The Official Pioneer 9G non-Elite KURO Owner's Discussion Thread - Page 432

As a sidenote I'd add that the gray bars used in 4:3 for SD in AUTO mode will significantly soften the picture. They add some sort of blurring when using the gray bars.

You'll need Advance or you can use Standard with a direct 24fps source.
See Test Results for Non-Elite Refresh Rates





Short of special remote supplied by Pioneer just for techs, no. You won't get better capabilities with anything outside of ControlCal anyway.


You can be fine with the just the video modes but PC modes does have a few different attributes just depending on what you want. Text is sharper for using a PC for instance.
The mode eliminates all the built-in video processing effects (similar to a 'pure' mode), it has perfect pixel level sharpness (like enhancer mode = 1 on elites) and it adds multiple grayscale memories you can adjust.

Black level is raised but only slightly back to about 8G Kuro level, still better than just about every Non Kuro display on the market. Color you can't do much with so you live with what you get after basic and grayscale adjustments. See HDMI PC Modes reference post.


You have to make sure the PC program playing your videos is matching the colorspace and signal type the Kuro is expecting. Kuro set to AUTO usually works but with some PC signals you may need to manually set the Kuro color space which is why the set includes those options.

Can somebody guide me on how to check the total hours my 5020 has been on (if possible) and how to change the gray bars in 4:3 mode (if recommended)?

I have controlcal...

Thanks!

Can anyone verify if they have used this Monster Cleaner below on their 5020 or 6020? It is specifically recommended by Pioneer for these model in the webpage below, but I wanted to get some input if anyone ahs used it. I tried the distilled water and microfiber cloth method and it just took forever.

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PU...een+TV+Cleaner

Thanks for your input.

KC

I've got an opportunity to purchase a new 500M for 2K, or a new 6020FD for roughly 3K. I love the larger size of the 6020. I'm not entirely set up for home theatre (I have a receiver at the ready), so I'll need to purchase speakers and stand, etc. for the 500M, which is fine. This purchase would be the kick in the butt I need to finally set up my family room. The 6020 would also be stimulus for the same, but to a lesser degree. I hate second guessing myself, so I ask the forum for their opinion comparing the two (that is if it's possible to compare to two).

Is the 6020 the better deal overall, or would I eventually experience 'kuro remorse' by not going with the 500M?

Bo

its really up to you if u want quality over quantity. I myself, would find it hard to decide also. 500m has ISF while 6020 doesnt. then again, 6020 is larger.

if u chouse one over the other, would u mind PMing some info. Im in the market for a Kuro too, but its hard to locate one.

The 500M is better. However, the 6020 produces 44% more viewing space, and if you get it professionally calibrated it will look great. It will never be as good as the 500M, but calibrated will be pretty close. So you will need to ask yourself if a larger viewing area is worth giving up a little PQ. Given the choice, I would go larger. BTW, the 6020 is also a KURO.

On the web site at bottom Pioneer does not assume responsibility. "Monster(R) products are subject to the Monster Cable manufacturer's warranty." That being said, I still have leftover Monster cleaner that I bought a few years ago and it looks exactly like that, down to the cloth. You can smell the alcohol in the cleaner. That would make me a little leery.

More importantly, how far do you sit and would you calibrate your unit?

If you sit far, then size will matter more.

Wow so let me get this straight. When I feed a 24p signal, standard mode will use the 72hz, but if i use the advance mode it will actually pull the 24fps out of 1080i material and seemlessly switch hz for me while watching television? That's quite a remarkable feature if that's really what happens. If that's the case though, how come I don't see any sort of "flash" when I change from a video source(like ESPN) to watching something that is film based on TV?

Either way thank you very much for the link that was very helpful. Looks like I'll have to figure out this control cal thing.

No brainer for me. I have 50" Sony and the 6020.
The size difference along with the great picture on the 6020 make it a winner.
At $3000 it's a steal.

Where does it say that Pioneer does not assume responsibility? It says that is has been tested on all 8g, and 9g panels. And the bottle clearly states "alcohol free". I hope that it was Pioneer who actually conducted the tests. They are selling it on their Web Site, and it is stated that all of their newer panels have been tested, with the exception of the Krps

Both displays calibrated by DNice and I bet than neither of you can tell the difference between the two different sets. Just based on a converstation with DNice while he calibrated by 5020 and I talked about fighting off the urge to go up to 500m or 600m.

Ive been using the liquid in that kit for about a year but I use it with the as-seen-on-TV Windshield Wonder. It does a great fast job. I use only a very fine mist on the pad and do not use it on a warm panel.

In the owners manual it clearly states not to use any liquid. That is what they will fall back on if you damage your screen. The question is who did the testing, Monster or Pioneer. By the way they worded the bottom of the page that Monster product is the responsibility of Monster, Monster is the one who did the test. Why even buy that stuff. Just get a mister bottle, and fill it with distilled water. It cleans just as well with no chemicals. I'm pretty sure that the monster solution would not damage the screen, but why take the chance?

Ask yourself this, even if you think it's safe to use, then just WHY does monster have this disclaimer printed on the package?

And make sure to note where it says "if the product stipulates to use only soap & water/water on your product, then do not use this"

Sounds about right. If you calibrate and really learn to use the XX20 the PQ possible will be superior or very comparable to any display on the market.

The 9G Kuro monitors are no doubt great values depending also on how you value the physical advantages of the TV models however Black Levels on all Kuros are extremely close to optimal.



500M's reported 'extra' black blacks sound tasty but IMO not at the expense of 10" screen. Not that absolute black isn't still desirable but the 9Gs are so close to black that the next Kuro models had to be reaching diminishing returns in terms of real visible impact.

As critical as black level is to video quality some scenes (dark) benefit significantly while most scenes depend on other display qualities. Screen size benefits all scenes in all materials. ymmv.

Okay one more important newbie question regarding my new pdp-5020fd. I have decided to get Control Cal and attempt to self-calibrate a bit using D_Nice offsets and maybe do more beyond that, BUT I'm a bit concerned about one thing.

Thanks to help I got in this thread so far I managed to firmly figure out and decide i like viewing my 1080/24p material in standard PureCinema mode. By far the smoothest and most natural of the modes and from what seems to be known, that mode is 72hz when fed 24p and 60hz when fed 60p 60i and such which seems like the best solution at most times.

However from what I have read in a few threads there seems to be some controversy surrounding whether or not you can calibrate the "standard" and "advanced" modes which are actually the two modes i would be on 99% of the time in the "movie" setting. Is this the case? I notice at the top page of this thread even with the suggested offsets the suggested mode is "standard" which seems to be contrary to that. is this because the inability to calibrate standard and advanced has been solved?

I just did the same thing about a week before your post. I was scanning for all the new channels, and was in the process of adding these channels to my favorite list and got onto 26.3 and the TV started acting up. I exchanged a few e-mails with Pioneer's tech support and they told me the tuner probably went dead, and that I needed to contact TV Unlimited to get this fixed under warranty. I called TV Unlimited about two weeks ago, they told me I needed to replace the entire circuit board. The guy just came by to replace the board on Monday, and I managed to get my relatives to help me get this TV back on the wall today. I went through the list to reset the favorite channels again, and when I got to channel 26.3, it did the same thing to me again. I've unplugged the power and will let it sit for a day and go back to see if it comes back alive. 26.3 has only Korean shows. I think I can survive without it.

The first time this happened to me was the day I got my TV about 8 months ago, and I installed the firmware upgrade, and it keep shutting the TV down, and restarting. I had followed the instruction to the letter. So I am reluctant to install that firmware update again.

FrankC

That issue was resolved and posted in this thread many posts ago. The 2 video mode calibration memories are based on the refresh rates. So you get one calibration for 60hz and one for 72Hz.

You can save the same settings to both or give each a different calibration (to accomodate more than 1 A/V mode). Then you use the Pure Cinema setting to select a refresh rate.

Remember the refresh rate is also based on source signal type per my post above so you can use Pure Cinema to select the calibration setting you want to use. (See Test Results for Non-Elite Refresh Rates).

See this calibration guide for how to calibrate both refresh rates..

I just found a display model 5020 at Best Buy for $1799. The guy said that it has been there for 8 months to a year and has been on from open to close every day. It's the last Kuro they had and he couldn't find any at any other Best Buy's in my state. I looked up their operating hours and calculated it out, and it adds up to a maximum of 4,368 hours on the TV if it's been on display for a year. I checked the screen and their didn't appear to be any burn in, but I'm not exactly sure what to look for to be certain. The video feed they were playing on it didn't have any static images on it for long.

All this being said, I have several questions:

1. Does anyone have experience buying a display model Kuro from Best Buy? Is this a good deal? I'm leaning towards going for it, as I've been looking at Kuro's a long time but never thought I could afford one until now, but I want to make sure there aren't any major issues with buying a display model. I don't think I could afford the prices they're going for new even now, as I really need it to be under $2000.

2. The picture still looked gorgeous, but what's the average lifespan of a Kuro and how much has being a display model cut into its lifespan?

3. Is there anything in particular I should look for to make sure it's ok to buy? What's the best way to check for burn-in?

4. Is the extended warranty through Best Buy worth it? It's only 1 year through Pioneer, and the guy said that if it broke they would replace it with a comparable Panasonic in the future if they couldn't fix it. It's 4 years for $340, 2 years for $250, and they stack on top of Pioneer's.

Ok, I think that's all my questions for now. Thanks so much for your help everyone!

@StrikerTek

You should be able to get them down quite a bit more on price. Have you made them an offer yet?

A lot of people on the forum have been buying up the display models and most seem very happy with them. I personally don't buy extended warranties so I can't really help you with that one.

I just bought an open box 5020FD at my Best Buy. It wad $1399, but didn't include the stand, speakers, or remote, and had some scratches on the bezel (not the screen). It was worth every penny. It looks so good.


I think the lifespan is 60,000 hours, so you're good on that one. Don't worry about the hours put on it in one year.


Make sure you check the screen with it turned off to be sure there aren't any scratches on the screen, and check for burn-in. If you have a thumb drive, you can load a white image file on it, and bring that up on the tv to check for any burn-in.


I am always against extended warranties, but I guess it makes sense for some people. I still wouldn't pay Best Buy though, I'd look at something like Squaretrade. That one is really up to you though.

I have not made them an offer yet. I wanted to check here first before I did to see what other people were getting them for.


$1399 would be amazing for this TV, that's really great to hear! I didn't think to ask if it came with the speakers, stand, and remote. I don't really care about the speakers, but I really need the stand and remote. Where can you buy them from if it doesn't have them? Pioneer's website?

That's a great idea about the thumb drive too. Would it be easiest to see burn in on a white image or on a black image? Or should I load up both?

I don't know if you can buy them direct from Pioneer. If they don't have the remote they might be able to order one from Pioneer for you. I have seen some remotes and stands on ebay before, but they're pretty expensive. I think the white image shows burn-in the best. An all black image would cause the panel to engage the Pioneer infinite black (or whatever they call it) after 30 seconds, which isn't enough time to really look the screen over.

I bought my 5020 brand new from BB for $1900 in August. $1400 for an open box with no remote, stand or speakers, and not knowing how many hours is on this set is a very bad price. No more than $1000. This tv is 2008 technology. Look on the back of the tv to see when it was built.

Thanks TJ7, I was hoping someone had succsesfully tried it. I was hoping for some more confirmations.

Thanks also to the people who are against using it. Your opinions are noted. I haven't decided if I am going to try it yet, but I did buy it a couple weeks ago. I'll try the distilled water one more time and see how long it takes again.


KC

StrikerTek:

I am in precisely the exact position right now. I have a display, same model and same asking price from another retailer that is being shipped to the local branch nearest me. I have 10% down on it, speaker/stands/remotes included, no apparent burn-in/cosmetic issues (word of mouth), was one the floor a little over a year, 1 yr Pioneer Warranty, etc. I have yet to personally see it, so I will have that opportunity next week hopefully.

Advice from others would be helpful...

- What would be an appropriate 'deal' to establish with them as far as asking price?
- Their return policy on open-box/display items is 14-days, I can make a decision by then as well. How can I test for burn-in/IR/and other the other issues?
- What other issues should I check? Is there a 'check list' of things I should know to look for?

I own a Pioneer 4280 and it is a gorgeous display, so I quite familiar with what I am purchasing. I do feel the price good considering the product, and thankfully the 'break-in' process will be out of the way. However, if I can ask for a lower price and get it, it sure helps with the other expenses (wall mount, BR, etc).

There are eight brand new 5020's being sold by the BB outlet store on ebay. They're located in Texas. They all have 5-7 days remaining

Been a while since I've been on here so I apologize if this has been answered before (tried searching but couldn't find what I was looking for). I have a 6020 and use D-Nice's movie mode settings and also used his offsets with ControlCal. I'm wondering if I'd see a significant improvement using the calibration described here http://www.hippotechsolutions.com/?page_id=234 and renting the x-rite-i1-pro device. Can't really swing a full professional calibration so I figured this might be a good compromise.