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The Official Pioneer 9G Kuro Settings/Issues Thread - Page 345

post #10321 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmmesch View Post

I can only hope that's what I get on the April 2010 acquired 151 after the 150 I had died a few times until Pioneer replaced at months less than 2 years old.

Jeff Meier calibrated the 150 after 200 hours and was back when the 151 had a little more than 200. He told me how lucky I was I got one of the last 151's and made it perfect. Then he re-calibrated my Yamaha RX-V3800 again for 7.1 PLIIX movie audio.

All I can say is the 150 was gorgeous when it worked Yet, the 151 is prettier on (they look about the same off - unless next to each other). What I thought was a WOW, is now a louder WOW!

If not for Jeff Meier's highest recommendation of the Pioneer Kuro Elites when I was the frustrated owner of a Sony SXRD RPTV, I would have never had the privilege of owning a 151. I still can't get over what a wonderful picture that it creates with good source material in our little home theater system; especially after UMR's superb audio and video calibration.

Sorry to hear of your problems with your 150, but that you were fortunate enough for Pioneer to replace it with a 151. Best of luck with Your 151
post #10322 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

What it the color type your 600A is saying it is receiving from your source equipment? 4:4:4, 4:2:2, RGB 16-235 or RGB 0-255?

Auto (600A) and Auto (LX52), but I tried all other combinations as well.
They all look the same, except I noticed when setting 4:2:2 or RGB 16-235 on the 600A, almost the whole screen becomes purple.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmschnur View Post

What kind of aging are you guys seeing in your. 2 year old sets in terms of brightness, color, and brightness after 3000 -5000 hours or so?

I don't see any change in my set. The issue (which doesn't seem to be an actual issue, but just "how things are") with grayish black in a fully darkened area has been there since the beginning.
post #10323 of 10769
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zeth View Post

Auto (600A) and Auto (LX52), but I tried all other combinations as well.
They all look the same, except I noticed when setting 4:2:2 or RGB 16-235 on the 600A, almost the whole screen becomes purple.

I don't see any change in my set. The issue (which doesn't seem to be an actual issue, but just "how things are") with grayish black in a fully darkened area has been there since the beginning.

I suggest you force your BD player and other source equipment to use RGB 16-235 and force your 600A to do the same. Also, play with your Onkyo as some model don't do RGB correctly.
post #10324 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Fosse View Post

Best of luck with Your 151

So far, it's great. Yeah, the 150 was as well, until it was 1 year, 10.5 months old (late November 2009). It was fixed 3X, and by April 2010, when it would no longer turn on for the 5th or 6th time, it was diagnosed and replaced. I hope this 151 was better built.
post #10325 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

I suggest you force your BD player and other source equipment to use RGB 16-235 and force your 600A to do the same. Also, play with your Onkyo as some model don't do RGB correctly.

Tried that, no change... The only picture option on the Onkyo is xvYCC. Enabling/disabling it didn't affect the black level.
I'll try playing around a little bit more, like bypassing the Onkyo and fiddle with the settings. But that will have to wait until the weekend.
Does everyone see the black bars much brighter that the brezel when watching an almost fully black image in a darkened room? I mean I would stop tweaking around if it was normal
As soon as I turn on a small light in the room, the black bars look pitch black
post #10326 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by zeth View Post

Does everyone see the black bars much brighter that the brezel when watching an almost fully black image in a darkened room?

That's a subjective assessment and no one can answer that question for you. Certainly the display is readily visible when fed a full-screen black image in light-free room after dark adaptation.
post #10327 of 10769
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zeth View Post

Tried that, no change... The only picture option on the Onkyo is xvYCC. Enabling/disabling it didn't affect the black level.
I'll try playing around a little bit more, like bypassing the Onkyo and fiddle with the settings. But that will have to wait until the weekend.
Does everyone see the black bars much brighter that the brezel when watching an almost fully black image in a darkened room? I mean I would stop tweaking around if it was normal
As soon as I turn on a small light in the room, the black bars look pitch black

You need to get out of tour head that that black bars on content are suppose to be the same color as your bezel. They are not and will not.
post #10328 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by bodosom View Post

That's a subjective assessment and no one can answer that question for you. Certainly the display is readily visible when fed a full-screen black image in light-free room after dark adaptation.

+1

Exactly!
post #10329 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

You need to get out of tour head that that black bars on content are suppose to be the same color as your bezel. They are not and will not.

I will strongly consider your advice - I guess with an almost perfect product like the Kuro, even trivial things can make you crazy
post #10330 of 10769
Hi Guys:

I posted this in the 9G kuro elite thread but since this is actually the settings/issues thread (forgot about this one at the time!) I figured it would not hurt to post it here as well.....

I appear to be having a problem developing with my PRO 111FD. The monitor is just shy of 3 years in service (one month left to go on the Canadian warranty) and the panel seems to be going red on black screens. It seems to be most noticeable at the top and bottom of the screen but instead of the general light "greyish glow" on a full black screen, there is now a general light "red glow" to an all black screen (in an all black room). I tried dialing down the low bias to -4 and checked test patterns by eye to keep a good low grey scale. The monitor has not been calibrated as my technician in these parts has not acquired the requisite software. The greyscale and picture up to this point has been nothing short of stunning.

On the most recent movies I have watched, the dark scenes now show a light crimson glow to letterbox bars and this can be distracting. The movies in question were the Harry Potter 5, 6, and 7 and last night FOTR. I always did notice the letterbox bars on really dark scenes, but they never stood out and definately had a lighter appearance and not a reddish tint. The greyscale patterns do not really seem to show the red tint, even at the bottom or top of the screen.

The red bias turned down does not eliminate the tint, turning it up to +6 does give a very red black.

Has anyone else come across this (a few post were made in the non-elite form about this being a known problem, but I did not see any resolutions mentioned). Is this just a calibration drift issue or is there a component going out of spec?

I (and my tech guy, who was going to check with Pioneer Canada) would appreciate any info you experts can supply.

Cheers,
P.E.H.
post #10331 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by phannon View Post

Hi Guys:

I posted this in the 9G kuro elite thread but since this is actually the settings/issues thread (forgot about this one at the time!) I figured it would not hurt to post it here as well.....

I appear to be having a problem developing with my PRO 111FD. The monitor is just shy of 3 years in service (one month left to go on the Canadian warranty) and the panel seems to be going red on black screens. It seems to be most noticeable at the top and bottom of the screen but instead of the general light "greyish glow" on a full black screen, there is now a general light "red glow" to an all black screen (in an all black room). I tried dialing down the low bias to -4 and checked test patterns by eye to keep a good low grey scale. The monitor has not been calibrated as my technician in these parts has not acquired the requisite software. The greyscale and picture up to this point has been nothing short of stunning.

On the most recent movies I have watched, the dark scenes now show a light crimson glow to letterbox bars and this can be distracting. The movies in question were the Harry Potter 5, 6, and 7 and last night FOTR. I always did notice the letterbox bars on really dark scenes, but they never stood out and definately had a lighter appearance and not a reddish tint. The greyscale patterns do not really seem to show the red tint, even at the bottom or top of the screen.

The red bias turned down does not eliminate the tint, turning it up to +6 does give a very red black.

Has anyone else come across this (a few post were made in the non-elite form about this being a known problem, but I did not see any resolutions mentioned). Is this just a calibration drift issue or is there a component going out of spec?

I (and my tech guy, who was going to check with Pioneer Canada) would appreciate any info you experts can supply.

Cheers,
P.E.H.

I have this problem on my 5020. It had also been mentioned by 3 other members in the past. I have searched endlessly for a solution to this problem to no avail. It seems it can occur on Kuros that have seen many hours of use.

I have had my display professionally calibrated, but that could not fix the issue. I have also had the (I believe it was the) "A" board replaced, still nothing.

Sorry about the bad news.

If you find out any more info that could remedy the issue, please let us know
post #10332 of 10769
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by phannon View Post

Hi Guys:

I posted this in the 9G kuro elite thread but since this is actually the settings/issues thread (forgot about this one at the time!) I figured it would not hurt to post it here as well.....

I appear to be having a problem developing with my PRO 111FD. The monitor is just shy of 3 years in service (one month left to go on the Canadian warranty) and the panel seems to be going red on black screens. It seems to be most noticeable at the top and bottom of the screen but instead of the general light "greyish glow" on a full black screen, there is now a general light "red glow" to an all black screen (in an all black room). I tried dialing down the low bias to -4 and checked test patterns by eye to keep a good low grey scale. The monitor has not been calibrated as my technician in these parts has not acquired the requisite software. The greyscale and picture up to this point has been nothing short of stunning.

On the most recent movies I have watched, the dark scenes now show a light crimson glow to letterbox bars and this can be distracting. The movies in question were the Harry Potter 5, 6, and 7 and last night FOTR. I always did notice the letterbox bars on really dark scenes, but they never stood out and definately had a lighter appearance and not a reddish tint. The greyscale patterns do not really seem to show the red tint, even at the bottom or top of the screen.

The red bias turned down does not eliminate the tint, turning it up to +6 does give a very red black.

Has anyone else come across this (a few post were made in the non-elite form about this being a known problem, but I did not see any resolutions mentioned). Is this just a calibration drift issue or is there a component going out of spec?

I (and my tech guy, who was going to check with Pioneer Canada) would appreciate any info you experts can supply.

Cheers,
P.E.H.

How many hours do you have on your display? What is the build date of your display?
post #10333 of 10769
D-Nice:

Thanks for the replies guys. Rather bizarrely the red tint is more noticable in the black bar region rather than in the picture area of letterbox movies! I sort of noticed the problem maybe a month ago but thought it was maybe an optical illusion....once you think you see it... It became rather noticeable over the last few weeks on the dark scenes in the movies listed in my post, with the bars appearing crimson (noticeaable against the black of the picture, not bright) and standing out during the really dark scenes. If I concentrate on the picture area it can be more or less ignored, but the eye is drawn toward it.....

I altered the bias settings by turning down the red low, but even turning it down a lot did not seem to alter the red tint nearly as much as it altered the active picture. I settled on dropping the red from -1 to -4. Turning up the blue (from 0) removes the red tint but the active picture takes on a blue tint and the blacks become lighter (green +1). I did not try this and then lowering the black level, as it seemed to mess up the picture area.

The present black level is 0 based on video essentials, all enhancements turned off, contrast at about 27 in pure mode and powersave on 2 (buzzes when turned off and did not seem to make a difference anyway.)

The build date is June 2008 and I figure about 7000 hours total use. There are no signs of burn in or other anomolies. Otherwise the picture is perfect.....

Thanks for any insights...

Cheers,
P.E.H.
post #10334 of 10769
Hi D-Nice - I have a 151 that is about 2 yrs old. I've done no calibration whatsoever. Can you kindly recommend what settings I should configure? Thanks in advance.

Steve
post #10335 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by phannon View Post

D-Nice:

Thanks for the replies guys. Rather bizarrely the red tint is more noticable in the black bar region rather than in the picture area of letterbox movies! I sort of noticed the problem maybe a month ago but thought it was maybe an optical illusion....once you think you see it... It became rather noticeable over the last few weeks on the dark scenes in the movies listed in my post, with the bars appearing crimson (noticeaable against the black of the picture, not bright) and standing out during the really dark scenes. If I concentrate on the picture area it can be more or less ignored, but the eye is drawn toward it.....

I altered the bias settings by turning down the red low, but even turning it down a lot did not seem to alter the red tint nearly as much as it altered the active picture. I settled on dropping the red from -1 to -4. Turning up the blue (from 0) removes the red tint but the active picture takes on a blue tint and the blacks become lighter (green +1). I did not try this and then lowering the black level, as it seemed to mess up the picture area.

The present black level is 0 based on video essentials, all enhancements turned off, contrast at about 27 in pure mode and powersave on 2 (buzzes when turned off and did not seem to make a difference anyway.)

The build date is June 2008 and I figure about 7000 hours total use. There are no signs of burn in or other anomolies. Otherwise the picture is perfect.....

Thanks for any insights...

Cheers,
P.E.H.

Hello mate,

My uk 9g 5090-H has started to get the 'Red Tinge' on black over the last few months and my story is almost identical to yours.

Initially it was worse in the bottom right hand section of the screen but it seems a little more uniform now.

I'll try playing with the settings to see if I can get rid of it, but this won't be too much help to me as my set has been ISF'd and the ISF modes are locked.

I'm not sure where I go from here, I guess I'm going to have to try and convince Pioneer that I actually have an issue....

Macca
post #10336 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigMacca View Post

Hello mate,

My uk 9g 5090-H has started to get the 'Red Tinge' on black over the last few months and my story is almost identical to yours.

Initially it was worse in the bottom right hand section of the screen but it seems a little more uniform now.

I'll try playing with the settings to see if I can get rid of it, but this won't be too much help to me as my set has been ISF'd and the ISF modes are locked.

I'm not sure where I go from here, I guess I'm going to have to try and convince Pioneer that I actually have an issue....

Macca

My June 2008 build 6020 has the same issue with only about 2500 hours on it. The best solution I could find is don't watch it in the dark..any ambient room light at all pretty much masks the issue.
post #10337 of 10769
Wow the red tint issue is becoming pretty common now that a lot of Kuros have been used for a good while, I posted about having this issue a long time ago, but I do use my Kuro like a madman since 2008 lol. I think this is the first time I heard about this issue from a 9G Elite Kuro owner, I had the impression that the screen coating of those was better and they weren't vulnerable to the red tint problem. So far it seems like all early 2008 9G builds could have this issue.

My friend and I have bought our 5020FD Kuros together in 2008 and he has the problem as well, so I highly doubt the odds of our 2 panels being specifically defected, seems like a general issue (He uses his TV a lot too). I've done the elite board swap mod to my Kuro so I have access to the manual color temperature controls, playing with the red settings barely makes any difference to the red tint on black, it does a tiny bit but that's when lowering it too much and the whole image becomes obviously screwed which is totally not worth it to me.

I try to avoid watching letterbox movies because I'll be looking for those red tints around the screen lol, with full screen movies it's only visible during very dark scenes. I was thinking about getting a video processor that makes me able to manipulate the aspect ratio of movies (like the DVDO EDGE), but I have no idea how letter box movies will look when changing their aspect ratios even by small margins.

Of course if someone was able to find a solution to this problem, many people will owe you their souls lol :P.
post #10338 of 10769
We have a 2007 6010 with about 5,500 hours that shows no sign of red tint. Our display was just recalibrated (5,200 hours) by UMR and he found no such problem.
post #10339 of 10769
No red tint or gray bars on my 151 (knock on wood). Just a lush perfect uniform screen.

What do you guys think of speed racer on this thing? I thought i had bough an 10g.

What would pioneer be up to now if they were still making TV's, 12g?
post #10340 of 10769
Now that I looked for it, I see an ever so slight red tint to my 5020 blacks. Watching my first 2.40:1 movie in a while made it quite evident.

Purchased this in March 2009 and it's had fairly heavy use.
post #10341 of 10769
Had this set for over a year, and it occured to me that when the screen is completely dark it always looks like a glowing dark grey in a completely dark room! Black screens between scenes in movies always look grey when viewing in complete darkness.

Didn't reviewers say that you shouldn't be able to tell that the TV is on in a dark room?! Yet the only time the black is truly black is when there is a bright object on the screen as well.

I set my brightness to as low as it can go, so that's clearly not the issue.

Is this normal? Thanks.
post #10342 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by WebEffect View Post
Didn't reviewers say that you shouldn't be able to tell that the TV is on in a dark room?!
Any reviewer who said that was nuts.
post #10343 of 10769
+1

The behavior you describe is perfectly normal.
post #10344 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by WebEffect View Post

...I set my brightness to as low as it can go, so that's clearly not the issue....

You need to purchase a calibration disc, and set the picture controls properly. They aren't expensive, and they will aid you to get what is a fine picture. As for the grayness of your screen, that's normal in a dark room.
post #10345 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by metallicaband View Post

Wow the red tint issue is becoming pretty common now that a lot of Kuros.

All three of my KUROs (two 500M's and a 111) have a slightly red tint during black scenes. It's never really bothered me, because it's pretty faint, but yeah it's obvious to a trained eye. It's less obvious on the 500M's but still visible. If you don't like whites that are tinted red, then I recommend against using the calibration settings from the big name calibrators.
post #10346 of 10769
Fixed it for ya -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Acid Snow View Post

If you don't like an accurate grayscale set as closely as possible to the D6500 standard, then I recommend against using the calibration settings from the big name calibrators.
post #10347 of 10769
hi - i was checking on my settings and realized i must have reset them a while back - so i went to put in the calibrated settings that were posted here from D-Nice -

and strange this is i cant seem to get into the color management settings ?

i followed the settings and when i go to pro adjust - i have the color management - but when i click it - nothing happens ?

according to the settings - theres an adjustment to be made in there - but i cant figure out how to get there --

i must be missing something -

can anyone help ?

thanks -
post #10348 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by expresso712 View Post

i followed the settings and when i go to pro adjust - i have the color management - but when i click it - nothing happens ?

I can't think of a scenario where the 500M would shut you out like that. It's not greyed out right
post #10349 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acid Snow View Post

I can't think of a scenario where the 500M would shut you out like that. It's not greyed out right


no its not grayed out - but its working now - very strange - i cant understand why it didnt just a few mins ago

i started to play a movie and went back in and when i clicked it - it worked -
i already had the correct adjustment - but dont understand what happened

i feel better now -

i got worried for a sec. - i must have reset it a while back just to see how it looked and forgot i did it -

so i went back in to check and realized the calibrated settings werent there -
i put them back and looks better -- i noticed it - watching a reg. dvd movie now - should be better with blu ray -

thanks for your response -
post #10350 of 10769
Quote:
Originally Posted by expresso712 View Post

no its not grayed out - but its working now - very strange - i cant understand why it didnt just a few mins ago

i started to play a movie and went back in and when i clicked it - it worked -
i already had the correct adjustment - but dont understand what happened

i feel better now -

i got worried for a sec. - i must have reset it a while back just to see how it looked and forgot i did it -

so i went back in to check and realized the calibrated settings werent there -
i put them back and looks better -- i noticed it - watching a reg. dvd movie now - should be better with blu ray -

thanks for your response -

LOL! The same thing happened to me tonight on my 101FD. I was watching cable TV at the time but decided to switch to my BD player on another input to adjust the settings for that input. When nothing happened with color management, I realized that the Kuro has to have a source from the input to change color management settings. So, once I turned the player on, all was good.

I'm guessing that your DVD player wasn't on when you made your first attempt to change the settings???

MikeT
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