*Official* Denon AVR 2309CI/889 Thread - Page 56

Hello guys, I picked up a 889 this past weekend from a CC that was closing down. 30% off was too hard to pass up. I have been holding out to get a new AVR to replace my RCA that crapped out.
Now I have a few questions.
1. I have hooked up what speakers I can just to do some tinkering with the settings. I found that the only sub option is Pre-out with Powered Sub. My past box RCA system didn't have a powered sub, it connected to positive/negative terminals on the receiver. I'm guessing there is no other way to connect an unpowered sub? Do I need to get another sub?

2. I would like to run all components through the Denon via HDMI, but then will have to go HDMI-DVI (my tv doesn't have HDMI) and run audio from Denon via RCA or optical. Can this be done?

3. If I connect everything via HDMI to the Denon, with it off will I still get audio/video to the tv? Reson I ask is because i haven't had a chance to get HDMI cables yet and don't want to get them unless they work right.

Thanks for the help in advance.

1. yes, time for a new sub!! you CAN hook up a passive sub using speaker wire but Audyssey will not function properly; modern receivers are designed for a mono RCA connection to a powered sub.

2. HDMI/DVI can be dicey, it CAN work theoretically but many people experience "handshake" problems and dropouts. And you will not be able to output audio to the TV in the way you describe. HDMI audio inputs can ONLY be passed out through the HDMI monitor out. These receivers will not "downconvert" HDMI audio to any other type of input.

3. probably not, I doubt the HDMI-passthrough feature works with an HDMI/DVI connector, but you are free to try.

If you are really set on being to run all the audio to your TV you will have to make some serious hook-up compromises. How many of your devices do you REALLY need to have TV audio from, as opposed to letting your fancy new AVR handle the audio?

Personally I'd just use component cables and optic/coax for the sound. Since your TV doesn't have HDMI there is no reason to go buy the cables. Wait until you get a TV w/ HDMI and make the changes then. That's just me.

I bought a 2309 on Valentine's Day for 68% of MSRP. I set it up Sat night and am in love. I can't believe how much better it sounds than the Onkyo I had previously. Of course, I put that one in the basement to replace a 15 yr old JVC so in a sense, that was an upgrade too.

I didn't think it was all that difficult to hook up, but I made a sketch as to what device was going where so it wasn't difficult to make any of the changes that needed to be made in the setup. I've set up Denons previously and I'm sure that helped.

I have a Harmony remote so I don't use the Denon remote which is another reason I'm not frustrated! I have Klipsch Quintet bookshelf speakers and a Klipsch 10" (12" possibly) sub. I wish I had the budget and space to upgrade to 7.1 and nicer speakers, but given what I'm working with I could not be happier.

That is what I really didn't want to hear.;( Guess I'll have to start saving up.



I have read this may be a problem with HDMI/DVI, but I was not clear on this exact question. I am planning to upgrade my TV to one with HDMI inputs (actually waiting on the price of the Samy series 8 to come down a bit). Does it pass through with HDMI on both sides of the receiver?
What about component on both sides?

For you lurkors out there, by becoming a FREE member of AVS Forum, you will be able to login and then will have access to the Search This Thread button which will show up next to the Thread Tools button (located at upper right of the page). This will allow you to search the particular thread you're in for key words (eg. HDMI Control) to read just those posts with those key words.

Randomly Dropped HDMI Signals connected to some HD TVs

I'm thinking about buying the Denon 1909 (or 2309). My concern about the Denons is that I've read some reports of randomly dropping HDMI video signals with some HD TVs. Is this pretty wide spread, or is this limited to a very few brands and models of HD TVs?

(I don't currently own a flat panel HD TV and will probably not purchase one for several months down the road - but I don't want to be unpleasantly surprised.)

Thanks!

Hey, tuba, welcome. AFAIK the "HDMI handshake" issues are known to most any and all brands/models of AVR's and monitors. There's nothing "Denon" about it. There are several fixes and workarounds used successfully and posted on these Denon threads because we have such an active on-line community of owners and Denon is, frankly, more of an "enthusiast/audiophile" brand. Try the 1909 thread for info (see jd's post above on searches) as it is a very active thread with lots of newbies. I suggest this trick:
search->advanced search, enter "HDMI handshake" in keyword and "batpig" in search by username, to get some authoritative answers pronto.
Edit: Thanks, jd, great suggestion above!
Edit: bp-no wonder I actually typed a response in my sad hunt & peck and got it posted before you-you answered on the other thread!!

Hey guys, Audio isn't my forte as of yet. I have some questions about setting up my sub. I'm also perusing the Audessey setup guide, but all the settings and possiblities are a bit overwhelming. I've had my Sub disconnected, because I live in a Condo and didn't want to anger my neighbours. But lately I've been a bit disappointed that the sound from my Denon and speakers doesn't feel complete, like they're something missing... so, I want to hook up my sub and tweak my setup.

So, here's my current HT setup. This is a starter Home Theater that I put together piece-meal.

Denon AVR 889
Fronts: Paradigm Mini Monitor V.4
Center: CC-370 v.2
Surround (5.1): ADP 370 v.2
Sub: PW-2100


Here are my questions, if you would be so kind.

1. Am I using the correct type of connector for my sub, or should I best be using the high or low-pass inputs, somehow? (pictures attached)

2. If these are the recommended settings when running Audyssey setup, then how do they apply to my sub?

Volume - 12 - 12 o'clock as in middle?
Low-Pass - Max - I don't have a low/pass
On/Auto - none
Phase - 0 - done

I have a sub-woofer cut-off frequency adjustment knob, which I'm assuming is the low-pass. (Confirmed through searching that it is) It ranges from 50Hz to 150Hz. Which is "Max"? Would "Max" be considered 50Hz or 150Hz?

3. The sub is currently suspended on a shelf, in a corner of the room.. but I think this might not be optimal, even though it would probably help to prevent reverberation to other condos. Should I just put it in a more appropriate spot, or will this not have a *huge* impact?

4. Are there any CDs that are generally used to calibrate systems that I should be using? Or just pick one of my favourites and calibrate it to that?


Thanks in advance for any help. There's so many variables, that I'm a bit confused, but trying to get through it!

yup, looks fine. the "LFE IN" is the correct connection for your receiver.


honestly, you can't get much clearer than a clock!! have you only ever seen a digital?



as you surmised, the "cut off" dial is your crossover/low-pass setting. turn it up all the way (to 150).


if there is no auto switch just leave the sub on


correct.


sub position has a huge impact on the sound, you are just going to have to experiment. if you have to raise the sub off the floor to avoid pissing off the neighbors, look into the auralex "subdude", it's a riser that acoustically isolates your sub from the floor.


buddy -- you just bought a fancy new AVR whose main selling point is the most sophisticated auto-calibration program on the market!! it calibrates itself! follow the Audyssey guide and then sit back and enjoy

ok just bought the 2309 last weekend and have the following connections

ps3-hdmi for audio and sound plugged into hdmi 1
xbox360(non elite)-plugged in useing component cables to tv input and audio toslink
then i have it all output to mitch.hd3000u over hdmi.

ps3 audio and video is fine no problems but 360 i only get sound unless i flip the lil hd switch on the 360's connector to standerd reseloution then i get an upscaled picture but dosent look so hot.what could i have set wrong that it wont just send a nonupscaled pic to projector iv obviously got all the inputs assigned right to output a pic cause it works when i flip that lil switch.any help greeeatly appreciated.id really like to get this setup so i can move on to setting up my logitech harmony1100 but want to get this figured out first.

xbox 360 is addressed in the video section of my FAQ, you have to set the resolution for HD to lower than 1080p.
http://batpigworld.com/fadq.html#section_03

I am planning to buy a US version of Denon AVR ( Denon AVR-1909 or AVR-2309CI). I want confirm if this receiver works well with PAL signals? Are these receivers capable of converting a PAL input to HDMI output as part of video conversion?

I saw this sentence in the manuals of Denon receivers. Does this mean that the receiver can convert a PAL to HDMI out?.

"The main zone video conversion function is compatible with the following format : NTSC ,PAL, SECAM, PAL-N, PAL-M, and PAL-60 "

Thanks
Ram

that quote sounds like pretty clear "yes" to me. If you need confirmation, you're probably best off just calling Denon directly and asking them.

ok! Will do. Thanks Batpig. Will definitely get the Subdude/Gramma as well. : )

Hello,

I just received a AVR 2309 receiver, and I have my first question I have tried to find information on this releatively simple question but have not seen the answer. If I just have regular basic cable, is there a input connection on the receiver or do I have to go directly into the TV? If there is a way to plug into the receiver, are there any benefits?

doh. So, I went out and bought a Subdude (HD is all they had). So now the sub is set up properly... but when I run the Audyssey setup, it always says that my sub is about 12 feet away (when it's more like 5), and sets the channel to -12dB. I've tried adjusting it a number of time from noon to 2, 3, 4 o'clock, and now I've tried 11 o'clock. But it always comes up -12dB. I'm going to keep experimenting, but am I doing something wrong? The low-pass is at 150Hz. I've also tried with and without the subdude, and have tried 2 o'clock. still -12db. I'm going to try max vol and min vol to see if that makes any difference. Finally got a different result. I lowered the sub to almost min, and got -9dB. I'm going to keep calibrating until I get +/- 3dB.

Any idea why this would be? I have a very open room... could that be it?

Also, my speakers are listed as large.. even though they're Paradigm Mini Monitors as fronts and ADPs as surrounds... (and I don't mean that I do not think they're physically large). Ofcourse, if I have to turn my sub way down to almost min volume, it's going to let my speakers handle the low frequencies. How do I configure my system so that it doesn't do this? I'd rather have the auto-calibration work (as Batpig said), rather than having to go in manually after and make adjustments that the auto-cal should have done for me.. (because I want it to work optimally without my somewhat incompetent input)

You can use either Component or HDMI from your Cable (Set top box) to your receiver. It will up-convert the video for you.

Your sub was simply too loud for those little satellites in that big room, -12 means The AVR cannot "trim" it down internally enough. -9 is fine, do not fret trying to obtain +/-3. The sub will still be handling the bass regardless. Your high sub distance measurement likely indicates you have some unwanted processing going on in the sub. Check for a phase control (it should be 0) and use the LFE/unfiltered input if you have one. Recheck that you have the low pass filter on the sub as high as possible. As for manual settings, follow the guidelines for proper bass management! Auto will not do it all. Set your fronts to small with a xover of 80, sub internal setting to 120 and see how it sounds.

Hello, welcome. You have a complex, sophisticated piece of new equipment and we'll be glad to help you get the most out of it. There are pros and cons to various ways to hook stuff up, depending on your equipment and what you want to do with it. First you have to start with the basics. Read batpig's guide http://batpigworld.com/
and some introductory stuff like this:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=958436 -pay close attention to the part about connection types, you will need a basic vocabulary to communicate with us effectively. You can also google something like "home theater basics".
Then post any questions here, first listing the stuff you want to hook up with your equipment info (like what exact connections are available on the back of your cable box, DVD player and TV). If it's important to you to be able to watch tv with just the TV sound on sometimes, without the Denon on, mention that too.

Thank you very much for the information. I will read the links listed. I currently have a Panasonic 42" 1080p plasma and a Panasonic Blu-Ray dvd. Currently the dvd is connected to the plasma using an HDMI cable. The only other likely connection will be the receiver. So I plan to route everything through the receiver and then the receiver into the plasma. My cable comes right out the wall, no set top box. I am currently awaiting the speakers and sub I order. I will let you know how it goes.

Thanks again.

Ahhh..I got ya now. Well, change of plans. The 75 Ohm coax cable out of the wall does not connect to the AVR. Normally that coax cable goes to a STB or DVR, and then you would chose from a few different connections (HDMI to AVR is easy & convenient, try it first but sometimes has handshake issues) to the TV and/or the AVR. So for now that cable coax would have to stay connected directly to your tv. Grab the sound from from your tv's optical SPDIF out and run that into the Denon. DVD to Denon via HDMI then HDMI to TV is fine.
DUDE, get a HDDVR for your HT! Then you will get much better PQ & SQ.

As soundofmind indicated, when you get a (-) channel setting from AUTO SETUP it means the speaker is "too loud" and a (+) channel setting means it is "too quiet", so you would need to dial down the sub in the other direction, closer to the 9 o'clock position.


Remember, that only analog (eg component) inputs are upconverted and upscaled. HDMI is simply "passed through" with no video processing by the Denon. Also, with a 1080p TV the TV is already doing the upscaling so there's no reason to have the Denon do it as well.


I strongly agree with soundofmind. Feeding a SD signal to an HDTV is a huge waste of quality HDTV viewing. Not too mention you cannot get DD 5.1 without an HD STB or DVR. I've never understood why someone would spend so much on a new HDTV and then not provide it with the quality HD signal it was designed to receive.

Something is clearly wrong with the way the AUTO SETUP is being done, either mic placement, or perhaps with Audyssey itself. Your Paradigm Mini Monitors only go down to 70hz so there's no reason that the Denon would have set them to LARGE if it was receiving the correct information from the Audyssey software. When they are set to SMALL by the Denon after AUTO Setup, you'll know you're on the right track.

I have Paradigm Atoms and my 889 Audissey set the crossover at 40Hz!
Sounds great though!

Just to be pedantic, you actually CAN get an HD signal using the ota tuner in current HDTV's. And you can still get DD 5.1 on whatever stations you tune using the OPTICAL OUT from the Panny.

Generally though, you don't get nearly as many HD channels as you would with an external HD DVR of course.

When satellite offers 100+ HD stations, clearly I am not referring to the 6-8 local stations one can pick up with an OTA. And it's only those HD stations that offer DD 5.1 as well.

Greetings - was at CC last nite and they had the 889 for $449 (new in sealed box).

I love my music but at te same time dont want to scrimp on the video portion either. Looked hard at the Onkyo 706/806 but was scared away from things I read online concerning video switching. Currently have an older Onkyo (not too old but pre-HDMI) and love the sound but would even love better if possible.

While cost is an issue, it isn't the determining factor here. Sure I like a good steal as much as the next guy but its more important to me that everything works correctly (HD, 7.1, et al) and I dont have any "issues" later on.

I'm mostly starting over again except for the speakers which I stuffed all up into the ceiling during last fall's house renovations. they are Boston Accustics
VRi595's for front, center, left; and Niles HD8's for SL, SR, SBL, SBR with a junky onkyo powered sub that will be replaced (the 595's have almost enough punch to not need a sub)

Most other components will be new purchases to follow so backward compat. isn't really an issue.

I guess Im just looking for verification that I wont be disappointed with the 889 since it won't be returnable.

Lets say my budget is $1000 or under - is this still a unit you would be considering ? If not what else ?

An 889 for $449, new in box with mfgr's warranty is a STEAL. Go get it now... in fact there's a good chance it's already gone.

If you hate it, you can easily resell it for more than you paid!

How does the 889 compare to the Onkyo 805/806? If you buy from CC, how long is the warranty on Denons? Last weekend my CC had some Dennon 889's and Onkyo 806's.
Thanks, Mike

ok tried changeing resolution on xbox360 it worked.But i went and changed inputs and plugged them into the dvd component inputs so id have my ps3 and 360 both on dvd input (ps3-hdmi & 360-component) now i lost video for my 360 again no matter what i do cant get it back even tried plugging back into the input i had it working on and no picture again.Hooked it straight up to projector worked fine and still set to same resolution it was working on
but have lost picture again and still have sound