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Onkyo PR-SC886P Pre/Pro Official thread - Page 13

post #361 of 3236
For BD/DVD think Oppo BD-83 probably coming in March.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jobo2 View Post


DVD thinking Denon DVM2845CI because I like the 5 disc feature and DVD-A and SACD support

Blu-Ray ???? Sony S550??
post #362 of 3236
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffNebraska View Post

For those of us with no complaints and not using Audessy Pro, is there any need for this upgrade?

If you have no complaints, you don't need anything.
post #363 of 3236
I am only able to achieve a maximum volume of -3 db on my 886 with eq and +6 db with eq turned off. While this is plenty loud for most situtations it is nowhere near as loud as any of my previous pre/pros (citation 7.0, msb ddp 2x). I have read in another review that this is a limitation of the Audyssey implementation. The review was for a Denon model and stated that it was a hardware issue. I guess with the Audyssey you lose dynamic headroom and can only acheive an certain volume level. For me that is well below the 120 db I would like to be able to acheive.

Just wanted to post this for anyone considering buying this or any other unit with Audyssey. For now, you just won't be able to acheive these volume levels. Hopefully, they will work this out with newer hardware so this won't be an issue. Maybe this is why some high end makers haven't included Audyssey on their units?

If anyone knows anymore about this please post here.

Thanks.
post #364 of 3236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hippie69 View Post

I am only able to achieve a maximum volume of -3 db on my 886 with eq and +6 db with eq turned off. While this is plenty loud for most situtations it is nowhere near as loud as any of my previous pre/pros (citation 7.0, msb ddp 2x).

I'm not following the post.

First of all, how can it reach max at -3 db? I guess you don't mean the readout on the face of the unit (which goes to +15 db I think), but I can't imagine what you do mean.

Second, with my Sherbourne 200x7 amp and high powered sub, my 886 reaches defeaning levels for some material at -2 on the volume dial and for everything else at +2 or +3.

My advice to prospective purchasers is that you need not have any fear that the 886 can take an equivalently high quality amp to ear splitting levels.
post #365 of 3236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hippie69 View Post

I am only able to achieve a maximum volume of -3 db on my 886 with eq and +6 db with eq turned off. While this is plenty loud for most situtations it is nowhere near as loud as any of my previous pre/pros (citation 7.0, msb ddp 2x). I have read in another review that this is a limitation of the Audyssey implementation. The review was for a Denon model and stated that it was a hardware issue. I guess with the Audyssey you lose dynamic headroom and can only acheive an certain volume level. For me that is well below the 120 db I would like to be able to acheive.

Just wanted to post this for anyone considering buying this or any other unit with Audyssey. For now, you just won't be able to acheive these volume levels. Hopefully, they will work this out with newer hardware so this won't be an issue. Maybe this is why some high end makers haven't included Audyssey on their units?

If anyone knows anymore about this please post here.

Thanks.

Audyseey is supposed to calibrate so 0.0 on the volume knob is reference...

For films (there is no monitoring reference for music) that reference should be 80db for all channels... in the digital world, when you mix, you set 80db at -20dbFs, which means you have 20db of headroom until you run out of bits and hit digital clipping...

Make sure that Dynamic Volume and Dynamic EQ are tuned off, and also THX Loudness Plus...

I don't know what you are referring to in trying to hit 120db, but 120db is not only ear splitting, it is bad for your auditory health... I wouldn't recommend trying to get there for anybody with any kind of recording.
post #366 of 3236
Quote:
Originally Posted by ehlarson View Post

For BD/DVD think Oppo BD-83 probably coming in March.

Thanks. I have looked into the Oppo's and they seem like great affordable units. It seems like the 980 is the one most configured for DVD-A and SACD, but I think I really want a universal player that is multi-disc and good audio, which they don't seem to make.

On the DVD video front, it seems like a waste to have the DVD player up-scale to 1080P via HDMI, since the 886 seems to have a better video scaler, no? Why let the DVD player upscale to 1080P instead of the pre/pro 886? Wouldn't it be better to actually have the DVD player output to component video at 480p and let the pre/pro do the scaling?
post #367 of 3236
One of the main advantages of the Oppo 980 is that it can output DVD-video in 480i/576i which is what you want to do with a pre-pro like the 886. The Onkyo will most like have both better de-interlacing and scaling.

As for it's audio capabilities, I have been very satisfied with mine (both the Oppo 980 and the 886). A miner difference though, I don't use the video processing part of the 886. All video is pass-through to my separate video processor.
post #368 of 3236
Hi all! I purchased the 886 last month and have been having an excellent time with it--beautiful results. However, as of late I have been unable to listen to DVDs in digital format (apparently) because the processor is stuck on something called HDMI through. I am certain I pushed a button somewhere or fiddled with a menu option, but I can't seem to get it back to playing digital. It's connected via an HDMI cable to the Panny BD35.

Anyone willing to save me more button mashing?
post #369 of 3236
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDudeAbides View Post

Hi all! I purchased the 886 last month and have been having an excellent time with it--beautiful results. However, as of late I have been unable to listen to DVDs in digital format (apparently) because the processor is stuck on something called HDMI through. I am certain I pushed a button somewhere or fiddled with a menu option, but I can't seem to get it back to playing digital. It's connected via an HDMI cable to the Panny BD35.

Anyone willing to save me more button mashing?

If I recall, the Through setting only has to do with video processing, i.e. no conversion to the video.

Try going into Setup Menu Item #5 Listening Mode Presets and going through those options..

See the manual, page 122 (or close to it, I've referred to the 9.9 manual). It's in the Advanced Setup>Listening Mode Presets section.
post #370 of 3236
I would check your speaker setup and see if it some of the speakers are pushed up with say 6-10dB of boost. That boost limits the total volume of the system. I had that problem until I was able to lower the amount of boost to my L/R speakers.
post #371 of 3236
Have any of the 886 owner's had the opportunity to compare the pix with and without the REON processing ? I notice some AVS'ers use the unit in the bypass/through mode (and do not give the reason why) while some that do go thru' the processing claims the pix IS better.
Just wondering out loud....
alan
post #372 of 3236
I run my HTPC in through mode since the 886 only does 1080P/60, while I have my HTPC set at 1080P/24. On my digital cable, I do upconvert it from 1080i to 1080P in the 886, but I cannot tell a difference between through or 1080P on my screens (Sharp Aquos LC-37D64U LCD flat panel and Panasonic PT-AE3000U LCD front projector).

Dan
post #373 of 3236
Did anyone try to feed PAL (576i or p) signal thru' HDMI and/or analog component to the 886's built in video scaler (both passthru' and scale up modes)?
I desperately need to find out if this will work on the US version; the manual sort of hints this however I need to be certain.
Thank you very much.
post #374 of 3236
Quote:
Originally Posted by HiRez View Post

Did anyone try to feed PAL (576i or p) signal thru' HDMI and/or analog component to the 886's built in video scaler (both passthru' and scale up modes)?
I desperately need to find out if this will work on the US version; the manual sort of hints this however I need to be certain.
Thank you very much.

Some time back, I played a PAL disc through the 9.8 using passthrough. That's all I can contribute.
post #375 of 3236
There are some interesting observations of the '886 at AVForums starting here...
post #376 of 3236
Quote:
Originally Posted by alanl715 View Post

Have any of the 886 owner's had the opportunity to compare the pix with and without the REON processing ? I notice some AVS'ers use the unit in the bypass/through mode (and do not give the reason why) while some that do go thru' the processing claims the pix IS better.
Just wondering out loud....
alan

Hi Alan,

I am running my 886 into a Sanyo Z-5 (720P Projector) and find that If I use the 886 to either downconvert (PS3 Blu-ray) or upconvert (Oppo 980hd) to 720P I get a soft image. I get sharper results by having the PJ downconvert the PS3 1080P material and have the Oppo upconvert to 720P - using "through" setting on the 886. I have read somewhere in these threads that the 886 is lacking in the scaling to 720P, but excells at 1080P. I was hoping to upgrade my PJ to 1080P this year but the economy and the issues with my favored Epson 6500 have scared me off.....

BajaPete
post #377 of 3236
Quote:
Originally Posted by BajaPete View Post

Hi Alan,

I am running my 886 into a Sanyo Z-5 (720P Projector) and find that If I use the 886 to either downconvert (PS3 Blu-ray) or upconvert (Oppo 980hd) to 720P I get a soft image. I get sharper results by having the PJ downconvert the PS3 1080P material and have the Oppo upconvert to 720P - using "through" setting on the 886. I have read somewhere in these threads that the 886 is lacking in the scaling to 720P, but excells at 1080P. I was hoping to upgrade my PJ to 1080P this year but the economy and the issues with my favored Epson 6500 have scared me off.....

BajaPete

Can the 886 be setup to passthrough some inputs, but not all.

I would like to passthrough my Blu-Ray player and not have the 886 modify the video. However, for my cablebox I would like the 886 to upconvert the native picture to 1080p.

Is this possible?

Thanks.
post #378 of 3236
Quote:
Originally Posted by |anubis77| View Post

Can the 886 be setup to passthrough some inputs, but not all.

I would like to passthrough my Blu-Ray player and not have the 886 modify the video. However, for my cablebox I would like the 886 to upconvert the native picture to 1080p.

Is this possible?

Thanks.

Yes, it's possible. Set the global "Monitor Out" setting to 'Source', and then in the Picture Settings for each source you can specify whether you want it to up-convert that source or pass-through.
post #379 of 3236
Right. So, in your view outputing 1080P video via HDMI is not a great combo when one has the video upscaling engine of the 886. I hate to ask the next supid question, but shouldn't I output 480P (vs i) and do I do that into the component video in?

Finally, do you output the SACD audio via 7.1 RCAs or HDMI?

I am just ramping back up on the technologies.
post #380 of 3236
Do we have any remote code for setting the HDMI output resolution to "source?"

My universal browser only has the 885 codes, which has no "source" setting. I need this for my macro so that I can run my TV at 720P and my projector at "Source" whenever I switch from HDMI main to sub.

A hex code would be fine, if it exists. Thoughts?
post #381 of 3236
Quote:
Originally Posted by jobo2 View Post

Thanks. I have looked into the Oppo's and they seem like great affordable units. It seems like the 980 is the one most configured for DVD-A and SACD, but I think I really want a universal player that is multi-disc and good audio, which they don't seem to make.

On the DVD video front, it seems like a waste to have the DVD player up-scale to 1080P via HDMI, since the 886 seems to have a better video scaler, no? Why let the DVD player upscale to 1080P instead of the pre/pro 886? Wouldn't it be better to actually have the DVD player output to component video at 480p and let the pre/pro do the scaling?

I gave up on multi-disk players because I could never find one that had current technology.

In the case of the Oppo BD-83 I think you would find it has scaling at least as good as the 886.
post #382 of 3236
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffNebraska View Post

I'm not following the post.

First of all, how can it reach max at -3 db? I guess you don't mean the readout on the face of the unit (which goes to +15 db I think), but I can't imagine what you do mean.

Second, with my Sherbourne 200x7 amp and high powered sub, my 886 reaches defeaning levels for some material at -2 on the volume dial and for everything else at +2 or +3.

My advice to prospective purchasers is that you need not have any fear that the 886 can take an equivalently high quality amp to ear splitting levels.

Yes, I do mean the readout on the front of the unit. I turn up the volume and the readout stops at -3.0 db. It will not go any higher either using the remote or volume knob.

I have tried adjusting the maximum volume setting in the setup. Regardless of that setting the display will not go up past -3.0 db.
post #383 of 3236
Quote:
Originally Posted by ptruce View Post

I would check your speaker setup and see if it some of the speakers are pushed up with say 6-10dB of boost. That boost limits the total volume of the system. I had that problem until I was able to lower the amount of boost to my L/R speakers.

I tried that but like the post below says, while the volume displays a larger value, the overall volume output is the same.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=5131

This post compares it to having a 300hp car, but limited to a max speed of 75 mph.
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums...7&postcount=31

Here is the article I mentioned.
http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/p...-tests-results
post #384 of 3236
For those of you have who have done the Audyessy Pro calibration, what are your thoughts? Was it a moderate upgrade, or was it a great upgrade? If you had paid a few hundred dollars for it, would you have been disappointed?

Thanks,
Dan
post #385 of 3236
The problem of "headroom" has been discussed some time ago on the Audyssey thread.
The problem is, that digital content actually does not really has anything like "dynamic headroom", because the number of available bits for handling any dynamic content is limited to the size of the data words used for representing the content. Whenever anything reaches the limit of all available bits set to "1" no more increase can (and will) happen.
This will be for all sources involved and as such will limit dynamic headroom even more in the complete chain.

If any frequency correction on the plus side is active, this will limit the remaining "headroom" up to 0db (reference) even further.
Digital content on the source side is (usualy) already (automatically) normalized, so that no dynamic content will go beyond +0db.
But further digital manipulation on the AVR side might hamper this and will create a sort of "cutoff".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hippie69 View Post

I tried that but like the post below says, while the volume displays a larger value, the overall volume output is the same.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=5131

This post compares it to having a 300hp car, but limited to a max speed of 75 mph.
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums...7&postcount=31

Here is the article I mentioned.
http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/p...-tests-results
post #386 of 3236
Quote:
Originally Posted by AirCeej View Post

There are some interesting observations of the '886 at AVForums starting here...

It really starts a few days earlier here and here.

I was able to compare players, processors, amplifiers and connection and configuration methods. There were lots of different results. The most interesting was that with a good BD player, the system performance was slightly better with analogue connections that with LPCM over HDMI, but bitstream was better still.

Also, if the receiver/processor has a good spdif input, its possible to get good SQ with DTS re-encode/down conversion.

The ends results depend the combinations of equipment used, and theres a lot of interaction between equipment. The SC886 performs very well with bitstream inputs, but is not nearly so good with LPCM, but this gap is also a function of the BD player.

There are lots of other conclusions.

Nick
post #387 of 3236
Quote:
Originally Posted by welwynnick View Post

The most interesting was that with a good BD player, the system performance was slightly better with analogue connections that with LPCM over HDMI, but bitstream was better still.

uhoh, so much for my PS3 that goes PCM over hdmi to my 886!!
And the PS3 was supposed to be towards the top of the list of players... just not for us!
post #388 of 3236
I love what Audyssey does with my bass (SVS PB13 Ultra, Genelec 1037C, 55Hz corssover) but despise the inherent high frequency roll-off...

Therefor I tend to use "Pure Audio" mode most of the time - even with movies - eventhough it sets all speakers to large and uses the subwoofer just for LFE.

Question: Is there any way to avoid Audyssey's high frequency roll-off with my 886?

I tried to use THX Ultra Music mode which has THX Re-Eq disabled and should use Audyssey FLAT by default BUT HF still is rolled-off compared to "Pure Audio" mode. Perhaps this is just Audyssey FLAT trying to get a flat response (BUT my Genelec 1037C are VERY neutral to begin with in my heavely treated room).

I would love to get the best of both worlds - dry, corrected audyssey bass response combined with untouched high frequencies (an area my Genelecs are IMHO as good as it gets to begin with)

Thanks in advance.
post #389 of 3236
Quote:


Therefor I tend to use "Pure Audio" mode most of the time - even with movies - eventhough it sets all speakers to large and uses the subwoofer just for LFE.

The problem with Direct is that you lose not only bass management, but room correction and speaker delays as well if I'm not mistaken.

Quote:


I would love to get the best of both worlds - dry, corrected audyssey bass response combined with untouched high frequencies (an area my Genelecs are IMHO as good as it gets to begin with)

From what I've gathered in this thread and the Audyssey and Integra 9.9 threads, your only options are to use a THX mode with Re-EQ off, or get the Audyssey Pro software which lets you choose the curve you want to use.

If it really is just SW equalization you want, I guess another option would be to turn Audyssey off in the pre/pro and get a separate EQ device for the sub.
post #390 of 3236
Quote:
Originally Posted by JKohn View Post

From what I've gathered in this thread and the Audyssey and Integra 9.9 threads, your only options are to use a THX mode with Re-EQ off, or get the Audyssey Pro software which lets you choose the curve you want to use.

If it really is just SW equalization you want, I guess another option would be to turn Audyssey off in the pre/pro and get a separate EQ device for the sub.

Thanks. I have thought about that too - eg. SVS EQ-1. But this wouldn't help the subwoofer/speaker integration. With Audyssey MultiXT enabled speakers + subwoofer blend much better than by manually adjusting crossover and phase.
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