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Official Sony XBR8 Series Owner's Thread - Page 162

post #4831 of 5405
7/3/10 at 9:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddddd55555 View Post

I may need to replace a 46xbr4 and have noticed the price of the 46xbr8 is lower than that of the xbr10, hx800 and especially the 909- would the xbr8 be the way to go or am I missing anything here?

I would get an XBR8 if you still can UNLESS you care about having 3D, in which case I would say to choose between the Sony HX800 and HX909.
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post #4832 of 5405
7/4/10 at 8:53am
My 46X4500 was calibrated yesterday.

Dimitri used a AVS HD calibrationdisk,first he calibrated input HDMI 1 after that he calibrated input HDMI 2,in both cases the PS3 was connected.

My first impression:The dark areas are darker than before - better motion - better colors ( before calibration colors were to blueish).

A ISF calibrator told me once that only one HDMI input needed to be calibrated ,the settings could be copied to HDMI input 2,3 etc,its seems that this is not true.

The service menu was not entered during calibration.

The settings (for a dark room with dimmed light behind the TV):
  • Target Inputs: HDMI 1 ( HD SatelliteReceiver)
    Picture Mode:Cinema
    Backlight:1
    Contrast:60
    Brightness:51
    Colour:44
    ColourTemp:Warm 2
    Sharpness:50
    Gamma:low
    LED Dynamic Control:Standard
    R gain:-2
    G gain: 0
    B gain:-6
    R bias:-1
    G bias: 0
    B bias:+1
  • Target Inputs: HDMI 2 ( PlayStation 3)
    Picture Mode:Cinema
    Backlight:2
    Contrast:55
    Brightness:51
    Colour:39
    ColourTemp:Warm 2
    Sharpness:35
    Gamma:low
    LED Dynamic Control:standard
    R gain:-3
    G gain:-1
    B gain:-6
    R bias:-1
    G bias: 0
    B bias:+1

 

Emile - Detailed Calibration Summary.pdf 26.1533203125k . file
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post #4833 of 5405
7/5/10 at 9:27pm
is the 46X4500 the XBR8 in some other country? may try these settings for my 55XBR8 if so.
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post #4834 of 5405
7/5/10 at 9:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by celldweller View Post

is the 46X4500 the XBR8 in some other country? may try these settings for my 55XBR8 if so.

Yep, European.
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post #4835 of 5405
7/7/10 at 8:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post

My 46X4500 was calibrated yesterday.

Dimitri used a AVS HD calibrationdisk,first he calibrated input HDMI 1 after that he calibrated input HDMI 2,in both cases the PS3 was connected.

My first impression:The dark areas are darker than before - better motion - better colors ( before calibration colors were to blueish).

A ISF calibrator told me once that only one HDMI input needed to be calibrated ,the settings could be copied to HDMI input 2,3 etc,its seems that this is not true.

The service menu was not entered during calibration.

The settings (for a dark room with dimmed light behind the TV):
  • Target Inputs: HDMI 1 ( HD SatelliteReceiver)
    Picture Mode:Cinema
    Backlight:1
    Contrast:60
    Brightness:51
    Colour:44
    ColourTemp:Warm 2
    Sharpness:50
    Gamma:low
    LED Dynamic Control:Standard
    R gain:-2
    G gain: 0
    B gain:-6
    R bias:-1
    G bias: 0
    B bias:+1
  • Target Inputs: HDMI 2 ( PlayStation 3)
    Picture Mode:Cinema
    Backlight:2
    Contrast:55
    Brightness:51
    Colour:39
    ColourTemp:Warm 2
    Sharpness:35
    Gamma:low
    LED Dynamic Control:standard
    R gain:-3
    G gain:-1
    B gain:-6
    R bias:-1
    G bias: 0
    B bias:+1

Hello 8mile13,

I thought you may want to try these to modifications to your settings. This is for the HD/satellite input.

The contrast (picture) setting seems too low. Try taking it up to (to your liking) 80-85 range . Also, try bumping up the color to 48-49.
I also noticed you didn't list the hue setting. Red -2 is what works for me.

Then again, we all see it differently and opinions vary, so if you're totally pleased with your settings please disregard these suggestions and enjoy!

best,
Tom
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post #4836 of 5405
7/7/10 at 10:22am
Quote:
Originally Posted by trcnet View Post

Hello 8mile13,

I thought you may want to try these to modifications to your settings. This is for the HD/satellite input.

The contrast (picture) setting seems too low. Try taking it up to (to your liking) 80-85 range . Also, try bumping up the color to 48-49.
I also noticed you didn't list the hue setting. Red -2 is what works for me.

Then again, we all see it differently and opinions vary, so if you're totally pleased with your settings please disregard these suggestions and enjoy!

best,
Tom

Thanks for your advise,always good to hear peoples opinions.

When i watch TV its always very dark in the room because of that he set contrast very low(the 'space' between dark and light is more extreem than before, this tells me that contrast has improved) .

I'm not an expert but it makes sense to me lowering color with Warm2 (color 44/warm 2 - color 39/warm2 seems about right).
Before calibration colorsetting was 'normal' ,some colors looked strange this problem is gone.

My xbr8 is european(46X4500),no hue adjustments possible in Europe.

My main problem:
Some bluraydisks are too sharp,i can set sharpness to zero and it still will be a probem (example: Underworld Rise of the Lycans , Sin City).
It seems to me there is nothing i can do to get rid of this,xbr8 is naturally sharp - PS3 is naturally sharp - .
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post #4837 of 5405
7/7/10 at 11:21am
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post

Thanks for your advise,always good to hear peoples opinions.

When i watch TV its always very dark in the room because of that he set contrast very low(the 'space' between dark and light is more extreem than before, this tells me that contrast has improved) .

I'm not an expert but it makes sense to me lowering color with Warm2 (color 44/warm 2 - color 39/warm2 seems about right).
Before calibration colorsetting was 'normal' ,some colors looked strange this problem is gone.

My xbr8 is european(46X4500),no hue adjustments possible in Europe.

My main problem:
Some bluraydisks are too sharp,i can set sharpness to zero and it still will be a probem (example: Underworld Rise of the Lycans , Sin City).
It seems to me there is nothing i can do to get rid of this,xbr8 is naturally sharp - PS3 is naturally sharp - .

Hello 8mile13,

You obviously know what you are after in picture quality and know what you are doing. I'm glad to hear you're enjoying your xbr8 and the calibration you had done to it. It's interesting to find out the european X4500 doesn't have a setting for hue. Any idea why?

best,
Tom
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post #4838 of 5405
7/7/10 at 1:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post

My main problem:
Some bluraydisks are too sharp,i can set sharpness to zero and it still will be a probem (example: Underworld Rise of the Lycans , Sin City).
It seems to me there is nothing i can do to get rid of this,xbr8 is naturally sharp - PS3 is naturally sharp - .

What DRC settings do you use? Have you tried playing with the DRC palette?
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post #4839 of 5405
7/7/10 at 1:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by trcnet View Post

Hello 8mile13,

You obviously know what you are after in picture quality and know what you are doing. I'm glad to hear you're enjoying your xbr8 and the calibration you had done to it. 's interesting to find out the european X4500 doesn't have a setting for hue. Any idea why?

best,
Tom

This article says:

PAL vs. NTSC ,NationalTelevisionSystemCommittee receivers have a tint control to perform colour correction manually.The PhaseAlternateLine standard automatically removes hue errors by utilising phase alternation of the colour signal,so a tint control is unnecessary.
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post #4840 of 5405
7/7/10 at 2:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benny42 View Post

What DRC settings do you use? Have you tried playing with the DRC palette?

When i watch SDtv and dvd's DRC is mostly 20-35/1,there is no sharpness problem.

Tonight i watched Germany vs. Spain 720p ARD with sharpness zero/Motionflow clear DRC off,it looked great,in general live HD on satellite-tv looks great,most recorded HD on satellite-tv i don't like.

1080p24 with DRCpalette? I never tried 1080p24 with DRC1 (DRC2 is only available with 1080i content).

After reading this thread sharpness goes to zero with 720p,1080i and 1080p material on my TV this helps a bit.
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post #4841 of 5405
7/8/10 at 7:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post

After reading this thread sharpness goes to zero with 720p,1080i and 1080p material on my TV this helps a bit.

The original poster in that thread talks about a number of different things, and calls them all "sharpness". In addition to picture quality, he also seems to be talking about motion smoothing. He also says that the picture is "too sharp" because the film grain is erased, which is the opposite of sharpening. Sharpening enhances edge contrast, so it should increase graininess.

Sharpness always adds something artificial to the input signal, and while it can be useful in enhancing the display of standard-def content on an HD screen, it always takes you away from the original HD content. If you want to get as close as possible to the HD content being sent to your TV, you should turn off sharpness completely when watching HD content. While some people may prefer to add sharpness, that's a matter of personal taste, and will only take you further away from the intended image.
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post #4842 of 5405
7/8/10 at 8:48am
This article 'Quick and Dirty TV Setup' Step 3: Tone down the Sharpness says: 'Often,the video that you're watching might already have had it's own Sharpening applied.Sadly,this process is very common,and once video has been Sharpened,there's almost nothing you can do about it.'
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post #4843 of 5405
7/8/10 at 12:59pm
That's true of almost all processing. You only receive the processed signal, so you can't magically extract the signal as it existed before it was processed.
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post #4844 of 5405
7/8/10 at 1:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post

When i watch SDtv and dvd's DRC is mostly 20-35/1,there is no sharpness problem.

Tonight i watched Germany vs. Spain 720p ARD with sharpness zero/Motionflow clear DRC off,it looked great,in general live HD on satellite-tv looks great,most recorded HD on satellite-tv i don't like.

1080p24 with DRCpalette? I never tried 1080p24 with DRC1 (DRC2 is only available with 1080i content).

After reading this thread sharpness goes to zero with 720p,1080i and 1080p material on my TV this helps a bit.

Hmm... In this case I can only give you a different opinion:

Motionflow on Clear gives you the highest motion sharpness but shouldn't affect still images (except for the reduced brightness, doh!).

I usually don't enable DRC at all (sometimes for SD video material, not with games) so I rely mostly on the Sharpness control and the enhancers in the advanced picture settings to get the "original" sharpness - not oversharpened, not visibly smoothened.

My general settings for the X4500, optimized with test images:
- Sharpness: 70
- DRC: Off
- Detail Enhancer: Medium
- Edge Enhancer: Off

The test image I use for tweaking the sharpness has colored lines on a gray background. When setting the sharpness too low the colored lines bleed out, when setting it too high the gray background next to the colored lines gets a darker than it should. The job is finding the sweet spot between these two extremes.

By enabling the Detail Enhancer one already enters the realm of artificial sharpening. Setting it to Medium is a nice compromise IMHO as it doesn't make the test images look bad -- and of course it's a matter of taste in the end...
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post #4845 of 5405
7/8/10 at 1:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evan E View Post

That's true of almost all processing. You only receive the processed signal, so you can't magically extract the signal as it existed before it was processed.

What one must also realize is that every display only produces an interpretation of the data. If one is lucky it is very close to the original material...
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post #4846 of 5405
7/9/10 at 7:08am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benny42 View Post

Hmm... In this case I can only give you a different opinion:

Motionflow on Clear gives you the highest motion sharpness but shouldn't affect still images (except for the reduced brightness, doh!).

I usually don't enable DRC at all (sometimes for SD video material, not with games) so I rely mostly on the Sharpness control and the enhancers in the advanced picture settings to get the "original" sharpness - not oversharpened, not visibly smoothened.

My general settings for the X4500, optimized with test images:
- Sharpness: 70
- DRC: Off
- Detail Enhancer: Medium
- Edge Enhancer: Off

The test image I use for tweaking the sharpness has colored lines on a gray background. When setting the sharpness too low the colored lines bleed out, when setting it too high the gray background next to the colored lines gets a darker than it should. The job is finding the sweet spot between these two extremes.

By enabling the Detail Enhancer one already enters the realm of artificial sharpening. Setting it to Medium is a nice compromise IMHO as it doesn't make the test images look bad -- and of course it's a matter of taste in the end...

You have to keep in mind that my TV is calibrated a week ago,its like buying a new TV,i have to get used to the new settings.

I have one question:

Before calibration motionflow 'clear' seemed instable,i did not like it.
After calibration motionflow 'clear' looks great.

What do i have to do to compensate when using motionflow 'clear'? I read somewhere Backlight should be up 2-4 points when using motionflow 'clear'.
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post #4847 of 5405
7/9/10 at 9:22am
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post

You have to keep in mind that my TV is calibrated a week ago,its like buying a new TV,i have to get used to the new settings.

I have one question:

Before calibration motionflow 'clear' seemed instable,i did not like it.
After calibration motionflow 'clear' looks great.

What do i have to do to compensate when using motionflow 'clear'? I read somewhere Backlight should be up 2-4 points when using motionflow 'clear'.

You want to keep your backlighting as low as possible (1-3 for me).
Bump your Contrast setting to offset the motionflow Clear setting.
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post #4848 of 5405
7/10/10 at 5:24am
I naturally don't like backlight ,i always kept it low (1 or 0).

I took a look yesterday and could see no difference between motionflow 'off' and 'clear',on my blurayplayer i tried some DVE-HD testpatterns and could see no difference,in this case i see no need to change backlight or contrast.
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post #4849 of 5405
7/10/10 at 11:46am
could i get some suggestions on settings for White Balance using Warm 1 as the color space? i really like the look of it compared to Warm 2 however it seems to be a bit heavy on the blue and maybe green and i'm not sure how to adjust correctly.
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post #4850 of 5405
7/10/10 at 12:54pm
All pro-calibrated reviews i have seen use warm 2,you could try Color:35-45 and Colourtemp:warm 2;for best settings hire a pro-calibrator,each tv will give a different result,each HDMI-input will give a different result.
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post #4851 of 5405
7/10/10 at 1:39pm
i'm not really a fan of the hue warm 2 gives to the overall picture but to each their own...i will try your recommendation though thanks. also is their a certain HDMI input i should use for say cable tv and gaming? right now i have my PS3 and 360 on HDMI 1 and comcast cable set to HDMI 3. EDIT: 8mile i tried your above settings which seem to look pretty good although maybe a tad dim but i was wondering if you could post the advanced settings ect. i'm not sure what to put them at so right now i'm just using the cnet advanced settings
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post #4852 of 5405
7/11/10 at 7:59am

The last thing i did before calibration was changing Warm 2 into Warm 1 because i did not like it ( too yellowish),after calibration Warm 2 looks allright.

The calibrator prefered Picture Mode Cinema.

Keep in mind i own the European 46X4500.

Pro calibration http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=4832

Set-up:
Auto S Video: on
AV2 Output: auto
Power Saving: off
Light Sensor: off
Logo Illumination: off

Video Settings:
Motionflow: Clear http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1269915
Motionflow: Clear2(HX909) http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=179
Motionflow: Motion Resolution http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...77&postcount=3

Motionflow: Off
Film Mode: Auto 1
Game/Text Mode: off*
x.v.Colour: Auto
Photo Colour Space: sYCC
RGB Dynamic Range: limited or auto
Colour Matrix: ITU709 ( HD colorspace)

Screen:
Display Area: normal (SD), 1+/full pixel (HD 720/1080) or Auto

Picture:
Picture Mode: cinema
Sharpness1 http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...9&postcount=20
Noise Reduction: low * (non blu-ray sources)
MPEG Noice Reduction: off
DRC Mode: off http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=4748

Black Corrector: off
Adv.Contrast Enhancer: off
Gamma: low
LED Dynamic Control: standard = Local Dimming ON
Auto Light Limiter: off
Clear White: off
Colour Space: standard
Live Colour: off

Detail Enhancer: off
Edge Enhancer: off


*Game/Text Mode:Yesterday i did some gaming ( Metal Gear Solid),i saw no problems,if you see problems ( input lag ) try Game Text/Mode: on

*Noise Reduction:
CNet ''the sony's noise reduction was superb''
LCdTV buying guide '' 720p/1080i/1080p Picture Quality: One feature that we found necessary was the Noise reduction feature - We do not normal recommend using many of the 'enhancing' features preset on todays TVs which typically add video noise.However,the Noise Reduction option on the XBR8 is a favorable feature.We recommend placing it on the medium setting which greatly helps to reduce background motion artifacts without softening the picture too much.''


 


Edited by 8mile13 - 11/6/12 at 3:51pm
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post #4853 of 5405
7/12/10 at 7:14pm
thanks for posting your settings. i will post my game and cable settings here soon...i think i've finally settled on what i like. i just received my new remote and owners manual today which the store i bought from ordered from Sony since they couldn't find the originals. i really really love this set!!!!
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post #4854 of 5405
7/13/10 at 9:18pm
I got the last display 46 XBR 8 at a Best Buy Magnolia about a month ago. I love the gorgeous picture, but I'm kind of disappointed in the highly-touted black performance of this TV. When the screen is black such as before the credits in a movie start, my screen is FAR from being totally black. I can see all kinds of areas of gray and almost even greenish gray areas.

Has anyone else experienced this? I have my backlight set to only 2 and I copied my picture settings off of one of the recommended ones on this thread. Like I said, the screen is great, but it seems like the black are no better or even worse than my XBR5.
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post #4855 of 5405
7/14/10 at 2:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jockewing View Post

I got the last display 46 XBR 8 at a Best Buy Magnolia about a month ago. I love the gorgeous picture, but I'm kind of disappointed in the highly-touted black performance of this TV. When the screen is black such as before the credits in a movie start, my screen is FAR from being totally black. I can see all kinds of areas of gray and almost even greenish gray areas.

Has anyone else experienced this? I have my backlight set to only 2 and I copied my picture settings off of one of the recommended ones on this thread. Like I said, the screen is great, but it seems like the black are no better or even worse than my XBR5.

This behaviour doesn't sound normal to me but it could very well be unoptimized picture settings. Also the bit about "greenish-gray" sounds weird.

What sources do you watch, by the way? Are you sure the TV is the culprit?
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post #4856 of 5405
7/14/10 at 5:37am
yeah that's not normal-check your settings and your input. I have a 46xbr8 and its pretty black- it's not perfect black (that would be my pioneer krp-500m kuro where the screen can go pitch black), but it's really really good
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post #4857 of 5405
7/14/10 at 7:19am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jockewing View Post

I got the last display 46 XBR 8 at a Best Buy Magnolia about a month ago. I love the gorgeous picture, but I'm kind of disappointed in the highly-touted black performance of this TV. When the screen is black such as before the credits in a movie start, my screen is FAR from being totally black. I can see all kinds of areas of gray and almost even greenish gray areas.

I'll echo others in saying that's in no way my experience. I remember seeing a grayish-green tint to dark areas when I had Game Mode on, which turns off local dimming. Are you sure you have local dimming on? Without that, you're missing the whole point of the XBR8.
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post #4858 of 5405
7/14/10 at 7:42am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jockewing View Post

I got the last display 46 XBR 8 at a Best Buy Magnolia about a month ago. I love the gorgeous picture, but I'm kind of disappointed in the highly-touted black performance of this TV. When the screen is black such as before the credits in a movie start, my screen is FAR from being totally black. I can see all kinds of areas of gray and almost even greenish gray areas.

Has anyone else experienced this? I have my backlight set to only 2 and I copied my picture settings off of one of the recommended ones on this thread. Like I said, the screen is great, but it seems like the black are no better or even worse than my XBR5.

Yes, the US XBR8 models do give a green tint to the screen that is noticable from off angles. The backlight and other components are the cause (RGGB backlighting). Having a wide color gamut has it's own problems... but is a plus for me (not the viewing angles, but the color fidelity).

I had the same thoughts about black level on this TV before purchasing (55" XBR8 vs 50" PRO-101FD vs 52" XBR9)... though ensuring that local diming is enabled, and in a home environment the black levels of this set can be better appreciated. Not quite the same as PDP fade out, but similar. The other cool thing about the XBR8 is that the screen goes completely black on fadeouts! Fun!

At this point in time, I'd check out the HX909 instead. While I strongly dislike the pixel structure of Sharp LCD panels (like the one used in the HX909), the overall picture is superb, and provides the next generation of Motion Flow "Clear" settings. Clear 2 adds BFI - a progression from the XBR8's scanning backlight of it's "Clear" setting.
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post #4859 of 5405
7/14/10 at 7:57am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evan E View Post

I'll echo others in saying that's in no way my experience. I remember seeing a grayish-green tint to dark areas when I had Game Mode on, which turns off local dimming. Are you sure you have local dimming on? Without that, you're missing the whole point of the XBR8.

Even with game mode on, the overall picture was still ahead of say, the XBR9. (IMHO )
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post #4860 of 5405
7/14/10 at 9:13am
jockewing,

First go to Video Settings,Game/Text Mode should be Off.

Second go to Picture , Advanced Settings , LED Dynamic Control (local dimming) should be set to Standard.


Third Cable and Satellite are dirty sources,try a recent Bluray movie and take a look at the blacks in the endcredits.


I own the X3500 (xbr5) and the X4500 (xbr8),the blacks on the xbr8 are much better,the xbr8 outperformes the xbr5 in many ways.
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