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Hauppauge HDPVR-1212 Owner's Thread - Page 112

post #3331 of 3814
Thanks for the replies. All I'm doing is storing it on the hard drive. The only time I could ever see myself putting it on a disc is if I were taking it to a friends house, so I've just set the bitrate fixed at 13.5

Particularly, I was wondering about the device settings though. I'm assuming the contrast, brightness, sharpness, etc would all affect the PQ. Are there any recommended settings for those, or should I just leave it on the defaults?
post #3332 of 3814
^Default. If you like futzing around with those things it should be in playback through your media player/display/image processor, that way you don't corrupt your recording for playback in an alternate scenario where your " +2 brightness", or whatever, will muck it up.

My understanding is "constant" is a waste of storage space and "variable" intelligently analyzes the signal which applies maximum bitrate only when needed. Constant has no visual advantage.

The only reason to use constant is if you have a particular playback device which can't deal with variable, and I think they are very rare in this day and age, it was more of a 90's thing.
Edited by m. zillch - 8/1/12 at 3:27pm
post #3333 of 3814
Gotcha, thanks
post #3334 of 3814
My 1212 "cannnot start"...

I had issues similar to ncinsguy last week- lights on, passthrough working, but TME wouldn't recognize or find the box. Win 7 device manager reports that the "USB device cannot start". After a round of e-mails with Hauppague Tech Support, I returned it to them (still under warranty). Waiting to hear about their diagnosis and fix...

I did not think of swapping the PS out, and in fact Tech Support did not suggest it either. Manual says use only the supplied wall wart yada yada...I did remove and reinstall TME (and IR blaster etc) software with no joy, which I presume would have refreshed the drivers.

So while waiting to get the unit back, here's an off-the-wall question: My various HD PVR-1212 files, mostly .ts, play great on the Boxee Box and Popcorn Hour, but not so well on a recently added Vizio TV (with VIA "smart" software, for both internet apps and "media" (local) files). It's somewhat better via the also-new Sony BD player, which also has "smart" features including local file playback, but still not "family friendly". Some files cause a "codec not supported" error, while some won't start at all. A few play fine.

Both the TV and BD player apparently rely on DLNA-type servers, while the Boxee Box and PCH do not, so my guess is it's a DLNA issue. FWIW my files live on an HP MediaSmart Server running Windows Home Server, which includes "Twonky Media" as its DLNA-compliant app for streaming. I gather Twonky is not the best DLNA app, so I'm considering adding Serviio (sp?) or another app to WHS, but am leery of changing the SW on the WHS server if it's not a WHS-specific addin.

I realize this question spans not only 1212 issues but also WHS, extenders, and DLNA, but I'm curious if any PVR-1212 users have had problems playing files via DLNA, and if so how you dealt with it? If I can use either the Vizio TV natively, or the Sony BD player, as a media extender, and not buy yet another stand-alone box, it would be wonderful.

Thanks for any advice,

Mike
post #3335 of 3814
Question: Does anyone have HDNET movies and tried to capture something from it?
post #3336 of 3814
^Yes, I do and have, although I think they have recently renamed that channel "AXSTV" in my Comcast line-up.
post #3337 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post

^Yes, I do and have, although I think they have recently renamed that channel "AXSTV" in my Comcast line-up.
No, HDNet was renamed to AxsTV. HDNet Movies is still the same.
http://insidetv.ew.com/2012/01/18/ryan-seacrest-hdnet/
post #3338 of 3814
Oh, then no, I dont get HDNET Movies, only AXS TV.
post #3339 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by Satori84 View Post

So while waiting to get the unit back, here's an off-the-wall question: My various HD PVR-1212 files, mostly .ts, play great on the Boxee Box and Popcorn Hour, but not so well on a recently added Vizio TV (with VIA "smart" software, for both internet apps and "media" (local) files). It's somewhat better via the also-new Sony BD player, which also has "smart" features including local file playback, but still not "family friendly". Some files cause a "codec not supported" error, while some won't start at all. A few play fine.

Mike
Have you checked the media properties on the files, particularly the frame rate? Unless something is different (and it shouldn't be), there is little reason why ALL programs captured from the same device with the same settings would not behave identically in the same playback device.

The Hauppauge 1212 has many many bugs, but there is one very insidious one that can really mess up your recordings. For no rhyme or reason that I have figured out, this device will just spontaneously decide to foul up the recorded frame rates. In US, frame rates are either 59.940 (progressive) or 29.970 (interlaced). I have found some captured files from the 1212 with frame rates of 60.000, 30.000 and 50.000. These are not just incorrect headers, either - I have actually checked the exact frame count in VRD to verify the files are flawed. Many devices and most PC software seem to handle these wrong frame rates OK, but NOT all.

Once the problem starts, EVERY captured file will have it until the 1212 is restarted! Now the good news, small as it may be, is that I have found restarting the 1212 at least once a day prevents this problem almost entirely. But the only way I have found to totally protect myself from this nasty little bug is to add the frame rate to the columns displayed in the detail view of File Explorer so I see if a new capture shows up wrong - that at least lets me know to restart the 1212 and re-capture the program.
Edited by V7Goose - 8/5/12 at 9:23am
post #3340 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalfreakNYC View Post

Question: Does anyone have HDNET movies and tried to capture something from it?
I regularly capture programs from HDNET MOVIES on FiOS with no problems at all. In fact, it is one of my preferred channels because their signal is ALWAYS clean with no audio drops that cause the 1212 to freeze up and dump about 10 seconds of the program when capturing from SPDIF input.
post #3341 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by V7Goose View Post

... In US, frame rates are either 59.940 (progressive) or 29.970 (interlaced). I have found some captured files from the 1212 with frame rates of 60.000, 30.000 and 50.000. These are not just incorrect headers, either - I have actually checked the exact frame count in VRD to verify the files are flawed. Many devices and most PC software seem to handle these wrong frame rates OK, but NOT all.
I'm wondering if re-encoding the file with VRD and resetting the frame rate can also solve the problem.
post #3342 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyrax View Post

I'm wondering if re-encoding the file with VRD and resetting the frame rate can also solve the problem.
No, VRD cannot change the frame rate. TME can - but the file sizes will go way up. I have done some testing with that and other products looking for a reasonable way to reset the frame rates to valid numbers. I burn a lot of DVDs and BDs using TME, and one of the things I really appreciate is the fast rendering without re-encoding. But when you try to use one of these bad files, TME recognizes the error and defaults to full recode. It seems to work OK, but I have never done much with it 'cause I do not want the larger files.

If you try to force VRD to recode the file, the only thing it can do is cut the frame rate in half by just throwing away every other frame if going from progressive to interlaced. It cannot actually "change" the frame rate to the correct value. If you try to go from interlaced to progressive, you end up with an invalid file with the original low frame rate. Although the VRD output options include a deinterlace function, I do not know why - it seems REALLY stupid to do any deinterlacing when the only thing it can do is create an invalid file.

BTW - the information about how VRD cannot properly change frame rates came directly from the VRD developers.
Edited by V7Goose - 8/5/12 at 12:20pm
post #3343 of 3814
@V7Goose-

Thanks for the 59.9/60.0 hint. I'll examine the PVR files (MediaInfo OK?) to see if there are any funny numbers in the field/frame rate.

Mike
post #3344 of 3814
How do you get frame rate to show up in the folder? I have details turned on and I chose frame rate as one of the columns but it's empty for all my captured files..
post #3345 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by V7Goose View Post

No, VRD cannot change the frame rate...
I use VRD mostly for edits and for (relatively) fast re-encoding tasks. When I care more about the encoding (or want to do trickier stuff), I use RipBot264. RipBot264 does allow you to change the framerate, although I've never needed to do that. It can be slow, but I've had some amazingly good results with it.

Edit:Sorry I screwed up the format of this message the first time I posted. This new format makes it harder to edit other people's quotes.
Edited by Hyrax - 8/6/12 at 7:07am
post #3346 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by Satori84 View Post

@V7Goose-
Thanks for the 59.9/60.0 hint. I'll examine the PVR files (MediaInfo OK?) to see if there are any funny numbers in the field/frame rate.
Mike
Yes, Mediainfo is fine - anything that either looks at the header or file properties should be OK, but the header info is preferable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nikknightt View Post

How do you get frame rate to show up in the folder? I have details turned on and I chose frame rate as one of the columns but it's empty for all my captured files..
Not sure what to tell you about that - if you can see the column header where it says "Frame Rate", then the information should be there. I use three different computers for the video work, and I have not had a problem showing the information on any of them. Try looking at the details tab under the file properties to make sure the frame rate is shown there.

I have found a couple of captured files that do not have any of the video information in the file properties, and thus will not show up in File Explorer, even though they were captured the same way as all the others. Mediainfo for them looks perfect. Those files will not even play in WMP, but they do play fine in VLC and other software I have tried. I have no idea what causes the file properties to not be correct, or why it is only on two out of several hundred files sitting on this PC at this time.
Edited by V7Goose - 8/5/12 at 8:58pm
post #3347 of 3814
I have a 1212 that will be delivered tomorrow, and I've been trying to do research ahead of time to figure out how I'm going to cable it. Unfortunately, there are times when your head was spinning already when you start the research, and the reading you do doesn't stop the rotation....

I have a Motorola DCH-3416 that has a few programs "trapped" on it that I want to record, and a Vizio 420 display. (Normally, the data moves via HDMI through a Denon AVR.) In looking at the backs of both units, the 3416 has component outputs and optical, or has the old style composite outputs as well. Component looks like my choice of choices. However, the Vizio takes inputs for component and can take R/L audio, but no optic input, only an optic output. My hunch is that I can just run the optical audio from the 3416 to the Hauppauge box, ignore the fact I can't "hear" the audio while I'm doing the recording, but just know it's there. I'm hoping that hunch is okay.

If it's not a good hunch, here is where my lack of knowledge really exposes itself: if I were to pull the audio from the composite outputs, is there 5.1 audio in the output from the 3416, or is it just stereo? (Yes, that could be a VERY stupid question, but I just don't know the answer of what is embedded in that signal.) Do units tend to output component video and the composite outputs of audio in sync, and does this all work? Will any of this effectively "confuse" the 1212 such that it won't be recording, or won't be recording audio correctly or in sync?

I know this is asking ahead of time, but if I really do have to record "blind" (or would that be "deaf"?), I could be hours trying to plug things in and out and playing with settings and never know why it isn't working, so I thought I would ask in advance, and hope it would be tolerated. All the reading I've done here makes this feel like it can be a very finnicky box, and while I rarely ever really want to transfer much using this route, I would like a minimum amount of grief while I'm doing so. Thanks.
post #3348 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnwjames5 View Post

I have a 1212 that will be delivered tomorrow, and I've been trying to do research ahead of time to figure out how I'm going to cable it. Unfortunately, there are times when your head was spinning already when you start the research, and the reading you do doesn't stop the rotation....
I have a Motorola DCH-3416 that has a few programs "trapped" on it that I want to record, and a Vizio 420 display. (Normally, the data moves via HDMI through a Denon AVR.) In looking at the backs of both units, the 3416 has component outputs and optical, or has the old style composite outputs as well. Component looks like my choice of choices. However, the Vizio takes inputs for component and can take R/L audio, but no optic input, only an optic output. My hunch is that I can just run the optical audio from the 3416 to the Hauppauge box, ignore the fact I can't "hear" the audio while I'm doing the recording, but just know it's there. I'm hoping that hunch is okay.
If it's not a good hunch, here is where my lack of knowledge really exposes itself: if I were to pull the audio from the composite outputs, is there 5.1 audio in the output from the 3416, or is it just stereo? (Yes, that could be a VERY stupid question, but I just don't know the answer of what is embedded in that signal.) Do units tend to output component video and the composite outputs of audio in sync, and does this all work? Will any of this effectively "confuse" the 1212 such that it won't be recording, or won't be recording audio correctly or in sync?
I know this is asking ahead of time, but if I really do have to record "blind" (or would that be "deaf"?), I could be hours trying to plug things in and out and playing with settings and never know why it isn't working, so I thought I would ask in advance, and hope it would be tolerated. All the reading I've done here makes this feel like it can be a very finnicky box, and while I rarely ever really want to transfer much using this route, I would like a minimum amount of grief while I'm doing so. Thanks.

I'm a little confused about what you described, Maybe somebody else has a better grasp than I do but here are a few tips that might help..
The 1212 needs an audio & video signal before the capture software will work. It looks like your tv gets audio from the 3416 via HDMI ~ so why wouldn't you hear anything if you use the optical out to the 1212?
Composite audio is 2.0 not 5.1.
You'll be able to listen to the audio thru the Hauppauge capture software on your PC. (we call it TME)
The only thing I would be concerned with is if your cable box won't output hdmi and component at the same time.
I hope this helps a little.
post #3349 of 3814
Optical and HDMI are the only sources that have 5.1 capability. Composite is only stereo. You could take the optical output from the Motorola and feed that to the 1212 while taking the analog stereo out of the Motorola and feed it to the TV.
post #3350 of 3814
I received my 1212 today, installed it, and after a bit of an embarrassing mistake got it all up and running. I downloaded the new drivers, installed them, and do have an immediate question: you can you tell what version firmware is on the 1212? I ask because I've been making some test recordings off stations the TME identifies as sending DD 5.1, but when I look at the files later, they all seem to be two channel stereo. I'm still playing with this, but it seems that one or more of the fixes in 3.0a address this issue, and I don't know how to tell if my installation of the recent driver did or did not update the 1212.
post #3351 of 3814
To record in 5.1 you need to us optical in, have the source send Dolby Digital 5.1, not use MP4 but instead .TS or .M2TS, and use the updated software.

I think you can check the drivers version by right clicking the devices in your device manager list and selecting the right options from there, IIRC.
post #3352 of 3814
I have been playing some with the output from the 1212, trying to decide on my own best practices to get what I want. I was playing with several settings, including the quality bitrate, to see just what the system could handle. I have an oldish laptop that I was using to do the recording, and I was concerned it might be a bottleneck, so I recorded some at 10.1 and some at 13.5, ran each to TS files, and then used Handbrake (most recent version) to convert them to .m4v containers so that they could be viewed through the ATV3. They look great on the ATV3, but I discovered something curious about the resulting file: the video would hang for eight to ten seconds at a time in iTunes, though the audio ran through just fine. I found this with both settings, got to wondering about the recordings themselves, but the raw files are fine, and VLC even plays the .m4v files locally without a problem, so it's not an actual problem with the video capture or any of the subsequent steps.

I don't care much about viewing these on a laptop in iTunes, but I do find this curious, and thought I would ask around. Is there some quality bitrate above which QuickTime is unhappy? Is there some fun little setting inside TME that caused this? I'm going to send the resulting files to a friend tomorrow to see if they exhibit the same behavior on a Mac, but in the meantime I was just interested as to what could be going on, and if anyone else has seen similar behavior.

UPDATE: I've since worked through and figured out that it seems to strictly be a shortcoming of Quicktime on Windows. I sent the file to a friend, who can play it just fine in iTunes / Quicktime on the Mac, and I can play it most anywhere else. It seems the old laptop I'm using for the capture can keep up just fine with a bitrate of 13.5.
Edited by johnwjames5 - 8/26/12 at 11:03am
post #3353 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnwjames5 View Post

I received my 1212 today, installed it, and after a bit of an embarrassing mistake got it all up and running. I downloaded the new drivers, installed them, and do have an immediate question: you can you tell what version firmware is on the 1212? I ask because I've been making some test recordings off stations the TME identifies as sending DD 5.1, but when I look at the files later, they all seem to be two channel stereo. I'm still playing with this, but it seems that one or more of the fixes in 3.0a address this issue, and I don't know how to tell if my installation of the recent driver did or did not update the 1212.

How do you 'look' at the files after capturing?
Sometimes when I check the captured file it's listed as 2.0 audio in tsmuxer but when I play it back it's 5.1.
I think that's due to the opening frames of my capture. It starts in 2.0 then turns into 5.1.
That's because I always start my captures with my dtv dvr on pause with the info/menu screen of the program i'm capturing..
post #3354 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikknightt View Post

How do you 'look' at the files after capturing?
Sometimes when I check the captured file it's listed as 2.0 audio in tsmuxer but when I play it back it's 5.1.
I think that's due to the opening frames of my capture. It starts in 2.0 then turns into 5.1.
That's because I always start my captures with my dtv dvr on pause with the info/menu screen of the program i'm capturing..

Yes that happens alot of times because of the intro. For example, if I start recording something on Cinemax, it's going to be 2.0 when the Cinemax information is on the screen. But as soon as the studio logo comes on, it goes right to 5.1. You just have to edit right at the beginning of that.
post #3355 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalfreakNYC View Post

Yes that happens alot of times because of the intro. For example, if I start recording something on Cinemax, it's going to be 2.0 when the Cinemax information is on the screen. But as soon as the studio logo comes on, it goes right to 5.1. You just have to edit right at the beginning of that.

Thanks but I don't have a problem it..
I was telling johnwjames about it..

I don't edit the 2.0 out, I leave it as is. My AVR shows me that it's playing 5.1 as soon as it gets to that point..
post #3356 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikknightt View Post

Thanks but I don't have a problem it..
I was telling johnwjames about it..
I don't edit the 2.0 out, I leave it as is. My AVR shows me that it's playing 5.1 as soon as it gets to that point..

If you try to burn it to a blu-ray, you're going to have a problem.
post #3357 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalfreakNYC View Post

If you try to burn it to a blu-ray, you're going to have a problem.

I have burned these files to BD. I haven't noticed a problem..
What kind of problem are you referring to?
post #3358 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikknightt View Post

I have burned these files to BD. I haven't noticed a problem..
What kind of problem are you referring to?

I agree, I haven't had any problems either and I burn all my recordings to BD. The audio plays just as it was recorded.
post #3359 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikknightt View Post

I have burned these files to BD. I haven't noticed a problem..
What kind of problem are you referring to?

It's authored as a 2.0 audio instead of the 5.1. I use Multiavchd as well.
post #3360 of 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalfreakNYC View Post

It's authored as a 2.0 audio instead of the 5.1. I use Multiavchd as well.

How does that effect playback?
I just tested a BD of mine that is done this way.
Popped the disc in my Samsung BD player, The AVR shows 2.0 audio at the beginning of the capture video and then shows 5.1 when the video gets to that part.
Sound is coming out of my rear speakers.

I guess I'm not understanding what the issue is..
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