even aside from the s-video's better PQ, at least between the two models, I would say for a non-geek, JSP or elderly person who doesn't want to mess around, just get the Zenith, because it's the best, simplest, all-around box (and remote). But for someone who really wants the better guide and sensitivity (and doesn't have any major multipath issues - if that's true - I don't have that problem so I couldn't tell), get the CM. If that stuff doesn't matter, and you're still a geek, than just get the Zenith. You can never go wrong with the Zenith.

I second the above second paragraph to a tee. No comment on the first paragraph since I have neither of those.
edit: In agreement with the 3rd paragraph too, the CM's not really a grandma's box

I don't believe I've ever seen an overscan problem with the DT502, although the DT250 is the model that the problem has been reported with.

Really,Are any of them? I mean.. if granny can't set the VCR clock can she be expected install and operate the box? Besides, most of them have remotes so small she'll have to go buy a magnifying glass even if she can get it to work.
They need to add CECB control to those $9.95 giant remotes sold at CVS and Walgreens.

You don't need a magnifying glass for the Digital Stream 9950, the RCA DTA800B1, or the RCA DTA809 remotes. The RCA's have UR's that control the TV ON/OFF, Volume, Mute, and the Input.

Those big-button universal remotes should have the ability to at least turn the CM on and off, and work the channels and volume. It uses a very, very old Pioneer cable box code. Might work the Pal, too (and many of the features on it), which uses an older Scientific Atlanta cable box code.

I updated my post based on the comments.

I read from someone in another post that the CM had problems tuning in channels in which they did not have a strong enough signal. Was this persons experience an isolated incident? Based on some comments here from other users it seems so. So I removed that bullet point on the CM.

Another reason that the Zenith is a good box for Grandma is the better CC. I notice that anyone with some hearing loss at later stage in life, often use the CC feature to compensate. And a readable CC is a very good feature in the Zenith. Not sure how the CM compares in CC but I thought I read somewhere it has issue with cropping off some of the CC area.

Haven't tried in on the CM, but did finally find a code via search in the satellite section that will fully operate the Zenith 900/901. Remote is a
available ate CVS and Overstock.com Item # 10379917

The Zenith DTT901 is very good but needs one improvement - an S video feed.
The composite video output is just not as sharp as an S video feed would be.

We have a good high end Sony 27" CRT and a DVD player connected to Video 1 via an S Video link and also connected to Video 2 input via a composite cord and the difference is quite noticeable. I'm sure it would be the same from the Zenith box. Why they didn't do it is beyond me.

The features and functions on the converter box are excellent and it does NOT run hot.

My 10/08 issue Zenith 901 works superbly well on my 30" 16:9 EDTV Tantus that "upconverts" 480i output of the Zen to progressive (thru Monster composites) via the Pro-Chip feature...and currently gets 60 channels here in LA County (Terk HDTVa + Motorola Booster). Very happy with this albeit "plain-jane" C Box...

Which CVS remote are you talking about, found these listed on CVS online.

And it like like this is the one from overstock (boy this is a huge remote):
Innovage Jumbo Universal Remote

And what are the codes for these for the Zenith?

I have a positive vote for the Coship N9988t. With the regular analog channels I only received maybe 10 channels. With the Coship I get around 40 channels and a lot clearer picture. There is a bit of a lag (about 1 second) when switching channels, but I am 50 miles away from their broadcast.

That's the one, it's not online at CVS but is in most stores at least here.
It's a big mutha! it's available on ebay too.
The procedure to read out the code found under search doesn't seem to work, I'll try and see if I can second guess it tomorrow in the daylight.
It is under the satellite key tho. I suspect it may work other CECB's like the CM as Rammitinski suggests.

It works well with the Zenith.

I have an RCA DTA800B (nope missed the B1's by a month or two) and an RCA DTA809. I have run them on 4 different indoor antennae: at home [1] a Jasco Optima now labeled GE, unamplified; all yellow UHF/VHF received (upstairs I got Violet UHF Ch. 41) ; [2] a Radio Shack 15-1892 (Star Ship, I loved it, wife hated it to put it mildly) got all Yellow UHF/VHF and a Violet UHF from 46miles away; and finally, [3] an RCA ANT2000, get everything the Radio Shack 15-1892 got, without rabbit ears and the Starship saucer section. At work I use an RCA DTA800B with a Jensen TV920 that is very sensitive to multipath, but in the ceiling, no one touches it, picks up Red and Blue UHF/VHF, a thousand times better than the old Analog reception in light of all the nearby buildings (used to barely get one Channel); in a different office with same RCA box use an RCA ANT1251 on 25 feet of RG6 coax, again getting all locals, also was subjected to lots of multi-path interference till put antenna in a window, now great reception.
I have 4 family members all with RCA DTA800B's, a variety of roof and attic antennas and all are favorably impressed. Easy to use and set up, reliable and long lasting remotes. They all wish they had waited for the DTA809 but then again all of us have enjoyed wonderful DTV since 2/08 here in the Twin Cities.
So I represent 13 family member that like the RCA best, between us, we do not like the Venturer, nor Apex nor GE boxes (all tried without success), and at two offices I represent 50 staff member that have been favorably impressed with the RCA DTA800B, and about a quarter of them have gone and bought them as well. A few had Zenith's and preferred the RCA for user friendliness and no one objected to sound nor video quality.
How's that for real experience!

And the reason for the QUOTE?

I shopped all the locally-available convertors early in 2008 and decided that the RCA DTA800B was my best option, in spite of the LACK of an S-Video output. (At that time NO ONE in Minneapolis carried or had even heard of a convertor with S-Video!) The attractive RCA was cheap and readilly available at WalMart. The biggest problem was finding one in stock before they were all sold out, usually within several days of arrival at each store. I found a review at hdtvexpert, online.

Findings:
- This has one of the best-designed remotes that I have ever seen!! Its buttons are color-coded to easily differentiate TV functions (Power, volume, input-toggle, mute) from Convertor Box functions. I found the buttons large and variable in size and shape, making them easy for me to work, even in a dimly-lit room. Also, the box tunes channels very quickly, about as fast as anyone could wish. However, one minor hardware oversight is the lack of a PrevChannel button; I do miss that function.

- I searched for a convertor with an S-Video output, because my older Mitsubishi 26 inch tube TV did not have a Comb filter. Due to the clearer image that ghost-free digital produces, I am now frustrated with hanging dots and dot crawl appearing on lines and edges in computer-generated graphics occasionally. This thankfully has only a minor effect on most non-graphics images. However, I believe that an inexpensive S-Video out would totally eliminate these cross-color artifacts, producing a pristine image.

- Also, I wish that it had a Program Guide that ran out for 12 or more hours as my 37 inch Syntax Olevia HDTV does. I really like, and use, that guide!

Summary- Now, the RCA DTA800B is NOT perfect, but for only $20 after voucher, RCA did use a great, user-friendly remote and produces a very good picture, with the minor exception of dot crawl issues. I know of only 2 or 3 company's convertors, out of the entire industry, that even dared (cared) include S-Video in these inexpensive consumer devices, which honestly are only temporary bridges to the future of full digital imaging. So, I guess that the RCA is a darn good buy and possibly one of the best $20 that I ever spent! It will probably get me through to a time when we all walk around with an HDTV/ cellphone/ web-connection on our wrist!

The RCA DTA-809 works great for me. Great remote (except for missing jump-to-previous-channel button). I don't need the TV remote any more. Easy setup, good sound, great picture on my 19" kitchen TV. I have to rotate the indoor bowtie antenna to reliably pick up channel 41 which comes from 156 degrees away from the other channels.

I was reminded to put my findings here. I have had great success with the RCA DTA800B & 809 and the Universal remote has been universally enjoyed by all family, friends, and office staff alike. The Insignia helped cure the problems I had in one unusual office location.
In Eagan home, I have an RCA DTA800B on the main floor hooked to an RCA ANT2000. I get wonderful rock steady pictures and no need to move the antenna as I had to do with my previous antennae: Optima (was Jensen now it's GE, this was non-amplified) and a wonderful RadioShack 15-1892 (Starship). Upstairs I have the new RCA DTA809 also hooked up to RCA ANT2000, also rock steady. I get all channels from 16.5 miles (2,4,5,9,11,17,23,29,and 45) I ALSO get Channel 41 which is 40+ miles away on BOTH TVs! Channel 41 comes in at 12-14% strength but good pictures...the joys of Smart Antenna!
At my Eagan office 2+ miles East north east of me, I elected to use an Insignia due to its better tuner history, and I hooked it to an RCA ANT1450 (couldn't find its lager cousin ANT1550), I get 2,4,5,9,11,23,and 29. Unfortunately we have a Walgreen's building 20 feet from the window I need to aim out of, and a 3 story bank building in Line of Sight to the Towers. We are not allowed to mount outside antenna, and the Stucco and steel construction prevents ceiling mount from being any better.
In my St Paul office, have an RCA DTA800B hooked to an old Jensen amplified TV920 and it gets 2,4,5,11,17,23,29,45, +/- 9. This was a real touchy antenna that took an hour to find the spot in the ceiling.
In Golden Valley, hooked a Philips ANT940 on a garage work shelf to an in-house RG59 antenna network and send perfect signals to 1 HDTV and 2 DTA800B boxes, one is 35ft from the antenna! We get ALL channels!
In Eden Prairie, used an Amplified Silver Sensor and get all but Channel 41 (could get it if drastically moved Antenna but in February,or later if Obama has his way, 41 will move to Shoreview towers) on an Aquos; same goes for sub-basement bedroom using a GE Futura hooked up to a DTA800B and get ALL but channel 41.
In a Bloomington veterinarian office of my sister, hooked up an RCA ANT1251 to an RCA DTA800B 35ft away and get all but 41.

I always advise using both TVfool.com along with antennaweb.org before installing any system. I bring extension cords, extra cable, extra connectors and adapters. It really is fun to see peoples eyes open up when they see DTV on an old TV, really makes all the antenna moving worth it.

As a new member of the forum, I wanted to send out a general thanks for the wealth of good information in the various converter box threads.

Without the knowledge I had gained in several days of browsing around here, I would not have known, for example, that the Insignia NS-DXA1-APT box at the BB store is essentially the same unit as the highly rated Zenith DTT-901. Nor would I EVER have guessed that the Zinwell ZAT-970/950 could be found at my local Osco drug store.

My browsing here also helped me decide (after much consternation about finding the "right" unit for my needs) that these were my best choices for 1) good reception and ease of use (Insignia) and 2) generally reliable event timers (Zinwell). And when I made my purchases, I knew to rummage through the June, July, August and September Insignia boxes still on the shelf at BB until I found ONE October box. And I knew how to check and verify that the new shipment of Zinwell 950's that arrived Saturday afternoon at the Osco were the 839 build.

So thanks for all the tremendous information made available here. I just wanted you all to know that non-tech people like me find it useful and appreciate you sharing your knowledge. (It's so different from so many other online forums that seem to descend into a flurry of insults to anyone who doesn't share the poster's views.)

I agree, it has been great to just relay experience without put downs! And the real expert knowledge as to the details of DTV has been a joy.

I bought a Tivax STB-T8 and it seemed to be fine for the 1/2 hour it worked, then it died, Tivax refuses to send me an RMA # as stated in their 90 day warranty, they tell me to return it to Amazon, Amazon says return it to the manufacture. It looks like I've been robbed, about the only option I see is small claims court, sure, who has the time for that.

Tivax is not an honest company.