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SHARP LED-LCD, Anticipation Thread! - Page 6

post #151 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stereodude View Post

Samsung has been doing this for some time.

I think that has never popped out, so in which models multipixel drive is
used, any info on this anywhere???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stereodude View Post

I've designed backlights with LED side lighting and lightguides and I don't see how you can do local area dimming with the LEDs on the side.

Simply you have not designed as sophisticated backlight as Sharp has.
Surely RGB its LEDs are on side and it is locally dimmed, how this is done I dunno.Question is if there are any specific artefacts of this design.
post #152 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by stephenC View Post

TNG - PGE has just announced a 6% price increase for electricity. Tell me again, what other areas can I reduce power consumption? All my lighting is either CFL or LED, I don't have A/C, my washer and dryer are new and Energy Star rated and low water consumption rated. I have PV solar on my roof generating enough clean power to offset my normal usage. My TV is the last item that is a big power draw. Please enlighten me.

Enlighten you? Sounds like you have it together and have spent allot on your projects.

While I would like to have the PV on the roof, I can't afford to do that. I do like the incandesent bulbs in certain apps (reading, CFL kills my eyes), CFL is just not quite there yet. For all that you have probably spent I can see your concern with why you would want to watch the power usage, but for me I am not there yet.
post #153 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by MUGEN View Post

Speaking of pricing, I find the 65" SHARP priced where it should be but the 52" should be in the $6-7,000 range.

There is emerging information that Sharp is using entirely new and much more complex technologies in the XS1. If that is true, and indeed results in absolutely no artefacts, the prices they ask would be kind of justified by the fact that e.g. Sony XBR8 is way simpler.
post #154 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by irkuck View Post

There is emerging information that Sharp is using entirely new and much more complex technologies in the XS1. If that is true, and indeed results in absolutely no artefacts, the prices they ask would be kind of justified by the fact that e.g. Sony XBR8 is way simpler.

New panel tech or electronics not connected to the LED backlight?
post #155 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by TNG View Post

New panel tech or electronics not connected to the LED backlight?

See above in this thread.
post #156 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by irkuck View Post

There is emerging information that Sharp is using entirely new and much more complex technologies in the XS1. If that is true, and indeed results in absolutely no artefacts, the prices they ask would be kind of justified by the fact that e.g. Sony XBR8 is way simpler.

Now that I know these SHARP's will be a limited number I can see the price being more than $6-7,000.

From the japan press release
Initial monthly production volume
-65 1,500
-52 1,000
-Suggested retail price is open
post #157 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by MUGEN View Post

Now that I know these SHARP's will be a limited number I can see the price being more than $6-7,000.

From the japan press release
Initial monthly production volume
-65 1,500
-52 1,000
-Suggested retail price is open

Any ideas about production quantities for the Samsung 55A950 or the Sony 55XBR8? These numbers from Sharp I think are on par with the numbers of units Sony did with their discontinued Qualia line.
post #158 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by JayC76 View Post

If that happens it would be great, but I highly doubt it. I've heard 11k msrp(52") directly from sharp. I'm sure if it is not price controlled, you may be able to get one close to 55XBR8 price a few months after release. The problem is they are not going to make alot of these, and people with money to burn will pay extra for the super thin design. Ohh, and the 65" will be 15k. Our store will probably have an XBR8 in all 50 showrooms, and the XS1 in maybe 5 showrooms to give you an idea of the limited production/distribution.

Are you willing to post the quantity per store for the new Sharp XS1 models? Based on MUGEN's post, I willing to bet you will get less than 10 units per store.
post #159 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by irkuck View Post

I think that has never popped out, so in which models multipixel drive is used, any info on this anywhere???

I think all their S-PVA panels have this. If you take a loupe to one you can see that the entire sub-pixel does not light evenly depending on what brightness level the pixel is trying to display.

Here's a composite shot of what the sub-pixels look like at different intensity levels from my 52" Samsung LN52A630.



You can clearly see that there are two quasi-independent portions of the sub-pixel.

Quote:


Simply you have not designed as sophisticated backlight as Sharp has.

Apparently not.
Quote:


Surely RGB its LEDs are on side and it is locally dimmed, how this is done I dunno.Question is if there are any specific artefacts of this design.

You can dim some of the LEDs on the side, but you will end up with stripes of continuous light across the panel, not small rectangular zones.
post #160 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by TNG View Post

I am not saying that saving power is not good, but that you should choose where and when to do it. IMO the TV is not the place, there are to many other areas that I can improve on before the TV gets looked at.
.

The wattage requirement seems to have dropped from their old Sharp 65". I believe the old one uses 650W, so 568W is quite good for the same size. I save electricity on everything in my house, in the recent years, I stop using dryer and just dry the clothes by hanging them in the house.

Now, I'm a bigger fan on Samsung. But my problem is, btwn. Samsung and Sony, there is no 65". So Sharp dominates this market. w/ Samsung and Sony, they stopped at 55", and w/ Sony a big jump to 70" which doesn't fit my room.

If Samsung is that good, why can't they build something bigger than 55"? Didn't they have the world largest LCD at like 100"?
post #161 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by happy hopping View Post

The wattage requirement seems to have dropped from their old Sharp 65". I believe the old one uses 650W, so 568W is quite good for the same size. I save electricity on everything in my house, in the recent years, I stop using dryer and just dry the clothes by hanging them in the house.

Now, I'm a bigger fan on Samsung. But my problem is, btwn. Samsung and Sony, there is no 65". So Sharp dominates this market. w/ Samsung and Sony, they stopped at 55", and w/ Sony a big jump to 70" which doesn't fit my room.

If Samsung is that good, why can't they build something bigger than 55"? Didn't they have the world largest LCD at like 100"?

Yes I dry allot of my clothes the same way.

Sharp seems to want to produce the 65". All in all it really is not a big seller for them when you compare it to the 52", 46", 42".

I think that Samsung is not going to produce something in this range because it probably would not sell enough units to justifiy the cost of developement. Sharp has already paid that price.

The Sony 70" probably carries a high price tag and would be difficult to move and install. Of course if you need something that big, you have a big room. BTW I did see a 108" (think it was 108") at the Nagoya Airport in Japan last year, Sharp.
post #162 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stereodude View Post

I think all their S-PVA panels have this. If you take a loupe to one you can see that the entire sub-pixel does not light evenly depending on what brightness level the pixel is trying to display.

Yes, you are right. I only wonder if the XS1 have improved version or not. Should one thus believe them viewing problem is completely eliminated?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stereodude View Post

I
You can dim some of the LEDs on the side, but you will end up with stripes of continuous light across the panel, not small rectangular zones.

Maybe they have some other solution, fibers to specific areas of the display???
post #163 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by TNG View Post

The Sony 70" probably carries a high price tag and would be difficult to move and install. Of course if you need something that big, you have a big room. BTW I did see a 108" (think it was 108") at the Nagoya Airport in Japan last year, Sharp.

The MSRP of the 70XBR7 is 19999US$. FYI, remember I said I put in a solar PV system. It cost the same as a 70XBR7. I somehow think it was money better spent on generating electricity rather than watching TV.
post #164 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by stephenC View Post

Are you willing to post the quantity per store for the new Sharp XS1 models? Based on MUGEN's post, I willing to bet you will get less than 10 units per store.

Like some limited production models in the past we usually just have our display model in certain stores, and the rest in our main warehouse for pickup/delivery. Its still too early to tell which stores will get them, but its usually our high traffic stores of course like NYC, Paramus NJ, Bay Plaza, Yonkers, maybe Commack L.I. etc..
post #165 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by happy hopping View Post

Now, I'm a bigger fan on Samsung. But my problem is, btwn. Samsung and Sony, there is no 65". So Sharp dominates this market. w/ Samsung and Sony, they stopped at 55", and w/ Sony a big jump to 70" which doesn't fit my room.

If Samsung is that good, why can't they build something bigger than 55"? Didn't they have the world largest LCD at like 100"?

The problem is not building something but mass producing at consumer accepted price. Samsung/Sony factory can not make bigger than 55", their lines handle glass of the size accommodating two columns of 52". It is only that they figured margins can be reduced so that the 55" displays fit into this glass.

One can bet they do not make 65" because of incovenience in direct competition with Sharp who can produce bigger volumes of 65".

So they try to outsmart Sharp by moving into 70" but it is unit, not mass produced.

Samsung plans to have next gen factory mass producing sizes in the 70" range in 2010-11 time frame.
post #166 of 603
Then I am afraid I'm stick w/ Sharp.

Let's cut to the chase, how many % of the old sharp screen has the bending problem? Is there a web site officially showing the % of bending LCD TV?
post #167 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by happy hopping View Post

Then I am afraid I'm stick w/ Sharp.
Let's cut to the chase, how many % of the old sharp screen has the bending problem? Is there a web site officially showing the % of bending LCD TV?

I presume you have in mind Sharp LED 65" XS1. There are no banding statistics for the XS1 seres as nobody had yet a chance to test them.
If you aim for the 65" and have the pocket monies it costs do not forget to report you owner impressions for the average crowd.
post #168 of 603
Please explain what 'banding' is...
post #169 of 603
Seems like Sharp will have the most complete consumer LED LCD on the market by far.

Actual image:



backlight:



Color dimming.
post #170 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by nosepass2 View Post

Please explain what 'banding' is...

Check out this youtube posting.

http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=kV5iv5TIT-M

Banding is an abnormal variation to the image produced by the LCD panel. I've never seen a good explanation of what causes it, but it seems to be a malady related to the Sharp LCD production line for panels larger than 37". I think. Like I said I don't really understand what causes it, only seen it in these video postings on youtube and read about it here on AVSforum.com.
post #171 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by irkuck View Post

I presume you have in mind Sharp LED 65" XS1. There are no banding statistics for the XS1 seres as nobody had yet a chance to test them.
.

I am referring to the banding stat. in the past models of sharp
post #172 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by happy hopping View Post

I am referring to the banding stat. in the past models of sharp

This may not be relevant to XS1, it should eXclusive Super 1st line
post #173 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by sharpbandaid View Post


backlight:



Color dimming.

Looks like quite precise dimming, every LED controlled separately?
post #174 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by sharpbandaid View Post

Seems like Sharp will have the most complete consumer LED LCD on the market by far.

Actual image:



backlight:



Color dimming.


Isnt that just regular RGB dimming?
post #175 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by KLee View Post

Isnt that just regular RGB dimming?

Yes. Being the first commercial RGB dimming lcd makes XS pretty special IMHO, plus it seems to have "enough" zones to justify sky high price.
post #176 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by sharpbandaid View Post

Yes. Being the first commercial RGB dimming lcd makes XS pretty special IMHO, plus it seems to have "enough" zones to justify sky high price.


I like your userid, very clever. I'm not sure I agree with your statement about the XS being the first RGB dimming LCD. Doesn't that title go to Sony with the 70XBR3? Do you know the numeric count of zones the new Sharp sets have? If you know for both sizes, please inform the uninformed. TIA.
post #177 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by stephenC View Post

I'm not sure I agree with your statement about the XS being the first RGB dimming LCD. Doesn't that title go to Sony with the 70XBR3? Do you know the numeric count of zones the new Sharp sets have? If you know for both sizes, please inform the uninformed. TIA.

XBR3 isn't a led local dimming lcd at all. XBR8 is a 2D dimming LED lcd, but has no control over LED color components(zones will emit white light).

XR1(XBR8):



Sharp XS takes this even further and its backlight can act as a full color low resolution display.



500 zones?
post #178 of 603
Wow, very impressive. No wonder the price is so high. Unfortunately, the time to market is horrible. With the global economy imploding I'm not sure how many buyers Sharp with have for a very expensive TV set.
post #179 of 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by stephenC View Post

Wow, very impressive. No wonder the price is so high. Unfortunately, the time to market is horrible. With the global economy imploding I'm not sure how many buyers Sharp with have for a very expensive TV set.

Heh, production quotas are 1000-1500 each model per month. That will be barely enough just for the financial types who now have lots of free time. Remember they were recently cashing 5-9 digit bonuses for excellent performance last year alone. Now they have time to consume fruits of their hard work and see the drama of financial apocalypse in glorious HD - I confidently predict run on those sets.
post #180 of 603
I must be crazy, but I really am looking forward to this 65" of fabulous picture (well, hope springs eternal among us sharpophiles). After patiently waiting for the banding fiasco to get under control and then to see the specs on this 65xs1 I am pumped. Shouldn't there be more news on this guy by now? Shouldn't some select stores be getting them soon? I want to see this thing in action. LED, local dimming, low power, lighter weight, separate media box, matte screen, ..., how can you go wrong? Oh, oh, I said that last time, I better wait and see the grey screen!

PS: I really like a separate media box. My Lc45gx has a separate box and I think it is a big design improvement.
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