or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › Audio › Speakers › **Official EMP Owner's Thread**
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

**Official EMP Owner's Thread** - Page 49

post #1441 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by Transmaniacon View Post

EMP sells wall-mounts made specifically for the E5Bi, http://emptek.com/emb.php

I will probably buy stands for mine and flank my sofa.

Ahh okay I dident see those
post #1442 of 3162
OR!

http://www.crutchfield.com/p_121AM24B/Pinpoint-AM24-Black.html?tp=586#details-tab


They work and are holding great. I forget what bolt I purchased to use with them, but it fits the threads and depth of the hole perfect. I'll check and report back
post #1443 of 3162
SO a little update. I'm waiting for my Integra Receiver with Audyssey to get here, as well as the other goodies I purchased

I was playing around yesterday and decided to crossover my EMP's at 60HZ, I must say that the center in particular seemed to image much better when crossed over here.
post #1444 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shady195 View Post

SO a little update. I'm waiting for my Integra Receiver with Audyssey to get here, as well as the other goodies I purchased

I was playing around yesterday and decided to crossover my EMP's at 60HZ, I must say that the center in particular seemed to image much better when crossed over here.

That's interesting, what are your front L & R crossed at? I would imagine this change combined with Audyssey would end up giving you great results cool.gif
post #1445 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shady195 View Post

SO a little update. I'm waiting for my Integra Receiver with Audyssey to get here, as well as the other goodies I purchased

I was playing around yesterday and decided to crossover my EMP's at 60HZ, I must say that the center in particular seemed to image much better when crossed over here.

How do you know that they are NOT imaging well? Just a question. Are your L & R mains not creating a perfect center image if needed? Adding a center in there should only anchor that...unless there's some things off like (refl., tune, etc). I run my e55's full range right now with the e56ci x'd at 80hz. I've tried it at 60hz, but at that point you're into LFE and it's sent to the sub. I wouldn't think there much content coming from the center at 60-80hz anyways. Maybe I'm mistaken.
post #1446 of 3162
ousooner2, How are you liking that Denon receiver compared to your old Yamaha?
Edited by Transmaniacon - 2/20/13 at 8:30am
post #1447 of 3162
@Shady, I don't think you're going to get a true "image" with a center in place. If you were running the towers by themselves, then I would see more emphasis on imaging. If you are running a center, then you are no longer creating an image, it's there(the center speaker). My theory on what might be happening is that the upper frequency on the EMP's are a little light & therefore doesn't produce that "airy" sound that can seem to "open" a sound stage up. The EMP's by themselves produce a laid back sound. They don't tend to jump out at you. However, when you get the Integra & run Audyssey, you are going to notice these speakers "come alive". They will produce that "airy" clear sound. This is just my opinion. You can read all the guides you want on Audyssey & they are going to tell you to use all six or eight measurements available, move the mic here & there, adjust this & that. Here is my personal experience with Audyssey(& when you get your mic in & get everything up & running you will see this too). I place the Audyssey mic at the location I normally sit(a little off center). I adjust it using a tripod to my ear height & run the calibration at that one spot(not moving the mic) & collect all the data from that one spot. I don't have to run all six or eight sweeps either, three is fine(Audyssey will give you an option to continue or go ahead process the data). This will dial everything in, at that location, to a greater accuracy. Now this only applies if you live in a household where you are the only critical listener. Though my take on that is there is only one spot for "critical listening" & why water it down by introducing anomalies from other areas. How far apart are your towers & are they towed in? How far do you sit?
post #1448 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by ousooner2 View Post

How do you know that they are NOT imaging well? Just a question. Are your L & R mains not creating a perfect center image if needed? Adding a center in there should only anchor that...unless there's some things off like (refl., tune, etc). I run my e55's full range right now with the e56ci x'd at 80hz. I've tried it at 60hz, but at that point you're into LFE and it's sent to the sub. I wouldn't think there much content coming from the center at 60-80hz anyways. Maybe I'm mistaken.

I guess I should say they sound "thin" they do image well if you are in the sweet spot, but thats a very small area to me. If I sit dead center they sound great, everything is quite immerseive, but god forbid I tilt my head a little to one side tongue.gif My previous two speaker sets, even the tiny sattelites I used before then had a wide sweet spot. I have moved these speakers every which way and while ive gotten them aligned to the point where the sweet spots is a little bigger but its still small, especially compared to my HTD's. The problem I had with the center specifically compared to the other centers I've had is it felt very directional. If I sat to the left of the center (my usual spot) I felt as if I was hearing everything with just my right ear, as with the HTD and polk center it still felt as if I was sitting directly in front of it. If I sat to the right the same thing, i felt like most of the sound was just hitting my left ear. It's just not what I'm used to, it does not feel as open and airy as Cadett said below. For whatever reason I changed the crossover to 60HZ last night and it opened up that center stage a little more, not sure why, my only guess is that the extra sound comming through the centers woofers made it sound more airy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cadett View Post

@Shady, I don't think you're going to get a true "image" with a center in place. If you were running the towers by themselves, then I would see more emphasis on imaging. If you are running a center, then you are no longer creating an image, it's there(the center speaker). My theory on what might be happening is that the upper frequency on the EMP's are a little light & therefore doesn't produce that "airy" sound that can seem to "open" a sound stage up. The EMP's by themselves produce a laid back sound. They don't tend to jump out at you. However, when you get the Integra & run Audyssey, you are going to notice these speakers "come alive". They will produce that "airy" clear sound. This is just my opinion. You can read all the guides you want on Audyssey & they are going to tell you to use all six or eight measurements available, move the mic here & there, adjust this & that. Here is my personal experience with Audyssey(& when you get your mic in & get everything up & running you will see this too). I place the Audyssey mic at the location I normally sit(a little off center). I adjust it using a tripod to my ear height & run the calibration at that one spot(not moving the mic) & collect all the data from that one spot. I don't have to run all six or eight sweeps either, three is fine(Audyssey will give you an option to continue or go ahead process the data). This will dial everything in, at that location, to a greater accuracy. Now this only applies if you live in a household where you are the only critical listener. Though my take on that is there is only one spot for "critical listening" & why water it down by introducing anomalies from other areas. How far apart are your towers & are they towed in? How far do you sit?

I sit about 12 feet back from the speakers.. My front are about 9 1/2 feet apart, toed in. I played with placement for quite awhile and the spot i have them in now seems best. I agree there is 1 "true" critical listening position, and while I do appreciate that when I watch a movie by myself, most of the time I sit about a foot off to the left from the "sweet" spot on our loveseat couch. My wife to the right, with my other speakers anywhere on that loveseat was the sweet spot, where as these EMP are a little more temperamental it seems. Not that I disslike them for it, its just not what I'm used to so its taking time for my ears to really adjust. if I don't think about it, its almost as if the space opens up, but there are times where I just notice it doesnt all seem to blend together and dissapear if you will..

If I am sitting front and center this is not a problem, hell if im sitting in the center I mine as well ask myself speakers? What speakers.. just trying to figure out how to get a wider sweet spot with these, its not like im sitting off to the right or left of everything, littereally a foot outside of the "zone"
post #1449 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by Transmaniacon View Post

ousooner2, How are you liking that Denon receiver compared to your old Yamaha?

It's great so far. A lot nicer looking for sure. I wasn't a big fan of the orange/red that Yammy uses. They're both too close to really care power wise. I think the Denon sounds a little warmer and balanced though. The Yammy had more of an edge to it. I didn't get enough time without EQ to really see what I thought about that assumption though. I'm liking what MultEQ XT has done so far. It's really opened up the stage and brought that top end up. Balanced out the lower end too. I was watching Monsters Inc. yesterday and there were some scenes where the bass was really impressive. Not just mush, but actually tactile, responsive and deep for these towers that are supposedly "bass deficient".

Quote:
Originally Posted by cadett View Post

@Shady, I don't think you're going to get a true "image" with a center in place. If you were running the towers by themselves, then I would see more emphasis on imaging. If you are running a center, then you are no longer creating an image, it's there(the center speaker). My theory on what might be happening is that the upper frequency on the EMP's are a little light & therefore doesn't produce that "airy" sound that can seem to "open" a sound stage up. The EMP's by themselves produce a laid back sound. They don't tend to jump out at you. However, when you get the Integra & run Audyssey, you are going to notice these speakers "come alive". They will produce that "airy" clear sound. This is just my opinion. You can read all the guides you want on Audyssey & they are going to tell you to use all six or eight measurements available, move the mic here & there, adjust this & that. Here is my personal experience with Audyssey(& when you get your mic in & get everything up & running you will see this too). I place the Audyssey mic at the location I normally sit(a little off center). I adjust it using a tripod to my ear height & run the calibration at that one spot(not moving the mic) & collect all the data from that one spot. I don't have to run all six or eight sweeps either, three is fine(Audyssey will give you an option to continue or go ahead process the data). This will dial everything in, at that location, to a greater accuracy. Now this only applies if you live in a household where you are the only critical listener. Though my take on that is there is only one spot for "critical listening" & why water it down by introducing anomalies from other areas. How far apart are your towers & are they towed in? How far do you sit?

+1 on the imaging stuff

I'm going to have to disagree with you about the Audyssey mic placement stuff....BUT I'm not sure if it's better to do that when your ALWAYS in that one particular sweet spot. I've always heard and seen (even from Audyssey creators themselves) that you should use all the sweeps that you have available in your AVR. They say you definitely want to use small (2' max I believe) offsets to your sweet spot to dial in possible reflections and to gain a larger and more cohesive sound stage. You might know more about using Audyssey when ONLY using a single spot to listen, but I'd think even then you'd want to use each sweep you have available. It's definitely not going to hurt

The first sweep is setting your TA and doing EQ. All the rest are EQ based on that TA so your soundstage can become much more cohesive with multiple placements. That's one reason why MultEQ XT and XT32 are valuable over other lesser Audyssesy's
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shady195 View Post

I guess I should say they sound "thin" they do image well if you are in the sweet spot, but thats a very small area to me. If I sit dead center they sound great, everything is quite immerseive, but god forbid I tilt my head a little to one side tongue.gif My previous two speaker sets, even the tiny sattelites I used before then had a wide sweet spot. I have moved these speakers every which way and while ive gotten them aligned to the point where the sweet spots is a little bigger but its still small, especially compared to my HTD's. The problem I had with the center specifically compared to the other centers I've had is it felt very directional. If I sat to the left of the center (my usual spot) I felt as if I was hearing everything with just my right ear, as with the HTD and polk center it still felt as if I was sitting directly in front of it. If I sat to the right the same thing, i felt like most of the sound was just hitting my left ear. It's just not what I'm used to, it does not feel as open and airy as Cadett said below. For whatever reason I changed the crossover to 60HZ last night and it opened up that center stage a little more, not sure why, my only guess is that the extra sound comming through the centers woofers made it sound more airy.
I sit about 12 feet back from the speakers.. My front are about 9 1/2 feet apart, toed in. I played with placement for quite awhile and the spot i have them in now seems best. I agree there is 1 "true" critical listening position, and while I do appreciate that when I watch a movie by myself, most of the time I sit about a foot off to the left from the "sweet" spot on our loveseat couch. My wife to the right, with my other speakers anywhere on that loveseat was the sweet spot, where as these EMP are a little more temperamental it seems. Not that I disslike them for it, its just not what I'm used to so its taking time for my ears to really adjust. if I don't think about it, its almost as if the space opens up, but there are times where I just notice it doesnt all seem to blend together and dissapear if you will..

If I am sitting front and center this is not a problem, hell if im sitting in the center I mine as well ask myself speakers? What speakers.. just trying to figure out how to get a wider sweet spot with these, its not like im sitting off to the right or left of everything, littereally a foot outside of the "zone"

If they sound thin you're likely getting some sort of cancellation. Most "thin" sounding issues I've heard or read about are a result of phase issues and/or EQ issues. If you have any sort of cancellation then you can get that thin sound very quickly. It wouldn't surprise me that when you find out your culprit for sounding thin, you'll resolve the soundstage width issue (and vise versa). Something is happening b/c I'm not getting any of that. I think they do sound a little light...some would call it thin if we're talking about the lower end....without EQ, but Audyssey did a good job to bring up the low end without bringing in distortion, too much excursion, etc.

Do you have any controls like Treble or Bass turned up/down? What kind of music or movies do you find it sounds thin? Also, how far away are they from the wall behind them?

Do you happen to have a few pics of your room? Don't change anything before taking the picture
Edited by ousooner2 - 2/20/13 at 11:00am
post #1450 of 3162
Quote:
I'm going to have to disagree with you about the Audyssey mic placement stuff....BUT I'm not sure if it's better to do that when your ALWAYS in that one particular sweet spot. I've always heard and seen (even from Audyssey creators themselves) that you should use all the sweeps that you have available in your AVR. They say you definitely want to use small (2' max I believe) offsets to your sweet spot to dial in possible reflections and to gain a larger and more cohesive sound stage. You might know more about using Audyssey when ONLY using a single spot to listen, but I'd think even then you'd want to use each sweep you have available. It's definitely not going to hurt
Quote:

If you are taking measurements in one spot the data isn't going to change, so there is no need to run multiple sweeps. All Audyssey really needs is three sweeps to be able to calculate. When I ran all eight Audyssey X32 sweeps in one spot & compared it to just three the graphs were virtually identical. If you want to encompass an area then run all eight, but if you want to narrow you're window, just run three at the mlp & call it day. The reason they recommend running all sweeps is because they are under the impression that you will be adjusting for an area, vs just one spot. I know in my room that if I move five feet either way of where I sit, the null I get in the low end moves from 30Hz to 40Hz, so I prefer to ajust for the null at the mlp, which is 40Hz. That's why I was getting a +/-5dB on the graphs I was posting. Now everthing is within +/-3 to 2dB
post #1451 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by cadett View Post

If you are taking measurements in one spot the data isn't going to change, so there is no need to run multiple sweeps. All Audyssey really needs is three sweeps to be able to calculate. When I ran all eight Audyssey X32 sweeps in one spot & compared it to just three the graphs were virtually identical. If you want to encompass an area then run all eight, but if you want to narrow you're window, just run three at the mlp & call it day. The reason they recommend running all sweeps is because they are under the impression that you will be adjusting for an area, vs just one spot. I know in my room that if I move five feet either way of where I sit, the null I get in the low end moves from 30Hz to 40Hz, so I prefer to ajust for the null at the mlp, which is 40Hz. That's why I was getting a +/-5dB on the graphs I was posting. Now everthing is within +/-3 to 2dB

If they're not exactly the same then the data is changing! lol jk. tongue.gif What if the t/s parameters have changed from sweep 1 to sweep 8 ...kinda like "speaker break-in" during calibration?? Haha oh god...lets not bring that topic up and get those people in here. I agree with you for the most part. It's likely not even audible. It wouldn't hurt, but it likely wouldn't help.
post #1452 of 3162
Quote:
What if the t/s parameters have changed from sweep 1 to sweep 8 ...kinda like "speaker break-in" during calibration?

Warm those puppies up first smile.gif. LOL
post #1453 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by cadett View Post

Warm those puppies up first smile.gif. LOL

Talk about warming up those puppies EMP is now having a Winter Warm Up Sale http://www.emptek.com/WinterWarmUp13.php

smile.gifsmile.gifsmile.gif
post #1454 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by koresuki View Post

Talk about warming up those puppies EMP is now having a Winter Warm Up Sale http://www.emptek.com/WinterWarmUp13.php

smile.gifsmile.gifsmile.gif

Wish they had the E56Ci or E5Bi on sale!
post #1455 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by Transmaniacon View Post

Wish they had the E56Ci or E5Bi on sale!

Me too. That was the first thing that I looked for and saw that the E56ci was not included. that sux but also is a good thing as well. I saved a few hundred dollars.
post #1456 of 3162
Well , they do have the dual subwoofer for sale...but I just bought the Klipsch 12 inch sub, so now I really cannot justify getting another sub!
post #1457 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elihawk View Post

Well , they do have the dual subwoofer for sale...but I just bought the Klipsch 12 inch sub, so now I really cannot justify getting another sub!

If it's the RW-12d then you likely made the right choice by means of graphs I've seen. The dual 10's in small ported just can't get deep/loud enough in a larger room. I wish they'd make that same enclosure but do a single 15" or dual 12's. Talk about a cash cow!! eek.gif
post #1458 of 3162
Anyone have opinions on the EW25 On-wall Speaker? I'd like to use them as height speakers with my 106" projector screen. Currently I'm using polks and this should get me closer to nirvana with my lrcs e5 emps.
post #1459 of 3162
Yes, I have not been disapointed in that sub! Gone from 8 inch (SLS sub) to 10 inch (Martin Logan) to 12 inch (Klipsch) and each step has been a really nice gain in subwoofer output and quality! The Klipsch blends well with My EMPtek e5tis...crossover set to 80.

i would love to hear a review of the EMP on wall speaker...those might be in my basement in the future!
post #1460 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elihawk View Post

Yes, I have not been disapointed in that sub! Gone from 8 inch (SLS sub) to 10 inch (Martin Logan) to 12 inch (Klipsch) and each step has been a really nice gain in subwoofer output and quality! The Klipsch blends well with My EMPtek e5tis...crossover set to 80.

i would love to hear a review of the EMP on wall speaker...those might be in my basement in the future!

I've thought about going with the RW-12d, but can't make up my mind lol. I'm pretty stingy with my money and always keep the whole diminishing returns thing in the back of my mind. I wouldn't mind piecing together a 5k+ setup, but I just have so many others things I'd like to have and I personally think the EMP's are pretty darn good. It's that last 5% that really makes you pay the big bucks if you know what I mean. I can't decide if I just want to go ahead and buy the rw-12d and try it out, or save for a Empire or DIY a Stereo Integ. HT15" or something like that. Ahhhh! I hate making decisions lol

How do you like it so far? Is it decently musical? I had the PA-120 and it was okay, but pretty boomy for my tastes. No real definition and ruined the lower end. Maybe I'll put one on either side of the e55ti's....Hm. Not a bad idea
post #1461 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by ousooner2 View Post

I've thought about going with the RW-12d, but can't make up my mind lol. I'm pretty stingy with my money and always keep the whole diminishing returns thing in the back of my mind. I wouldn't mind piecing together a 5k+ setup, but I just have so many others things I'd like to have and I personally think the EMP's are pretty darn good. It's that last 5% that really makes you pay the big bucks if you know what I mean. I can't decide if I just want to go ahead and buy the rw-12d and try it out, or save for a Empire or DIY a Stereo Integ. HT15" or something like that. Ahhhh! I hate making decisions lol

How do you like it so far? Is it decently musical? I had the PA-120 and it was okay, but pretty boomy for my tastes. No real definition and ruined the lower end.

If you want a nice sub now and don't want to spend a lot get the 12D.

I have it, and it's a great little sub! It has no problem getting loud without sounding too boomy or garbled up. I have a what I consider "small" room. Its 12ft wide 24ft at the longest point, 18ft at the shortest (theres a closet in the one corner) with 8ft high celings. It has no problem filling up that room and hitting 95DB on my SPL meter. I turn my speakers up to around -15 DB with movies at the most (any more kind hurts to be honest depending on the movie) also keep in mind all my speakers are leveled to 85DB. and the sub has no problem keeping up with that.

Though I will say due to its placement in the corner, 4 ft away from the left side wall, 2 ft away from the back wall (found this to be the best sounding placement) I will need to get a second sub to fill the bass a little more as at times it does seem slightly directional in the higher frequencies, its not really all that bad, if I put it right up against the corner it fills up the entire room, but it sounds a bit to boomy. I am really debating getting another one of these or going another route such as DIY. Though im curious to know how two will sound front and center on either side of my tv on the inside of my speakers
post #1462 of 3162
my Martin logan sub was fine for movies, but was boomy for music. The Klipsch blends much more smoothly with my towers...
post #1463 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by ousooner2 View Post

I've thought about going with the RW-12d, but can't make up my mind lol. I'm pretty stingy with my money and always keep the whole diminishing returns thing in the back of my mind. I wouldn't mind piecing together a 5k+ setup, but I just have so many others things I'd like to have and I personally think the EMP's are pretty darn good. It's that last 5% that really makes you pay the big bucks if you know what I mean. I can't decide if I just want to go ahead and buy the rw-12d and try it out, or save for a Empire or DIY a Stereo Integ. HT15" or something like that. Ahhhh! I hate making decisions lol

How do you like it so far? Is it decently musical? I had the PA-120 and it was okay, but pretty boomy for my tastes. No real definition and ruined the lower end. Maybe I'll put one on either side of the e55ti's....Hm. Not a bad idea

I would save about $200 more bucks & go with the Outlaw Plus. I haven't heard the 12D, but I also had the PA-120 & the Outlaw is so much more musical, for only $200 more bucks. I would think the 12D & PA-120 would be comparable. This of course, if you don't go the diy route.
post #1464 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by cadett View Post

I would save about $200 more bucks & go with the Outlaw Plus. I haven't heard the 12D, but I also had the PA-120 & the Outlaw is so much more musical, for only $200 more bucks. I would think the 12D & PA-120 would be comparable. This of course, if you don't go the diy route.

I agree 100%.. I have owned both of those subs. I can't say the outlaw is worth 200 bux more but it does do a better job all around. The diy route is the best bang for your buck and you get can better results with the same amout of money spent on the Outlaw, but it can also rack up costs on amps and interconnects as well. If money is an issue, save for the right sub. Do it once do it right is the motto I go by.
post #1465 of 3162
I'm thinking of buying the dual 10" sub as a gift to a friend.
Since it's dual 10inch will it be as loud as a 12inch from 30hz - 80hz?
post #1466 of 3162
I'm a bit baffled by their pricing. Take a look at the price from the 9th via the way back machine at archive.org.


EW25 On-wall Speaker
(Compare at $385.00 each MSRP)
SALE PRICE
$198.00 EACH

vs today

EW25 On-wall Speaker
(Compare at $198.00 each)

SALE PRICE
$129.00 EACH

So it's always on sale?
Edited by gregoryperkins - 2/21/13 at 7:08pm
post #1467 of 3162
Okay....just watched "The Perks Of Being A Wallflower" and with Audyssey engaged I was getting some serious distortion from what I think was the center. It sounds like crackling and even my girl said she could hear it. I don't have a mic so I can't pinpoint what freq. it's at but maybe tomorrow I'll get some time to find out if it's just the center and where/why it's happening. It's much better without MultEQ XT engaged (dynamic eq on or off didn't seem to matter). I'll have to do some reading tomorrow at work to see if anyone has had this same problem. When this crackling distortion isn't happening I like the sound so it'd be nice to figure this out.
post #1468 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by gregoryperkins View Post

I'm a bit baffled by their pricing. Take a look at the price from the 9th via the way back machine at archive.org.


EW25 On-wall Speaker
(Compare at $385.00 each MSRP)
SALE PRICE
$198.00 EACH

vs today

EW25 On-wall Speaker
(Compare at $198.00 each)

SALE PRICE
$129.00 EACH

So it's always on sale?

I think their normal price is always less than the MSRP so they consider it on sale, and then these are additional sales.
post #1469 of 3162
Quote:
Originally Posted by koresuki View Post

I'm thinking of buying the dual 10" sub as a gift to a friend.
Since it's dual 10inch will it be as loud as a 12inch from 30hz - 80hz?

IIRC Audioholics did a review of the dual 10" sub, so maybe see what they have to say.

Edit: Here you go: http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/speakers/subwoofers/emptek-es1010i
Edited by Transmaniacon - 2/22/13 at 5:54am
post #1470 of 3162
So..

Replacement tweeter installed
Integra DTR-40.2 Hooked up
Audyssey Ran (Though maybe be using the wrong mic, borrowed a friends from his denon, though I did order the correct replacement mic today to run later as well, mine did not come with one mad.gif)

Speakers sound SO much better, wrong mic or not audyssey did a hell of a job (from my ears point of view) eq'ing the speakers.


Chances are at somepoint tommorow I'll be playing with REW as I got my UMM-6 in from CSL, I'll take some measurements for you with Audyssey/and No correction at all.


My "review" to come in the next few days.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Speakers
AVS › AVS Forum › Audio › Speakers › **Official EMP Owner's Thread**