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"Fringe" on Fox HD - Page 12

post #331 of 6444
To me it has some of the magic that made the early seasons of the Xfiles really good. John Noble's Walter is awsome. I loved the "I think remember where I parked my car" and "Do you have any cocaine?" I cracked up. I really like this show. I just hope FOX doesn't let us all down and cancel it like they do almost every new show they make.
post #332 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viventis View Post

I will look forward to the Walter line of the week. This week it had to be his discussion of the heated car seat. I cracked up! Does anyone remember the exact line? Second place was Walter's reaction to the statement that he already had a lab.

It was, "I've never seen a feature like this before. It warms your ass. Have you tried it?" Of course, the delivery is what makes it so precious .
post #333 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

I think they're speaking of the advanced "futuristic" technology possessed by a space-faring race, far different from us earthlings. We need to see the characters as contemporaries to better relate to them, but they're clearly more advanced technologically than us. That sort of thing is typically classified as sci-fi. I don't think BSG, one of TV's great series in recent years on a number of levels, has to run from that classification. It is what it is.

I agree. I don't think they need to run from it either (although if they did, more people may give it a chance). I think BSG may end up being the best show on television of all time (depending on how the last 10/11/12/whatever episodes play out).

But saying it's future-based just because it takes place in space is like saying Fringe takes place in the present just because it's on Earth. I think we'll conquer space travel way before we're capable of jumping into someone's head to talk to them in their dreams. But they're seemingly afraid to call it Science Fiction, which is why I could see them making that distinction...even if it doesn't make much sense. Or doesn't make much sense to me anyway.
post #334 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by michaeltscott View Post

It was, "I've never seen a feature like this before. It warms your ass. Have you tried it?" Of course, the delivery is what makes it so precious .

As I said before, they should retool the show into The Walter Hour. Walter is so frakkin awesome he makes much of the awfulness of the show bearable.

And the cool thing with Walter is there is an obvious level at which Walter's naive behavior is clearly sitting on top of a pile of very bad things he doesn't want to confront. How bad what Walter did is may be the only big reveal the show has that I care to see.

Was Walter a naive rube to EvilCo's plans? Not likely. Was Walter sooo evil that his current state is how his conscience dealt with what he unleashed? Is Walter just playing dumb, kinda the old Chinese master defense? Was Walter unable to deal with how far he went so fast that he just shut himself in?

It is weird to see such a single brilliant character so well-acted in the middle of what is, otherwise, a laughably awful show.

Quote:
Originally Posted by moob View Post

I think BSG may end up being the best show on television of all time (depending on how the last 10/11/12/whatever episodes play out).

Dude? There have been better. For example, there was this show called MASH way back when.

I think you can make an argument that BSG season 1 may have been the greatest single season of TV ever. But, taking the series as a whole, the argument fails quickly. Significant portions of S2 and S3 were born in bottle episode hell.
post #335 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by MeowMeow View Post

Dude? There have been better. For example, there was this show called MASH way back when.

I think you can make an argument that BSG season 1 may have been the greatest single season of TV ever. But, taking the series as a whole, the argument fails quickly. Significant portions of S2 and S3 were born in bottle episode hell.

A matter of personal preference really. I jumped into BSG kinda late, so I watched all of seasons 1 (and mini) and 2 together, and I just don't see why some folks love season 1 so much (or 33 for that matter). Altogether, I think season 2 was better than 1, and 3 was just as good as 2. Although there were a couple episodes in both 2 and 3 that could be airlocked as far as I'm concerned and season 1 didn't have any. I've just never seen a show like BSG on tv before...relentlessly bleak and unwavering in its reality. But like I said, if the last 11 episodes crash and burn I'd have to change my mind.

In any case, back to Fringe...Peter is a pretty decent character as well. If it were just Walter, Peter, and the cow, I'd be happy.
post #336 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by VisionOn View Post

You see I'm watching this and not seeing the part where they are trying to be tongue in cheek. With the exception of Walter and his Son (who appear to exist in a different show all of their own sometimes*) the rest all seem to be paying this earnestly as if it were a serious drama.

I believe that the actors portraying Walter and his son are playing it as straight as the other members of the cast. The difference in their performances from the other characters, it seems to me, is not that the actors are playing their parts for laughs but that Walter is nuts and the son is an inveterate wiseass. More seriously, I agree that both Walter and his son are funny guys.
post #337 of 6444
Agree that the son is definitely a highlight of the show, but just to a lesser extent to that of his dad. But then, the older guy does get the best lines.

FWIW, I heard somewhere, can't remember where now, that the guy playing Walter was a real strange dude during the filming of LotR. They didn't really know what to make of him apparently...so maybe he's sort of coo-coo like that in person.
post #338 of 6444
The thing with Walter & son is that they're the only part of the show that the writers didn't just staple together from other shows.

Most good characters in any medium build their own twist around a timeless archetype. Walter and son are obviously some kind of twist on the failings of fathers. And, within the context of small-f fringe science, the notion of a failed father is timeless. That, or I completely missed the point to Frankenstein.

And the line between archetypes and cliches is a thin one. Look at EvilCo.

It's kinda funny, as we've been talking about BSG. BSG has a real yearning to do the failings of parents archetype, also. But, it actually fails miserably in that goal. I've always felt that's because the central father figure, Bill Adama, is simply too warm, likable. He's what football people call a players' coach. It's hard to see him as a failed father even when he fails.

With Walter, it's very out front. There's just a certain lost puppy dog sadness to the character. And that contrasts with the strong impression that the son is very worldly.

I'll give Fringe this, on a serious level: there are two characters you care about, and that's two more than most shows have. For all the bashing I've done on here, there is something to Fringe.
post #339 of 6444
As far as Agent Dunham, she just lost the love of her life and found out he was on the wrong side, so she's probably not in a great place and never forget the great line from Tommy Lee Jones in MIB:

"We at the FBI do not have a sense of humor that we are aware of."
post #340 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by MeowMeow View Post

I'll give Fringe this, on a serious level: there are two characters you care about, and that's two more than most shows have. For all the bashing I've done on here, there is something to Fringe.

Agreed.
post #341 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by MeowMeow View Post

The thing with Walter & son is that they're the only part of the show that the writers didn't just staple together from other shows.

With Walter, it's very out front. There's just a certain lost puppy dog sadness to the character. And that contrasts with the strong impression that the son is very worldly.

I'll give Fringe this, on a serious level: there are two characters you care about, and that's two more than most shows have. For all the bashing I've done on here, there is something to Fringe.

I'd agree with much of what you're stating, but it seems that you're side-stepping the issue of the weakest link, i.e. the bland blonde.

For reasons unknown, they repeated the Letterman show with Anya the other night. The same one I commented upon very early on in this thread, which led to the whole furor about whether she was unattractive and/or didn't have much personality. She was nervous, which is certainly understandable under the circumstances, but worse, she was boring and trite. Aren't the flacks supposed to prep these people to sound at least mildly interesting in their debut on a national talk show to shill the series?

And your remarks above pretty much confirm the problem. There is simply no chemistry at all between Dunham and the other two, despite how anxiously it seems the son wants to get in her pants. There didn"t even seem to be much chemistry between her and her dead boyfriend in the sack. You want chemistry? Well Diana Rigg would be great , but probably wouldn't be interested? Amanda Tapping?Well at least you'd finally have someone formidable on the team. My ideal choice would be someone similar to Mary McCormack, a strong character with a quick sense of humor. But why in the world would she want to give up her own personal showcase of "In Plain Sight"?

That's what's really missing here, a third character who must be female so that any females in the audience can identify with them, (look how they seem to be outnumbering the male characters in the police procedurals these days)who can pull their own weight, like most of Monk's assistants can.

Maybe JJ had so much success with a barely known, fresh-faced de Ravin chck in LOST, that he now thinks he's a starmaker?

________________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind
post #342 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Palladin View Post

I'd agree with much of what you're stating, but it seems that you're side-stepping the issue of the weakest link, i.e. the bland blonde.

For reasons unknown, they repeated the Letterman show with Anya the other night. The same one I commented upon very early on in this thread, which led to the whole furor about whether she was unattractive and/or didn't have much personality. She was nervous, which is certainly understandable under the circumstances, but worse, she was boring and trite. Aren't the flacks supposed to prep these people to sound at least mildly interesting in their debut on a national talk show to shill the series?

And your remarks above pretty much confirm the problem. There is simply no chemistry at all between Dunham and the other two, despite how anxiously it seems the son wants to get in her pants. There didn"t even seem to be much chemistry between her and her dead boyfriend in the sack. You want chemistry? Well Diana Rigg would be great , but probably wouldn't be interested? Amanda Tapping?Well at least you'd finally have someone formidable on the team. My ideal choice would be someone similar to Mary McCormack, a strong character with a quick sense of humor. But why in the world would she want to give up her own personal showcase of "In Plain Sight"?

That's what's really missing here, a third character who must be female so that any females in the audience can identify with them, (look how they seem to be outnumbering the male characters in the police procedurals these days)who can pull their own weight, like most of Monk's assistants can.

Maybe JJ had so much success with a barely known, fresh-faced de Ravin chck in LOST, that he now thinks he's a starmaker?

I like Torv a lot. She is both beautiful and a competent actress, it seems to me. I bought her relationship with her now dead partner-boyfriend and its aftermath, which is clearly torturing her. I understand why there is not yet much overt chemistry between Torv's Olivia and the mad doctor's son, Peter. They are both trapped in situations not of their own making and are not very happy about it. In fact it led to Olivia's ruthless manipulation of Peter in the very beginning. In short, both of these characters are carrying a LOT of baggage so it seems to me that much evidence of physical attraction at this early stage would be premature. I am looking forward, though, to what develops on that front.
post #343 of 6444
I think Torv's role on the show is to be the "rock" so to speak. She's surrounded by crazy events, and definitely crazy people...are we supposed to expect her to be overly dramatic too? An FBI agent is supposed to be cool and in control, and so far she's done that.

Whether she is "believable" or not in her role, is entirely subjective...and I don't know that I'd say she is failing at that right now. I will say she's being a little upstaged by her 2 male co-stars, but then they are getting most of the best scenes/lines.
post #344 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by IrmoGamecoq View Post

I think Torv's role on the show is to be the "rock" so to speak. She's surrounded by crazy events, and definitely crazy people...are we supposed to expect her to be overly dramatic too? An FBI agent is supposed to be cool and in control, and so far she's done that.

Only if you believe that having a personality somehow = overly dramatic. Everyone has their own take, but I'm betting there are more people in this world that have personalities, than those who are overly dramatic.

Quote:


Whether she is "believable" or not in her role, is entirely subjective.

Umm, yeah, sure, what else would it be??

Quote:


...and I don't know that I'd say she is failing at that right now.

.
Well, when you do know, get back to me, cause I don't think she's passing anything either.

Quote:


I will say she's being a little upstaged by her 2 male co-stars, but then they are getting most of the best scenes/lines.

And why do you think that is? Maybe because the creative team thinks the co-stars can act and deliver their lines better?

___________________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind
post #345 of 6444
Right now she's a dead fish, but we can explain that away with what happened and cut her some slack.

I just hope the show isn't, as someone else said, just a 'let's solve this impossibility with some equally impossible work in the lab' weekly exercise. Plus the growing rehash of a conspiracy at EvilCo, of course.

More Walter and Son out in the field is what we need, not in the lab.
post #346 of 6444
Ok, I'm gone. "Series recording" deleted.

I find it a shame that Lance Reddick is remembered more by this thread for his 3 appearances on "Lost" than for his 60 appearances as Lt. Cedric Daniels on "The Wire". Does he have a calcified spine? Why is his head always tilted when he talks to you?

Anyway, that cow-in-the-lab storyline is UDDERLY ridiculous! Don't they know that a cow (1) must be fed, (2) poops a great deal... and that needs to be cleaned up, (3) smells awful, and (4) after you milk it with your hands into a gleaming shiny stainless steel pail right next to your lab table and put the pail into a holder right on your lab table, that you should probably wash your hands before you go back to work?

Quote:


--something weird kills someone; team is sent to investigate
--call in Walter (CMS) who remembers doing something like that about 20 years ago
--come up with a crazy experiment to obtain a vital clue
--drama (involving EvilCo, Pattern, conspiracy theory)
--solve the case
--give a quick glimpse into "everything is not as it seems"

Exactly.

After two episodes I don't care for the premise or the execution (or the writing, or Blair Brown's character). I'm not entertained by "a gizmo a week".

I'm gone.
post #347 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSperber View Post

Ok, I'm gone. "Series recording" deleted...

I'm gone.

Ok. Bye.
post #348 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSperber View Post

Ok, I'm gone. "Series recording" deleted.


I'm gone.


Goodbye.
post #349 of 6444
Wow, can't believe the amount of bashing going on in here with this show. IMO it isnt that bad compared to many shows currently on the air. Both the "Boss" and myself enjoy watching this show. Of course, I dont try to analyze every second of the show to see if its "accurate". I try to watch the show for what it is a piece of fictional work, that is trying to mix mainstream with the X Files type stories.."The Boss" who is no fan of this genre at all, has gotten sucked into the storyline ...As for me, Ill keep watching for the rest of the season, there isnt much else that keeps my attention on Tuesday nights anyways....
post #350 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

Wow, can't believe the amount of bashing going on in here with this show. IMO it isnt that bad compared to many shows currently on the air. Both the "Boss" and myself enjoy watching this show. Of course, I dont try to analyze every second of the show to see if its "accurate". I try to watch the show for what it is a piece of fictional work, that is trying to mix mainstream with the X Files type stories.."The Boss" who is no fan of this genre at all, has gotten sucked into the storyline ...As for me, Ill keep watching for the rest of the season, there isnt much else that keeps my attention on Tuesday nights anyways....

BTW, I am trying to give this show a chance, but I don't think I've seen much of that mainstream stuff you're referring to. Could you be more specific? Is it because they haven't shown any rocketships yet?

_______________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind
post #351 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

Wow, can't believe the amount of bashing going on in here with this show. IMO it isnt that bad compared to many shows currently on the air. Both the "Boss" and myself enjoy watching this show. Of course, I dont try to analyze every second of the show to see if its "accurate". I try to watch the show for what it is a piece of fictional work, that is trying to mix mainstream with the X Files type stories.."The Boss" who is no fan of this genre at all, has gotten sucked into the storyline ...As for me, Ill keep watching for the rest of the season, there isnt much else that keeps my attention on Tuesday nights anyways....

I can accept the bashing as long as it is done by a poster on his way out of the thread. I just hope that we don't have twerps coming back week after week only to post that they still hate the show. That's trolling, pure and simple.
post #352 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

I can accept the bashing as long as it is done by a poster on his way out of the thread. I just hope that we don't have twerps coming back week after week only to post that they still hate the show. That's trolling, pure and simple.

Yep, and we have one on this thread.
post #353 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Palladin View Post

Only if you believe that having a personality somehow = overly dramatic. Everyone has their own take, but I'm betting there are more people in this world that have personalities, than those who are overly dramatic.


Umm, yeah, sure, what else would it be??


And why do you think that is? Maybe because the creative team thinks the co-stars can act and deliver their lines better?

Don't roll your pedantic eyes at me, I already told you her "believability" is subjective, and you apparently agreed. Maybe she is performing her role exactly as the "creative team" wants.
post #354 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Palladin View Post

BTW, I am trying to give this show a chance, but I don't think I've seen much of that mainstream stuff you're referring to. Could you be more specific? Is it because they haven't shown any rocketships yet?

_______________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind

As far as mainstream I mean CSI, and all that crap.....Which I dont watch..Why would I care about rocketships????Especially with this show that comment "was over the top"

As far as giving this show a chance, at least to me (and it seems others) you have already deemed this show "unworthy"....It may be time just to pack it in and give up.......
post #355 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by IrmoGamecoq View Post

I think Torv's role on the show is to be the "rock" so to speak. She's surrounded by crazy events, and definitely crazy people...are we supposed to expect her to be overly dramatic too? An FBI agent is supposed to be cool and in control, and so far she's done that.

Again, being cool or controlled doesn't prevent people from having some kind of personality or presnce. And Its certainly not an excuse for having less presence than skim milk. Ask the cow. As far as being 'overly dramatic' goes, hell at this point I'd be satisfied with her just being at least 'dramatic', which, (get ready) is what an ACTRESS is SUPPOSED to be doing anyway, no?

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Whether she is "believable" or not in her role, is entirely subjective... and I don't know that I'd say she is failing at that right now.

Well, now this is where you really went south and elicited the response I gave you. First, unless some fact is empirically objective and closed off to more than one form of interpretation, it is by definition, subjective. And lets be blunt, by stating that you can't say that "she is failing right now; you're implying that you can't say she's suceeding either. Kind of a backhanded compliment, isn't it?

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I will say she's being a little upstaged by her 2 male co-stars....

Isn't that kind of like saying a woman in her eighth month is "a little bit" pregnant?
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Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

As for the "Boss" comment it was a "tounge and cheek" statement but I guess unless I spell that out with a bunch of emoticons then the point is missed....

I'm tempted to offer an assist by pointing out that it is 'tongue-in-cheek', but then I'm afraid Irmo will claim that I'm being 'pedantic' for not using the wrong term again

Quote:


As far as mainstream I mean CSI, and all that crap.....Which I dont watch..Why would I care about rocketships????Especially with this show that comment "was over the top"

Only if you didn't get the intent. You're the one who described this show as a 'mix' of mainstream and the X-files. Yes, like the X-files, its a bunch of Boogie-man stories in psuedo-science haunted houses. But I really don't see that 'mainstream' part you referenced so far. That's why the rocketship analogy, because its about as far from the mainstream that I could think of at that moment.
Quote:


As far as giving this show a chance, at least to me (and it seems others) you have already deemed this show "unworthy"....It may be time just to pack it in and give up.......

Hey, now wait a second. I don't want you to feel you have to leave on my account. Stick around. The show might improve after awhile.


____________________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind
post #356 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Palladin View Post

Well, now this is where you really went south and elicited the response I gave you. First, unless some fact is empirically objective and closed off to more than one form of interpretation, it is by definition, subjective. And lets be blunt, by stating that you can't say that "she is failing right now; you're implying that you can't say she's suceeding either. Kind of a backhanded compliment, isn't it?

At great risk of encouraging your trolling nature, I'll answer no, it means that it's too early to call. We are 2 episodes into the show, which is far too soon to write off Ms Torv's ability.
post #357 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Palladin View Post

Again, being cool or controlled doesn't prevent people from having some kind of personality or presnce. And Its certainly not an excuse for having less presence than skim milk. Ask the cow. As far as being 'overly dramatic' goes, hell at this point I'd be satisfied with her just being at least 'dramatic', which, (get ready) is what an ACTRESS is SUPPOSED to be doing anyway, no?


Well, now this is where you really went south and elicited the response I gave you. First, unless some fact is empirically objective and closed off to more than one form of interpretation, it is by definition, subjective. And lets be blunt, by stating that you can't say that "she is failing right now; you're implying that you can't say she's suceeding either. Kind of a backhanded compliment, isn't it?


Isn't that kind of like saying a woman in her eighth month is "a little bit" pregnant?

I'm tempted to offer an assist by pointing out that it is 'tongue-in-cheek', but then I'm afraid Irmo will claim that I'm being 'pedantic' for not using the wrong term again


Only if you didn't get the intent. You're the one who described this show as a 'mix' of mainstream and the X-files. Yes, like the X-files, its a bunch of Boogie-man stories in psuedo-science haunted houses. But I really don't see that 'mainstream' part you referenced so far. That's why the rocketship analogy, because its about as far from the mainstream that I could think of at that moment.

Hey, now wait a second. I don't want you to feel you have to leave on my account. Stick around. The show might improve after awhile.



Nice idea. At least I would have been envious.


____________________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind

??? That comment wasnt for me, I have the season set up to be recored on my DVR, since I like it.....I already think the show is good..

If you knew the comment was in humor then, why even bring it up??? I guess everyone has to comment on something

I never said the X FIles was mainstream, in fact I know its not..."Mainstream" ala CSI and its ilk (cop drama) is what I was refering to....This show is trying to blend a cop drama and the Xfiles type stories....

I guess I have something a little more connected to this story as well since its based out of Boston which is very close to me.....

As for this convo, I think I will end it here, as I said before it looks like you have already made you mind up...
post #358 of 6444
I guess the question is now- is he determined to force us to make up our mind, since he has made up his mind. I never really understood the sorts of comments that someone has "given up" on the show. Why would we care, in this particular topic? Are our watching habits somehow contingent on what other people decide to do? I'll watch what pleases me, and others can watch whatever they feel like.
post #359 of 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by IrmoGamecoq View Post

At great risk of encouraging your trolling nature, I'll answer no, it means that it's too early to call. We are 2 episodes into the show, which is far too soon to write off Ms Torv's ability.

"Trolling nature" huh. Well, let's see, I guess that means at the very least that I have enough courage in my convictions to be consistent. I initially stated after seeing a very disappointing Torv (whom I never even heard of before) on Letterman , that I found her neither attractive nor interesting, and had concerns about the series as a result. I've also noted (along with quite a few others) that so far the series seemed to be going through growing pains (i.e. the pilot) which is not uncommon this early on, and would reserve any final judgment until it had at least 3-4 eps under its belt, or I found it to be such unmitigated crap that I could no longer sit through it. I haven't changed my position on that either.

Actually It seems like I'm giving the show as much, if not more, of a fair chance than you are, as you're not willing to even offer Torv a passing grade at this juncture, or take any kind of meaningful stand on it. Conversely, I was among the first to sing the praises of Walter. What were you doing?

So given a choice, I think I'd rather be an honest "troll", than someone who shows up late to the party and equivocates every issue to death.
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Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

I guess I have something a little more connected to this story as well since its based out of Boston which is very close to me.....

Having lived in Back Bay through most of the 70's and 80's, I tend to doubt you feel any more connected than I do. Boston is a great town with many interesting aspects, but the great scenery is still not going to overcome a poor script.
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As for this convo, I think I will end it here, as I said before it looks like you have already made you mind up...

Actually I haven't made my mind up yet. Just seems some here would rather believe that than question this show's many shortcomings.
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Originally Posted by Mr. Hanky View Post

I guess the question is now- is he determined to force us to make up our mind, since he has made up his mind. I never really understood the sorts of comments that someone has "given up" on the show. Why would we care, in this particular topic? Are our watching habits somehow contingent on what other people decide to do? I'll watch what pleases me, and others can watch whatever they feel like.

Wait a sec, weren’t you the ‘Parallax View’ conspiracy theorist from a page or 2 back??

Yes, you’re right, its true, I and my counterparts from Remulac are here to FORCE you to entertain thoughts of sedition and the like. Not even your pyramid hat can prevent us from taking over your mind in the name of our distant planet --NBC. The FALSE is out there.

Just curious, but is it mere coincidence that your AVS handle is the same name of a cartoon character who is made up of...never mind

________________________________________________
Palladin

Chance favors the prepared mind
post #360 of 6444
So I guess this is fair concession that your "mind will not be made up" until the season is over, and we will be kept graciously apprised of your rabid distaste of each and every episode from here on out? I dunno about you or anyone else here, but that would seem to be a clear and blatant case of threadshitting. I'm pretty sure it is not welcome here, thank you.

It is highly unlikely you will suddenly become impressed with the show 2 or 4 or even 6 episodes into it. We already are well aware of your negative stance on the show, so far. So really, what really is there to be achieved by continuing to remind us with your evident distaste for the show? Pack your bags and head onward. There's no guilt in that, nor is there any loss on our part. Just save yourself from the eternal attack mode.

If you do happen to radically change your mind, I'm sure it will be post-worthy. Until then...enough! We are well aware you don't like the show, so far.
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