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The Official Pioneer 9G Elite KURO Owner's Discussion Thread - Page 982

post #29431 of 30259
Well, you left out that crucial detail, which would push me even further towards the V/ZT60 (at maybe even double or more than the 141FD). wink.gif
post #29432 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post

Quick question(s) to everyone... If you had an opportunity to purchase a 141fd for $1400 right now, would you do it? Or would you wait for the inevitable Panasonic plasma fire sale to pull the trigger on a 65 inch VT60?

First world problems, right?

Thanks in advance guys.

If its in the NY area and you don't want it, I'll take it.
post #29433 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsskid View Post

If its in the NY area and you don't want it, I'll take it.

Its on the west coast.
post #29434 of 30259
Its a very tempting deal for 1400 bucks.
post #29435 of 30259
A friend of mine bought the Elite 70 inch.
We calibrated it a neither of us liked the look.

He sold it and got a 65VT50. A little size loss but just putting it THX mode very good
I would get the ZT over the VT because the direct bonded glass is better at handling room reflections.

- Rich
post #29436 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post

Thanks for the input, guys. The 141fd or vt will be replacing a 70 inch sharp led. Im sick and tired of the banding and poor black levels. I should also factor in screen size in my decision, as ive gotten used to the 70 inch. A 10 inch downgrade might not be worth the picture quality upgrade.

Don't want to be a party pooper but there are lots of banding on the Panasonic consumer plasmas. And has been the same for the last two generations/years.

Although of course the black levels on the VT will be far superior naturally to the SHARP 70". And/but you may get lucky on finding a Panasonic that the banding is only visible on certain solid colors/patterns.

141 all day long especially if you value film motion but the 10" drop in size a big drop in size to what you're used to smile.gif
post #29437 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post

Quick question(s) to everyone... If you had an opportunity to purchase a 141fd for $1400 right now, would you do it? Or would you wait for the inevitable Panasonic plasma fire sale to pull the trigger on a 65 inch VT60?

First world problems, right?

Thanks in advance guys.

There wont be any fire sales like the kuros had i think.

Do you care about smart TV features or just PQ? If all you want is PQ the 141 is a good choice for a much cheaper price. BUT......please check how many hours are on it and how it was used. You might get one with a high black level among other issues.

I also saw you said you going down from 70". Well the 65" VT/ZT might lessen the size change. So if that's an important factor i would consider one of the Panasonics.

Enjoy whatever you choose.
post #29438 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu03 View Post

Don't want to be a party pooper but there are lots of banding on the Panasonic consumer plasmas. And has been the same for the last two generations/years.

Although of course the black levels on the VT will be far superior naturally to the SHARP 70". And/but you may get lucky on finding a Panasonic that the banding is only visible on certain solid colors/patterns.

141 all day long especially if you value film motion but the 10" drop in size a big drop in size to what you're used to smile.gif

If I didnt own the 70 incher, I would go for the 141 without hesitation.
post #29439 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by saprano View Post

There wont be any fire sales like the kuros had i think.

Do you care about smart TV features or just PQ? If all you want is PQ the 141 is a good choice for a much cheaper price. BUT......please check how many hours are on it and how it was used. You might get one with a high black level among other issues.

I also saw you said you going down from 70". Well the 65" VT/ZT might lessen the size change. So if that's an important factor i would consider one of the Panasonics.

Enjoy whatever you choose.

How do you guys know there wont be a fire sale? Was the kuro fire sale expected?

I place no importance on smart features, 3d or any other bells and whistles.

I will be checking out the 141 after sunset and will have the seller replicate a dim viewing environment. I'll also check the hours with kuro reader.

The size reduction from 70 inches iisthe factor causing this predicament.
post #29440 of 30259
A lot depends on Panasonic management, I suppose.

Concerning a previous matter, there was banding on my ZT60 in the early stages of its life (one band in particular, on the right-hand side), but it has long since subsided (currently at ~1000 hours). There is DSE noted on horizontal scans, which is no worse than the DSE on vertical scans that was apparent on my prior 111FD. The 141FD could just as easily have this anomaly, so if that's the route you go, that audition would be helpful (particularly pans on solid bright backgrounds).
post #29441 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by nevero View Post


Please elaborate on what you mean by "burn their displaying." How did this burn manifest? Do you recommend any kind of "break-in" with a new plasma? Any dos or don'ts?Wv7Zu
There has recently been so much misinformation on the breaking-in of new plasmas, and the good and/or harm that it does .... if anything. You are definitely the man of authority with much experience in such matters, and I ... and I'm sure others here ... would appreciate your advise and opinion. We'd also be interested to hear from any other professional calibrators on the forum. Thanks.
What I call burn is an image that is worn in the display unevenly. You can see it when the image changes.

The key thing with plasma is to keep the light output below 40 fL maximum and not to have ticker tapes and black bars on the screen for more than about 50% of the time. I have never seen a display that was treated this way show uneven wear. The newer plasmas also appear to be much less likely to wear unevenly.
Edited by televisiontv - 11/2/13 at 7:35pm
post #29442 of 30259
I am feeling a bit glum that the curtains are coming down on plasma.

But in a happy way i feel proud that i managed to source a brand new 500M back in July. I feel proud that i stuck to my guns and bought this masterpiece, could have got another manufacturer or bigger size for just a few hundred more. But made my choice - stuck to it and it was the correct one. I could have bought a 600 or well used 60" 9G for the money i bought the KRP500 for. But there is something very special about the 500 plus it had remaining warranty i couldn't resist so it was a no brainer. And sitting an average of five feet 60" was just too big. And having seen the new pannys and and one next to a friends Kuro the thought of jumping ship never crossed my mind. They are good but just not my cup of tea for numerous reasons.

Who wouldn't have bought a Kuro with only 25hrs on it.

It has got better all the time since and this masterpiece sings beautifully.

I think we all knew deep down plasma was coming to a standstill. It was (or should have been) a giant hint when Pioneer left back in 09. And was only a matter of time when Panasonic followed suit. As happy as i am to own along with the 101 the best 50" flat panel ever built, i felt a twinge of sadness when i started reading Panasonic's statement.

As good as the Panasonic consumer plasmas are my choice of the 500M is without doubt and is now cast in stone - and feel very lucky to have one so new.

But will miss having a plasma choice in the future.
post #29443 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu03 View Post

I am feeling a bit glum that the curtains are coming down on plasma.

But in a happy way i feel proud that i managed to source a brand new 500M back in July. I feel proud that i stuck to my guns and bought this masterpiece, could have got another manufacturer or bigger size for just a few hundred more. But made my choice - stuck to it and it was the correct one. I could have bought a 600 or well used 60" 9G for the money i bought the KRP500 for. But there is something very special about the 500 plus it had remaining warranty i couldn't resist so it was a no brainer. And sitting an average of five feet 60" was just too big. And having seen the new pannys and and one next to a friends Kuro the thought of jumping ship never crossed my mind. They are good but just not my cup of tea for numerous reasons.

Who wouldn't have bought a Kuro with only 25hrs on it.

It has got better all the time since and this masterpiece sings beautifully.

I think we all knew deep down plasma was coming to a standstill. It was (or should have been) a giant hint when Pioneer left back in 09. And was only a matter of time when Panasonic followed suit. As happy as i am to own along with the 101 the best 50" flat panel ever built, i felt a twinge of sadness when i started reading Panasonic's statement.

As good as the Panasonic consumer plasmas are my choice of the 500M is without doubt and is now cast in stone - and feel very lucky to have one so new.

But will miss having a plasma choice in the future.

You're not going to miss plasmas and your Kuro once you see the OLED..... wink.gif
post #29444 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu03 View Post

I am feeling a bit glum that the curtains are coming down on plasma.

But in a happy way i feel proud that i managed to source a brand new 500M back in July. I feel proud that i stuck to my guns and bought this masterpiece, could have got another manufacturer or bigger size for just a few hundred more. But made my choice - stuck to it and it was the correct one. I could have bought a 600 or well used 60" 9G for the money i bought the KRP500 for. But there is something very special about the 500 plus it had remaining warranty i couldn't resist so it was a no brainer. And sitting an average of five feet 60" was just too big. And having seen the new pannys and and one next to a friends Kuro the thought of jumping ship never crossed my mind. They are good but just not my cup of tea for numerous reasons.

Who wouldn't have bought a Kuro with only 25hrs on it.

It has got better all the time since and this masterpiece sings beautifully.

I think we all knew deep down plasma was coming to a standstill. It was (or should have been) a giant hint when Pioneer left back in 09. And was only a matter of time when Panasonic followed suit. As happy as i am to own along with the 101 the best 50" flat panel ever built, i felt a twinge of sadness when i started reading Panasonic's statement.

As good as the Panasonic consumer plasmas are my choice of the 500M is without doubt and is now cast in stone - and feel very lucky to have one so new.

But will miss having a plasma choice in the future.

Kinda sad really, that all the R&D went into producing such nice displays, (both Pioneer & Panasonic), to the point that any additional improvements, for 95% of the consumers, would be overkill.

All they would have to do is increase current production efficiency, and spend a little money on marketing. Why not do what the car manufacturers do, and use the same model for 3 yrs, with minor cosmetic changes, ie remote, bezel trim, apps....all things that would cost minimal, yet still sell some displays.

My guess/fear is that in another year (2015) Samsung and LG will follow suit.

But it's all about the Benjamin's....and trying to convince the consumer to upgrade every five years.

Sad.
post #29445 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by tubby497 View Post

You're not going to miss plasmas and your Kuro once you see the OLED..... wink.gif

We still don't know enough about OLED.....what is the lifespan? ..., after all it is Organic, faced with heat.
What are the risks of image retentions? What about lag?

And those prices....

Are they really that much of a picture quality difference ( to all but the trained eye) over current flagship plasma (or Kuro) picture quality. Once you get down to .001, how many J6P will notice improvement, or will care? It's really the law of diminishing returns.

What CE manufacturers often forget,, with average consumers, it all comes down to price. Kuros had a hard time selling at the $4000 price point, but took off when they were clearances at half that.

$1500 -$2000 seems to be the magic price point for large flat panel tvs. Why do you think the ST60s are selling better than the VT60 and ZT60? Because unless they are side to side, most would be hard pressed to detect much of a picture difference, but they can see the cost difference.
post #29446 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsskid View Post

We still don't know enough about OLED.....what is the lifespan? ..., after all it is Organic, faced with heat.
What are the risks of image retentions? What about lag?

And those prices....

Are they really that much of a picture quality difference ( to all but the trained eye) over current flagship plasma (or Kuro) picture quality. Once you get down to .001, how many J6P will notice improvement, or will care? It's really the law of diminishing returns.

What CE manufacturers often forget,, with average consumers, it all comes down to price. Kuros had a hard time selling at the $4000 price point, but took off when they were clearances at half that.

$1500 -$2000 seems to be the magic price point for large flat panel tvs. Why do you think the ST60s are selling better than the VT60 and ZT60? Because unless they are side to side, most would be hard pressed to detect much of a picture difference, but they can see the cost difference.

It's all about moving forward. Remember when plasma was introduced in the beginning? It's the same thing. Very expensive and we didn't know much about it. But eventually as time went by, prices fell and the technology matured.

Prices of OLED will come down. So far all the reviews of OLED have been very positive. I look forward to the future.
post #29447 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by tubby497 View Post

You're not going to miss plasmas and your Kuro once you see the OLED..... wink.gif

Very true... And in the future with a refined 4K version for sure.

Being a realist there isn't a hope in hell's chance i would swap out my new 500M for a first gen 1080P OLED now though.

They have too many issues to speak of. And for a quarter of a click of the brightness control drop in mll in comparison if there was such a thing on the KRP500, isn't worth it.


A guy in the UK has already returned two for lines of weird pixels etc. That and the serious lag issues they have at the moment.

Although if money was no object i would definitely just buy one because i could and have it in another room to look nice wink.gif

Definitely got something to look forward to though in a few years - but a long way to go before they outperform a 9G enough to warrant a purchase as a direct replacement for the main display i have now tbh
post #29448 of 30259
OLED has been "coming" for a very long time. Strangely long. I would even less likely buy a first consumer gen of one of those than I'd buy the first (or even second) year of a new gen of car. I wonder if "warranty issues" has been a $$$ problem for Panny and hastened their plasma's demise? Just going by stuff I read here, though anybody on this forum is likely a lot fussier and more knowledgable than the typical consumer. I hate it when new stuff performs more poorly than "old" stuff. It does happen a lot these days it seems. Consumer demands change, or more likely, what's marketed to consumers changes their demands.
post #29449 of 30259
Kevin Miller did a tune-up calibration on my PRO-111 yesterday. He also did the initial one 5 years ago. At that initial one, it was recommended there be 160 hours minimum on the panel. I had 162.

Despite the long time between, the set wasn't in such bad shape. The reds were high (obvious with a black screen) and the black level was up a bit. Both were taken care of. It's good.

I should also mention that, subjectively, the picture seems just a tad crisper.
Edited by prepress - 11/3/13 at 2:07pm
post #29450 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by prepress View Post

Kevin Miller did a tune-up calibration on my PRO-111 yesterday. He also did the initial one 5 years ago. At that initial one, it was recommended there be 160 hours minimum on the panel. I had 162.

Despite the long time between, the set wasn't in such bad shape. The reds were high (obvious with a black screen) and the black level was up a bit. Both were taken care of. It's good.

I should also mention that, subjectively, the picture seems just a tad crisper.

Interesting. When you mention the reds were high, are you talking about the "red tint" that is apparent on the screen at times? My 111 has it on the bottom of the screen.

I was thinking about re-calibrating my 111 and having my 500M calibrated as well. But I'm considering just selling both to pick up a ZT60 now.
post #29451 of 30259
Amazon is having a sale on the S60 65".
post #29452 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by hhaller View Post

Interesting. When you mention the reds were high, are you talking about the "red tint" that is apparent on the screen at times? My 111 has it on the bottom of the screen.

I was thinking about re-calibrating my 111 and having my 500M calibrated as well. But I'm considering just selling both to pick up a ZT60 now.

With an all-black screen, I noticed a general reddish tint overall in recent times. It wasn't so obvious on program material, though. Nor was the slightly higher black level. But after additional viewing, skin tones look really good and the picture is indeed sharper. It's great!
post #29453 of 30259
Ready to play the ps4 on my 151 when it comes in Friday!
post #29454 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by t-town oil View Post

Ready to play the ps4 on my 151 when it comes in Friday!

Will be a sight to behold I'm sure...

The further into the generation the more the games will be 'native' 1080P.

And there won't be a better way for 1080P gaming on a large screen plasma than a Kuro. Especially when the Kuro's setting's and the consoles are optimised for games.

What will you be playing first ?
post #29455 of 30259
I'm thinking Killzone, but will probably end up being Knack so my 7 year-old and I can play something together
post #29456 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by t-town oil View Post

I'm thinking Killzone, but will probably end up being Knack so my 7 year-old and I can play something together

Cool, enjoy. My boy has only turned 4 this last week or two and he's starting to pay more attention to console games nowadays. He gets frustrated his hands aren't bigger i think lol
post #29457 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by t-town oil View Post

Ready to play the ps4 on my 151 when it comes in Friday!

Same here! Looking forward to getting my PS4 friday to fire up on my 101fd. I am going with Nba 2k14,Killzone, and either Madden or knack. Target is having a buy 2 get 1 so I plan on taking advantage of that.
post #29458 of 30259
I took advantage of Amazon's same offer
post #29459 of 30259
Likewise. I can't wait to pick up my PS4 this Friday and then Xbox one next week.

AC4 for Xbox one and watchdogs on PS4
post #29460 of 30259
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmmesch View Post

Amazon is having a sale on the S60 65".

Wrong thread???????




GTAV looks really good with game mode. But i always go back to pure after awhile. The image is too natural not to use. Not getting a PS4 until next year. I can imagine native 1080p games will look amazing.
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