Input Lag of various projectors - Page 5

Scaling 720p to 1080 is alot different then the 80ms 1024X768.

The reon does significantly other advanced scaling for obscure resolutions, one of its strengths. It does nothing really moving 720p to 1080. I am testing right now and people over at ign claimed if it was that bad some of us benq owners should notice as one person said he heard the worst was 68ms, but so far none of us see this problem and there are other gamers in the benq thread. The tester also did not test this resolution with his other projectors. He only did 1080p.


Furthermore there is question and been question what exactly is in the benq. Even though is a reon its been scaled to bare bones with almost all of its processing not unlocked even questioning if the reon was pulled from the machine because it did not pass any more hqv tests then the ps3.


I would have liked to see the numbers at 720p which is native for most games at 60 hrtz compared.

You dont have to convince me anything about my projector, almost all of us owners are incredibly happy with it and it has received glowing reviews. Im still happy with the 50ms response time in the one test I dont think its that bad at all for a projector if that is the actual true response time, the one he went with measured 30 and I was told on ign many sets do 30-40. Its unfair to look at the 85ms because he did not do the 768 test with those projectors, only the 1080p.

According to one person not ideal for gaming, but Im testing it and trying connecting to different displays and i dont see any lag that my eyes can comprehend. I have this years panasonic plasma and this years lcd samsung with a game mode that was recomended by pc gamers, and split the signal and cant see any difference.

Also firmware in the benq is constantly changed 1.16 was updated but 2.01 was the latest, sync issues were a problem in previous firmware.

Here is a good example of processing lag.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2CZs...eature=related

On the right is the Panasonic AE2000, on the left the AE3000 with frame creation on. You'll notice the image is from the same source, but the image from the AE3000 is slightly behind the AE2000.

+1 (and + many more on behalf of all the gamers?)

Could some owner kindly do the measurements for HW10? Please

Does anyone, anywhere have any spec the Pannys and the Epsons on frame delay in miliseconds.

miliseconds is the easiest way to interpret these delays.

Im confused as to wether we are disusing delays factors in the micro seconds? 10-50 milliseconds?300-700 miliseconds???!!!!!

can someone provide some more insight as to what type of delays we are talking about here or at least some ballpark estimates

Congrats!

The Epson 6500 is the same thing correct? I'm sure many will be eager to read your thoughts on lag, as AVS will be selling the 6500 in Dec.

Congrats on your pre order, I look forward to your feedback. Be sure you get the 360 VGA cable, I bet the VGA input will bypass the Reon.

I can't wait to see some real-world impressions of the Epson, I've been waiting for the successor to the 1080UB for a few months now. And don't forget to try setting it to x.v color mode for the 360 through HDMI, as based on the settings you can't use with x.v color (as detailed in the manual), that may also bypass the Reon completely as well.

Hey, peteer1, congrats on the purchase!

Now that you own the TW4000, I was wondering. In addition to testing the input lag over HDMI and VGA, would it be possible for you to also connect your PC via S-video, so you can test out the projector's performance when de-interlacing is involved? Actually, it would be cool if Yodobashi would let you do that with the Panny as well.

Thanks in advance. Plugging in a NES and playing Super Mario Bros on a 110-inch screen is sort of a lifelong dream of mine.

peteer01, will you be able to test your TW4000 for lag via HDMI? The PS3 doesn't have VGA.

Go buy a Junk Sega Saturn at a Hard Off for a few bucks, and grab a Saturn S-Video cable. Japanese Sega Saturn had the best overall game lineup in console history IMO. You owe it to yourself to have a Sega Saturn parked next to that 360.

Wow, I guess they do exist.
Will be looking forward to your review.

Lag looks pretty good...can't wait to see the full stats on HDMI!

I'm trying to interpret the photos I see on Flickr. It seems that the Z3 is on par with or ahead of the laptop, while the TW4000 (with frame creation off) is on par with or behind the laptop. Is my interpretation correct? If so, then how come you say the TW4000 is as fast or faster than the Z3?

So you're saying that gaming with HDMI works well?

I have the Panny AE700 and desperately want to upgrade. I play games about 70% of the time on my pj, with movies only constituting 30% of the time.

Ouch. Well, have you tried enabling x.v.Color to see if the kicks the Reon into bypass mode?

with those sorts of numbers on the epson, exactly how much of a difference would that make while playing games? ive never owned a projector but am looking at getting one soon...it seems with frame creation off the epson was keeping up at the best while the sanyo was ahead sometimes...are the measurements on the epson "normal" so to speak for a projector?

As a avid gamer, I am glad to see a thread on input lag. Input lag with all of these fancy image processors is the bane of gamers everywhere! I went through the same thing trying to find a widescreen 24" LCD for my computer. Come to find out that most screens not only have lag, but significant lag. A good fast display for most people would be a half frame (8ms) or less of input lag. An acceptable display would be one full frame (16ms) of lag. Anything 32ms or over in my opinion is a show-stopper.
To the original poster, you must test with a CRT screen and not a laptop LCD. Your laptop screen will have lag and unless you test your laptop versus a CRT, you will not know how much lag. So your results are skewed to begin with. Altough, there are some LCD's like the one that I found for my computer, based on TN screen technology, that have 2ms or less of input lag.
I personally am looking at the Panasonic AE3000 as it has a input lag reduction gaming mode. Has anyone yet tested how fast the AE3000 is in this mode? Here is a quote from the Projector Central review of the AE3000:

"Gaming Mode. As far as gaming is concerned, video delay is not a good thing, and audio delay does not fix the problem. So the AE3000 has a feature which is not called Gaming Mode, but should be. It is called Frame Response, and it lets you adjust the speed of frame delivery from the buffer. Your options are "Normal" and "Fast." "Normal" will provide normal video processing and results in a frame delay of about 3 frames (assuming Frame Creation is off). "Fast" will eliminate some of the standard video processing overhead and cuts frame delay to about 1.5 frames. You can see the effect on lip synch when switching between Normal and Fast, as lip synch problems pretty much disappear in Fast mode. There is no way for a video picture to appear instantaneously with zero delay on any digital video display, so the Fast frame delivery feature on the AE3000 is about as good as it gets. Put the AE3000 into Fast frame response mode, select Dynamic calibration with a few color tweaks, and you end up with a magnificent high resolution gaming system.

(By the way, we tried to activate Frame Creation while setting Frame Response to "fast" to see if the projector would explode. Apparently, the engineers anticipated this. The AE3000 simply defaults to Frame Creation and ignores the fast Frame Response command. The AE3000 knows when it is in the hands of a stupid user.)"

He does not say how he came upon these numbers he is quoting. He says 1.5 frames of lag, or about 24ms in gaming mode! That is barely passable if it is true. The quoted number of three frames, or 48ms for normal mode is truely horrible. That is almost an entire 1/20th of a second which is really noticeable. I think you would have some lip sync issues watching movies with that much lag.

If the lag on the AE3000 really is that slow, I might have to look into other projectors like the Sanyo PLV-Z3000. Please, keep the posts coming on this important issue!

Panasonic projectors are very laggy. It's well known in these parts that Panasonic's Game Mode/Selective frame response option merely lower's the lag to that of an average non-gaming specific projector without a game mode.

1.5 frames of lag at 60hz input is 24ms, not 48. Your other numbers are off by 2x as well.

Yes, you are correct. I have edited the numbers. I am pretty sensitive when it comes to input lag so the projector with the lowest numbers will be the one I purchase.