*Official* Denon AVR 1909/789 Thread - Page 20

Do not believe inflated wattage specs. Do you really think a $599 MSRP consumer receiver has as much power as a $1500 flagship like the 3808ci? Do you think it has TWICE the power of the Harman Kardon AVR 254 (65W/ch)?

It is much safer to assume that AV receivers in the same price bracket will have similar amounts of power. Pioneer doesn't even specify how they measured the "130Wx7" figure.

Power differences should never be the deciding factor between AVR's in the same price bracket. Choose based on features, input flexibility, reliability, brand rep, how it looks, etc.

Directly from Pioneer web-site: 1kHz w/0.05% THD @ 8 ohm

will the 1909 be able to output the HDMI inputs through the component video out ? Not sure if this is best way about doing this but I have three digital sources with HDMI that I would like to switch between my projector and LCD.

I only see the 4308CI having two HDMI outputs. Seems to have all the latest DACs minus the dynamic volume. Hopefully it will be discounted heavily soon.
http://www.listenup.com/DENON+AVR-43...I-p-49908.html

For those that are wondering,

If you want to gurantee that you get the $499 price, just start the phone call like "I'm calling about the preorder special for the Denon 1909 for $499 with free ship." The salesman (doesn't matter who) will then tell you to hold on while he checks, then come back and say "OK".

If you don't phrase it like this, you may get quoted $599, like i did when i first called today. I read another few posts earlier about getting quoted $599. I suppose you could just haggle them down, but figure the first approach is easier.

Also, Tony, who i spoke to, said this product ships Mid August, as least for my order, which was placed a few minutes ago.

ah so! I saw that on the website but I didn't read that as necessarily being correlated with the "130x7" claim, more like "here's the power rating" and "here's the THD rating".... I highly, highly doubt that a $599 receiver could actually put out 130Wx7 at 8ohms with 0.05% THD. The 3808ci can't even do that in bench tests.

40W / channel will surely make a difference. But then:

-do you really need that much power?

-and more important, is there REALLY 40W difference? Denon is quite reliable when it comes to power, they are clearly not the worse in this game. A 500$ amp like the Pio having 130W/channel is MUCH MORE suspicious. Why not THX 2 Ultra, all the audyssey auto setup, Reon processor and Charlize Theron installing it for free in bikini?

I would really like to see a measurement of this amp. Don't believe the numbers, listen to it, or wait for a real accurate review. It seems natural for us to rush for the best features/price ratio, but when it's too good to be true, most of the time, it's NOT true I have nothing against Pioneer, maybe this amp will be the greatest offer on the market. But I'm not really taking bets with 500$ Denon is not the cheapest brand, but they release reliable products, you get more or less what you are paying for. The 1909 already has good reviews, you should maybe wait for the first Pio users to give their opinion, and more important, for reliable press reviews to appear.

Or you can take a bet

No, there's pretty much nothing that will do this. It's an HDCP copy protection issue, no device will transcode digital HDMI video signals to component output (AFAIK).

Remember, that is at 1khz. WAY easier to produce 130watts there than at 20-20,000.

So I'm going to end up with one of these sort of by default - I ordered the ELT525 system from AV123, and all indications are this is the included receiver. http://**********/index.php

Way more high end than I've ever dealt with before, so I'll apologize in advance for all the stupid questions I'll be asking over the next few weeks.

up on ebay

just search for denon 1909

does anyone know if J&R have a good return policy in case I run into any trouble?

If you want to read the Pio 1018 thread, it's 43 pages thick:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...1#post14415890


The 1018's msrp is $599

And the wattage rating of 130 is peak, it's true rms rating is comparable to ALL the others in this price range.

here, it's 110 rms, taken from the "product brochure' on their site:

"Stereo - Continuous average power output of 110 watts + 110 watts at 8 ohms, from 20 Hz to 20 kHz with no more than 0.09 % total harmonic distortion."

better yet, here it's from the manual. I just purchased this receiver.

Amplifier section
Continuous average power output of 110 watts* per
channel, min., at 8 ohms, from 20 Hz to 20 000 Hz
with no more than 0.09 %** total harmonic
distortion (front).
Continuous Power Output (20 Hz to 20 kHz, 8 Ω, 0.09 %)
Front. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 110 W + 110 W
Center . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 110 W
Surround . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 110 W + 110 W
Surround back . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 110 W + 110 W
Continuous Power Output (1 kHz, 6 Ω, 1.0 %)
Front. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 150 W + 150 W
Center . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 150 W
Surround . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 150 W + 150 W
Surround back . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 150 W + 150 W
Related Power Output (1 kHz, 8 Ω, 0.05 %)
Front. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 130 W per channel
Center . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 130 W
Surround . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 130 W per channel
Total harmonic distortion. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 0.09 %
(20 Hz to 20 kHz, 110 W, 8 Ω)
* Measured pursuant to the Federal Trade Commission's
Trade Regulation rule on Power Output Claims for Amplifiers
** Measured by Audio Spectrum Analyzer

Sounds pretty good if you just keep it in good shape for 30 days. J&R Return Policy

Where is that report post button.

I don't see an automatic restocking fee in their policy.

hmm so tempting!! .. guess the main reason id like to upgrade would be for the HDMI which would give me extra hdmi connections since both my hdmi on my tv is used. single cable for video/audio and of course the hd audio. hmmmmm..

I do it in my system, Just use HDFury.

Interesting!

So I pulled the trigger on the Denon 1909 about 5 mins ago. I got it from J&R for a price of $499. Awesome deal I think... I had to tell them about this post, but they still honored the pre-order price. I was told it will ship out tomorrow by UPS Ground.

Shipping tomorrow eh? Did their shipment arrive while you were on the phone? I was told 1-2 weeks...

sweet

it looks like they have them in stock and everyone should get theirs soon

It says they are in stock on their site, but at a price of $649. I told the guy that I *MUST* have it by 8/15 and he said no worries.

Yep, I got a call from JR today regarding my purchase on July 28th confirming my shipping address being correct and that they were shipping it out today.

I can't say (don't know) if it is, but they do sell the 1909. Mine is supposed to ship out today from them. Nice price too, but not quite JR good. Hey, if it does ship today, I'm happy to pay a little more.

What site did you check...I looked at the site and still says coming soon. I just called and checked my order and there is still no ETA. I hope your right, but you might want to call back and confirm. If anyone else can too that would be great.

I was under the impression HK's avr-254 was 50wtt/ch

I don't get it.
I ordered two days ago and was told two weeks till ship. No ETA when I check my order status and when I check their site it still says "coming soon."

I just returned an HK avr-254 due to a strange and becomingly annoying buzzing sound from the unit, and sadly now miss my receiver and its good looks. I am very interested in this denon unit as it practically stacks up to the HK piece for piece.
Does anyone know if the unit does upconversion/upscaling of all video content, and is it bypassable (hk's was always on)? b/c down the road this may be a nuisance.
Is there no preamp outs? even for a sub? is this even a big deal, I considered it useful for the HK unit b/c of the lower wattage but perhaps I am over exaggerating the benefits?
how does logic 7 compare to audessey? I am comming from a 10 band yamaha eq which did wonders for my music...are the two even something to be comparable?

if any of these questions are further up this thread slap me

You convinced me...