The Official Usher Audio Owners Thread - Page 10

If anyone has an original box and packaging material for an Usher BE-718 that you want to sell, please pm me

Thanks

Hi,
I have a similar question to KK's (I hope I am intruding)
I am new to the Usher world and really glad to be here. I just bought the 8571 MK2 with DMD tweeter ( a demo pair my dealer had) and I think I've made a mistake. Let me explain-
The Ushers sound unbelievable - open, detailed and most importantly have that mid-range thwack (the snare drum sound like you hear on Heavy Fuel, Dire Straits) that I really love. I live in New York and have heard B&Ws, Dynaudios, Magnepans, Wilsons, Anthony Gallos etc. and I think the Ushers are the best I've heard till date especially since for a lot of high end brands the sound becomes increasingly flat and sterile as you move up.
My problem is this and I hope some of you can help- if the 8571s are so good, should I go for the BE-10s? For those who've heard both- is there a big difference especially in the mid-top end attack ( to justify a 60% increase in price)? Or is the difference more in the bottom end? I heard the BE-10s only briefly but I think the 8571s have better mid-range dynamics. Anyone else have that thought? Unfortunately, I cannot listen to the BE-10s since there are no dealers around here that carry Ushers (sad)!
Thanks!

Saumm, how come you are interested to change if you've just bought a pari of 8571 MK2? What is it that you are not happy with?

I am really really happy with the sound, and that's the reason why I wonder what the BE-10s sound like. I feel (and hope) though that they are not better as far as the mid range attack is concerned... they might be better at sorting out a few more instruments in the mid range.. In a nutshell I know the chase towards perfection is endless and super expensive but I am wondering if I can get the 8571s qualities+ a lot more in the BE-10s.
Thanks

After spending some time to check and think, my first choice is the demo unit of 8571 with DMD over the BE-10 with BE tweeter. I have no chance to audit both of them but the new 8571 only cost 2/3 of the used BE-10. Will get the 8571 this weekend and 'll share how they sound. I believe they are not such different and 8571 will be easier to blend with other center and surround in dancer series.

KK

Hi Saumm,

Congratulations on your 8571's. They are truly great speakers! I have a question, when Usher releases the BE-15, would you be willing to trade in your BE-10's? Such is the life of an audiophile. If the answer is yes, then I recommend finding a dealer with the BE-10's and flying out for the weekend to test them. You will not be happy until you do. And no one else will be able to adequately express the particular characteristics that are important to YOU. If there is any hesitation, then you may want to reconsider on the BE-10's. Sometimes it's easy to get so focused on the next mountain and forget to enjoy the beautiful vistas from the mountain you just climbed. As you've already purchased the 8571's, I recommend letting them settle in and see if you really are happy with them. Start buying more records. Play LOTS of records. Enjoy the view.

Aloha,

Griller

Griller- I can't argue with that. There's always going to be something better...if only i had more control over myself!... but given that I want to close the speaker quest for a 5 year period, maybe the BE-10s are worth a try? KK- did you get a chance to listen to both speakers even if separately?

Hello, I am looking for a nice set of speakers from usher. I cannot locate any 6311's for sale. But I have found the V-604's for sale. Anyone have an experience with these? I believe that they were pre CP series. A dealer has a demo pair available. Thanks, Mike

Did you like them when you heard them?

roguemodel, I have a pair of 6311 in excellent condition in gloss yellow finish if you're interested. I have excellent feedback on audiogon.

I was asking about the 6311 and the rep said they have essentially stopped production on these. Even in Taiwan you can't get them. I have been steering people towards the X-718. I think that has the best value in their line for the price.

It's about the music!

Aloha,

Griller

I have Usher 6381 driven by Hyperion HT88 18w per channel tube amp. They sound great under low to medium volume ( though preamp is cranked to +6db) I was wondering is anyone can suggest the following

1. If I want to continue using tube amp, what is the absolute minimum wpc I need for these speakers 40 , 60 , 100 watts ?

2. Manufacturer says that it's best to use them with solid state. If we are talking about solid state amp. I have pioneer sc 35 with 140wpc, would it be better then to get a good stereo power amp with 200 or maybe 250 wpc ?

How big is your room?

I have a friend with 50 wpc tube amps driving 8571's with no problems hitting reference levels, but his room was small, 12x15 tops. Plenty of headroom.

I am driving Mini 2's with 120 wpc tubes. No problems, plenty of headroom, it's a huge room but they are easier to drive than the big boys.

I will admit I was concerned about wattage, but tube watts are stronger than SS. I can't think of a worse idea than driving Ushers with SS amplification, unless you are considering Pass Labs or Ayre. If you really like the tube sound, stick with it, if you aren't, then perhaps SS will work for you. My experience is that Monoblock construction is a good indicator to getting the best sound outside of true boutique brands like Shindo, etc.

50-60 wpc should meet most requirements unless you have an exceptionally large room. You could potentially get by with less depending on your room, musical tastes, setup, and associated components. Dead rooms will really soak up your power and kill the sound. Hope this helps!

It's about the MUSIC!

Aloha,

Griller

Hi,
I had a question about my 8571s. As i am listening to music, when I stand up the bass seems much better (fuller, more dynamic) than when I am sitting down.

My sitting position is at a normal height and my room is about 19*20. Does anyone else have the same problem? I've read somewhere that some other people had the same problem, but I could find no solution to it

Thanks so much
Saum

Saumm,

I'll bet your treble balance changes too. Bass nodes can be challenging to manage. If you want some really strong bass, go sit in the corner of your room. I'll bet your bass presentation changes significantly! The point is that bass presentation is related to the position of the speaker AND the listener. If you move your speakers around (sorry, I know how big they are) you can dramatically change their presentation. For bass, it seems to change for me more when I change my distance from the speakers. Try moving your listening position forward and back and see what kind of difference that makes. There are some reference materials on audio system setup, the most popular, Robert Harley's Complete Guide to High End Audio, that go into several things that most people never bother with. Or you could buy a processor with Audyssey EQ, run the setup with the microphone, and call it good. If you're looking for a bass heavy mix, you could punch up the bass on your preamp too, if it has that adjustment. If you want flat, it may just be that when you are sitting down, and you're getting a boost when you stand up. It may not be a problem, more a matter of preference. You have a lot of options, but I doubt there's anything wrong with your speakers, if that is your concern. Wow, I blathered on, sorry!

Aloha,

James

I expect delivery of a new pair of Dancer Mini Two DMD's this weekend. I'll be powering them with a Unison Research Unico SE hybrid integrated amp, putting 140 w into 8 ohms and almost twice that into this loudspeaker's rated 4 ohms. My listening room is roughly 24' x 24'.

I've auditioned these speakers at shows, but never in a home environment. Any tips on break-in times and toe-in...and any other set-up advice...would be much appreciated.

Thanks!

Congrats! These are awesome speakers! I have mine toed in pointing just behind my listening position, but experiment for your own taste. There are some references on the web for speaker separation and toe-in. Just google it. I have found the DMDs require a LONG break in. I heard them when they were brand new at the dealer and they were AWFUL. harsh, strident, I left almost immediately. I went back 4 months later and they had smoothed out considerably. The dealer said they take a long time to break in, and if I hadn't heard it myself I'd have said he was smoking something. I've always been suspicious of so-called "break-in" but it's true, at least with these speakers. Your hybrid should do them justice. I think Ushers, especially the DMD, perform better with tubes and I don't like them with SS amplification. (but I'm a tube guy too) I'm listening to mine right now. :-)

The long break in time, could it be because of the weak tube amp you're using? Mine broke in real fast.

Mine too...

Thank you!
My current floorstanders are positioned 8' tweeter to tweeter, 10' to the sweet spot and, like yours, cross just past the listening position. So I'll begin there, and report back after run-in.

Actually, I'm using 120 watt Monoblocks. The DMD's I heard were at the dealer and amplified by a very strong, if indelicate, Usher amp. I have the BE tweeters in my Mini 2's. There was virtually no break in with the BE's. The DMD's were a completely different story.

Please let us know how many hours you get in on them Before you consider them broken in. Happy listening!

Ten days after delivery I have reached the Usher Audio-suggested 180 hour mark; about 120 playing the "IsoTek Full System Enhancer CD" and perhaps 60 playing SACD's.

For the first three days the loudspeakers were not yet mounted on their cast iron bases, and bass response was predictably muddy. Once I found two people to assist in set-up, bass was fine but treble still constricted.

I'm well pleased with the sound quality now. Using Patricia Barber's "Nightclub" SACD as a benchmark I'm hearing a warm yet resolving frequency response, a broad soundstage and good imaging. I do note that in my room precise positioning seems critical: Right now I'm using the Jim Smith "Get Better Sound" method of having the distance between tweeters 83% of tweeter to listening position, and toeing in to just behind the sweet spot. I suspect that more tweaking will occur.

'Hope this helps.

New Usher review for Dancer Mini One http://www.usheraudio.com/files/revi...RLD_2012-3.pdf

No reviews of the BE-10 with diamond tweeter yet. Above review says the Diamond tweeter needs a lot of break-in.

Griller, I am here near Tienmu also. What is this about a BE-15, yours is the first I heard of it, or were you just using it as an example. Any idea when the Taiwan High End show is this year?

I don't see any problem using the R-1.5 amp. The US mail order importer lists it http://usheraudiousa.com/products/el...-1-5-amplifier Get two and monoblock them, that should offer 300 wpc.

I don't see the BE-20 as needed, except for big rooms.

I mostly agree withe review. I think the tweeter is forward, but component matching can help, and tubes would help a lot. The BE-15 was just an example, there is no BE-15 that I am aware of, and I am driving Mini 2's with the previous Beryllium tweeter in my system.

If I remember correctly the Taiwan hi-end show is in November. It is usually at the Taipei Dynasty hotel on Dunhua, next to Ikea. But there are a lot more shows than just that. I go to a record dealer and he is often off to some show or another.

Current fave vinyl - Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers, Live Anthology

Aloha,

Griller

Just wanted to talk a bit about typical Usher setups. Myself and two other friends in town have done as follows. BE-718 for front L/R. X-718 center. S-520 rear. SW-212 sub. Powered by a Denon 4311ci (or similar, or Onkyo). The idea is that this system is a hybrid for 2.0 or 2.1 listening, and for 5.1 (or 7.1 or 9.2...) movies.

Now this system can be improved upon in a couple ways. Firstly, using an AVR with pre-out, the 2.0 front L/R can be run through a separate amp, and what could be better than the Usher R-1.5. Second, again the front L/R could be upgraded to a mini-dancer one or the CP-8571 or even the BE-10. Really by the time you buy stands for your BE-718 the mini-dancer one is not much more. Beyond that some people swear by 7.1 or 9.1 setups with more speakers. The S-520 is such a bargain it seems like its worth trying. Some feel the DMD tweeter is a bit intense. At least, it needs breaking in. Also, I managed to fry a pair, its a sensitive instrument. Lastly, some like me, want to use similar speakers for the front, I use an X-718 for the front center but a friend and I are going to split a pair of BE-718 and use it for the front center.

For electronics, I feel its pretty essential to use Audyssey in general, and the latest MultEQ XT32 in specific. Not many amps offer it yet http://www.audyssey.com/products?ins...d=44&ptype=All and even with a refurb you're $1000+. For $2000+ you can get a pure pre-amp like the Onkyo PR-SC5508 and that adds balanced XLR out, and removes all amps. So add an R-1.5 for the front, and maybe an Emotiva XLR for the surround 3 or 5 channels. Note that the PR-SC5509 is not sold in the USA.

Some people prefer softer sound and the old Beryllium tweeter. Or using a tube amp. I am going to just go with an R-1.5 and see if the DMD tweeter softens up after some break in. There are a few reviews here http://www.usheraudio.com/reviews-and-awards.html and people feel the R-1.5 is downright tube-like for a transistor amp. Speaking of reviews, the DMD tweeter has been out for a couple years and there are only one or two reviews covering it.

Going a little OT, source is up to you, we like an HTPC running MPC. And for storing BD images and music, another Taiwan product, a NAS from Synology. Gives you your own personal terabyte sized cloud, can stream your music to your iPad iPod or Galaxy S, or use your smartphone as a remote control to send the music in over AirPlay. Or just jack your IEM's into it, though some have better DACs than others. http://www.head-fi.org/t/541494/mult...-added-5-15-12

One thought, I'm not sure of the current situation, but at one point in time Usher offered other amps (1.2 2.5 2.8 3.0) so these may turn up used. Talked to Charles in Taipei today. R-1.5 has 2 models. Balanced XLR model costs about 24% more than RCA model. Both models can be bridged.

BE-10 comes in maple, birch, and walnut (from light to dark). All BE-10 models have 45 day lead time. Credit price same as cash price. This information is for Taiwan. High-End show was July last year, August this year.

Current fave .m4a ALAC served from Synology NAS to Airplay or DS Audio on cell phone, SSL over WAN or LAN or 3G or LTE: Blade Runner OST, Raging Bull OST

i have a couple of questions:
1) i currently have the cp-6381's in a dedicated room that is 28 x 13 using all Classe gear (200 watt amp, cp-60 preamp with phono). i really like the sound, very good bass, nice soundstaging, etc... i do have room treatments for the 1st reflection and tube traps in the back corners. speakers are close to 10ft out from the back wall, slightly toed-in. i am thinking about going to either a nice tube integrated amp or possibly a mcintosh integrated amp (ma-6900/ma-7000). since i moved to a small town far from any dealers, what would be a good tube integrated amp that would power these speakers? i mostly listen to jazz/blues/new age with some heavy rock thrown in, not at earth shaking levels.

2) i have always liked the sound of usher speakers. my other 2 systems in the house have the x-719's and the v-601's which sound very nice. so a couple of speakers that i'm curious about are the 8571's and the 8871's. it looks like the 8571's use the same drivers as my 6381's and the 8871 use the dual woofers. besides the much better looks, would there be a huge increase in sound performance compared to what i have now? i have nice tight bass with the 6381's in my room now.

thanks

Personally, I'd think you'd hear the most improvement by first sinking money into the speakers, the 8571's or even the BE-10's. (I don't hold with the dual-woofer variants of those, viz. 8871, BE-20). Per this article, break in the diamond tweeters for a while http://www.usheraudio.com/files/revi...RLD_2012-3.pdf You could then rotate the 6381's out to replace one of your other pairs Usher speakers and retire the V-601's, which are really not in a class with the rest of your kit. Later, do consider the Usher pre-amp and R-1.5S amp.

the drivers look similar but they are not of the same specs...

I thought the 6381 was just an X-718 on steroids. You have to decide if you will like the change from silk dome to DMD tweeter (once its properly broken in). But the speakers proposed get you into the Dancer series. I would certainly skip over the 8871 to get into the BE-10 if you are in that price range. An 8571 or enen a BE-718 get you that diamond tweeter. There is a reason these command the prices they do.

Huge is relative. Personally I vote for huge. In any event, upgrading the speakers will be vastly more improvement than upgrading the electronics. Go have a listen. And read some reviews. I generally stick to the models with lots of reviews.