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Which one and how to install linux distro? - Page 2

post #31 of 123
No, not literally... :[

I pictured me without matches, frantically trying to keep these guys from killing me, while trying to get them organized without speaking their language.

I tried BSD a couple times, and it is just too primitive, whatever the rep.

Hey, have you ever dealt with a real estate fund mm?
post #32 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by quantumstate View Post

Hey, have you ever dealt with a real estate fund mm?

I don't even know what a real estate fund is, but I'm certain that *now* is a bad time to try and find out.
post #33 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by waterhead View Post



What I mean is that Suse doesn't offer kernel upgrades that stray very far from the original installed version. If there is something in a new kernel that you want, you will have to compile your own.

With Fedora, you usually can upgrade to the latest stable kernel. No compiling involved.

You can do the same with a KOTD (kernel of the day). I believe these are auto builds, with a few security patches, but no other bells and whistles, and are not supported -- but if it works, hey you got yourself the latest and greatest.

And, although I've never used it, isn't this not also accomplished via Factory ? (And Factory would/should include all the bells and whistles)
post #34 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by mythmaster View Post

I don't even know what a real estate fund is

it could refer to a number of things
-- an equity mutual fund geared towards real estate
-- a private equity fund
-- an investment trust (REIT)
-- a hedge speculation fund dealing in real estate

Quote:
but I'm certain that *now* is a bad time to try and find out.

yes, most areas still have a ways to go with residential, and commercial is just now starting to fall off the cliff. Though, now might be a good time to start soliciting funds for future transactions.
post #35 of 123
Thanks, CK, but I speculate that I won't be touching this one with a 10 foot pole (no offense to QS, of course).
post #36 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by CityK View Post

-- a private equity fund
...
Though, now might be a good time to start soliciting funds for future transactions.

*Ding*

Naturally there's alot more to this. Trouble is, there's an advanced new deal structure that no one but a few (expensive) lawyers know anything about. (partic1pating preferred 'hybr1d' fund)

But of course, only Liberals can use this structure.
post #37 of 123
I could start a new thread if that would be better... but had a feeling this thread rears its head rather too often and that might be frowned upon

My background:
- PC user at work (with no enthusiasm)
- Mac owner at home for 20 years, was thrilled when it became unix-based
- Unix/Solaris/Linux/etc user at work for 15+ years

Since Apple sat on their *$$ for so bloody long with the Mini, I decided to play with a *nix box of some sort for HTPC. I had a bunch of server type stuff running anyway, so a unix box seemed a fair alternative.

on the HTPC front, I wanted
- movie playback from DVD (with 5.1)
- movie playback with ripped DVDs (again with 5.1)
- mp3 playback
- Web "video" playback (ie. the Daily Show, YouTube, Hulu, etc)

I picked Ubuntu for no good reason other than I seemed to hear the most about it.

Given that 8.10 was just released 1.5 months ago, I figured everything would be very up to date (but it appears some of my issues have only very recently been solved)

While I've been able to solve most of my issues, I'm now approaching a 200+ line install script to

- upgrade audio drivers to get HDMI audio
- upgrade video drivers to get HDMI audio
- install wireless drivers for card that was not supported
- no clue what I will find when I tackle bluetooth
- still no sound from Firefox (installing pulseaudio was a massive disaster to
the work I'd done to get HDMI audio working)
- adding Flash to Firefox

I can understand I'd need to get my hands dirty to install apache, php, mysql, etc, but most of the above I had considered basic, should-been-working-out-of-the-box for any "mainstream" OS

Should I have tried a different distro? (Fedora, Suse, etc)

Also just learned that the Ubuntu repositories aren't likely to get these updated drivers (not until Jaunty)... I'm still new to the use model, but that seems odd to me to stay stuck at pre-November levels (unless upgrading to Jaunty is easier than I think it will be) (does that mean no new VLC updates, etc... again, I can do this by hand, but sort of defeats half the use of their very nice package manager, IMO)

Thanks,
Mike
post #38 of 123
I would recommend Ubuntu 8.04 or 8.10 if 8.04 doesn't support your hardware out of the box. Use the i386 32bit versions, NOT the 64bit x64 versions, unless you know what you're doing and are technically adept. There is NO current practical, day-to-day benefit in using the 64bit OS's for anyone using less than 4GB of RAM (i.e. most people and most media PC's)

If you want to control a tuner card or tuner box, install Mythbuntu from the Synaptic GUI (Add/Remove programs for ex-Windows users). You then set up MythTV via the Mythbuntu Control Center GUI in a very wizard-like fashion. Don't install Myth/Mythbuntu if you don't need to control tuner cards/boxes. I've installed Mythbuntu from Synaptic on top of Ubuntu 8.04, but haven't tried it from Ubuntu 8.10 yet.

If you want a media-center like front end for photos/music/random video files/DVD/CD, install XBMC from their PPA repos, follow instructions at

http://xbmc.org/forum/showthread.php?p=185738

If you don't want/need a media-center style front end for media playback, just install SMplayer and the latest VLC via either Synaptic (VLC) or the SMplayer repo:
http://smplayer.sourceforge.net/downloads.php

Use VLC for DVD playback and SMPlayer for all other video files, though the latest VLC 9.x plays great with most video files, too.

You should install ubuntu-restricted-extras from Synaptic first, as well as the w32codecs from Medibuntu (follow instructions copy/paste at):

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Medibuntu

Plenty of other apps available for desktop style photo viewing and music management/playback:

Music: Audacious (classic Winamp 2.x style), Banshee, Amarok, Songbird, or Foobar under Wine, etc. SMplayer and VLC play music fine, too.

Photo Viewing/Slideshow: GPIcView, GQview, gThumb, mirage, Gwenview, Picasa, or IrfanView under Wine,etc.

To address some of zim2dive's issues:

In the 20+ years I've been building PC's, from DOS through Win3.1/95/98/98SE/XP and now linux, I've *always* had to install audio, video and network drivers after the initial OS install from its CD/disks. In fact, since switching to Linux, I usually only need to install the video driver for Nvidia via the auto-popup in Ubuntu 8.10, or at worst via the third party EnvyNG simple GUI in Ubuntu 8.04. Either way, ATI and Nvidia video driver install in Ubuntu is trivial.

An argument could be made that audio driver and network driver (Ethernet or wireless cards) installation/updates could be made simpler in Ubuntu/Linux, but that's a separate issue, and subjective. Most of the time for most people, wired Ethernet and audio should work out of the box, and wireless cards if you selected the wireless card for Linux compatibility in the first place- lots to choose from at newegg.com, just search the reviews for each wireless PCI/PCIe/USB card for "linux" to determine compatibility:

http://www.newegg.com/Store/SubCateg...eless-Adapters

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...Keywords=linux

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...Keywords=linux

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...Keywords=linux

An OS-agnostic method (i.e. no wireless drivers needed) to add wireless to any computer with a wired Ethernet port is to use a Wireless Access point in Bridge mode connected to the computer via an Ethernet cable- a good, simple method to add wireless to a stationary media PC, with the benefit of locating the antennas for best reception:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16833156159

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16833156232

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16833203004

Flash install in Ubuntu 8.04 or higher is trivial- just install via the popup in Firefox when you hit a page that needs Flash (other than Youtube- YOutube is fine after the inital Flash install). Try pogo.com for the Java and Flash auto-popups in Firefox to auto-install Flash and Java. In Windows, I always had to browse to adobe.com, find the Flash installer, download it, then run it. Then do the same for Java at sun.com, if you could comprehend their site and versioning logic In Ubuntu/Firefox, it's all automatic.

Anyone who's been doing media PC's/HTPC's since the late 1990's knows that it took several years just to get reliable SPDIF output from Win98SE/XP- it wasn't until around 2002/2003 or so that SPDIF output became stable and relatively easy to enable in Windows. I was amazed how trivial it was to enable SPDIF passthrough on Linux the first time I tried last year. By these measures, I'm amazed that HDMI output is so far along in Linux given the relatively short time HDMI ports have been on common PC hardware...
post #39 of 123
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by quantumstate View Post

I suggest (and use exclusively) Kubuntu.

For that IGP you are definitely going to want the latest beta driver

There are 3 packages, which one should I get?

Quote:
Originally Posted by quantumstate View Post

- Boot the system
- and log in
- sudo -i and give user password
- /etc/init.d/kdm stop
- cd {to whereever the nVidia driver is}
- ./NVIDIA{whatever the rest of the driver name is}
- Follow the instructions
- Reboot

hi, thanks for reply. however, i'm complete newbie in linux. do i have to type these lines on a terminal window?

for the 1st bootup, can i use tv as display via hdmi?

thx
post #40 of 123
Updated last post with more detail re: wireless on Linux media PC's and emphasis on trying Ubuntu 8.04 first, and avoiding the 64bit versions. I've been testing/evaluating Ubuntu 8.10 since the beginning of November, dual booting with 8.04.

While 8.10 has some interesting upgrades, I've been running into issues with scanner/Xsane lockups, USB disconnects of external drives, sound problems under Wine (pulseaudio related), and apparent slowdowns with drive access (maybe indexing?).

I've just rebooted back to the 8.04 partition and it's snappier and more responsive overall. My scanner (HP 8250 USB 2.0) works perfectly with Xsane, and I can burn DVD's from NTFS hard drives via USB, which were disconnecting on 8.10. Some processes or services, or perhaps the newer Xorg/Nautilus/Metacity are slowing down 8.10 (?)

I tested 8.10 on a Biostar TF7050PV/X2 5000/2GB DDR2-800 rig. Other chipsets/mobos/scanners may behave better on 8.10...
post #41 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by vblanche View Post

There are (Kubongo) 3 packages, which one should I get?

Depends on how new your hardware is. I would stick with 8.04 if you can, but if SATA2 on your mobo, use 8.10. Personally I always use 64bit, and have seen no drawback to it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by vblanche View Post

hi, thanks for reply. however, i'm complete newbie in linux. do i have to type these lines on a terminal window?

When your system boots, it will take you to a login window. (like Winduhs) Actually that is only one of several desktops you can use. So I'm saying to go to another desktop using . This will be a terminal window.


Quote:
Originally Posted by vblanche View Post

for the 1st bootup, can i use tv as display via hdmi?

Depends on your hardware. I have the nVidia 9300 IGP, so if I only have HDMI plugged it will post and boot to that. If VGA is plugged in though, it will always default to that.
post #42 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rgb View Post

Flash install in Ubuntu 8.04 or higher is trivial- just install via the popup in Firefox when you hit a page that needs Flash (other than Youtube- YOutube is fine after the inital Flash install). Try pogo.com for the Java and Flash auto-popups in Firefox to auto-install Flash and Java. In Windows, I always had to browse to adobe.com, find the Flash installer, download it, then run it. Then do the same for Java at sun.com, if you could comprehend their site and versioning logic In Ubuntu/Firefox, it's all automatic.

I got shockwave flash by going to pogo.com, and can see video on cnn.com, but all the video at thedailyshow.com comes up as a just a hole on the screen.. no pop=up asking me to install any plugin of any sort. On my PC I am running Flash 9 for these videos.

EDIT: I had to install the Flash plugin by going to adobe labs.. the main flash download page didn't seem to have a plugin that was 64-bit compatible.

Quote:


Anyone who's been doing media PC's/HTPC's since the late 1990's knows that it took several years just to get reliable SPDIF output from Win98SE/XP- it wasn't until around 2002/2003 or so that SPDIF output became stable and relatively easy to enable in Windows. I was amazed how trivial it was to enable SPDIF passthrough on Linux the first time I tried last year. By these measures, I'm amazed that HDMI output is so far along in Linux given the relatively short time HDMI ports have been on common PC hardware...

As someone that has had digital optical working from my Mac for 3+ years, this is not a "mac is better" argument, this is a "why isn't linux more caught up" argument. I *like* *nix.. I *want* it to become more accepted in the mainstream. I am capable of wrangling thru to make it work for me.. 98% of the "mainstream" tho is not and I find that disappointing.

I still have no sound from Firefox despite setting all my Volume control panels to be HDA nVidia HDMI (Alsa).. again I'm sure I'll eventually find something to tell me how, but my point is that it shouldn't require 2 hours of google searching.

If I bought parts and assembled, yes I might be better off to get all plug-n-play works out of the box parts, but I bought instead a pre-built Acer PC...

Shrug.. back to trying to force sound out of Firefox and discover why I get no video from TDS.

Edit: also finally figured out that while I didn't need the 1.0.18 alsa-plugins for mplayer or VLC, that was what I also needed to upgrade to make Firefox happy.
post #43 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac The Knife View Post

I'm having one of my "the grass must certainly be greener somewhere else" moments so I'm considering trying something other than a Debian/Ubuntu derivative.

Personally, I hate RPMs with a passion, which is why I've been using Ubuntu. But I've run into some annoying issues lately. And Shuttleworth has made some statements that have me concerned about the future of Ubuntu. And the Debian team seems to be running around like chickens with their heads cut off and can't get their act together and get Lenny out the door.

So....

If I were to go against my better judgment and try an RPM disto again, what would everyone recommend?

Have you considered Linux Mint? It is Debian/Ubuntu based, but I am using it to run my MythTV system and it works quite well for a media center system. I would recommend Mint-5 Gnome instead of Mint-6 for the time being. Mint-5 is based on Ubuntu Hardy.
post #44 of 123
^^^ Yeah, but part of my current angst is at Debian distros use of cdrkit instead of the original burner toolkit and at Debian seeming to really lag far behind the rpm distros.

Anyway, I've been playing around with openSUSE11.1 last night and I think I've mostly gotten over my Debian/Ubuntu angst. And although I find the YAST package manager interesting (it actually gives even more info than Synaptic), it seems the grass isn't really greener anyplace else.

I think Ubuntu still has better repostories, better support, better set of apps in the standard install, etc, etc. So I'll probably end up sticking with Ubuntu for actually getting my work done and continue to cheat on the side with SUSE and see if SUSE can break up my marriage to Ubuntu.

I guess I just have to go through this exercise every couple of years.
post #45 of 123
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by quantumstate View Post

I suggest (and use exclusively) Kubuntu.

For that IGP you are definitely going to want the latest beta driver.
- Boot the system
- and log in
- sudo -i and give user password
- /etc/init.d/kdm stop
- cd {to whereever the nVidia driver is}
- ./NVIDIA{whatever the rest of the driver name is}
- Follow the instructions
- Reboot

well, I installed ubuntu 8.10. downloaded nvidia drivers 180.11 in desktop. then I tried these lines...not working. sudo -i works, but next lines not..should I type exactly what you wrote: /etc/init....?

I'm too used to windows XP, need to learn how to do things in linux...

thanks
post #46 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by vblanche View Post

well, I installed ubuntu 8.10. downloaded nvidia drivers 180.11 in desktop. then I tried these lines...not working. sudo -i works, but next lines not..should I type exactly what you wrote: /etc/init....?

I'm too used to windows XP, need to learn how to do things in linux...

thanks

Actually 180.16 is the latest.. this link http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=122606 take you to the always newest thread.

FWIW tho, my Ubuntu 8.10 got so unstable under 180.16 I had to revert to 177.82

As for the instructions, the gets you to a terminal login
sudo lets you run things as superuser. You can do it the way listed above, or put sudo in front of every command, ie.

sudo /etc/init.d/gdm stop
cd ~/Desktop
sudo ./N (hit tab key).. go from there

Similar page on the topic... (this has more than you will need, and the version #s are different, but it was helpful to me)

http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2008/11...trepid-2627-7/
post #47 of 123
I know, but please do not use 180.16; all other apps must be compiled to its new API. Use .11.

Ya vblanche, you unstalled ubuntu, not kubuntu. That's why they didn't work.

Alot of ppl like ubuntu because it uses a simple interface (Gnome), but KDE is not difficult, and gives much more depth in the long-run.
post #48 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by quantumstate View Post

I know, but please do not use 180.16; all other apps must be compiled to its new API. Use .11.

Sorry, didn't know that.. off to read about VDPAU...

thanks,
Mike
post #49 of 123
Before installing any driver downloaded form nVidia, you first need to install some required prerequisite programs.

In a terminal, enter these commands, one at a time.

Code:
sudo apt-get install linux-source
Code:
sudo apt-get install build-essential
Code:
sudo apt-get install linux-headers-`uname -r`
You can combine the commands and install them all at once, but I don't want to confuse a newbie.

To explain the last command, the uname -r part is an actual command. You can enter this into a terminal to see which kernel version it is running. When it is surrounded by backticks, it will run the command within a command. Pretty slick, Huh?
post #50 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by zim2dive View Post

FWIW tho, my Ubuntu 8.10 got so unstable under 180.16 I had to revert to 177.82

Quote:
Originally Posted by quantumstate View Post

I know, but please do not use 180.16; all other apps must be compiled to its new API. Use .11.

I've had zero issues running 180.16 in Kubuntu and video playback is better than with .11 (less tearing -- practically none, actually). You only need to recompile the apps that are using VDPAU -- mplayer (if you're using it) and mythtv (works WAY better).
post #51 of 123
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by quantumstate View Post

I know, but please do not use 180.16; all other apps must be compiled to its new API. Use .11.

Ya vblanche, you unstalled ubuntu, not kubuntu. That's why they didn't work.

Alot of ppl like ubuntu because it uses a simple interface (Gnome), but KDE is not difficult, and gives much more depth in the long-run.

can I un-install ubuntu and put kubuntu?
post #52 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by vblanche View Post

can I un-install ubuntu and put kubuntu?

No need to un-install. Just install Kubuntu to the same partition(s) and tell the installer to format them.
post #53 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by mythmaster View Post

I've had zero issues running 180.16 in Kubuntu and video playback is better than with .11 (less tearing -- practically none, actually). You only need to recompile the apps that are using VDPAU -- mplayer (if you're using it) and mythtv (works WAY better).

I see some of the same issue with 177.82 (vs. 177.80 that ships with Ubuntu, but doesn't seem to support 5.1 for the 8200).. ie. when I log off ubuntu, instead of a single orange progress bar, I get what looks like a full equalizer below where the bar should be.. and under 180.16, Firefox for me was a nightmare.. it would crash on some pages, and refused to quit, locking the system up with it.

So I went back to 177.82 and will wait for subsequent (and hopefully more stable to my system) releases.
post #54 of 123
You guys who are having tearing and other odd video issues with nVidia, in xorg.conf Devices:
Option "UseEvents" "True"
After adding UseEvents, Xv Vsync needs to be enabled in the nvidia-settings application.
post #55 of 123
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mythmaster View Post

No need to un-install. Just install Kubuntu to the same partition(s) and tell the installer to format them.

ok, I download Kubuntu 8.10, burn it on cd, put cd-rom as first booting device, but I don't have the choice to install, format...it starts linux.
post #56 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by vblanche View Post

ok, I download Kubuntu 8.10, burn it on cd, put cd-rom as first booting device, but I don't have the choice to install, format...it starts linux.

It's on the initial boot menu. After you select your language, it's the second option IIRC.
post #57 of 123
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mythmaster View Post

It's on the initial boot menu. After you select your language, it's the second option IIRC.

I don't even have the initial boot menu, it loads directly ubuntu, it does not seem to read the cd, even if it's defined as 1st bootup device in bios...

how can I do a fresh installation?
post #58 of 123
post #59 of 123
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by quantumstate View Post

Please use this image:
http://www.gtlib.gatech.edu/pub/ubun...ktop-amd64.iso

is it the original 64-bit image? I burn one that I got from kubuntu website.

I just tried to install it...cd is not read or recognized but I know that this cd works...I don't understand why the cd-rom as 1st bootup device is skiped...
post #60 of 123
Yes, the kubuntu website refers you to a number of download locations, and this is one I know is reliable.

Is your mobo bios set to boot from your CDRom -device-? Not just ATAPI CDRom, but the actual device. What mobo do you have?
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