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Official Pioneer Elite BDP-05FD & BDP-51FD Owners Thread / Vs 1.32 DTS-HD MA - Page 502

post #15031 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beemer533 View Post

Ahh, missed that!

Thanks for all the help guys. I think I will go will the 51, as I will only rarely use the component outputs. Now I only need to decide if I should get an an Oppo for all my SD-DVDs... it never ends, does it!

I haven't even turned my Oppo on since about FW1.17. In fact, now it's downstairs hooked to my old Toshiba CRT.
post #15032 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saturn94 View Post

$1150 for an 05 and waiting since January?

Did you mean to say 09?


I thought the same thing, but I guess he probably means $1150 CAD.
post #15033 of 30448
I just ordered the BDP-51FD as well. From everything I have seen the only difference between this model and the 05 is the lack of the ELITE name on the player and slightly lesser grade video DACS. Is this correct or am I missing something here?

Also when will Pioneer release the "promised" DTS Master Audio update for there players? Will they fix this issue? I'm scratching my head as to why they would release a blu-ray player thats capable of True Dolby decoding but only core DTS audio? I ultimately went with the 51 over a panny because I already have a VSX-56TXi and yes the price was right. Now I'm waiting for Pioneer to deliver the goods on this fix. Anybody else? Maybe we could start a damn union.
post #15034 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beemer533 View Post

Ahh, missed that!

Thanks for all the help guys. I think I will go will the 51, as I will only rarely use the component outputs. Now I only need to decide if I should get an an Oppo for all my SD-DVDs... it never ends, does it!

From the feedback I've read, the 51/05's upconversion performance (since v1.17) is extremely close to, if not on par, with the Oppo 983H. Unless you cannot stand the layer change on the 51/05, then the Oppo isn't worth it IMO.
post #15035 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saturn94 View Post

From the feedback I've read, the 51/05's upconversion performance (since v1.17) is extremely close to, if not on par, with the Oppo 983H. Unless you cannot stand the layer change on the 51/05, then the Oppo isn't worth it IMO.


So it appears that v1.17 has improved SD-DVD upconversion? What is the layer change you are refering to?
post #15036 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Headspace View Post

I just ordered the BDP-51FD as well. From everything I have seen the only difference between this model and the 05 is the lack of the ELITE name on the player and slightly lesser grade video DACS. Is this correct or am I missing something here?

Also when will Pioneer release the "promised" DTS Master Audio update for there players? Will they fix this issue? I'm scratching my head as to why they would release a blu-ray player thats capable of True Dolby decoding but only core DTS audio? I ultimately went with the 51 over a panny because I already have a VSX-56TXi and yes the price was right. Now I'm waiting for Pioneer to deliver the goods on this fix. Anybody else? Maybe we could start a damn union.

In terms of performance, that's about the only difference.

According to post#7, DTS-MA is still promised but now looks like it won't come until April. I remember when it was going to be Oct 08, then Dec 08, then Jan 09, then Feb 09, then.....................well, you get the picture.

Personally, if I had to choose, I would like to see the DVD audio repeat bug fixed first.

Hopefully when we do get DTS-MA, it won't have any bugs that we will have to wait for another firmware version to fix.
post #15037 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saturn94 View Post

$1150 for an 05 and waiting since January?

Did you mean to say 09?

Mate, the 09's are $4599.00 over here in OZ!
The 05's have a list price of $1439 and retailers are reluctant to do deals as supply is limited. I only got this price because I have bought a LOT of gear over the years from this retailer.
You guys don't know how good you've got it over there, economic climate notwithstanding!

Click on the link below (Pioneer Australia) to see what I mean...
http://www.pioneer.com.au/Products/H...20Players.aspx
post #15038 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beemer533 View Post

So it appears that v1.17 has improved SD-DVD upconversion? What is the layer change you are refering to?

The layer change on dual layer DVDs can be quite noticable on the 51/05, up to 2 or 3 seconds or so depending on the title (see post#7). The Oppo is much quicker in this regard (only a fraction of a second according to tests I've read).

On BDs, however, I've never noticed a layer change with the 51/05. It puzzles me how they can do this with BD but not DVD.
post #15039 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saturn94 View Post

In terms of performance, that's about the only difference.

According to post#7, DTS-MA is still promised but now looks like it won't come until April. I remember when it was going to be Oct 08, then Dec 08, then Jan 09, then Feb 09, then.....................well, you get the picture.

Personally, if I had to choose, I would like to see the DVD audio repeat bug fixed first.

Hopefully when we do get DTS-MA, it won't have any bugs that we will have to wait for another firmware version to fix.

I will be using the component outputs on the 51 once it arrives going through my 56TXi to my monitor. Hopefully the DACS aren't that bad compared to the 05. But I tell you I also saved quite a bit of dough going with the 51 too.

Well on the positive side at least Pio is releasing updates...
post #15040 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kreyfish View Post

Mate, the 09's are $4599.00 over here in OZ!
The 05's have a list price of $1439 and retailers are reluctant to do deals as supply is limited. I only got this price because I have bought a LOT of gear over the years from this retailer.
You guys don't know how good you've got it over there, economic climate notwithstanding!

Click on the link below (Pioneer Australia) to see what I mean...
http://www.pioneer.com.au/Products/H...20Players.aspx

OUCH! I guess I can't complain about what I paid for my 51 back in Aug.
post #15041 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Headspace View Post

I will be using the component outputs on the 51 once it arrives going through my 56TXi to my monitor. Hopefully the DACS aren't that bad compared to the 05. But I tell you I also saved quite a bit of dough going with the 51 too.

Well on the positive side at least Pio is releasing updates...

I don't think you will be disappointed.

When I bought my 51 last August, my TV at the time did not have HDMI inputs, so I used the component outputs on the 51 with excellent results.
post #15042 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruined View Post

A few reasons:
1. I heard the models are may not be due imminently, likely May which can be long for some .

2. Secondly, the only player in the new models which matches the 51FD feature for feature is the $599 Elite model.

3. Thirdly, the new models use the same SoC chipset as the old models. Meaning the only real advances you'd likely see are possibly faster speeds or better error detection if they use a different drive.

4. Fourth, we know that the 51FD is amazing and its $300. We don't know how good/bad the new models will be in things like CD output quality and the like. The 51FD will sell out and then you won't have a choice.



This is a very real possibility, however in recent firmware versions starting with v1.21, the 51FD has improved in error correction. So that is worth taking into account.



Wolfson seems to be the DAC of choice these days.



Most likely they are cost reduction models. They are smaller hence cheaper to make. Some new features like multich PQLS in the elite version, though that seems to be the extent of it.



They likely made a lot less of the Elite line. On the other hand, the 51FD sold well so they probably continued to make a ton of them. Now that the new models are here, they need to clear that stock.

Thanks for taking the time to answer my questions.

So you don't think that there will be any changes in the new models significant enough that one would be sorry if they bought a 51 now?

Another post after mine talked about getting a different play for SD-DVD's...is there an issue I missed with the upconversion on the 51?

Thought I'd seen a post that they got if from 6th ave for $266, when I looked on there site the price is $284?

Thanks again
Brian
post #15043 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kreyfish View Post

Mate, the 09's are $4599.00 over here in OZ!
The 05's have a list price of $1439 and retailers are reluctant to do deals as supply is limited. I only got this price because I have bought a LOT of gear over the years from this retailer.
You guys don't know how good you've got it over there, economic climate notwithstanding!

Click on the link below (Pioneer Australia) to see what I mean...
http://www.pioneer.com.au/Products/H...20Players.aspx

I had a similar problem when I got my 71. I was part of a DTVForum Australia group buy and all the 51 owners got their units way before I got mine! Very few retailers bothered to stock the 71 in Australia - I'm yet to see one on a shelf anywhere (but I'm very happy with mine).

And yep, I thought that the Denon3800 was priced well out of my budget in Australia (approx $3,600) - and then I saw the MSRP for the LX-91!
post #15044 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by dave_con View Post

I had a similar problem when I got my 71. I was part of a DTVForum Australia group buy and all the 51 owners got their units way before I got mine! Very few retailers bothered to stock the 71 in Australia - I'm yet to see one on a shelf anywhere (but I'm very happy with mine).

And yep, I thought that the Denon3800 was priced well out of my budget in Australia (approx $3,600) - and then I saw the MSRP for the LX-91!

I haven't seen a 71 on the shelf either. Most (all?) retailers won't even order one unless you pay up front. The bloke I am buying the 71 from still has a couple of 70a (95 in USA) machines that he can't sell.

My machine was supposed to arrive at Pioneer HQ on Feb 10th and in the store on the 15th. My guy phoned Pioneer on the 16th and was told another week or so, yet I am still waiting...

I am just wondering how much difference there is in component video quality between the 05 and the 51 for my 720p projector as if the difference is not great then I will cancel my 05 and just grab a 51 off the shelf and pocket $500.
post #15045 of 30448
New to this forum seeking advice.
Just picked up a bdp-05 and did initial setup with my old sony 34" 1080i crt via component video and analogs out to my cj multichannel pre/amp.
Then I upgraded firmware from 1.08 to 1.25
The problems are two fold;
First trying to use the mutichannel analog outs but seems to default to downmixes to two channel
Secondly when I switched the 05 to an elite151 1080p plasma via hdmi and analogues out I cannot get any video signal thru the hdmi connection, and only 1080i with components, like the initial analogue setup, which is greyed out and unusable. not sure if problem is with plasma or 05
any ideas
thanks
bob
post #15046 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saturn94 View Post

I don't think you will be disappointed.

When I bought my 51 last August, my TV at the time did not have HDMI inputs, so I used the component outputs on the 51 with excellent results.

Well I appreciate that "peace of mind vaccination" Saturn.
post #15047 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by rad1co View Post

New to this forum seeking advice.
Just picked up a bdp-05 and did initial setup with my old sony 34" 1080i crt via component video and analogs out to my cj multichannel pre/amp.
Then I upgraded firmware from 1.08 to 1.25
The problems are two fold;
First trying to use the mutichannel analog outs but seems to default to downmixes to two channel
Secondly when I switched the 05 to an elite151 1080p plasma via hdmi and analogues out I cannot get any video signal thru the hdmi connection, and only 1080i with components, like the initial analogue setup, which is greyed out and unusable. not sure if problem is with plasma or 05
any ideas
thanks
bob

It sounds like the Output Priority for audio and video may not be set correctly.

For audio via the multichannel outputs, Output Priority must be set to Analog and multichannel outputs selected.

For video, it may be that like the 51, the player will not output video via HDMI and Component at the same time. If so, then when using Component the Output Priority must be set as such, and for HDMI, it must be set to HDMI.

The manual for the 51 does suggest that the video output can be changed on the remote via the "Video Select" button. So you might give that a try.

It also important to note that using the component outputs limits you to 480i/p for DVD and 1080i for Blu ray. 1080p is only available via HDMI.

If it's a problem with the firmware update, you may try unplugging the player for awhile or do a factory reset (see post #7 or link in my signature). This has solved issues for other users before.

Hope something in here helps.

PS - The Elite 151/05 combo is a killer combination!
post #15048 of 30448
Quote:


For video, it may be that like the 51, the player will not output video via HDMI and Component at the same time. If so, then when using Component the Output Priority must be set as such, and for HDMI, it must be set to HDMI

.

Thankyou Saturn94,
Think you hit on something, and its a catch22
In order for me to reset the output priority i have to switch to component input on the 151 to get to 05 setup options to change to hdmi. It switches to hdmi before i can get into setup mode... Maybe I need to remove hdmi cable and unplug for a while. Really want to see tru 1080p, will get directv hd tomorrow, should be cool 1080i, but the 05 should be better, anyway thanks
post #15049 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by rad1co View Post

.

Thankyou Saturn94,
Think you hit on something, and its a catch22
In order for me to reset the output priority i have to switch to component input on the 151 to get to 05 setup options to change to hdmi. It switches to hdmi before i can get into setup mode... Maybe I need to remove hdmi cable and unplug for a while. Really want to see tru 1080p, will get directv hd tomorrow, should be cool 1080i, but the 05 should be better, anyway thanks

Why run both component and HDMI to the 151?

That is where your problem lies.....
post #15050 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by adidino View Post

Got the Pio 51 already?

Yeah got it yesterday at best buy early afternoon,couldnt be happier with it,also i was blown away by the upconversion of standard dvds.....
post #15051 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kreyfish View Post

I haven't seen a 71 on the shelf either. Most (all?) retailers won't even order one unless you pay up front. The bloke I am buying the 71 from still has a couple of 70a (95 in USA) machines that he can't sell.

My machine was supposed to arrive at Pioneer HQ on Feb 10th and in the store on the 15th. My guy phoned Pioneer on the 16th and was told another week or so, yet I am still waiting...

I am just wondering how much difference there is in component video quality between the 05 and the 51 for my 720p projector as if the difference is not great then I will cancel my 05 and just grab a 51 off the shelf and pocket $500.

Can't say I've actually compared (as I don't have a 51 too!), but the DACS for video on the 71 are rated at, well, actually I can't find that info! I know they're supposed to be twice as good as the 51 though.
post #15052 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beemer533 View Post

Now I only need to decide if I should get an an Oppo for all my SD-DVDs... it never ends, does it!

Others have mentioned it already, but the 51 does an amazing job with SD discs. I sold my Oppo 981 when I bought the Pio.

The slower layer change is the only price you pay for using the 51.
post #15053 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saturn94 View Post

In terms of performance, that's about the only difference.

According to post#7, DTS-MA is still promised but now looks like it won't come until April. I remember when it was going to be Oct 08, then Dec 08, then Jan 09, then Feb 09, then.....................well, you get the picture.

Personally, if I had to choose, I would like to see the DVD audio repeat bug fixed first.

Hopefully when we do get DTS-MA, it won't have any bugs that we will have to wait for another firmware version to fix.

Been holding out on new pioneer or oppo...if the 51/05 don't get the upgrades soon, I think i will opt for the oppo. The state of Pioneer does worry me about future firmware updates vital for the BD Java. Fingers crossed Pioneer has it out soon!
post #15054 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by kemitchell View Post

Correct. But if your HK has a 6/8 channel direct setting you could send the analog straight through. My HK 745 will allow this but I use the analog inputs for SACD/DVD-A from my DVD47.

To be honest, the DACs in your HK may be as good as those in the 51. It would be worth it though to try it both ways to see which sounds better to you IMHO.

Thanks Kyle.
post #15055 of 30448
Hi fella's...Don't know if this has been brought up before or not... (this thread is too long to search every post) Anyways, I noticed that on Universal blu-ray flicks such as, "Serenity" and "King Kong" once you pause long enough for it to go to the silver/blue screensaver, it will not let you resume or hit play... If you hit, "Pop Up Menu" or "enter" the movie will resume...this kinda sucks, but, thought I would share it. What I've done is add the "enter" macro to my play button on my MX-3000 remote so as to make it acceptable to me.
post #15056 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by winston9332 View Post

Been holding out on new pioneer or oppo...if the 51/05 don't get the upgrades soon, I think i will opt for the oppo. The state of Pioneer does worry me about future firmware updates vital for the BD Java. Fingers crossed Pioneer has it out soon!

I'm not sure why you'd think you'd be in a better boat with the Oppo as it is in an even more immature state than the Pioneer.
post #15057 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by dogone View Post

Hi fella's...Don't know if this has been brought up before or not... (this thread is too long to search every post) Anyways, I noticed that on Universal blu-ray flicks such as, "Serenity" and "King Kong" once you pause long enough for it to go to the silver/blue screensaver, it will not let you resume or hit play...However I did find a work around...> If you hit, "Pop Up Menu" the movie will resume...this kinda sucks, but, thought I would share it. What I've done is add the pop up macro to my play button on my MX-3000 remote so as to make it acceptable to me.

Or just hit ENTER to clear the screensaver as designed. With a screensaver like that it is 100% up to the disc programmers to decide which buttons work and which don't.
post #15058 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruined View Post

Or just hit ENTER to clear the screensaver as designed. With a screensaver like that it is 100% up to the disc programmers to decide which buttons work and which don't.

I didn't know that...I did notice that some movies I can hit play from the screen saver mode...Hmmm, Thanks, however I do prefer to hit play when in screensaver mode...Guess I'm just programmed that way.
post #15059 of 30448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vader424242 View Post

Never mind the fact that the Pioneer is a whole lot prettier... (IMHO, of course) !

Totally agree! Pioneer is in tough waters and I worry about its impact on build quality and product support. Oppo is a tiny company that does largely one thing - make dvd and blu ray players. Product support will be critical to their success. Pioneer is a much larger, public company that is rapidly jettisoning what it can to survive. The DTS HD Master Audio is the proverbial canary in the coal mine on customer support for the Pioneer blu ray going forward. I could be wrong to judge it upon that, but they launched the product saying it would happen and feel it fair to use it as a measure to judge their committment to their customers. Gosh, I sound like damn Ralph Nader.
post #15060 of 30448
This may be a dumb questions but here goes...

What is the difference between the "core" DD and DTS tracks on a blu-ray vs the tracks on a standard DVD? I am not using the HD audio formats yet but the standard DD on blu-ray sounds quite a bit better than DD on a DVD.

Am I on drugs?

BTW... my 1.25a update went great and I have not had any issues with the player. (knock on wood)

-Eli
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