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Pioneer 9G "buzz" poll (Elite and non-Elite) - Page 3

post #61 of 1627
6/30/08 at 10:32pm
Hmm, I am starting to experience buzzing on my Pro151 from about 15 ft away. It wasn't this loud before, although it's only been 3 days, but it definitely wasn't this loud the first 2.
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post #62 of 1627
6/30/08 at 10:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by chadmak09 View Post

I agree.
I did not notice or care abot the buzz that my 5080 had. I never gave the buzz issue a single thought. Most people probably have a buzz like my 5080 had.
Althogh some have extreme buzzers.
There is absolutly no way that someone would not notice the buzz I hear when turning powersave mode to off and surfing the internet on my 6020.
ITs so annoying that I have no choice but to go to powersave mode2. I didn't use powersave mode2 at first when surfing the net. And the buzz drove me so crazy I could still hear it in my head (like a song you hear on the radio that you can't get out of your head) after I left the living room and turned the TV off. lol. Its like it was stuck in my mind I had got so used to hearing it.

I understand, I wish you luck in getting it resolved if you need my help let me know.
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post #63 of 1627
7/1/08 at 1:19am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fanaticalism View Post

Hmm, I am starting to experience buzzing on my Pro151 from about 15 ft away. It wasn't this loud before, although it's only been 3 days, but it definitely wasn't this loud the first 2.

Looks like you need to change your vote. Sorry you're joining this unfortunate club.
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post #64 of 1627
7/1/08 at 6:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by G-star View Post

that's odd, it seems you voted "yes, and that's the reason i returned the set" in this poll.

what gives?

I wanted to see the poll results.

Take one away from the "return" column.

While it is too early to tell, the numbers so far seem to mirror the 8G buzz poll; which leads me to believe Pioneer did nothing to resolve the issues, reported by 8G owners, for the 9G series.
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post #65 of 1627
7/1/08 at 6:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by optivity View Post

I wanted to see the poll results.

Take one away from the "return" column.

While it is too early to tell, the numbers so far seem to mirror the 8G buzz poll; which leads me to believe Pioneer did nothing to resolve the issues, reported by 8G owners, for the 9G series.

after 9,000+ posts you don't know how to view poll results w/o voting? and of the 6 choices, you vote for the one that makes Pioneer look the worst?

sounds like sour grapes to me.
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post #66 of 1627
7/1/08 at 6:59am
Quote:
Originally Posted by G-star View Post

after 9,000+ posts you don't know how to view poll results w/o voting? and of the 6 choices, you vote for the one that makes Pioneer look the worst?

sounds like sour grapes to me.

Did you pony up $7750 for the "privilege" of owning a Pioneer 'Elite' Kuro PDP?
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post #67 of 1627
7/1/08 at 7:32am
Quote:
Originally Posted by optivity View Post

I wanted to see the poll results.

So you failed to see the "View Poll Results" link at the lower right????

Quote:


Take one away from the "return" column.

He can't

Quote:


While it is too early to tell, the numbers so far seem to mirror the 8G buzz poll; which leads me to believe Pioneer did nothing to resolve the issues, reported by 8G owners, for the 9G series.

If you paid attention to the original 8G poll, you would have seen where there are 2 distinct and different buzzes. One was from the power supply and the other from the PDP glass itself. Pioneer fixed the power supply buzz. They CANNOT eliminate the glass buzz as it is INHERENT to the PDP module design.
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post #68 of 1627
7/1/08 at 7:51am
After you question me about questioning the sincerity of people.
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post #69 of 1627
7/1/08 at 7:58am
Quote:
Originally Posted by chadmak09 View Post

I agree.
I did not notice or care abot the buzz that my 5080 had. I never gave the buzz issue a single thought. Most people probably have a buzz like my 5080 had.
Althogh some have extreme buzzers.
There is absolutly no way that someone would not notice the buzz I hear when turning powersave mode to off and surfing the internet on my 6020.
ITs so annoying that I have no choice but to go to powersave mode2. I didn't use powersave mode2 at first when surfing the net. And the buzz drove me so crazy I could still hear it in my head (like a song you hear on the radio that you can't get out of your head) after I left the living room and turned the TV off. lol. Its like it was stuck in my mind I had got so used to hearing it.

That completely stinks...are you going to return it and hope for a less buzzy model?

Sadly, I agree that it seems a number of folks are, for whatever reason, pumping up the no-buzz statistics. This is a shame, because a thread like this in a highly visited forum can help "encourage" manufacturers to fix future models and develop work-arounds for existing ones.

Why do I think that the no-buzz stats are being artificially inflated. I've done statistical polling and the way that question is phrased, I would have used it as a "throw away" category to catch outliers of two kinds: 1) Folks trying to skew the results for whatever reason and 2) Folks who are being completely honest but simply can't hear well.

That question is, for lack of a better explanation, a superlative question. Ever have your wife tell you that you "never help her do X." Well, chances are you did help her do "X" at some point, even if it was only once. That makes her statement false, although past experience has taught me to leave it alone :-P

If you walk up to the back of 99%+ percent of any electronic device pulling 600+ watts, you will hear a hum. That's why the powersave mode helps, you are decreasing the wattage at the expense of brightness.

The vast majority of people who walk up to a 600+ watt device and do not hear any sound whatsoever fall into category 1 or 2 listed above.

The question is...why?
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post #70 of 1627
7/1/08 at 8:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

So you failed to see the "View Poll Results" link at the lower right????

He can't

If you paid attention to the original 8G poll. You would have seen where there are 2 distinct and different buzzes. One was from the power supply and the other from the PDP glass itself. Pioneer fixed the power supply buzz. They CANNOT eliminate the glass buzz as it is INHERENT to the PDP module design.

If the panel buzz was INHERENT why do some sets have it and others don't; also why would a set develop it if it was something naturally occurring due to design?

I can understand some people may have the power supply buzz which is steady but the panel buzz which in my case cycles up and down based on the scene color. I have listened to other sets PBG display that do not have the buzz so I don't think it is inherent but maybe something to do with manufacturing varences.
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post #71 of 1627
7/1/08 at 8:09am
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

So you failed to see the "View Poll Results" link at the lower right????

I highly doubt it, i think he didn't realize it was a public poll so he planted a fake vote to make Pioneer look bad was shocked to see his name suddenly appear which exposed him for all the world to see. That must have been pretty embrassing
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post #72 of 1627
7/1/08 at 8:13am
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

So you failed to see the "View Poll Results" link at the lower right????

He can't

If you paid attention to the original 8G poll, you would have seen where there are 2 distinct and different buzzes. One was from the power supply and the other from the PDP glass itself. Pioneer fixed the power supply buzz. They CANNOT eliminate the glass buzz as it is INHERENT to the PDP module design.

Out of curiosity, are you saying that buzzing in an inherent quality of all PDPs or just Pioneer.

I ask because there are models out there that I have found to be completely and utterly silent from the front. I'll provide one specific example because it's not one that I own so have absolutely no skin in that game (provided in advance for those who would flame me ). The new Panasonic with the full glass front is silent. Now, perhaps it is a characteristic of that single sheet of glass across the bezel, but no hum.

FWIW, I'd suggest you guys gather your data and enlist the aid of some forum sponsors to try and get a real Pioneer tech to come to the house of someone in this thread that has the worst hum, and then report back what's causing it.

Because you chose the worst, it can't be written off as "in spec." If I had a vote, I'd choose Chad because it's bad enough to be a splinter in his mind, driving him mad.

Oh...and just calling Pioneer like any other manufacturer, will get you contracted labor from a local certified shop. Great folks, I'm sure, but no skin in the game.

I had to do this with a car I once owned...had to use lemon law legislation to get the manufacturer to send down an engineer to crawl through my car, because the dealer wasn't incented enough to fix it. It works...two weeks later I had a shiny new car.

You guys are the exact target market, Pioneer does not want to piss off. You are their zealots...their extended marketing arm...Powah to the People !!!

ok...too much coffee...i'm done :-P
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post #73 of 1627
7/1/08 at 8:31am
Quote:
Originally Posted by DMP2722 View Post

If the panel buzz was INHERENT why do some sets have it and others don't;

Panel buzz IS INHERENT to the PDP module design.....simply put, they ALL have it. Whether one can here it is based on numerous factors including room acoustics and the person's hearing capabilities.

Quote:


also why would a set develop it if it was something naturally occurring due to design?

If a set "develops a buzz" later in it's life cycle, how and why would you assume it has anything to do with the PDP module design buzz?

Quote:


I can understand some people may have the power supply buzz which is steady but the panel buzz which in my case cycles up and down based on the scene color. I have listened to other sets PBG display that do not have the buzz so I don't think it is inherent but maybe something to do with manufacturing varences.

If you are implying you cannot hear panel buzz on any other panel besides Pioneer, then you have some hearing challenges with certain frequencies. ALL plasmas buzz....every single one of them. The difference between Pioneer and.....say Samsung or Panasonic is the fact that Pioneer does not have an additional layer of glass that both Samsung and Panasonic have. That additional layer of glass cover's their color filter and acts as sound insulator that muffles the PDP module buzz

Pioneer removed their additional layer of glass and replaced it with the bonded "First Surface Color Filter" way back on the 5Gs. Ever since then, owners have commented on the additional panel buzz.

Folks, the buzz is in the tech. It's not going anywhere until Pioneer either adds an additional layer of glass (doubt if that happens) or when 10 lumen tech is implemented.
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post #74 of 1627
7/1/08 at 8:35am
yeah pioneer doesnt have any ghosting cuz of the single glass.
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post #75 of 1627
7/1/08 at 8:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by rwr1776 View Post

Out of curiosity, are you saying that buzzing in an inherent quality of all PDPs or just Pioneer.

Quality??? Technology

Quote:


I ask because there are models out there that I have found to be completely and utterly silent from the front. I'll provide one specific example because it's not one that I own so have absolutely no skin in that game (provided in advance for those who would flame me ). The new Panasonic with the full glass front is silent. Now, perhaps it is a characteristic of that single sheet of glass across the bezel, but no hum.

I disagree. I have a TH50PZ800u in my home and it buzz just like the Pioneers. Again, all plasmas buzz.
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post #76 of 1627
7/1/08 at 8:59am
I have a 3+ year old Panasonic PDP w/no audible buzz...

I tend to leave this TV on at night w/the 90 min. sleep timer & sound down very low so if there was a buzz coming from the display I believe I would notice.

My PRO-150FD did not buzz when brand new last September but does buzz now.

For $7750 I do not accept the premise that buzzing panels w/de d/stuck pixels are inherent with plasma display technology and therefore acceptable.

I am not the kind of individual who "borrows" PDPs from retail stores and I "demand" better quality when it comes to spending my hard earned money.
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post #77 of 1627
7/1/08 at 9:14am
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

Panel buzz IS INHERENT to the PDP module design.....simply put, they ALL have it. Whether one can here it is based on numerous factors including room acoustics and the person's hearing capabilities.

If a set "develops a buzz" later in it's life cycle, how and why would you assume it has anything to do with the PDP module design buzz?

Because pioneer confirmed it the buzz was caused by the panel. I don't assume it is design and if it was why would Pioneer pay to replace the panel after they already replaced the power supply. As for listening to other sets. I have listened to them and can confirm some have it and others don't. Also the techs and sales staff have confirmed this as well on replaced sets. Agreed all plasmas have some buzz that is normal but not noticable during normal viewing unlike the cyclical buzz on some Pioneer panels. I agree not everyone will hear it due their hearing ability and room accoustics come into play as well. I am basing my input on same person, same location.


If you are implying you cannot hear panel buzz on any other panel besides Pioneer, then you have some hearing challenges with certain frequencies. ALL plasmas buzz....every single one of them. The difference between Pioneer and.....say Samsung or Panasonic is the fact that Pioneer does not have an additional layer of glass that both Samsung and Panasonic have. That additional layer of glass cover's their color filter and acts as sound insulator that muffles the PDP module buzz

I did not say I couldn't hear a buzz on other manufacters panels. All plasmas have a buzz that can be heard if you put your ear in close proximity to the set but is not heard in normal viewing. My 150 had the normal buzz when I first received it and was perfect. It developed the cyclical buzz that is extremely noticable after 130 hours. Pioneer replaced thef power supply but nothing changed.

Pioneer removed their additional layer of glass and replaced it with the bonded "First Surface Color Filter" way back on the 5Gs. Ever since then, owners have commented on the additional panel buzz.

This maybe the cause I am not disputing that what I am saying is there might be subtle variances in manufacturing practices and locations that could account for some sets being worse than others.

Folks, the buzz is in the tech. It's not going anywhere until Pioneer either adds an additional layer of glass (doubt if that happens) or when 10 lumen tech is implemented.

Not trying to be disagreeable just wanted to add my input based on personal experience and I am answering on a cell so it is a bit tedious to say the least :-)
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post #78 of 1627
7/1/08 at 9:26am
I gotta admit, I'm disappointed with the fact that quite a few folks are still experiencing buzz, whether it's in the tech or not.

Please understand where I'm coming from: I watched the Russ Johnston videos over and over again last year
(after I left the LCD realm) and he talked about how Pioneer re-engineered their plasmas from the bottom-up.
They wanted to improve everything, including the sound. Further, I read the elite series of plasmas go under
stringent scrutiny before they are released. I was so impressed with all the stuff, I spent over $8K for a 150
last year and waited an eternity for it to arrive. When it did, I was disappointed to have a panel that buzzed
really really loud, and it had lots of streaks all over it. Folks can read posts like optivity and such and think
he's being a bit negative, but imagine a guy like myself, or even Chadmak09 who is so incredibly excited for a
panel, only to be horribly disappointed in one way or another when it arrives. In my case, I sacrificed a 52 inch
LCD TV and waited 6 months for a new one (I caved and bought a 37 inch to watch in that period) only to be sorely
disappointed. I am actually more disapointed with the streaks than the buzzing, but still, I think folks have to
question the QC from time to time. I know I have every right since my streaks should *NEVER* have passed QC...
especially on the company's flagship 'Elite' TV which has stringent QC measures. Sorry, but as of now, I believe
there is *NO* distinction between elite and non-elite when it comes to QC.

Further, Russ Johnston's videos echoed how Pioneer strived to perfect each element of the TV, which includes sound.
If they worked so hard on the audio aspect of the TV, then why did they not consider reducing panel buzz if it was
inherent, as it *DOES* interfere with the sound. Yes, mine buzzed loud enough that you can hear it while watching
regular TV content with the sound at a relatively medium level.

Sigh... folks just can't understand how disheartening go from the king of one technology (Sharp/LCD) to another
(Pioneer/Plasma) and have the same nasty bug of QC issues follow you.
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post #79 of 1627
7/1/08 at 9:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by optivity View Post

I have a 3+ year old Panasonic PDP w/no audible buzz...

I tend to leave this TV on at night w/the 90 min. sleep timer & sound down very low so if there was a buzz coming from the display I believe I would notice.

Sounds like a case of hearing loss.


Quote:


My PRO-150FD did not buzz when brand new last September but does buzz now.

As I stated before, what relevance does this have to do with PDP module buzz. "Did not buzz when brand new last September but does buzz now" sounds like a problem you need to take up with your Pioneer warranty....you know the thing listed in the manual you worship like it's the ten commandments.

Quote:


For $7750 I do not accept the premise that buzzing panels w/de d/stuck pixels are inherent with plasma display technology and therefore acceptable.

I would expect this from you as you have limited knowledge of anything beyond what you personally believe. Research PDP technology and hopefully you will comprehend what's going on.

Quote:


I am not the kind of individual who "borrows" PDPs from retail stores and I "demand" better quality when it comes to spending my hard earned money.

What does this have to do with this thread? I guess it's true that you can't teach old dogs new tricks. Get over yourself optivity. It might help you build that "better box" so you can get in it, seal it, and misplace it.
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post #80 of 1627
7/1/08 at 9:32am
Quote:
Originally Posted by DMP2722 View Post

Not trying to be disagreeable just wanted to add my input based on personal experience and I am answering on a cell so it is a bit tedious to say the least :-)

I wasn't attempting to shoot down your post. I'm just stating the facts regarding PDP module buzz.

Cell phone replies....I know the feeling
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post #81 of 1627
7/1/08 at 9:35am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nambit View Post

I gotta admit, I'm disappointed with the fact that quite a few folks are still experiencing buzz, whether it's in the tech or not.

Please understand where I'm coming from: I watched the Russ Johnston videos over and over again last year
(after I left the LCD realm) and he talked about how Pioneer re-engineered their plasmas from the bottom-up.
They wanted to improve everything, including the sound. Further, I read the elite series of plasmas go under
stringent scrutiny before they are released. I was so impressed with all the stuff, I spent over $8K for a 150
last year and waited an eternity for it to arrive. When it did, I was disappointed to have a panel that buzzed
really really loud, and it had lots of streaks all over it. Folks can read posts like optivity and such and think
he's being a bit negative, but imagine a guy like myself, or even Chadmak09 who is so incredibly excited for a
panel, only to be horribly disappointed in one way or another when it arrives. In my case, I sacrificed a 52 inch
LCD TV and waited 6 months for a new one (I caved and bought a 37 inch to watch in that period) only to be sorely
disappointed. I am actually more disapointed with the streaks than the buzzing, but still, I think folks have to
question the QC from time to time. I know I have every right since my streaks should *NEVER* have passed QC...
especially on the company's flagship 'Elite' TV which has stringent QC measures. Sorry, but as of now, I believe
there is *NO* distinction between elite and non-elite when it comes to QC.

Further, Russ Johnston's videos echoed how Pioneer strived to perfect each element of the TV, which includes sound.
If they worked so hard on the audio aspect of the TV, then why did they not consider reducing panel buzz if it was
inherent, as it *DOES* interfere with the sound. Yes, mine buzzed loud enough that you can hear it while watching
regular TV content with the sound at a relatively medium level.

Sigh... folks just can't understand how disheartening go from the king of one technology (Sharp/LCD) to another
(Pioneer/Plasma) and have the same nasty bug of QC issues follow you.

I think yuo misinterpreted "sound". The video speaks of the speaker quality....NOT panel buzz.

If you had streaks on your Elite, why didn't you get it replaced?
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post #82 of 1627
7/1/08 at 9:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by optivity View Post

Did you pony up $7750 for the "privilege" of owning a Pioneer 'Elite' Kuro PDP?

i guess you don't care about your credibility around here. sounds like Randy was correct in his assesment:

Quote:


i think he didn't realize it was a public poll so he planted a fake vote to make Pioneer look bad was shocked to see his name suddenly appear which exposed him for all the world to see. That must have been pretty embrassing
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post #83 of 1627
7/1/08 at 9:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

If you had streaks on your Elite, why didn't you get it replaced?

Ask Pioneer Canada, as I vehemently tried. Further, the tech they sent said they've never seen anything like that, but recorded it as IR.
When I pushed pioneer to send a different tech as I was unsatisfied with the first one, they refused and said my TV has IR which is not
under warranty. I have their e-mail from some top-level tech support basically telling me they can't do anything for me. Regardless, I am
so shocked this TV passed QC and I am even more shocked that they refused my requests for a different technician (over and over again).
You guys that don't have insane buzz (not regular buzz) and streaks are so unbelievably lucky. Heck, I'm sure Pioneer USA gives better support.
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post #84 of 1627
7/1/08 at 9:49am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nambit View Post

Ask Pioneer Canada, as I vehemently tried. Further, the tech they sent said they've never seen anything like that, but recorded it as IR.
When I pushed pioneer to send a different tech as I was unsatisfied with the first one, they refused and said my TV has IR which is not
under warranty. I have their e-mail from some top-level tech support basically telling me they can't do anything for me. Regardless, I am
so shocked this TV passed QC and I am even more shocked that they refused my requests for a different technician (over and over again).

That's ridiculous.
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post #85 of 1627
7/1/08 at 10:00am
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

Panel buzz IS INHERENT to the PDP module design.....simply put, they ALL have it. Whether one can here it is based on numerous factors including room acoustics and the person's hearing capabilities.

If a set "develops a buzz" later in it's life cycle, how and why would you assume it has anything to do with the PDP module design buzz?

If you are implying you cannot hear panel buzz on any other panel besides Pioneer, then you have some hearing challenges with certain frequencies. ALL plasmas buzz....every single one of them. The difference between Pioneer and.....say Samsung or Panasonic is the fact that Pioneer does not have an additional layer of glass that both Samsung and Panasonic have. That additional layer of glass cover's their color filter and acts as sound insulator that muffles the PDP module buzz

Pioneer removed their additional layer of glass and replaced it with the bonded "First Surface Color Filter" way back on the 5Gs. Ever since then, owners have commented on the additional panel buzz.

Folks, the buzz is in the tech. It's not going anywhere until Pioneer either adds an additional layer of glass (doubt if that happens) or when 10 lumen tech is implemented.

D-Nice - Just trying to understand industry direction, and your support with clarification would be greatly appreciated - The more I read, the more I am confused?

1) Does your last notation here imply that the 10G Kuro (Fall 09), 5 Lumens panel via Panny new glass factory will probably not have a reduction in panel buzz?

2) Will both the Kuro and Panny panels eliminate the cover glass in 2009 even though current Pannys have it? I think I remember a post noting 10G Kuro will keep bonded cover filter proprietary, but unsure if it was this or the drivers and/or the processing?

3) Althgouth I do not place a high level of confidence in HDNet reviews, I think the recent one for the latest 08s, highest-end Panny 850 with great colors noted no cover glass. Is this accurate and a common direction for both companies?

4) Can you please clarify if the Kuro 10Gs (2009s) will utilize a new common glass design significantly reducing cost and thickness although not to 9mm concept levels? Will this finally occur in 2010 in parallel with 10 lumens? Bottom line, are 2009s via new common glass factory preparing for 2010 with 10 lumens and 9mm - Will glass be the same for 5 & 10 lumens?

Thanks for your ongoing support to this forum.
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post #86 of 1627
7/1/08 at 10:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nambit View Post

Ask Pioneer Canada, as I vehemently tried. Further, the tech they sent said they've never seen anything like that, but recorded it as IR.
When I pushed pioneer to send a different tech as I was unsatisfied with the first one, they refused and said my TV has IR which is not
under warranty. I have their e-mail from some top-level tech support basically telling me they can't do anything for me. Regardless, I am
so shocked this TV passed QC and I am even more shocked that they refused my requests for a different technician (over and over again).
You guys that don't have insane buzz (not regular buzz) and streaks are so unbelievably lucky. Heck, I'm sure Pioneer USA gives better support.

Yikes. Pioneer Canada is rough on there warranty policy, I have seen up to 3 techs sent to one home before on the buzzing issue. Don't let up on them, something good is bound to happen.
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post #87 of 1627
7/1/08 at 10:29am
So has any consensus been reached on whether the alternating (for light and dark scenes) buzz that seems to emanate the loudest from the direct center of the screen (and lowers noticeably when moving off-axis, or goes away nearly completely with Power Save Mode 2) is in fact abnormal, and worthy of gambling on a return to be better?
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post #88 of 1627
7/1/08 at 10:36am
I have had my 60" 151FD Elite in the house for a little over a week now. I have completed the break-in period and am now enjoying an absolutely stunning picture. And this is just on my crappy TW feed! Can't wait until I get a BD player in house.

I have absolutely zero buzz. From the moment I plugged it in, this fact hasn't changed. I've turned off every possible source of ambient noise and even listened late at night...nothing, nadda, zilch. I've had other family members and the delivery drivers listen, all of which were in their late teens and early twenties. The only one to say he heard a faint "something" was the late-teens delivery driver...but this was only after he walked right up to the panel and put his hear an inch or two from it.

I started to write that I must be one of the lucky ones. However, the results of the poll (at least as of this writing) show that I'm part of the majority that don't have a problem with their set.

Accounting for the one admitted voting mistake (could there be others?), it appears only 18.3% of owners have a problem they consider either annoying and annoying enough that they've returned it. That means that almost 82% of us are content with their set (at least from the buzz perspective).

My heart does go out to those that have the excessive buzz. I do hope you can get it resolved through your dealer. You paid a lot of money for your set and hopefully you can get it resolved.

That said, I must say that given the results of the poll (I realize it's early yet) it appears Pioneer has done a good job with this incredibly complex and hard-to-ship piece of gear.

Edit: Oh, I think we were asked to say something about our elevation. My house sits at sea level, but my feet are in the clouds when watching this incredible panel!
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post #89 of 1627
7/1/08 at 11:52am
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexInvision View Post

Yikes. Pioneer Canada is rough on there warranty policy, I have seen up to 3 techs sent to one home before on the buzzing issue. Don't let up on them, something good is bound to happen.

After phoning Pioneer as many times as I did... I gave up. Remember, the TV
is now gone as the guy who bought the condo now has it. He's damned happy
to have a huge pioneer elite as it is...

Meanwhile, I am still debating on the 141. A side of me is thinking that I should
hold off as my house is not going to be ready until January anyhow. I could
just go 10g and be done with it. Then again, purchasing a TV will likely be a
whole lot harder once the house is built. I'm already thinking of just dumping
the TV funds on new furniture and such and living with the 4280. I just don't
know if the 9g is worth risking the hassles I went through last year.

**EDIT** Well, I decided to forget the TV and wait for the house next year.
I've just canceled my order. I'll wait and see what's available then before I
buy another TV (if I do even pick one up).
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post #90 of 1627
7/1/08 at 2:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shutterman View Post

I have had my 60" 151FD Elite in the house for a little over a week now. I have completed the break-in period and am now enjoying an absolutely stunning picture. And this is just on my crappy TW feed! Can't wait until I get a BD player in house.

I have absolutely zero buzz. From the moment I plugged it in, this fact hasn't changed. I've turned off every possible source of ambient noise and even listened late at night...nothing, nadda, zilch. I've had other family members and the delivery drivers listen, all of which were in their late teens and early twenties. The only one to say he heard a faint "something" was the late-teens delivery driver...but this was only after he walked right up to the panel and put his hear an inch or two from it.

I started to write that I must be one of the lucky ones. However, the results of the poll (at least as of this writing) show that I'm part of the majority that don't have a problem with their set.

Accounting for the one admitted voting mistake (could there be others?), it appears only 18.3% of owners have a problem they consider either annoying and annoying enough that they've returned it. That means that almost 82% of us are content with their set (at least from the buzz perspective).

My heart does go out to those that have the excessive buzz. I do hope you can get it resolved through your dealer. You paid a lot of money for your set and hopefully you can get it resolved.

That said, I must say that given the results of the poll (I realize it's early yet) it appears Pioneer has done a good job with this incredibly complex and hard-to-ship piece of gear.

Edit: Oh, I think we were asked to say something about our elevation. My house sits at sea level, but my feet are in the clouds when watching this incredible panel!

With all due respect, I think you are looking at this the wrong way.

Assuming my advanced degree in statistical models is useless and that the votes for the first category reflect reality vs the human desire to validate decisions, you imply that a 1 in 5 failure rate is acceptable for an extremely expensive piece of equipment. If 20% of the BMW 335i Convertibles had annoying wind noise, would folks find that acceptable. As a BMW owner, I'd be on that MFR's arse to fix the problem. Heck, I think a 1% failure rate is too high with today's manufacturing processes.

Annoyance is subjective, so to be safe one should really add all three "buzz" categories together, in which case the failure rate is even higher.

Again...I think you guys are missing a golden opportunity to put some pressure on a MFR who cannot afford to ignore a major constituency.

Heck, there should be some objective criteria in terms of dB and distance that is considered acceptable. According to D-Nice who seems to be very knowledgable, there is no way to construct PDP w/o hum and Pio has made the design decision to not insulate the actual panel with an additioanl pane of glass. It then makes sense that those displays may be a bit louder than other MFRs, but there should still be a threashold that's not crossed and, for the majority, isn't crossed.

Your experience seems to be impossible, according to the resident expert, so I don't know what to say other than that it seems better to focus on pressuring this MFR to at least address the issue.
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AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Plasma Flat Panel Displays › Pioneer 9G "buzz" poll (Elite and non-Elite)