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The Official AVS Dish DTVPal DVR Topic! - Page 487

post #14581 of 18096
I have also had the problem.

It is certainly inconsistent, but seems to happen most often when I use the "mini-Single-Channel" guide. What I mean by that is the guide that you get when you hit the Right-Arrow, to the Right of the Select button. It allows you to see the guide for the channel you are currently on, while still viewing TV. I avoid that now, and the problem seems much better.

There already is a Low-Battery message that pops up on the TV.
post #14582 of 18096
Quote:
Originally Posted by kkoceski View Post

I have also had the problem.
It is certainly inconsistent, but seems to happen most often when I use the "mini-Single-Channel" guide. What I mean by that is the guide that you get when you hit the Right-Arrow, to the Right of the Select button. It allows you to see the guide for the channel you are currently on, while still viewing TV. I avoid that now, and the problem seems much better.
There already is a Low-Battery message that pops up on the TV.

Thanks about the battery warning folks! I did not know that and never saw it! I just assumed the battery needed changing after a year or so (or when I think about it) and change it. So now I will just leave the battery in until I see the message.
post #14583 of 18096
EXTERNAL DRIVE SETUP

From one of my earlier posts:
Quote:
Thanks for posting your experiences with the WD10EARX drive LenL. I also ordered a so called "WD10EADS" drive from Amazon/BetterChoice on Friday and, from your experience, am now expecting to receive a WD10EARX drive. So, I'll post something on this thread to confirm that it also works (or does not work) in my case.

So, I did indeed receive a WD10EARX drive, and it works perfectly for me as well. It shows 142 hours and 40 minutes of HD recording time. I also did a hard drive "stress" test by recording on two channels while viewing a previously recorded program - no issues...

I'm not sure if anyone is maintaining the first post on this thread, but I think it would make sense to add that drive as one of the ones known to work as a 1TB replacement. Especially since the WD10EARX is still available while most of the ones listed are not available anymore.

Now, I must say that I went one step further in my installation... Instead of putting the new drive in as a replacement internal drive, I'm using it as an external drive (with no internal drive). I can now easily switch drives (in a matter of seconds) which allows me to still access the content of the original drive, use the new 1TB drive, or any other drive I may want to get in the future.

This is what I got:
- 40" SATA to eSATA data cable (http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=79_82&item_id=015996), and
- eSATA external drive enclosure (http://www.vantecusa.com/en/product/view_detail/374)

Actually, I got two of those external drive enclosures (one for the original 250G drive and the other for the new 1TB drive).

I have the red SATA cable (about 3/8" wide and 1/8" thick) coming out the back of the DVR enclosure through a narrow slit where the top cover meets the bottom part. This is the only link between the DVR and external drive. In this setup, the drive is powered by the external drive enclosure, so there is no need to run a SATA "power" cable from the DVR.

If you were to open your DVR, you would notice that there are two cables going to the hard drive. The SATA "power" cable from the power supply board, and the SATA "data" cable from the motherboard. I am not using those cables anymore: 1) there is no need for the power cable, and 2) the internal data cable was replaced by the 40" SATA to eSATA cable (with the SATA end connected to the motheboard). To emulate the behaviour of an internal drive, I need to make sure the external drive is powered when the DVR unit is plugged in. I simply have the DVR and external drive plugged in the same power bar and leave the hard drive switched "on".

Note that I could have been more fancy and mounted a SATA to eSATA bracket (such as this http://www.buy.com/prod/startech-com-esata-to-sata-cable-with-bracket-1-x-esata-1-x-sata-1ft/208668126.html) at the back of the unit, which would then have an eSATA to eSATA cable connecting to the drive, but I did not bother (I would need to cut down the length of the bracket and cut a square opening in the DVR enclosure, drill holes, put screws and so on...)

Anyways, if there is any demand, I could follow this up with more detailed instructions (with photos) on how to do this. Note that the most "difficult" part is to get the cover off the DVR. I could not have done it without the "instructions" http://www.avsforum.com/t/1099071/the-official-avs-dish-dtvpal-dvr-topic/4260#post_16292799 . Once the cover is open, the rest is a "piece of cake" as they say.

One last thing, my unit is a CM-7000PAL, but there does not appear to be any differences between it and the Dish DTVPal.

,,,Paul
post #14584 of 18096
Can't find my old post, just want to share using of pretty good Vantec external SATA enclosure (you could use existing power cable or external power supply). Here go:




It could be use for the DVR or any Dish DVR (622,722,922,813).

Nice thing is the enclose has temp gauge and fan's control with a buzzer if overheating. And a lock in case of having curios kids. smile.gif
For me it has most attractive feature - easy to change drives.
Edited by P Smith - 9/3/12 at 11:25am
post #14585 of 18096
Pauljb,

Your experience did follow mine exactly. Amazon can not be trusted to sell the product advertized all the time.

That being said, you further proved the WD10EARX drive is a more current drive to use as a replacement in the DVR we use where the PAL or CM.

Your making an external setup was interesting and I suppose for people wanting to swap drives it is a good and simple idea, and as long as they have a safe place for another piece of equipment along side the DVR. Thanks for sharing.
post #14586 of 18096
PaulJB,

Some further thoughts on your external setup:

1. Is there is a danger of inadvertantly pulling on the SATA cord and damaging the SATA connection inside the unit? This is the only bad thing I could think of.

2. By pulling the HD out of the unit you are eliminating heat inside the unit and possibly greatly prolonging the life of the components in the PALDVR...a good thing.

3. BY pulling the HD and the internal HD mounts you are allowing the PALDVR fan to circulate more cool air helping to prolong the units life.....another good thing.

So I would like to have more info and pictures as I would consider doing this adaptation!
post #14587 of 18096
re: EXTERNAL DRIVE SETUP

LenL, no, there is no danger of inadvertently pulling out the SATA cord and damaging the SATA connection inside the unit (as shown below).

Here is more info and some photos (this is a follow-up to my 14594 post http://www.avsforum.com/t/1099071/the-official-avs-dish-dtvpal-dvr-topic/14580#post_22363021).

1) Photo 1 shows what the unit looks like after removing the cover. The internal hard drive is attached to the metal casing covering the left-hand side of the unit (it sits under the casing). Note that in this particular photo, the hard drive has already been removed (I did not want to re-install the drive just for the purposes of this photo...)



2) Photo 2 was taken after removing the metal casing. You can see the 2 cables that were connected to the hard drive.



3) Photo 3 shows that those 2 cables have been removed, and the red SATA "data" cable was replaced by the 40" SATA to eSATA data cable (http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=79_82&item_id=015996). Note that for added protection, I ran that cable through the same white "clip" the original cable went through. You will also notice that, where that cables goes out of the unit, it is resting in a little notch in the DVR casing where one corner of the hard drive's metal casing used to sit.



4) Photo 4 shows what it looks like after I put the cover back on. I did not make any cut in the DVR casing, it just happens that that little notch is just barely big enough to let the cable through. Actually, it squeezes the cable such that it can't slip. Note that I left the internal hard drive metal casing out (the cable would not have fit through the notch if I had put that metal casing back in).



5) Photo 5 demonstrates that the SATA cable is indeed very secure. I'm holding the DVR up in the air by that cable.



6) Photo 6 shows my final setup with the 2 eSATA external drive enclosures (http://www.vantecusa.com/en/product/view_detail/374). Of course, only one drive can be connected at the same time.



7) Photo shows the same view, but from the back.



By the way, as suggested by other posters, I did clip off those 4 internal clips (accessible through the slits) before putting the cover back on. They serve no purpose except making it very difficult to remove the cover. The cover is still very solidly attached to the rest of the unit without them.

,,,Paul
post #14588 of 18096
Thanks!

I think this should be put in the first thread too! Very good info to add to the documentation!
post #14589 of 18096
P Smith, thanks for letting us know about the Vantec EZ Swap 4 external hard drive enclosure. That is also a good option in that the same enclosure can be used for multiple drives. Also, if the drive tends to heat up, the integrated fan can dissipate that heat.

The enclosures I got (Vantec NexStar CX) don't have a fan. But, the hard drives I'm using (original DVR drive and the new WD10EARX 1TB drive) seem to run quite cool. At least, I don't detect any noticeable heat when touching the enclosure after the hard drive has been running for a while.

,,,Paul
post #14590 of 18096
I know for sure these DVR's old WD OEM 250 GB drives (have many of them) creating much more heat then the new 1TB drive.
post #14591 of 18096
Really great info and pictures on the external drive.
Forgive my ignnorance but when I put in the new EURX a week ago there were three connections to the drive.
You have only one cable comming out of the unit.
What about the other 2 one was a connector and the other a single wire?
Bernieoc
post #14592 of 18096
The single wire is a ground connection between the hard drive's metal casing and the DVR's power supply board. It is not actually connected to the hard drive itself. You can actually see it in the first photo if you click on it and look at it full size (blue wire). That wire is not needed in the final setup since the metal casing is not used anymore.

The other cable you are referring to supplies power to the drive (the SATA power cable). You can also see it in the first photo (the cable composed of red/black/yellow wires). That one is not needed anymore as well because the external hard drive enclosure supplies its own power to the drive.

,,,Paul
post #14593 of 18096
Thank you - simple explanation - makes good sense
Thank you for your reply
Bernieoc
post #14594 of 18096
This is a riot! The ePVision PHD DVR has an external, usb harddrive. The forum for that device has detailed instructions showing how to move the drive to inside the box. The PalDVR has an internal drive, and we now have detailed instructions for moving the drive outside the box. THE GRASS IS ALWAYS GREENER...
post #14595 of 18096
Cute! I guess the ideal setup is having an internal drive with the option of adding an external drive for storage expansion. In other words, no external drive needed unless the storage capacity on the internal drive is reached.

When such a solution is not possible and we are stuck with an internal-only or external-only configuration. I'll take the external-only solution any day with its "unlimited storage" advantage. But, I can imagine that, for some people, having a compact setup with fewer devices/connections is better. Especially if they don't care about the expanded storage possibilities.

So, there you have it. Instructions to go from external to internal, and instructions to go from internal to external. Different options catering to different preferences.

,,,Paul
post #14596 of 18096
Quote:
Originally Posted by pauljb View Post

I'll take the external-only solution any day with its "unlimited storage" advantage.
,,,Paul

Keep in mind that we are still limited to 1 TB regardless of where the HD is. However if it is outside it makes it easier to swap drives in and out but they would have to be 1 TB or less until someone finds away around this.
post #14597 of 18096
Quote:
Originally Posted by DB100 View Post

This is a riot! The ePVision PHD DVR has an external, usb harddrive. The forum for that device has detailed instructions showing how to move the drive to inside the box. The PalDVR has an internal drive, and we now have detailed instructions for moving the drive outside the box. THE GRASS IS ALWAYS GREENER...
Keep in mind that these units are completely different from each other. The DTVPal unit has a proprietary recording that seems to be impossible to copy. That is the reason why many have gone to an external HDD for archiving programs simply by changing the HDD. The PHD DVR uses a readily available recording software that is transferable to a computer. This makes it an ideal unit to use an internal HDD and simply run a USB cable to your computer for archiving. This brings to mind one other comment I noticed about only being able to use a 1 TB HDD. There may be an argument that it would be better to keep your HDD smaller if possible. A 1TB HDD will hold many recordings which makes it a bit cumbersome when full. You also need to keep in mind that every HDD will eventually fail and when your 1 TB fails you are going to lose a lot more than when your 250 GB one fails. If at all possible it might be better to get several smaller HDDs especially if the cost is significantly less. cool.gif
post #14598 of 18096
TMN1,


Valid points about HD failure. However I don't think finding drives under 1 TB that will work with the PALDVR will be easy. Also there are still a lot more advantages to having 1 TB to use versus 250GB.

I thought what was interesting is there is another option for a OTA DVR, the ePVision PHD DVR. The price seems reasonable too. Not sure how well it compares to the PALDVR. Seems it doesn't have the 7 day TVGUIDE feature which is a big minus.
post #14599 of 18096
I would IMHO self restrain from discussing the ePVision PHD DVR in the DTVPAL DVR thread.
post #14600 of 18096
Quote:
Originally Posted by LenL View Post

TMN1,
I thought what was interesting is there is another option for a OTA DVR, the ePVision PHD DVR. The price seems reasonable too. Not sure how well it compares to the PALDVR. Seems it doesn't have the 7 day TVGUIDE feature which is a big minus.
Since I own both units I can give you my thoughts. There is no question the DTVPal/CM7000Pal is a much better unit for OTA. IMHO because it has a better tuner, it has a good free program guide provided you have TVGOS and there are many helpful hints in this thread the DTVPal/CM7000Pal is the best OTA choice available. There are drawbacks to every choice and there are advantages but for my money this is the best right now! If you want to learn about the other products you can search out the appropriate thread. Look for both the owners thread and the speculation thread with the PHD product as reading both will give you many of the reasons I have this opinion. biggrin.gif
post #14601 of 18096
The VRX DVR from ePVision also has a very good tuner, but interesting that the DTVPal/CM7000 tuner is perhaps even better. Good to know. Too bad that the newer CM7400 has a problematic tuner. I wish now that I had ordered a CM7000, but I may still try to see if they have any available.
post #14602 of 18096
Quote:
Originally Posted by P Smith View Post

I would IMHO self restrain from discussing the ePVision PHD DVR in the DTVPAL DVR thread.

Within reason, I would certainly hope that people will continue to post information about any alternatives to the DTVPAL DVR, and comparisons of those alternatives to the DTVPAL DVR. That is one of the few reasons I still monitor this thread.
post #14603 of 18096
Quote:
Originally Posted by vcbaker60 View Post

Within reason, I would certainly hope that people will continue to post information about any alternatives to the DTVPAL DVR, and comparisons of those alternatives to the DTVPAL DVR. That is one of the few reasons I still monitor this thread.
In that context I would agree, but not when posts going and going about one particular off-topic subject ...
post #14604 of 18096
Quote:
Originally Posted by vcbaker60 View Post

Within reason, I would certainly hope that people will continue to post information about any alternatives to the DTVPAL DVR, and comparisons of those alternatives to the DTVPAL DVR. That is one of the few reasons I still monitor this thread.

I agree with you and I think we have kept the discussion on topic. Whenever and if a new OTA DVR comes out, we should ask how does it compare to the PALDVR and is it a viable atlernative on this FORUM.
post #14605 of 18096
OK, here is something really valuable info for those who are looking into HDD replacement.
Since the OTA DVR designed and produces by echostar/dish and it's known they has some rules about using HDD:
  • all DVRs by the company has to be in unified APPROVED list
  • the list is slow populating after thorough examination and verification of new AV HDD models
  • the list is mandatory for satellite devices (we are lucky of the missing implementation in PAL DVR FW ).

The list is officially not published, but available at Yahoo group DishMod.
That would be a nod to use officially approved drive.
post #14606 of 18096
Quote:
Originally Posted by P Smith View Post

OK, here is something really valuable info for those who are looking into HDD replacement.
Since the OTA DVR designed and produces by echostar/dish and it's known they has some rules about using HDD:
  • all DVRs by the company has to be in unified APPROVED list
  • the list is slow populating after thorough examination and verification of new AV HDD models
  • the list is mandatory for satellite devices (we are lucky of the missing implementation in PAL DVR FW ).
The list is officially not published, but available at Yahoo group DishMod.
That would be a nod to use officially approved drive.
What's the URL to this group?
post #14607 of 18096
Kidding ?
post #14608 of 18096
TVGOS off in Philly?

Could anyone with a DTVPal DVR or CM7000 in the Philly area (using KYW OTA to receive TVGOS) confirm that there are no listings for next Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, and Saturday? I want to contact Rovi about this, but wanted to make sure it was really off.

Thanks
Edited by frank70 - 9/8/12 at 7:16am
post #14609 of 18096
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post

...I wish now that I had ordered a CM7000, but I may still try to see if they have any available.

You can purchase a manufacturer-refurbished/open-box CM-7000PAL DVR directly from Channel Master for $329.99 (plus shipping). There is also an eBay seller who has "more than 10 available" of the same refurbished units for $299.99 (plus $13.27 shipping). These refurbished units come with a 1-year warranty from Channel Master.
post #14610 of 18096
Quote:
Originally Posted by frank70 View Post

TVGOS off in Philly?
Could anyone with a DTVPal DVR or CM7000 in the Philly area (using KYW OTA to receive TVGOS) confirm that there are no listings for next Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, and Saturday? I want to contact Rovi about this, but wanted to make sure it was really off.
Thanks

I noticed the same thing in NYC with WCBS.
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