Guide To Building A Media Storage Server - Page 223

Several months ago I got a 120mm fan wall straight from Norco, they were backordered at the time I placed my will call order but less than a week later they shipped it to me.

Thanks for the info (and to the other poster who directed me to buy straight from Norco - it says it fits the "new style" 4220 - wondering how I determine which style I have perhaps I'll just contact their support. Thanks all!

OK maybe someone can help me out here

I have an old Dell Poweredge 1600SC which is collecting dust, and was figuring I could turn it into a NAS.

Right now it has 6 drive bay SCSI with 2x40 gig HD's in a raid 1.

Since SCSI drives are too expensive, I figured I would take out the SCSI controller and drives and add a HD cage and a great controller card 3WARE AMCC 12 PORT SATA RAID CONTROLLER 9550SX-12SI

Not including HD, my cost so far would be about $200 plus the server.

I can even get a second CPU off e-bay for about $40.

Now this server is loud and big, but would be placing it under the stairs.

Or should I just go out and buy a NAS?

If it were me personally - I would start from scratch but I suppose it depends on how large you see your storage needs growing to.

When I first started I used an old Chieftec full tower case (had 10 drives in it) and never thought I'd need to add more. I began running out of room with my 750GB drives, but still couldn't force myself to toss them so I bit the bullet for the Norco 4220 and I couldn't be happy with that case for the price.

Just my opinion of course - I realize not everyone has the ability to spend $300 on a case!

Well I might have to go that route as the Dell Poweredge is not on the compatibility list for the 3WARE AMCC 12 PORT SATA RAID CONTROLLER 9550SX-12SI.

This seems like a great card and is being liquidated for $90 ea plus shipping.

I am now thinking of getting the 4020/4220 and getting 2 of these cards.

What motherboard are you using in your case?

Thanks

Hi everyone,

I just unboxed my new Norco 4224 and had a question after looking around through it. Does anyone have a recommended way of mounting two OS 2.5" hdds? I know with a SSD I could stick it to the side; is that still recommended for traditional drives?

I'd rather not use one of the 3.5" drive trays if I don't have to...

Thanks,
Ryan

There PCI carrier cards (no contacts though) that hold up to two 2.5" drives.. if you have spare slots.

^It's these... http://www.scythe-usa.com/product/ac...er_detail.html

I use them on 2 of my boxes.

i just finished building mine also...i mounted a 3.5 sideways in the case in front of the psu from the bottom using the holes for the redundant psu

I ordered the Norco 4224 yesterday and was hoping there would be a way to mount the OS drive inside the case also and have a couple questions...

Do the pci riser cards take up more than one slot? It's hard to tell from the pictures.
Were you able to get 2 screws in the sideways mounted drive, or just one?

Thanks guys. Just put in an order from one. For everyone else's benefit, I had a somewhat difficult time finding someone who was selling these for a relatively reasonable price. Some vendors are around 25$ when you include shipping. I got mine from: http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/scsra2hmo.html. Total was $12.25 shipped.

Thanks,
Ryan

Hi. First off I must say I'm based in the UK. Anyway, here goes:

I'll be building my HTPC shortly. Now, my budget is a bit limited so I'll have to spread the costs over time which rules out a big bang approach; instead, a steady upgrade path is the way to go. I've selected good HTPC components so that's not the issue. The one that is, is storage.

Initially the hard drives will be inside the HTPC itself - pretty much bog standard SATA drives and connections. I've chosen a mid-tower case that has six 3.5" bays plus four 5.25" ones. Storage will be added as needed, up to and including an enclosure that'll turn the 5.25" bays into something more useful (there are some nice units that turn three into five 3.5" ones).

But, of course, the day will come when I'll be running short of space and will want to add more.

I wondered if I could get some recommendations on this. As a starting point, I have no requirement to stream media all over the house, to other PC's, plsyers or anything else. This is purely a dedicated HTPC (that sits in the same room as everything else, right next to the AV gear) - it's all done for the convenience of centralising, organising and having a navigable library rather than the mess of CD's etc that I have now.

It would seem, therefore, that a DAS expansion rather than a full-blown NAS or WHS solution would be suitable. I've got my eyes on something like the Rosewill RSV-S8 which - as I understand it - simply gives you an 8-drive enclosure which includes 2 RAID controllers and connects via eSATA. Here in the UK we have a unit called the EdgeStore, which is just a rebadge I believe. The problem is that this unit seems to be largely becoming unavailable, I don't know why.

Is it possible to build a version of this oneself? I imagine that it could be done by utilising another tower case with appropriate power supply and controllers - the question, though, is which ones? All the ones I've seen require a motherboard etc (which kind of defeats the object)

If not, I guess I will have to go for a NAS. I don;t want a prebuilt (too expensive). Thoughts? It seems that in that case a relatively cheap and cheerful mobo/CPU plus controller cards, Gb ethernet & PSU would provide the hardware.

I don;t know Linux at all, so would WHS be a better way forward?

It seems a shame when all I want to do is build some relatively dumb storage expansion that will just sit right next to the HTPC.

Unless of course anyone has a different way of doing it.

Advice welcomed.

As I say, this is looking ahead to the future.

Hopefully by the time I;ve outgrown the combination above, there'll be bigger drives available rather than having to consider one of those rackmount jobs. As ever, the hardware choices are more limited here in the UK. Smaller market and fewer home theatres sadly.

I've built Server that has 16x2TB hd's and one SSD for the OS. I used Lian-Li PC-A70F case with two Lian-Li EX-23NB BLACK HDD EXTENSION KIT. I used one 16 channel Raid card, but you can get four channel cards for cheap, and start with one and just add another with additional HDs, nd another as time goes by. Make sure that the motherboard has at least 4 PCIx slots, and buy powerful enough processor since you will be using software Raid cards. Memory you can add as you build up. Also remember to get big enough power supply.

Good luck.

I just want to say that I've had a fantastic experience with unRaid. Setup and hardware selections were a breeze. Low power cheap hardware works perfectly.

So the suggestion is to just expand the storage directly in the HTPC itself rather than attempting to build a dedicated DAS or NAS, utilising a large tower. I had worried about heat but that case above appears to effectively deal with that. I wonder if it's available here..I bet not

The processing should be no issue as I plan to build my HTPC around a Sandy Bridge so there should be ample horsepower in that.

You can look at Amazon. I got the case here in US, but I know that it is available in Europe as I got side panel with two 14" fans from Amazon Germany. I have absolutely no heat problems with 16 HD and Adaptec Raid card that runs at normal operating temp of 70 deg Celsius.

I've done this. I outgrew my server case, and rather than buy a dedicated HD rack, I bought a PC case with lots of drive slots. One of the SATA cards in my server has 4 port multiplier capable eSATA ports, and I currently have two port multipliers for the extra case. I have a standard ATX power supply in that case, with the appropriate pins jumpered to force it to power up w/o a MB. Granted, part of my reasoning was because I wanted to allow for the option of adding another motherboard, as I may be building a firewall/router. So that one case can house both the MB for that, plus extra drives for the server. But even if I didn't want the MB mounting space, A PC case + PS + port multipliers is still quite a bit cheaper than most "pre-built" solutions.

I've used this port multiplier, which just mounts into a blank PCI bracket space in the new case, attached to one of these in my server. But if you already have a PM capable eSATA port, you don't need the card (but you need one eSATA port for every PM, which gives you 5 SATA ports each). I've seen that same PM for $45 since I bought it, but I can't remember where.

Ah, so basically (as I thought) to build the DAS I was thinking of, it's a question of:

Putting a card that has an eSATA port in the HTPC and then having a second case (tower) with lots of hard-drives and a PSU, plus SATA port multipliers that have an eSATA connection and connecting the two. With the proviso that the eSATA has to be port multiplier 'aware' (which mobo ones may not be)

Like this

HTPC>---eSATA card>---eSATA port>....cable.....eSATA port>--->SATA port multiplier>--->SATA port--->HDD>---DAS tower

With the port multiplier having as many SATA ports and HDD's as desired

This is another option to consider.

As I say, the main problem for me was to locate SATA port multipliers to sit in the DAS that didn't require a motherboard. You've linked to one, what search terms did you use to locate it?

Yes, correct. Most of the port multipliers I've seen have 5 ports on them (as they seem to all use the same Sil3726 Image chipset). The Meritline one I linked to doesn't list the chipset, but I emailed them and confirmed. I just search for "port multipler" or sata "port multiplier" or esata "port multiplier". They are quite numerous. Addonics is a popular vendor for them. They shouldn't need a motherboard; they just need a power supply connector (typically a floppy type connector), and one SATA "in" host port and five SATA "outs". Many do physically mount in a PCI slot of the case, but they don't electrically plug into a motherboard. You will find some that have an SATA "in" connector on the "inside" portion of the board, meant so you can add ports internally from within the same case, and some have an extrenal eSATA host port so you can bring the SATA connection from outside the case.

Also, that four port host adapter I listed isn't necessary. There are much cheaper two port cards you can get, like what would typically come with the external case you mentioned. But those typically connect to a PCIe 1x slot. A 1x slot doesn't have a lot of bandwidth (and the SiI3132 cards are known for having low bandwidth anyway). Not an issue if you're only accessing 1 or two drives at a time. The PCIe 8x card just has more bandwidth if you're simultaneously accessing a bunch of drives concurrently.

Most of the port multipliers I've look at have PCI edge connectors..are you saying they would work even if they're not plugged in to a mobo (so long as they have power via a floppy power cable)

Am I correct in saying that the way I would want to use it, the "host in" is via the eSATA, ie

HTPC>eSATA card>eSATA port> to eSATA port>Port multiplier card>DAS enclosure

The only one I could find that didn;t have such a motherboard edge connector was from Addonics - and, of course, you can't buy those here in the UK

AGHH

Sorry to be such a noob, I used to work in IT but I've gotten very rusty as I had to stop work and be a live-in carer for my disabled mom and dad, so much has changed in a few years

He is saying these specific PM's do not need to be placed in a motherboard.

They have a power connector. (check them here, no PCI connector)

Ones that have PCI connectors need to be placed in a MB

To be honest, I'm not sure if I've ever noticed any that had edge connectors, though it's certainly possible that some do have it just for power. But if you're searching for "port multiplier", you need to make sure you're looking at results for port multipliers, and not port multiplier capable host adapters. The latter shows up, even though that's not what you're looking for. Though you may need that too, because the host eSATA port DOES need to be port multiplier capable. Not all are, and most MB ports are not PM capable either. So you may need both the adapter card in the "main" PC, and the PM in the remote case. That would be the case even if you just got a drive enclosure IF it didn't come with a card. The enclosure has the PM part built in, and they often come with a card for the host PC, since many/most PCs don't already have ports that are Port Multiplier capable.

Sorry if I'm making this confusing.

Edit: you said you can't get the Addonics there, but they are available from a lot of vendors (see here). Also, I mentioned that I bought one of the Meritline PMs, but the other one I have is a Datoptic SPM3726, if that helps. There are a lot of them under different names, but they are all pretty much the same.

Ah thanks. After much tooth-grindingly frustrating googling using addonics parts numbers I have found a company based in the UK that acts as a reseller for addonics products here. They have everything I would need.

I'm aware that there are suppliers in the States who will ship here, but sadly, this usually means paying a hefty markup in shipping fees plus Customs duties on top, and defective item return is a nightmare.

The addonics HPM-XA Enclosure Version card does the same job and you can buy an adapter bracket that allows it to attach to a PCI expansion plate. Sadly the internal version lacks the necessary eSATA port. Naturally, the UK shop does the port multiplier but not the 99c adapter ...

Alternatively, I'll have to ask my US pal for a favour

It's possibly because of the larger market you have in the States, it invariably means you have more to choose from and there's sufficient demand for even relatively obscure products due to the much larger consumer base. Sure, the EU is even larger but it's way more fragmented for stuff like this - someone in Idaho can happily shop online and buy stuff from a specialist store in Florida...in theory I can do that here, but a specialist store located somewhere in Denmark is hardly accessible to me here in England even though there are similarly no customs or import restrictions.

Virtually ALL of the port multipliers here are of the host type rather than the sort you can put in an enclosure. The Addonics one you've provided a Google Shop link to is of the Enclosure type and isn't designed for a PC case with PCI expansion slots and, whilst the Addonics reseller here does the card it doesn't sell the necessary adapter you can screw onto the rear plate which probably costs less than a buck

I;ve found a few port multiplier cards that look right mostly from Lycom, but so far, they've all lacked the necessary eSATA port - whilst they're fine for fitting inside a PC tower and don;t require a mobo, they are strictly "internal" only and just take one SATA port and turn it into five. I guess they'll be for people who have space but are short of slots on their mobo.

It's all so frustrating, I'm nearly there but not quite.

This all said, Addonics do some quite nice little hard-drive enclosure standalone units (which that UK store does have) at fairly reasonable prices. They only hold four drives, but probably by the time I need extra storage, 4Tb drives will have appeared and four of those would keep me going.

You weren;t being confusing at all, I was just being a bit dense, plus, there's the issue that things that are relatively common and easy to locate where you are just aren't around over here.

Thanks for taking the time to put up with me and my endless questions. It's all fascinating stuff. AT least I got the basic principles right!

Just to make sure there's no confusion, the host adapters aren't another type of port multiplier, they are SATA host adapters that are port multiplier capable. In other words, you can't plug a port multiplier into just ANY SATA or eSATA port, that port has to be capable of supporting a port multiplier. Some PCs have an eSATA port that is port multiplier capable. I think it's less common for the internal ports. But regardless, you need to confirm that YOUR port can handle port multipliers (and more specifically, FIS switching port multipliers). If not, you will need to get an adapter card to put in your PC to get a compatible port. That's why the external enclosures sometimes come with a card for the host PC.

Yes, more specifically, it's a SCSI-I format. That just happens to be how Addonics chooses to physically package it, and offers the PCI bracket for those cases. That was one of the reasons I went with the Meritline one. But you could always just place it behind an open PCI slot, then get a washer or something to fasten it to the case (screw going through washer, into bracket, so bracket & washer sandwich the case slots).


If those are much more easily or cheaply found, you could always get one of those and an SATA-eSATA cable. Just pass the cable through an open PCI bracket slot, and connect to the internal connector.

All good points. It's just that the eSATA solution is, well, a little more elegant.

And indeed, as you say, there is the approach of using a screw and washer for those adaptec ones

Yes I was aware that you have to make sure that you're connecting the multiplier to a port that is capable of supporting them and that some mobo based ones aren't. As I recall, the mobo I'm looking at doesn;t even have an eSATA port.

Ok, just making sure it was all clear. I certainly understand the desire to keep everything "clean", I just wasn't sure how desperate you were. I've been known to rig a few things to save some bucks, or just make them doable.

I've also managed to locate a second store that does everything I need (even the little adaptor brackets for PCI bases cases, should one be needed.

They also do a rather neat little 5-bay enclosure, it's just a five-drive box with one on those port multipliers already in it but sadly it's really built for 5.25" drives and whilst it comes with rails that permit the use of 3.5" drives the enclosures are enormous. Shame.

I am new to the site but have been streaming video for awhile just been using the xbox or xbox 360 as my device. I am going to finally build a HTPC but am having a issue, I am going to get rid of cable and all that and going to use my HPTC for everything and will have a lot of content. I have a old machine that I was wondering if I could turn it into a Home Server for storage. I was looking at a free NAS Server, not sure if my old machine has the capabilities to do this. Its an oldy, it has the Asus ASUS A7V266-E motherboard and a AMD Athlon XP 1600+ cpu. It is in a big case and I could fit 6-8 HDD's in it, I was hoping I could just update the power supply and then get a PCI SATA Controller Card or a couple to start. I would just probably have 2, 2 TB hard drives to start and then add more as needed.

I'm building a new file server and I'm still looking for components, came across the Supermicro X8ST3-F which again lead me to the X8SIA-F.

The thing is that I need enough connections to connect 20+2 drives internally, and then I want to have PCI-E slot free so I can add external exclosures aswell.

Any thoughts on either of those, or any other suggestions?