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Signature Elite 141 Owners Thread - Page 69

post #2041 of 5267
Thanks turbe and sillysally. I think I will look into getting to know my panel and a first step will be to get and explore ControlCAL.

On another note, I would like to confirm what everyone is doing as far as connections.

I will pretty much have only two pieces of equipment setup as my video sources going into the tv. HD cable PVR with HDMI output and PS3 gaming/BD player with HDMI output as well.

Now, I'm not sure what the accepted practice is; whether to go HDMI from those two sources into an A/V receiver and then one HDMI into the TV? I think this is the best route except my reservations in regards to source programming etc for the panel. I'm still learning, but I would think that if one programs different inputs on the tv, by going this route one foregoes them? The panel would not be able to distinguish which is the ps3 nor the cable box? At the same time, does it matter?

I think I have read in the manual that the panel can sense whether the source is HD or SD coming from the cable and will adjust accordingly? By going the above root will the panel still recognize that?

Otherwise, if one were to go HDMI from the source to the panel directly and for sound optical to the a/v, would there be more automation as far as auto picture adjustment or in either case, one still has to press the modes for the types of programming they're watching? I'm thinking here that there is the picture modes (sports, pure, movies, etc) as well as content modes (HD/SD).

Any guidance would be appreciated.
post #2042 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by falcon123 View Post

Thanks turbe and sillysally. I think I will look into getting to know my panel and a first step will be to get and explore ControlCAL.

On another note, I would like to confirm what everyone is doing as far as connections.

I will pretty much have only two pieces of equipment setup as my video sources going into the tv. HD cable PVR with HDMI output and PS3 gaming/BD player with HDMI output as well.

Now, I'm not sure what the accepted practice is; whether to go HDMI from those two sources into an A/V receiver and then one HDMI into the TV? I think this is the best route except my reservations in regards to source programming etc for the panel. I'm still learning, but I would think that if one programs different inputs on the tv, by going this route one foregoes them? The panel would not be able to distinguish which is the ps3 nor the cable box? At the same time, does it matter?

I think I have read in the manual that the panel can sense whether the source is HD or SD coming from the cable and will adjust accordingly? By going the above root will the panel still recognize that?

Otherwise, if one were to go HDMI from the source to the panel directly and for sound optical to the a/v, would there be more automation as far as auto picture adjustment or in either case, one still has to press the modes for the types of programming they're watching? I'm thinking here that there is the picture modes (sports, pure, movies, etc) as well as content modes (HD/SD).

Any guidance would be appreciated.

1. If your A/V will pass through your Video signal and is 1.3 compliant to your 141 untouched, then that probably is the best way to go. Use a HDMI 1.3 category 2 cable for all sources, shorter the run the better. If your A/V is not 1.3 compliant then run your source direct to your 141 via HDMI, and run Analog or optical to your A/V

2. If you use the ISF modes then your 141 will not change any setting for any resolution. So you would set ISF day mode for your PVR and ISF night mode for your PS3.
If you don't use ISF mode then when the signal goes from 480i to say 1080P your 141 will have to have individualize settings for each resolution.
post #2043 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by sk20 View Post

Sounds like a sleazy way to create a calibrator's guild (not that I have anything against calibrators themselves).

Pioneer should have exposed this on the regular menus. If the fear was accidental modification, password protect them from changes.

The Signature models were designed for corporate customers which is why they have Internet capability, no tuners or speakers, and a lock down on ISF mode.
post #2044 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by markrubin View Post

My KURO 141 ISF Calibration

Kevin Miller calibrated my panel today: it was a worthwhile experience.

Thanks for your calibration report Mark. I've included it in the owner's flat panel (Post#2) list that's linked at the bottom of my post.
post #2045 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by sillysally View Post

1. If your A/V will pass through your Video signal and is 1.3 compliant to your 141 untouched, then that probably is the best way to go. Use a HDMI 1.3 category 2 cable for all sources, shorter the run the better. If your A/V is not 1.3 compliant then run your source direct to your 141 via HDMI, and run Analog or optical to your A/V

2. If you use the ISF modes then your 141 will not change any setting for any resolution. So you would set ISF day mode for your PVR and ISF night mode for your PS3.
If you don't use ISF mode then when the signal goes from 480i to say 1080P your 141 will have to have individualize settings for each resolution.

Thanks.

Darn, it never crossed my mind to check, but my pio elite 72TXV is HDMI 1.1 compliant. Oh well, will have to go direct to tv. It doesn't make sense to upgrade the receiver to gain this functionality. I guess it shows its age but still fully funtional. Checked the cable HD PVR as well and it is 1.1 compliant as well. I guess I could still use HDMI for cable to the a/v receiver and then tv. For PS3, direct to TV.

Thanks again, really appreciate it.
post #2046 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

The Signature models were designed for corporate customers which is why they have Internet capability, no tuners or speakers, and a lock down on ISF mode.

Hmmm, That's a new one. Were did you get that idea?

There is a lock not only for ISF modes on the 141 but on all 8G and 9G kuro elites. Up untill the Bata Controlcal there really was no reliable way to use ISFccc on the elites. Just ask your friend umr. He wouldn't touch a 8G ISFccc calibration.

The Internet capability of a 141 was included so ISF calibrators could adjust your settings over the internet.

The 141 is directed at the real video enthusiast. That have there own sound system's and turner, like a cable box or like me BD and HD players.

btw; I sure would like to see the calibration reports posted along with the comments. The reports would really help folks pick a good calibrator.
post #2047 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by falcon123 View Post

Thanks.

Darn, it never crossed my mind to check, but my pio elite 72TXV is HDMI 1.1 compliant. Oh well, will have to go direct to tv. It doesn't make sense to upgrade the receiver to gain this functionality. I guess it shows its age but still fully funtional. Checked the cable HD PVR as well and it is 1.1 compliant as well. I guess I could still use HDMI for cable to the a/v receiver and then tv. For PS3, direct to TV.

Thanks again, really appreciate it.

Some folks do run the HDMI cable to there display. And then run analog cables from there source to there A/V. So you will be just fine.
post #2048 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by vancouver View Post

interesting....so what exactly is behind the ISF password? What can you change in ISF mode if you got into it via the web server? Personally I think not allowing to change not calibration settings for ISF is strange...and annoying. Pure Cinema has nothing to do with calibration so why block it?

On the European models (KRP-M) I found that you can get into the ISF section by logging into the regular web interface and then going to:

http://your_kuro_ip/cgi/isf.cgi

as this bypasses the password page.

The options available are:
post #2049 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by sillysally View Post

Hmmm, That's a new one. Were did you get that idea?

There is a lock not only for ISF modes on the 141 but on all 8G and 9G kuro elites. Up untill the Bata Controlcal there really was no reliable way to use ISFccc on the elites. Just ask your friend umr. He wouldn't touch a 8G ISFccc calibration.

The Internet capability of a 141 was included so ISF calibrators could adjust your settings over the internet.

The 141 is directed at the real video enthusiast. That have there own sound system's and turner, like a cable box or like me BD and HD players.

btw; I sure would like to see the calibration reports posted along with the comments. The reports would really help folks pick a good calibrator.

Not to do a calibration as there are only those Controls available, but touch-up
post #2050 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by vancouver View Post

Do you know why the Cinema settings are locked in ISF? What is the reason behind that?

Anyways, I think you mean missing but you keep saying locked....

EDIT: After re-reading your question and your previous post about 'PC has nothing to do with Calibration', I think I know what you are asking. You want to be able to configure PC independently for each Memory, not a Global Setting. Many use one PC Setting in one memory and another PC Setting in another memory. This is how the ISFccc Interface functions on all 8G and 9G Pioneer Models (that have ISFccc).


For the past/current generations, a 3rd Party (non-Pioneer) application is intended to be used for doing an initial/proper calibration (you can see the limited Control available via the web interface above - same as I posted previously) and that is why I am working directly with Pioneer on ControlCAL's support for their Models.

I don't make those decisions, I do provide the tool/solution.

Without the password, things can be funky in the interface on those limited Controls. I signed an NDA with Pioneer so obviously that is why I never did anything with your previous and other member's requests to me for that information.

post #2051 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by vancouver View Post

I did have ControlCal used on my display and of course the result was perfection. I, however, made an error, or at least thought at the time I should set all my Pure Cinema settings for Day, Night and Auto to Smooth, because I prefer the effect. This was a mistake because sometimes I do, and sometimes I dont, and above all i like to play around with settings.


Well, you could set PC different in each Memory if needed (1 with Advance, 1 with Smooth, 1 with Off?), that way you could quickly change memories..

Quote:
Originally Posted by vancouver View Post

I am not sure what "PC settings via Winsock" means but if its simple ill buy in. The problem I have is my centre channel is blocking the serial port so I have to remove and unplug every time. I need something I can use to change ISF on the fly with simply using my remote or the web server.

via the Network.. Instead of just a Serial/RS232 Option, having ControlCAL have a Serial Option and Network Option in a future version.
post #2052 of 5267
After 100 hours of the break-in, I felt comfortable watching a letterboxed movie. It looked great. Then turned it off and looked at the screen, and no image retention at all. None. This display is awesome!
post #2053 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by sk20 View Post

After 100 hours of the break-in, I felt comfortable watching a letterboxed movie. It looked great. Then turned it off and looked at the screen, and no image retention at all. None. This display is awesome!

One for every room..

May new more Power Sources.......
post #2054 of 5267
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by turbe View Post

Well, you could set PC different in each Memory if needed (1 with Advance, 1 with Smooth, 1 with Off?), that way you could quickly change memories.

I could have, but I made the mistake by not doing that and now I want to be able to change, hence my questions around how to do that.


Quote:
Originally Posted by turbe View Post

via the Network.. Instead of just a Serial/RS232 Option, having ControlCAL have a Serial Option and Network Option in a future version.

This is good...so basically load the software on your computer and access it via the ethernet connection rather then serial? Sign me up.
post #2055 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by vancouver View Post

This is good...so basically load the software on your computer and access it via the ethernet connection rather then serial? Sign me up.

Not in the current version (that a planned option in an upcoming version)...


I think we can get you taking care of now... do you have a Serial Cable around there?
post #2056 of 5267
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by turbe View Post

Not in the current version (that a planned option in an upcoming version)...


I think we can get you taking care of now... do you have a Serial Cable around there?

serial cable is not an option for me with my setup. Ill wait for the upcoming version to be available.
post #2057 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by turbe View Post

Not to do a calibration as there are only those Controls available, but touch-up

Yep, That's why I used the word Adjust.
post #2058 of 5267
You can say that I'm a vergin to the world of video and audio calibration.

I have just acquired controlCAL as a first step in ISF menu activation.

I'm about to purchase the backlight, ideal lume, and I see that they carry digital video essentials there - the professional version. Would this product be useful in any sort of calibration of SD and HD content as well as home theatre optimization or is it a waste of money?

Thanks.
post #2059 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by falcon123 View Post

they carry digital video essentials there - the professional version. Would this product be useful in any sort of calibration of SD and HD content as well as home theatre optimization or is it a waste of money?

Thanks.

HERE is one that is free.
post #2060 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by turbe View Post

HERE is one that is free.

Thank you for a quick reply - you just saved me $80.
post #2061 of 5267
Quote:


Our primary intent is to offer video patterns for calibrating digital displays (LCD, Plasma, DLP, D-ILA, SXRD). That means there are no audio portions or patterns specifically meant for analog TVs (CRT), which can be found on Digital Video Essentials and Avia discs. The patterns provided have simply been divided into sections for different tasks, and each section is made up of a number of two-minute video clips. The Blu-ray and HD DVD discs allow you to select sections from the menus, and the video clips in each section can be navigated by chapter skipping. The Basic Settings, Miscellaneous Patterns, and Resolution sections are intended to be useful in setting user controls for your electronics with no test equipment, except possibly a color filter. The remaining sections are meant for taking measurements from the display, with a colorimeter or spectroradiometer, using software like ColorHCFR or CalMAN.

Do you want audio and CRT support too?
post #2062 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by turbe View Post

HERE is one that is free.

Quick draw turbe.

The BD version works very well and I use it, but I have my reservation on the HD version. Why I say this is because I just used the HD version for my HD-A35 and imo I didn't like the way the 22Pt gray scale displayed. So I used the HD version for the color windows and used DVE HD for the gray scale.
post #2063 of 5267
I have an XA2 and should calibrate that with the 141 but I think I'm going to eBay it (I've been meaning to for months LOL)...

Do you need the HD HQV Benchmark disc...
post #2064 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV TiVo Dealer View Post

Mark, 141's are aged as part of the QC process. Some say 200 hrs, but I was told 100 hrs.

-Robert

I also noticed that after a few days running the breakin dvd, the botches seem to have faded slightly and the buzz is not as loud as when i first powered it on.
post #2065 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by turbe View Post

Do you want audio and CRT support too?

No, I don't need CRT support. As far as audio, not sure at this point. My a/v receiver has a mic calibration. Not sure how the mic calibration compares with DVE audio or some other software.

Turbe, I will have to read up on the different software a bit.
post #2066 of 5267
At least burn AVS HD 709, blank disc is the cost and a little time.
post #2067 of 5267
Error in my last posted setting.. Cyan should read -1 not -2.
Sorry for any inconvenience.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...2#post15452782
post #2068 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by sillysally View Post

Hmmm, That's a new one. Were did you get that idea?

I got that idea indirectly from Pioneer promotional material posted here at AVS during the speculation phase.

Pioneer fans haven't let them get away with that, but it does provide one explanation for the ISF mode lock.
post #2069 of 5267
I am waiting for my bracket to arrive and running some full screen content on the 141 and with Hd Discovery channels Planet Earth broadcast notice a faint line along the left side of the screen. On my previous panel when viewing Planet Earth in HD, there were small, black bars on each side of the image so is the broadcast not 16x9, possibly 1:75:1?

Is the faint line a symptom of wide mode or similar feature? It is as if the image is cloned and placed on the left side to eliminate bars.
post #2070 of 5267
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewfee View Post

On the European models (KRP-M) I found that you can get into the ISF section by logging into the regular web interface and then going to:

http://your_kuro_ip/cgi/isf.cgi

as this bypasses the password page.

The options available are:

Thanks for the info. I just tried this on my 141 and it works fine.
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