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Best Buy Uses Tricks To Sell Calibration Service: ESPN And ESPN HD On Same Models TVs

post #1 of 32
Thread Starter 
Sorry if this is in the wrong subforum, mods, please move if necessary....I just saw this article and I HAD to show you guys....this really takes the cake, a la Monster Cable-esque deception. This is almost exactly what Monster has tried in the past to make their cables seem superior. PLEASE ppl, DO NOT buy BB's "calibration" service...tell your friends and family!

http://consumerist.com/5074930/best-...t-regular-espn

Quoted from article:

I've read some bad Best Buy stories in my time here at The Consumerist, but this one really takes the ******* cake. To sell its special HDTV calibration service, this Best Buy in NC set up two identical model HDTVs, both showing ESPN. As seen in the picture tipster Robert took, the "calibrated" one is noticeably better. That's because it's showing ESPN HD and the one on the left is showing just regular ESPN. You can also see how a set of box have been placed in front of the non-calibrated tv on the left so you can't see that's it not ESPN HD. That, my friends, is quintessential deceptive marketing. Robert's story of what he saw, and the rivers of ******** and non-answer that came out of the Best Buy employees' mouths when he confronted them about it, inside...

Dear Consumerist,

While helping my father look for an HDTV at the newest Best Buy in Charlotte, NC this Sunday, I came across their demo display of their color calibration service. On the left side of the demo, they had a HDTV tuned to ESPN, and on the right, there was the exact same model of TV presumably tuned to the same station, but with a far superior picture. The difference between the two was remarkable; the left one was grainy and blurry while the right one looked sharp and detailed. Thinking that something was not right, I took a further look at the demo and realized that the inferior tv on the left was turned to plain old ESPN, and the superior tv on the right was tuned to ESPN HD. What's even worse is they had a box for their Black Tie TV Protection Plan strategically placed so that when looking at the display from most angles, it covered up the ESPN logo on the left tv as to disguise the fact that it was not an HD channel.

Having figured out the nature of their scam, I went to talk to one of the employees. I showed him the TVs, and he didn't have much to say besides that the color calibration service would decrease power consumption on my TV by 30%, which if I am not mistaken, a flat out lie.

Another employee overheard our conversation, and would at first, not admit that one tv had an HD signal and that the other one did not. He insisted that the difference was strictly because of their color calibration. Not wanting to let him get away with his BS, I told him that his claim was impossible, and finally got him to admit not only that I was right, but also that the tv with the standard signal was set to stretch the picture out (presumably to make the picture even worse). He then say that it would probably help to set the TVs to the same channel, but he "didn't know where the remote was."

By that point I was tired of the crap flowing out of his mouth, so I proceeded to shop around. Ten minutes later when I was ready to leave, I passed by the demo again only to find that the employee had done nothing, and that it was just as misleading as it was before.

This is just a cheap tactic to get people to buy into their crappy calibration service, which I could probably do myself with a half hour of playing with the settings on my TV. While I noticed the scam, I highly doubt that my 70+ year old father would.

Attached is a picture I quickly snapped with my iPhone. It's not the best, but you can still see that the right one is set on ESPN HD while the left one is just regular ESPN. I guess this is just another example of Best Buys classy business practices.

-Robert
post #2 of 32
that Robert guy is a moron and so are about 90% of the people that replied to that
post #3 of 32
Thread Starter 
How so?
post #4 of 32
just because that particular store has a shady demo doesnt mean that you shouldnt buy the service

a good calibration takes me aboout 2 hours, and ive done almost 700. you have no idea what you are talking about if you think you can do anything by playing around with it for 30 minutes
post #5 of 32
Best buy has plano's sent out to each store to tell them what to hook up and where. The display that you mention should have ether 2 Panasonic 42" plasmas or 2 LG 42" plasmas. The one on the right calibrated and the one on the left not calibrated. Also sent along with this planogram is an HDMI splitter. It is meant to be set up with one HD DirecTV outputting one HDMI signal out to two seperate TVs. Dont blame every best buy because one home theater departments sup was too ignorant to see if the display was setup correctly.
post #6 of 32
I hate when people try to go out of their way to catch a retailer in a lie. get a life. I highly doubt this guy just happened to notice, he was probably looking for it.

Anyways, when I used to work at Best Buy, I was in Houston for a summer and we had one of the TVs (a 42" Panasonic plasma) calibrated and the other not, but they were both tuned to the same HD source. So I think this Robert guy is full of crap. As said earlier, just because one shady Best Buy store did this does NOT represent their entire company. And their calibration service is actually decent. Not as good as a true ISF professional, but they do a decent job as many on this forum can vouch.
post #7 of 32
Part of the problem is that most people think calibration is nothing but smoke and mirrors. Stunts like this do nothing to help things out. I doubt that this is a common occurance at most Best Buys though.
post #8 of 32
If you're concerned about the efficacy of BB's calibration services, that's one thing. Please do not confuse these dumb kids' tactics with the need to calibrate; it's still a great idea, albeit perhaps not from BB...

Quote:
Originally Posted by CURX8 View Post

I hate when people try to go out of their way to catch a retailer in a lie. get a life. I highly doubt this guy just happened to notice, he was probably looking for it.

Sometimes I wonder why people feel the need to cause a scene at a store, when they KNOW that BB/CC/ULT are masters of failure. Do people seek out things like this? I suppose the need to be an internet hero overcomes all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sperron View Post

Part of the problem is that most people think calibration is nothing but smoke and mirrors.

Some people think the earth is flat also, but these people can also be ignored.
post #9 of 32
Copied from my post on CEPro

I am a Magnolia Senior at a best buy in California. This story is just downright irresponsible. How exactly does a random guy who is so obviously sending in a story about a bad experience at a store in a heated state of mind with his evidence being an iPhone picture make a big CEPRO headline exactly?

First of all, the display in this article is brand new. Up until anywhere from 2 weeks ago to now(depending on the store's merchandising team), this display was simply to show you the difference in a DirecTV Standard Definition vs. High Definition channel and why you need to upgrade whatever TV service you have, and it was chock full of SD vs HD banners and signs. There was an SD box and an HD box feeding the Televisions the two different sources. Most stores during this time used it as a calibration demonstration as well using a blu-ray player split to both TVs(its the only place in the entire store that conveniently has two identical TVs side-by-side, thus the only place this demonstration is easy to set up). Demonstrating a calibration simply involved switching inputs to the BD player to show off the difference in color accuracy.

Corporate offices have changed that signage over to Calibration service signage(theres even a note on the signage that asks you to ask an associate to see the difference) and to use a BD player on a seperate input to show the benefits of the service. There are also watt minders to show the power differences between the two.

Some stores, due to the new display, haven't quite gotten used to setting the display on the blu-ray demo instead of the Directv demo. While this is unfortunate, as is a few bad egg associates who are ill-informed, it is certainly not headline news worthy for even the National Star.

As a side note, the part that is really funny about all of this is the fact that most of these stores have stopped using this as their go-to calibration demo. This display is paid for by LG to have two Plasma TVs set there. LGs are the worst TVs on the market to have calibrated, and anyone using that particular place to demo the service anymore is just hurting their business.

If you see this happening at any store, I urge you to contact the stores General Manager, Home Theater Supervisor, Corporate Office, or ISF directly so that you can set the store straight. If they indeed are saying that the SD vs HD difference is a result of the service, they should not be allowed to sell that service. It gives the Imaging Science Foundation a bad name.
post #10 of 32
A had a WH 47" go bad. One year later BB said they would replace it. I went to BB & they dont carry the 47" WH anymore. The prices dropped so i had a choice of any TV, pay more or get a refund BB card. Samsung was sold out. If i left without a TV that day there was a chance a would get the same WH, i went with the LG.

I do own two Sharps, & the LG was calibrated by BB for free. It took well over an hour & it made a huge difference!

Its a great picture, im very happy with it & BBs calibration service. I didnt plan on having this done, im glad it was free, and i would never got a picture like i have now by playing with the TV for a 1/2 hour.

I seen pics of "much better" LCD TVs on other HD forums calibrated with DVDs & my picture blows them away.
Just my 2¢
post #11 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by ainlawls View Post

This story is just downright irresponsible.

It most certainly is not. A misrepresentation of services hurts not only Best Buy, but also the ISF who is partnering with Best Buy as well as all calibration professionals. I've already seen posters in other places citing this story as proof that calibration is all smoke and mirrors. Regardless of how Best Buy screwed up, the damage is already done.

Now if you want to take issue with how the story was presented or written, that's a seperate issue. Bad journalism takes place everywhere these days. Outlets attempt to sensationlize everything they can. This still doesn't excuse the fact that Best Buy made the error.
post #12 of 32
I find it funny that Bestbuy employees , Magnolia or regular think they know everything about what they sell. I would never get a Calibration done by Best Buy. Bestbuy will go bankrupt in 4 years anyways. They all do! I just walked into my local Walmart that was remodeled. As soon as i walked in i thought i walked into bestbuy. It was designed to a middleclassier level like bestbuy. Time to buy walmart STOCK!!!
post #13 of 32
The guy who "broke the story" on this is an idiot
post #14 of 32
How so? Because he caught BB in deceptive practices?
I have been to many Best Buys and have not seen this so I am sure this is not their general practice. But this store sure is misleading the consumer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mattf2686 View Post

The guy who "broke the story" on this is an idiot
post #15 of 32
It is intentional here in Gainesville. I assumed it was just stupidity or lack of understanding, but after asking about it, I found that they had no intention of actually comparing calibrated and uncalibrated sets with the same signal or even resolution. The salesman told me that it was their policy to display them this way and argued that it was a fair comparison.
post #16 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by lcaillo View Post

It is intentional here in Gainesville. I assumed it was just stupidity or lack of understanding, but after asking about it, I found that they had no intention of actually comparing calibrated and uncalibrated sets with the same signal or even resolution. The salesman told me that it was their policy to display them this way and argued that it was a fair comparison.

Considering Best Buy is where a majority of the public is going to first hear about calibration, this is totally unacceptable. I wonder if the ISF has any recourse since they are partnered with Best Buy. It certainly won't reflect well on thier reputation if behavior like this is widespread at Best Buys.
post #17 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by ainlawls View Post

Copied from my post on CEPro

I am a Magnolia Senior at a best buy in California. This story is just downright irresponsible. How exactly does a random guy who is so obviously sending in a story about a bad experience at a store in a heated state of mind with his evidence being an iPhone picture make a big CEPRO headline exactly?

First of all, the display in this article is brand new. Up until anywhere from 2 weeks ago to now(depending on the store's merchandising team), this display was simply to show you the difference in a DirecTV Standard Definition vs. High Definition channel and why you need to upgrade whatever TV service you have, and it was chock full of SD vs HD banners and signs. There was an SD box and an HD box feeding the Televisions the two different sources. Most stores during this time used it as a calibration demonstration as well using a blu-ray player split to both TVs(its the only place in the entire store that conveniently has two identical TVs side-by-side, thus the only place this demonstration is easy to set up). Demonstrating a calibration simply involved switching inputs to the BD player to show off the difference in color accuracy.

Corporate offices have changed that signage over to Calibration service signage(theres even a note on the signage that asks you to ask an associate to see the difference) and to use a BD player on a seperate input to show the benefits of the service. There are also watt minders to show the power differences between the two.

Some stores, due to the new display, haven't quite gotten used to setting the display on the blu-ray demo instead of the Directv demo. While this is unfortunate, as is a few bad egg associates who are ill-informed, it is certainly not headline news worthy for even the National Star.

As a side note, the part that is really funny about all of this is the fact that most of these stores have stopped using this as their go-to calibration demo. This display is paid for by LG to have two Plasma TVs set there. LGs are the worst TVs on the market to have calibrated, and anyone using that particular place to demo the service anymore is just hurting their business.

If you see this happening at any store, I urge you to contact the stores General Manager, Home Theater Supervisor, Corporate Office, or ISF directly so that you can set the store straight. If they indeed are saying that the SD vs HD difference is a result of the service, they should not be allowed to sell that service. It gives the Imaging Science Foundation a bad name.

/end thread
post #18 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by sperron View Post

Considering Best Buy is where a majority of the public is going to first hear about calibration, this is totally unacceptable. I wonder if the ISF has any recourse since they are partnered with Best Buy. It certainly won't reflect well on thier reputation if behavior like this is widespread at Best Buys.


ISF only teaches classes and certifies that people learned the material in that course. They do not provide any policing of the calibration industry. They have no contractual connection with those that they certify once the class is done. There is not much that they could do other than refuse to accept BB people in the classes. This would be pointless, and would simply mean that there would be less training than there is now.

It is a failing of ISF, IMO, that it does not provide follow up certification and rating of the business practices and calibration performance of those using its logo and name. It would be a stream of revenue and a service to the industry. That said, one must also recognize that IS has done more than any other entity to improve the performance of video displays and is essentially an organization with very little resources. Joel ain't getting rich on the deal...
post #19 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by lcaillo View Post

ISF only teaches classes and certifies that people learned the material in that course. They do not provide any policing of the calibration industry. They have no contractual connection with those that they certify once the class is done. There is not much that they could do other than refuse to accept BB people in the classes. This would be pointless, and would simply mean that there would be less training than there is now.

It is a failing of ISF, IMO, that it does not provide follow up certification and rating of the business practices and calibration performance of those using its logo and name. It would be a stream of revenue and a service to the industry. That said, one must also recognize that IS has done more than any other entity to improve the performance of video displays and is essentially an organization with very little resources. Joel ain't getting rich on the deal...


Well said...

I would add that the term ISF Certified is incorrect and misleading. The ISF training is a seminar. Those that want to be listed on the ISF website and be referred to as an ISF Calibrator must simply attend the class and pass the open book test. This does not make someone a calibrator. It is merely an introduction into the world of display calibration. Lots of study, practice and STUDY develops a true calibration professional.
post #20 of 32
Anyone can point me to a reputable calibrator in Pittsburgh PA...........besides Best Buy ?
post #21 of 32
Check with Eliab on his current tour schedule.

http://www.imagingscience.com/isf_re...dlr_status=CAL
post #22 of 32
Newb here so let the bashing begin. I recently purchased a Pioneer 5020 from best buy. I know, I know. I struggled with buying from BB or over the internet for a while but ended up at BB for the price, $2699 vs MSRP of $4000 and $2499 for the THX Panny 800u. The sale ended on Sat but couldn't make it to the store until Sun. I told myself I would buy the 5020 if they would sell it to me for the $2699 sale price. In an attempt to convince the salesman to ok the deal, I said I would by the calibration service and the service agreement. He ok'd the deal and now I have an awesome plasma display. I admit that I didn't research the calibration beforehand, and that I should have held out on offering to buy the calibration unless they wouldn't ok the deal. Hind sight is 20-20, I know. I have run the 150 hour break in dvd(thanks Evangelo2!) with D-Nice's settings (thanks D-Nice!) Now I am ready to have the display calibrated but after reading all of the posts on BB's calibration service, I am wondering if I should seek out a reputable local calibration service. More like I think I should. I think I will visit the store and see if they will refund the price of the calibration, or see if I can gather some information from their calibrator.
I'm not looking to try and catch them in any sort of scam. I am merely questioning their calibrator's skills and/or experience with calibrating the 5020.
I don't think I could do very well with the DVE BD. I'd rather leave it to someone who know's what they are doing. My question, as I'm sure some of you were wondering if there was one, is what would the average cost be for an independent calibrator? And does anyone have any experience with calibrators in the Southeast Michigan area? Grand Blanc to be exact.
post #23 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by CURX8 View Post

I hate when people try to go out of their way to catch a retailer in a lie. get a life. I highly doubt this guy just happened to notice, he was probably looking for it.

Anyways, when I used to work at Best Buy, I was in Houston for a summer and we had one of the TVs (a 42" Panasonic plasma) calibrated and the other not, but they were both tuned to the same HD source. So I think this Robert guy is full of crap. As said earlier, just because one shady Best Buy store did this does NOT represent their entire company. And their calibration service is actually decent. Not as good as a true ISF professional, but they do a decent job as many on this forum can vouch.

are you crazy? You must work for Best Buy and if I see it at my local store I am calling the state attorney generals office!
post #24 of 32
Only an idiot would think both displays are being fed from the same channel...

The picture clearly shows the 2 sets having a different program/scene from each other...Even a 70 year old man could tell the difference...
post #25 of 32
Just got back from our BB, same thing. One screen ESPN and the other ESPNHD.
post #26 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by scooper750 View Post

How so? Because he caught BB in deceptive practices?
I have been to many Best Buys and have not seen this so I am sure this is not their general practice. But this store sure is misleading the consumer.

No, because he jumped to the "deceptive practice" conclusion before looking into any other option. He was clearly trying to see malfesance.

Those of us who know that display, know that it appears to have been in the middle of being changed over to the new calibration display.
post #27 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by MANTI5 View Post

Just got back from our BB, same thing. One screen ESPN and the other ESPNHD.

That display is meant to show the difference between HD and SD.

The NEW display that's taking its place is designed to show the difference between HD and SD.

I feel like a broken record. Is noone reading my posts? LOL
post #28 of 32
Irishman, you might want to consider that the salespeople in BB stores may not share your impression of the purpose. One argued rather strongly to me that the display was a fair comparison of calibrated vs uncalibrated and when I suggested that your perpective was the case he said very specifically that this was not so.
post #29 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by lcaillo View Post

Irishman, you might want to consider that the salespeople in BB stores may not share your impression of the purpose. One argued rather strongly to me that the display was a fair comparison of calibrated vs uncalibrated and when I suggested that your perpective was the case he said very specifically that this was not so.

And of course, I'm doing all I can to make sure that misconception of purpose doesn't persist.
post #30 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Splicer010 View Post

Only an idiot would think both displays are being fed from the same channel...

The picture clearly shows the 2 sets having a different program/scene from each other...Even a 70 year old man could tell the difference...

I wasn't going to participate in this thread, until I read this.

are you really saying you did not notice at all that one set is playing "regular" espn and the other is playing "HD" espn ? That is the whole point! When one comparing one 'variable' everything else needs to be constant! It should be a level playing field! I'd say even the source program should be same i.e. it should be just the regular and hd versions of the SAME channel. Now, if they are trying to show that the picture quality even on the "regular" channel was so much better after a calibration than the picture quality on the "hd" channel without calibration, then thats a different thing (while possible, I doubt that would be practically true to be constant enough for all BB stores all over the country).

I am convinced about this farce that BB (or atleast quite a few of their stores) are trying to pull and fool their unsuspecting customers.

And what a lame excuse that Mr.Robert was "looking" for trouble. Ok, even if that was true that does not help hide the fact that BB is cheating its customers for calibration.

I think BB is just shooting itself in the foot and undermining its own cause and also in the process of it not doing justice to the fact that almost all TVs would indeed benefit from a calibration.

btw, I am seeing a lot of "protectionism" going on for BB here. Protectionism is when you try to justify the fault with lame excuses and obscure theories, instead of hard facts.


Sad story.
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