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Nordost released the Quantum QX2 & QX4 Power Purification Device - Page 2

post #31 of 558
Well, anything that embiggens my soundstage.........
post #32 of 558
I the term " Electro Magnetic Field Stabilizer" made up? I googled it and came up with a whole lot of nothing.
post #33 of 558
Thread Starter 
I agree that the lack of explanation of what the device does is not helping people to accept the device. From what I gather (and I could be wrong) is that electron flow moves in a chaotic state as it goes from one charge to another. That a magnetic field will force them to align in a controlled motion/path.

I'm not a theoretical physicist to be able to explain if this would make an improvement or not. I do know that a magnetic field can manipulate electrons. That's what MRI technology is based upon in the medical field. Actually the magnets used in MRI can manipulate a whole lot of things like chairs, knives, beds. Technicians would stand in the hallway and watch their necklaces "float" in the air as the magnet was drawing it towards it.

Based on this fact. I have opened my mind to at least try the device instead of poke fun at it with child-like behaviour. Until I actually have hands on experience with the device, I have no opinion of the device.

When people take no time to even evaluate a device before making jokes, it really shows how ignorant they really are. I don't know why I bother.
post #34 of 558
post #35 of 558
Quote:
From what I gather (and I could be wrong) is that electron flow moves in a chaotic state as it goes from one charge to another. That a magnetic field will force them to align in a controlled motion/path.

This is what every high end product talks about.

Quote:
Based on this fact. I have opened my mind to at least try the device instead of poke fun at it with child-like behaviour.

Child like? I think this product and people who support it must have the mind of a child since nothing is questioned and everything is just thought up.

Quote:
When people take no time to even evaluate a device before making jokes, it really shows how ignorant they really are. I don't know why I bother.

I guess people who want to know how a product works are ignorant then.
post #36 of 558
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DougWinsor View Post

Child like? I think this product and people who support it must have the mind of a child since nothing is questioned and everything is just thought up.

What?!? Questioning and proving a device/technology has nothing to do a mind of a child. We test and prove/disprove theories all the time. What does this have to do with a mind of a child? Yes.. I agree that in order to create ANY product it must first be thought up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DougWinsor View Post

I guess people who want to know how a product works are ignorant then.

Please re-read my post. You clearly got it wrong. Wanting to know how a product works has nothing to do with making fun of a technology (acting like a child).

If one doesn't think it will work.... then state so and give a reason why. Quite simple really. You don't see me jumping up and down (Oh my God... Oh my God). I have not made any claims. All I stated was that there was a new product from Nordost using Quantum's QRT technology. That I was going to evaluate to see if it does anything or not.

So I take it that if I report back it does nothing you will accept it. But if it does something good, you won't?

With thinking like that we would still be in the stone ages.
post #37 of 558
There isn't even a plausible explanation of what the device does, so how can one evaluate how well it does it? Based on the "fact" sheet, it seems to be mostly an electronic good-luck charm.
post #38 of 558
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Lee (QSC) View Post

There isn't even a plausible explanation of what the device does, so how can one evaluate how well it does it? Based on the "fact" sheet, it seems to be mostly an electronic good-luck charm.

Well I'm going to find out if it does anything at all. If it does do something that improves the sound then I would like to know how, why, etc...

I'm skeptical as well. But I learned a long time ago to wait until you see/hear a product before coming to a conclusion.
post #39 of 558
Us Reference Nordost Dealers were recently at the North American Distributor for Nordost (Audiophile Systems) where they unveiled the "Quantum." The results/effects were staggering. Like some mentioned, it is not a replacement for the Thor but rather it should be placed in line with the Thor and other associated gear plugged into the distribution unit. Lars (Nordost's Rep.) does some great demonstrations as many have seen at the shows. One particular example stands out in my mind from the training---we did most of the line running up to Valhalla and Odin and the effects of Quantum were so significant on the source unit that a stock ($5) power cord running through a Quantum hooked up to the unit bested Odin connected directly. (You should have seen the dealer orders after the demo) It is really hard to understand the sonic benefits until you have done a head to head.
post #40 of 558
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tmueller View Post

Us Reference Nordost Dealers were recently at the North American Distributor for Nordost (Audiophile Systems) where they unveiled the "Quantum." The results/effects were staggering. Like some mentioned, it is not a replacement for the Thor but rather it should be placed in line with the Thor and other associated gear plugged into the distribution unit. Lars (Nordost's Rep.) does some great demonstrations as many have seen at the shows. One particular example stands out in my mind from the training---we did most of the line running up to Valhalla and Odin and the effects of Quantum were so significant on the source unit that a stock ($5) power cord running through a Quantum hooked up to the unit bested Odin connected directly. (You should have seen the dealer orders after the demo) It is really hard to understand the sonic benefits until you have to done a head to head.


That is all well and good. Thank you for sharing. But what did it do? In your own words how would you describe the effect before and after? Was there any technical explanation as to what it is doing?

Thanks.
post #41 of 558
"QRT has created a new device that is infinitely more effective called an Electro Magnetic Field Stabilizer"

"Quantum Resonant Technology is based in Santa Monica California. The company was founded in 1997 and has engaged in research and development in the field of imaging electronics and medical devices."



They've been doing R&D for 11 yrs, yet they don't have any issued patents, or published patent applications.

The term "Electro Magnetic Field Stabilizer" (or alternately "Electromagnetic Field Stabilizer") does not seem to appear in any issued patents or published applications.
post #42 of 558
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim HTPC View Post

Well I'm going to find out if it does anything at all. If it does do something that improves the sound then I would like to know how, why, etc...

I'm skeptical as well. But I learned a long time ago to wait until you see/hear a product before coming to a conclusion.

Please explain how you will test it to see if it improves the sound?
post #43 of 558
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tmueller View Post

Us Reference Nordost Dealers were recently at the North American Distributor for Nordost (Audiophile Systems) where they unveiled the "Quantum." The results/effects were staggering. Like some mentioned, it is not a replacement for the Thor but rather it should be placed in line with the Thor and other associated gear plugged into the distribution unit. Lars (Nordost's Rep.) does some great demonstrations as many have seen at the shows. One particular example stands out in my mind from the training---we did most of the line running up to Valhalla and Odin and the effects of Quantum were so significant on the source unit that a stock ($5) power cord running through a Quantum hooked up to the unit bested Odin connected directly. (You should have seen the dealer orders after the demo) It is really hard to understand the sonic benefits until you have to done a head to head.

Really? So they did a freq plot of the sound to show it improved? Or did they just plug it in and say WOW how awesome is this?
post #44 of 558
Quote:
Originally Posted by rider View Post

They've been doing R&D for 11 yrs, yet they don't have any issued patents, or published patent applications.

We will explain no technology before its time. We will sell it, however, at a very 'reasonable' price. Someday, when we are living in the Bahamas under assumed names, we are pretty sure we'll be able to reveal all.
post #45 of 558
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by speco2003 View Post

Please explain how you will test it to see if it improves the sound?

Let me ask you a simple question. When you bought your last set speakers, did you listen to them? Did you listen to other speakers prior to making a decision? Was there a difference? Not all speakers sound the same. Do you need a piece of test equipment to tell you there was a difference? We all have a finely tuned instrument called our ears.

I have become accustomed with this setup playing the same music for over a year. I will either hear no change after adding the device, or I will hear something different. IF I hear nothing at all... then test over. If I hear something different then I need to ask, does it create a better experience or not?

I find it disturbing that people are willing to denounce a product without ever having any experience with the device. So with no knowledge or experience they are experts because of what they think?!? That's just being ignorant and all credibility one may have had, is lost.
post #46 of 558
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim HTPC from the QRT claims link View Post

Benefits in Video Systems

# Big improvement in color saturation
# Edge definition
# Overall detail on display device

Jim, my suggestion would be to test these claims first. Since you have a HTPC (at least your user name suggests that) you could easily do lossless A/B framegrabber screengrabs and post A/B images both with and without the EMFS and we could all observe and measure the differences and alleged improvements to your HTPC video (if any.)

It seems to me these video claims are much easier for one to test (and share results and data) as I think there is less psycho in the visual than in the acoustical. If it offers “big improvement in color saturation”, it should be easily duplicated and easily evidenced as such.

As Chu noted, if it somehow makes changes to the color saturation, you’ll want and need to recalibrate if you believe your saturation is correctly calibrated to reference standards without the Electro Magnetic Field Stabilization Unit in place.

If it doesn’t change color saturation or pass tests on the video claims, then the other claims from the same source are bogus by association.

Dave
post #47 of 558
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim HTPC View Post

Let me ask you a simple question. When you bought your last set speakers, did you listen to them? Did you listen to other speakers prior to making a decision? Was there a difference? Not all speakers sound the same. Do you need a piece of test equipment to tell you there was a difference? We all have a finely tuned instrument called our ears.


Jim, there is a BIG difference. No one question the sound difference between speakers, because they are proven both in test and by measurments. This junk is not.
post #48 of 558
I have tremendous faith in Nordost and their products. After all, they sold me their Frey cables for a few thousand coin, which I switched in and out of my system and heard no difference compared to my less than $100 worth of Acoustic Research cables. Good stuff...
post #49 of 558
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlarsen View Post

Jim, my suggestion would be to test these claims first. Since you have a HTPC (at least your user name suggests that) you could easily do lossless A/B framegrabber screengrabs and post A/B images both with and without the EMFS and we could all observe and measure the differences and alleged improvements to your HTPC video (if any.)

It seems to me these video claims are much easier for one to test (and share results and data) as I think there is less psycho in the visual than in the acoustical. If it offers big improvement in color saturation, it should be easily duplicated and easily evidenced as such.

As Chu noted, if it somehow makes changes to the color saturation, you'll want and need to recalibrate if you believe your saturation is correctly calibrated to reference standards without the Electro Magnetic Field Stabilization Unit in place.

If it doesn't change color saturation or pass tests on the video claims, then the other claims from the same source are bogus by association.

Dave

Yes I have a few HTPC's as well as a custom Blu-ray 14TB Player/Server for streaming different movies and music at the same time to each room. I am not certain that a screen grab will show a difference due to one device being digital (computer), and the other being analog (HDTV). So I believe I would need to use a camera. I already have a Richard Gray 1200 for my video. I was not going to use the Quantum for the Video. I could try it though. Actually if I understand this correctly that other circuits would benefit from the device just being plugged in no? I wonder how much better will it be in conjunction with the RGPC? I've already had to recalibrate when I inserted the RGPC. That was clear as night and day. The video will take longer to setup and test. I'll see what I can do.
post #50 of 558
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by QueueCumber View Post

I have tremendous faith in Nordost and their products. After all, they sold me their Frey cables for a few thousand coin, which I switched in and out of my system and heard no difference compared to my less than $100 worth of Acoustic Research cables. Good stuff...

Why did you buy the cables then? Should have saved your money and bought something more meaningful that would make a difference.

For me, it better make a positive difference. Throwing away money is not a good idea.
post #51 of 558
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NIN74 View Post

Jim, there is a BIG difference. No one question the sound difference between speakers, because they are proven both in test and by measurments. This junk is not.

My comment was in response as to how I will test the device. Just like every single person on this forum did when they bought speakers, they listened to them. If there was no difference, then we'd all have the same cost/brand speakers most likely. So my comment was to listen. Would there be a difference from listening?

I would be willing to bet some of us have some hearing loss. Be it from work, war, concerts, headphones, etc... If I can't hear 19KHz but there is a measured difference, does it really matter what a devices does? If you rely on a piece of equipment it may show an improvement. But can you hear a difference? That is the easiest way to testing a device that claims to improve audio. Just listen. And not everyone's ears are the same. Take a blind person for example. They tend to hear things a person with perfect sight does not.

My bottom line is to remain skeptical, but open my mind to other possibilities until proven one way or another. That's all.
post #52 of 558
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim HTPC View Post

Why did you buy the cables then? Should have saved your money and bought something more meaningful that would make a difference.

For me, it better make a positive difference. Throwing away money is not a good idea.

Duh, because at that point in time I had no way to try any out before hand and I believed their advertising bologna as well as some people on these fora...
post #53 of 558
Quote:
Originally Posted by speco2003 View Post

Please explain how you will test it to see if it improves the sound?

God forbid one would listen and make a determination, eh?
post #54 of 558
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim HTPC View Post

I am not certain that a screen grab will show a difference due to one device being digital (computer), and the other being analog (HDTV).

I think if a framebuffer screen grab doesn’t show a difference then that would be a data-point that the device didn’t do a thing to the up-stream source. Does the claim only apply to analog or digital? (not both?) If a framebuffer screen grab doesn’t show a difference, it seems that would only be because there was no difference to be seen. That would explain why there aren't hundreds of A/B screenshots to support these claims.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim HTPC View Post

Actually if I understand this correctly that other circuits would benefit from the device just being plugged in no? )

It seems that’s what they're hoping you believe and understand as that’s the only remotely plausible explanation to me.

I don’t believe so. Most all of the sensitive electronics in a source or display is powered off of regulated output DC rails- well isolated, buffered, and decoupled from the AC mains. Reasonably designed, these DC rails should have the same DC voltage and noise components regardless of the mains. Most AC-DC main operated supplies auto range from 90-230V and will have the same output over that range. Perhaps there are designs that exhibit sensitivity to the AC mains or hyper-sensitive to effects of stray EM fields but I think this would be more an indication of the weakness of such a design rather that the strength of an external box. Possibly an exception to this would be a high-power audio amplifier that uses less-than-stiff DC rails and not as well isolated from the mains as most lower power and small-signal electronics are today.

Dave
post #55 of 558
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlarsen View Post

I don't believe so. Most all of the sensitive electronics in a source or display is powered off of DC rails- well isolated and buffered from the AC mains. Reasonably designed, these DC rails should have the same DC voltage and noise components regardless of the mains. Most AC-DC main operated supplies auto range from 90-230V and will have the same output over that range. Perhaps there are designs that exhibit sensitivity to the AC mains or hyper-sensitive to effects of stray EM fields but I think this would be more an indication of the weakness of such a design rather that the strength of an external box. Possibly an exception to this would be a high-power audio amplifier that uses less-than-stiff DC rails and not as well isolated from the mains as most lower power and small-signal electronics are today.

Dave

I would agree with your logic. It stands to reason that maybe the benefits are apparent due to poorly designed power supplies? It's not the first time companies try to save a buck and skimp on quality components/design in their products. I recall adding a Richard Gray to my HDTV required me to re-calibrate the gray scale. I know power supplies in TV's are mostly garbage. The other factor is going from solid copper in the walls to stranded Copper and/or Silver in power cables. Once you leave the wall you have loss (resistance, reactance, capacitance) to contend with due to the strands of wire vs. solid Romex Copper wire.

We'll see what happens. No idea what to expect. I'd like to have the Quantum plugged in (without my knowledge) to see if there is a difference I can easily detect or not.
post #56 of 558
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim HTPC View Post

…I've already had to recalibrate when I inserted the RGPC…
…I recall adding a Richard Gray to my HDTV required me to re-calibrate the gray scale….

It seems to me that if you had your saturation and gray scale properly calibrated to reference standards before adding more external boxes, then you had to recalibrate to reference standards after adding a box, systemically, there was no change to saturation or gray-scale. In both cases, your system was properly calibrated to reference standards. No?

Dave
post #57 of 558
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim HTPC View Post

It stands to reason that maybe the benefits are apparent due to poorly designed power supplies?

If that were the case and the claims are real and honest, I’d expect the claims to be much more specific and to that point and not so seeming global and universal. An honest claim that it improved or covered a specific weakness would me made like “removes hum-bars and noise from XYZ projectors” etc. Some of these claims are so universal that they imply I’ll enjoy much more uniform and flavorful toast if I use it on my toaster. Regardless of the brand or type of toaster.

Dave
post #58 of 558
Quote:


God forbid one would listen and make a determination, eh?

Quote:


I find it disturbing that people are willing to denounce a product without ever having any experience with the device.

You know, I'd be more inclined to accept that as valid criticism except for the complete ******** used to market these things. As I've said many times before, if these companies wouldn't try to invent nonsensical pseudoscientific explanations for their perceived benefits I would be far, far less critical of them.

In fact, I'm actually more open to the audible impact of power conditioners than I am to high-end cables and esoteric tweaks. But I don't apologize in the least for dismissing a device like this without listening to it when the very explanations offered by the seller are manure.
post #59 of 558
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Grant View Post

But I don't apologize in the least for dismissing a device like this without listening to it when the very explanations offered by the seller are manure.


Amen! Amen! and Amen!
post #60 of 558
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Grant View Post

But I don't apologize in the least for dismissing a device like this without listening to it when the very explanations offered by the seller are manure.

Michael,

Hear!! Hear!! I agree - if the seller, who designed the product; can't give a cogent
explanation of how the product works that falls within the realm of the laws of physics;
then the product is "snake oil".
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