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Zenith DTT901 - Page 9

post #241 of 2239
It isn't just the coast, not at all. It doesn't show on OPB's map, but at least some of the main metro stations do reach the coastal towns. Plus, I get one analog station from the coast with indoor antenna, so the signal carries ok in that direction even with the coastal range. Except for the Portland/Corvallis/Eugene/Bend station reach, the whole state is in the post transition analog zone. OR is among the highest OTA viewers, ~27% -- compared to Wilmington's 6%. OPB started educating viewers months before other stations. But even Portland is heavy with boosters because of dead spots, and people getting those boosters may need analog to continue getting the main networks, even a couple miles from the towers. OPB's map is mostly about OPB coverage, but 12/24 of the signals tvfool shows are analog post Feb. That means the whole state could use 901s. I have a 900 and don't want a 900 for my second coupon. Link below is to OPB's map.

http://www.opb.org/digital/images/DTVMap.jpg
post #242 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by TalkingRat View Post

OPB started educating viewers months before other stations. But even Portland is heavy with boosters because of dead spots, and people getting those boosters may need analog to continue getting the main networks, even a couple miles from the towers. OPB's map is mostly about OPB coverage, but 12/24 of the signals tvfool shows are analog post Feb. That means the whole state could use 901s. I have a 900 and don't want a 900 for my second coupon.

As interesting as the Oregon Public Broadcasting map is, the complete story is found on the OPB channel list:

http://www.opb.org/television/?mode=findChannel

Notice that five OPB channels are located in Washington State. OPB on-air announcements state that OPB serves Oregon and southwest Washington.

I expect that this station list is typical of Oregon commercial broadcast station repeaters/translators as well.
post #243 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by TalkingRat View Post

It isn't just the coast, not at all. It doesn't show on OPB's map, but at least some of the main metro stations do reach the coastal towns. Plus, I get one analog station from the coast with indoor antenna, so the signal carries ok in that direction even with the coastal range. Except for the Portland/Corvallis/Eugene/Bend station reach, the whole state is in the post transition analog zone. OR is among the highest OTA viewers, ~27% -- compared to Wilmington's 6%. OPB started educating viewers months before other stations. But even Portland is heavy with boosters because of dead spots, and people getting those boosters may need analog to continue getting the main networks, even a couple miles from the towers. OPB's map is mostly about OPB coverage, but 12/24 of the signals tvfool shows are analog post Feb. That means the whole state could use 901s. I have a 900 and don't want a 900 for my second coupon. Link below is to OPB's map.

http://www.opb.org/digital/images/DTVMap.jpg

I stand corrected. I see from the FCC database that there are now a few low power analog stations along the central to northern coast. I also see a few construction permits for low power digital stations, some by Meredith communications (owners of KPTV and KPDX). So the residents could use the boxes soon.

Talking Rat, out of curiosity, what community do you live in and which coastal station do you get?
post #244 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by TalkingRat View Post

12/24 of the signals tvfool shows are analog post Feb. That means the whole state could use 901s. I have a 900 and don't want a 900 for my second coupon.

Oregon and Washington residents (some 2.2 million in the Portland OR/Vancouver WA MSA alone) have much the same situation.

That is why I find the Hayden Island Circuit City manager holding back DTT901 models from sale to customers with expiring coupons to be particularly egregious.

It seems that this is the same situation (gleaned from telephone inquiries) at the Tigard and Clackamas CC stores. The Gateway CC store, just a few miles from eastern portions of Vancouver, seems to be the exception with a trickle of DTT901 models.

The Hayden Island CC store is located one mile from downtown Vancouver. The next closest Washington CC store is located in Olympia, about 110 miles distant. The other Portland area CC stores (and even a CC store located some 45 miles distant in Keizer Oregon) are closer to the Portland/Vancouver MSA than the Olympia Washington CC store.
post #245 of 2239
This thread is getting off topic.
The current discussion deserves it's own thread.
post #246 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by avnstf View Post

so does this mean a lot of Oregon stations don't already have a digital station going yet? that isn't true here around San Francisco, where the digital stations have been going for years, so I basically don't even look at the analog versions any more...

(I realize that in rural areas many stations don't have digital equivalents yet, but I thought that was mostly areas that depended on repeaters, many of which are unlikely to have swtiched over even by February)

The main stations in Oregon run south from Portland to Eugene to Roseburg to Medford, and south from Bend to Klamath Falls. There are mountains on both sides of the Portland - Medford corridor (Coast Range on the west, Cascades on the east), and the same for the Bend - KFalls area (Cascades west, Ochocos/Fremonts east). Most of the rest of the state is decidedly rural, especially when compared with the Bay area. The only area on the coast with stations is Coos Bay, but the topography of the Coast Range isolates that area. So, OTA is all on repeaters there. In fact, Astoria, OR had the first cable TV system in the country, pulling in the first Seattle station in 1948 and distributing it around town.

My parents live way out in Eastern Oregon, near a town called Unity. They get their OTA from Boise, ID, 110 miles SE from them.
post #247 of 2239
Please keep on topic. Take local discussions to the appropriate local forum.
post #248 of 2239
Does anyone know if the DTT901 (or any other box with analog pass-through for that matter) has separate on and off buttons on the remote? I would like to program my JP1 remote to power on the DTT901 (disabling the pass-through) when I press the CBL button and power off the DTT901 (enabling the pass-through) when I press the TV button. If the same button toggles the power, it could easily get out of sync and power on the cable box when I press the TV button.

I am trying to keep the WAF (Wife Acceptance Factor) as high as possible here.
post #249 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by roger1818 View Post

Does anyone know if the DTT901 (or any other box with analog pass-through for that matter) has separate on and off buttons on the remote? I would like to program my JP1 remote to power on the DTT901 (disabling the pass-through) when I press the CBL button and power off the DTT901 (enabling the pass-through) when I press the TV button. If the same button toggles the power, it could easily get out of sync and power on the cable box when I press the TV button.

I am trying to keep the WAF (Wife Acceptance Factor) as high as possible here.

The DTT901 uses the same remote as the DTT900. There are separate buttons for TV Power and Converter Box Power. The remote's model number is AKB36157102.
post #250 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by roger1818 View Post

Does anyone know if the DTT901 (or any other box with analog pass-through for that matter) has separate on and off buttons on the remote? I would like to program my JP1 remote to power on the DTT901 (disabling the pass-through) when I press the CBL button and power off the DTT901 (enabling the pass-through) when I press the TV button. If the same button toggles the power, it could easily get out of sync and power on the cable box when I press the TV button.

I am trying to keep the WAF (Wife Acceptance Factor) as high as possible here.

The DTT901 does not have discrete on/off buttons, and I don't know of any CECB's that do.
post #251 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by roger1818 View Post

Does anyone know if the DTT901 (or any other box with analog pass-through for that matter) has separate on and off buttons on the remote? I would like to program my JP1 remote to power on the DTT901 (disabling the pass-through) when I press the CBL button and power off the DTT901 (enabling the pass-through) when I press the TV button. If the same button toggles the power, it could easily get out of sync and power on the cable box when I press the TV button.

I am trying to keep the WAF (Wife Acceptance Factor) as high as possible here.

The Remote Control for the DTT900 and DTT901 has has the on/off button for the CEDB and an On/off button for the TV. The attached picture is the manual's page for the Remote Control. In this forum I have seen and used links to download manuals for several CECBs.
LL
post #252 of 2239
Found this at king-cart:

Original PDF

1.Inner of DTT901



2.Main Board of DTT901




3.Inner of NS-DXA1-APT



4.Main Board of NS-DXA1-APT




5.Power Board of DTT901 and NS-DXA1-APT




6.LGIT Tuner (TDVG-H151F)




7.Inner of the LGIT Tuner (TDVG-H151F)


post #253 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by roger1818 View Post

Does anyone know if the DTT901 (or any other box with analog pass-through for that matter) has separate on and off buttons on the remote? I would like to program my JP1 remote to power on the DTT901 (disabling the pass-through) when I press the CBL button and power off the DTT901 (enabling the pass-through) when I press the TV button. If the same button toggles the power, it could easily get out of sync and power on the cable box when I press the TV button.

I am trying to keep the WAF (Wife Acceptance Factor) as high as possible here.

I found what appears to be a discrete "Off" but no discrete "On". You might have to create a small macro for a positive "On" by sending "Off", then the "Power Toggle" to turn it back on. You'd probably be putting a macro on the Cbl and TV buttons anyway in order to put the remote into the correct mode after sending the DTT901 commands.

EFC 228, OBC 92 is an apparent discrete "Off"

The discussion in the DTT900 thread and the "Hacking The CECB" boxes also applies. Over at JP1 I added all the commands I found in the off topic converter box thread.
post #254 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by cia_viewer View Post

The Remote Control for the DTT900 and DTT901 has has the on/off button for the CEDB and an On/off button for the TV. The attached picture is the manual's page for the Remote Control. In this forum I have seen and used links to download manuals for several CECBs.

Please post the link to the DTT901 manual. I haven't found it.

Or with the exception of the PT, is it identical to the Insignia manual?
post #255 of 2239
Is anyone besides me noticing that L/R stereo separation is virtually non-existent from the DTT901's RCA jacks? Of the 53 channels I receive in the Los Angeles area, there is absolutely no discernable difference when switching between MONO and STEREO settings on 50 of them. Of the remaining 3 channels, the difference between MONO and STEREO settings is so subtle that's it very difficult to actually say there's any change.
post #256 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by uniquelyme View Post

Is anyone besides me noticing that L/R stereo separation is virtually non-existent from the DTT901's RCA jacks? Of the 53 channels I receive in the Los Angeles area, there is absolutely no discernable difference when switching between MONO and STEREO settings on 50 of them. Of the remaining 3 channels, the difference between MONO and STEREO settings is so subtle that's it very difficult to actually say there's any change.


Yes, I noticed that too. After listening to it, there is absolutely no difference between the mono and stereo settings using the a/v jacks. There isn't even a difference in the volume levels. When I switch between mono and stereo on my television's settings or even on my stereo system, there is at least a bit of volume difference on those components, but no noticeable difference in volume on the 901. I would think there would be a small difference in volume also. But you're right, I can't hear any stereo separation when switching from mono to stereo on the 901. It makes me wonder if they fixed the low stereo volume problem by making the stereo just mono, and I am really switching from mono to mono.
post #257 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by uniquelyme View Post

Is anyone besides me noticing that L/R stereo separation is virtually non-existent from the DTT901's RCA jacks? Of the 53 channels I receive in the Los Angeles area, there is absolutely no discernable difference when switching between MONO and STEREO settings on 50 of them. Of the remaining 3 channels, the difference between MONO and STEREO settings is so subtle that's it very difficult to actually say there's any change.

Over here, there's very noticeable stereo separation when switching from mono to stereo.
post #258 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by wh5916 View Post

Over here, there's very noticeable stereo separation when switching from mono to stereo.

Is your DTT901 an April or May unit? Mine was manufactured in April.
post #259 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by viewer29 View Post

Please post the link to the DTT901 manual. I haven't found it.

Or with the exception of the PT, is it identical to the Insignia manual?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_CECB_units

Includes links to sites with manuals for many of the CECBs

NoPassThru => NoPassThru
Zenith DTT900 => Zenith DTT901
Insignia NS-DXA1 => Insignia NS-DXA1-APT

I think there is very little change between DTT900 and DTT901 manuals. I do not have an electronic copy of the DTT901 manual.

The Zenith and Insignia manuals LOOK much a like?
The Zenith and Insignia CECBs LOOK much a like?

The pictures on the websites imply that the Insignia also has the well perforated metal case.

In my part of Colorado, Circuit City carries Zenith and Best Buy carries Insignia.
post #260 of 2239
I've noticed another thing the DTT901 fixes that I have not seen discussed. I have had 2 DTT900's (April build) for about a month and a half now. I picked up 2 DTT901's (April build) this weekend. I never turn off the boxes. If I leave the DTT900's parked on the same RF channel for anywhere from 2 to 24 hours, when I go to use the channel guide I get the "No Program Information" message for all channels, including the one it's been parked on. To reload the channel guide you must either toggle the box power or change to another RF channel and then back again. I fully expect the channels it has not been on to be deplete of information but not the current channel. While it's not the end of the world it is annoying. I hooked up one of the DTT901's Saturday and on Sunday morning when I turned on the TV and used the channel guide I noticed it was still showing information for the current channel. So Sunday afternoon I started an experiment with the 2 models. Both parked on the local PBS channel. Monday morning both boxes still had guide information on PBS. Monday evening the DTT900 showed the "No Program Information" on all the PBS subchannels while the DTT901 still showed proper information. This morning after about 38 hours, the DTT900 still shows no information and the DTT901 continues to show full information on PBS.
post #261 of 2239
Some quick observations from looking at the posted PCB pics for the DTT901 show an unpopulated Smart Antenna jack at CN204 on the power PCB. The missing resistors and cap values can be found on the power controller IC151 (KIA78R12) datasheet. CN303 looks like it's a serial interface, not sure if it's 3.3v or 5v yet and it's also accessible through the bottom of the case without needing to open the unit.
post #262 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by RamJam View Post

Yes, I noticed that too. After listening to it, there is absolutely no difference between the mono and stereo settings using the a/v jacks. ... and I am really switching from mono to mono.

I don't have the 901, but I have an April build 900. I am going to be very cautious with my testing when I can get my hands on a 901. I hope they "fixed" the volume level problem the right way. To me, the stereo level on the 900 is correct, matches exactly to my Samsung DTB-H260 tuner's optical output (of which the volume adjustment on the samsung has no effect). The mono setting however is way louder than it should be. The volume on the 900 is set at 100%.

If they have raised the stereo volume to match the mono volume, and IF it's significantly louder than my Samsung's digital out, then they have fixed a non-existent problem by caving to public demand without spending some real effort to see what exactly is the cause of the problem. Just like they "fixed" the zoom mode crop by changing it from 16:9 zoom to 14x9, but distorts the aspect ratio in the process.

Since I don't have my hands on a 901, this is all speculation. I do like the pass through feature, but not if audio out is broken..
post #263 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by uniquelyme View Post

Is your DTT901 an April or May unit? Mine was manufactured in April.


Mine was manufactured in May.
post #264 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigaDo View Post


The manager then said "I don't care about converter boxes or that business--do you know how much we make on each converter box?" I said "probably around $10.00." The manager said "just two cents."

Interesting.

I found this at the following link (post #10 at Zenith DTT901 vs Apex DT250:

Quote:



At any rate, there's a Kiosk at BB that lets you look for items in the store or on BB's website, but it also serves as an employee Kiosk for them to check inventory, pricing, order status, etc. As I walked by, I noticed that some employee had left themselves logged in, and with me chomping at the bit to know if and when the DT250's were gonna come in, I quickly jumped in. (As an aside, and contrary to what I'm about to tell you, all BB employees must be required to push the Insignia boxes, as they will claim that they are the only boxes BB will be selling, whish is a lie) I was surprised at all the info that they have on there. The good news I found out was that my store has 70 on order (but not in transit yet)...and there are over 600 total on order within about 100 miles or so radius.

The disappointing news came when I clicked on a link on the paged titled "Advanced pricing" which displayed this: while BB is selling the DT250 boxes for $59.99, the cost to them per box is $38.50. I about fell in the floor when I read that.

I'm annoyed to say the least. Anyway, knowing that they jacked up the price on the DT250, I decided to check the price of the Insignia's and again I discovered they're selling them for $59.99 but they cost the company $39.30.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...9#post14144959

Paul
post #265 of 2239
The markup is not unreasonable for them to stay in business, since they have to pay for other operating costs like employee wages, rent, electricity, etc, plus a certain net profit.
For analogy, a $3 hamburger you pay at McDonald's might just cost them $1 before operating costs.

Regarding the stereo sound of the DTT901, I got one from CC in New Jersey (they have to get it from the back room for me) and there is very noticeable difference between mono and stereo setting. My DTT901 is April build.
post #266 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by uniquelyme View Post

Is your DTT901 an April or May unit? Mine was manufactured in April.

It's an April unit. Stereo separation is very pronounced on stations broadcasting in stereo.
post #267 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by cia_viewer View Post

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_CECB_units

Includes links to sites with manuals for many of the CECBs

I've looked at the above link many times. I have found some manuals on there.

What am I missing? The link on the Zenith is to a spec sheet and quick setup guide. No manual that I can find.
post #268 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by wh5916 View Post

It's an April unit. Stereo separation is very pronounced on stations broadcasting in stereo.

Thanks for the info. I'm going to take the one I have back to CC and exchange it for another 901 and see if it's any better.
post #269 of 2239
Quote:
Originally Posted by viewer29 View Post

I've looked at the above link many times. I have found some manuals on there.

What am I missing? The link on the Zenith is to a spec sheet and quick setup guide. No manual that I can find.

The DTT901 manual differs very little from that of the DTT900:

There is an additional "Install Guide" feature added to the Setup Menu. This feature allows one to access/rerun the initial power-up routine.

There are three paragraphs concerning the "Analog Pass-Through Feature." Most of this is not product-specific excepting these two sentences: "Simply put, to receive analog stations, turn the box off; the analog signal will 'pass-through" the box to be tuned in the TV. To enjoy the digital stations, tune them through the converter box as explained in this operating guide."
post #270 of 2239
The 901 manual is very close to the 900, except they fill up the extra space on page 7, so they have room for very little more detail on using the Install Guide to customize settings (nothing meaningful), and add a 4-point explanation of setting the clock and daylight saving time (unnecessary).

The only big change is the addition of Page 16, headed "Analog Pass-Through Feature" which starts out with the analog exceptions to the digital Feb. 17th deadline (which we all know), and then a mention of the APT on the device, with the meat of it being:

Quote:


Simply put, to receive analog stations, turn off the box; the analog signal will "pass through" the box to be tuned in the tv. To enjoy the digital stations, tune them through the converter box as explained in this operating guide.

They give a couple online sources for low power TV info:
www.dtvtransition.org/lowpower
https://www.dtv2009.gov/lowpower/
www.dtv.gov

and map and list of LPs by state:
www.ntia.doc.gov/dtvcoupon/LPTVmap.html

And then close with the FCC digital tv transition notice.

ETA: DigaDo, you beat me to it. I'll leave mine, it looks longer. :-)
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