AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › CRT Projectors › Do you display 1080p on your Sony G70?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Do you display 1080p on your Sony G70? - Page 3

post #61 of 105
1/15/09 at 6:23am
Thread Starter 
hmmmm.... someone told me that 1080i is actually two fields of 540, interlaced with each other.

Hence I thought 1080i was lower rez.
Reply
Reply

AVS Top Picks

post #62 of 105
1/15/09 at 7:15am
I agree rajdude, Craig Rounds a calibrator set up my mitsubishi rear PJ(a 1080i set) using a lumagen VP. He set it up to output 540p and it looks better set to that than to 1080i, the Mitsu thinks its 1080i but scans it in a way to improve pic quality.
1080p is higher res than 1080i its obvious since it uses more bandwidth.
Also you will get a higher light output using 1080p, i didn't understand this till
I was at cliffs meet and Ken Whitcomb demonstrated it with one of the PJ on. he measured the light out put while sending a 1080i signal using the same test disc and same source, then switched the VP to output 1080p and the light out put went up
more that i thought. the reason? even though we can nto percive each line beings scanned it happens too fast for the eye to see we still can notice brightness.
So at 1080i only 540 lines ant any one moment in time is being lit up on the screen, while at 1080p all lines are being lit up. So 1080i is a lower resolution but not any less information, thats way you hear people say its the same signal, in a sense it is, its just different in how its transported to our eyes. I went home a tried it my self with my colorimeter and it too saw a decrease in ftlb at 1080i.

Athanasios
Reply
Reply
post #63 of 105
1/15/09 at 7:34am
Thread Starter 
About less light....

Well I think you can get around that by having a memory in the PJ for 1080i which is set to a higher contrast level. That way you may get the same ft-l on the screen.

Now the thing I am still not clear about is this.....
is 1080i really less detailed (less resolution) than 1080p?

Quote:
Originally Posted by nashou66 View Post

I agree rajdude, Craig Rounds a calibrator set up my mitsubishi rear PJ(a 1080i set) using a lumagen VP. He set it up to output 540p and it looks better set to that than to 1080i, the Mitsu thinks its 1080i but scans it in a way to improve pic quality.
1080p is higher res than 1080i its obvious since it uses more bandwidth.
Also you will get a higher light output using 1080p, i didn't understand this till
I was at cliffs meet and Ken Whitcomb demonstrated it with one of the PJ on. he measured the light out put while sending a 1080i signal using the same test disc and same source, then switched the VP to output 1080p and the light out put went up
more that i thought. the reason? even though we can nto percive each line beings scanned it happens too fast for the eye to see we still can notice brightness.
So at 1080i only 540 lines ant any one moment in time is being lit up on the screen, while at 1080p all lines are being lit up. So 1080i is a lower resolution but not any less information, thats way you hear people say its the same signal, in a sense it is, its just different in how its transported to our eyes. I went home a tried it my self with my colorimeter and it too saw a decrease in ftlb at 1080i.

Athanasios
Reply
Reply
post #64 of 105
1/15/09 at 9:25am
1080p@48Hz and 1080i@96Hz uses the same bandwidth. The difference lies in how the lines are scanned on the tube surface.

In other words it's wrong to say that 1080i is less detailed or lower res than 1080p.

// John
Reply
Reply
post #65 of 105
1/15/09 at 9:44am
Quote:
Originally Posted by rajdude View Post

About less light....
Now the thing I am still not clear about is this.....
is 1080i really less detailed (less resolution) than 1080p?

For a 1080/24p source, no. You have to understand that 1080/60p is drawing the same content multiple times. 1080/60i is drawing the same content, just not as many times, but still enough to draw the original frame that came from a 1080/24p source. In order to have information lost with projecting 1080/60i, you would need a 1080/60p source.
Reply
Reply
post #66 of 105
1/15/09 at 11:00am
the thing is unless your display has great scaling abilities or you have a really high end
VP with 1080i you will see interlacing artifacts, with 1080p its non existent.
I had 1080i from my LG before i got a moome card to handle the HDCP. the LG circle was not smooth and round, it had jaggies. With 1080p it is nice and smooth, the same with diagonal lines. I always get annoyed with these post's dont talk about it just TRY IT !!!! then decide for your self what you prefer.

Athanasios
Reply
Reply
post #67 of 105
1/15/09 at 12:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by nashou66 View Post

Also you will get a higher light output using 1080p, i didn't understand this till
I was at cliffs meet and Ken Whitcomb demonstrated it with one of the PJ on. he measured the light out put while sending a 1080i signal using the same test disc and same source, then switched the VP to output 1080p and the light out put went up
more that i thought. the reason? even though we can nto percive each line beings scanned it happens too fast for the eye to see we still can notice brightness.
So at 1080i only 540 lines ant any one moment in time is being lit up on the screen, while at 1080p all lines are being lit up. So 1080i is a lower resolution but not any less information, thats way you hear people say its the same signal, in a sense it is, its just different in how its transported to our eyes. I went home a tried it my self with my colorimeter and it too saw a decrease in ftlb at 1080i.

Athanasios

So that means you're using up the tube twice as fast? It'd be the same as using higher contrast/brightness to get the same light level? Rather than having the gun skip a portion of tube face, it's burning ever so slowly what was previously a non-drawn interlaced field? So if that slight loss of light means so much why not crank up contrast/brightness? Unless by doing so blooming occurs.
Reply
Reply
post #68 of 105
1/15/09 at 12:14pm
not necessarily so, i dont think its a linear curve for the use of phosphor, it may wear it more but not by much. But like I said just try what ever resolution you want and be done with it, no need to ask questions,try it , then you like it or not. Your PJ isn't going to blow up.

Athanasios
Reply
Reply
post #69 of 105
1/15/09 at 12:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by nashou66 View Post

not necessarily so, i dont think its a linear curve for the use of phosphor, it may wear it more but not by much. But like I said just try what ever resolution you want and be done with it, no need to ask questions,try it , then you like it or not. Your PJ isn't going to blow up.

Athanasios

I may be just jealous that I can't get a projector which can even think of producing a 1080p signal.
Reply
Reply
post #70 of 105
1/15/09 at 1:10pm
I can't believe all the misinformation and plain ******** that is now being spread in this thread...

1080i 96hz works. Just try it.

There are no jagged circles. There is no loss in resolution. There is "line dancing" on 1:1 test patterns, but they don't happen in movies.

It is better than 1080p 48 hz (no flicker), and better than 1080p 60hz (judder). FRIGGIN TRY IT.
Reply
Reply
post #71 of 105
1/15/09 at 3:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark_A_W View Post

I can't believe all the misinformation and plain ******** that is now being spread in this thread...

1080i 96hz works. Just try it.

There are no jagged circles. There is no loss in resolution. There is "line dancing" on 1:1 test patterns, but they don't happen in movies.

It is better than 1080p 48 hz (no flicker), and better than 1080p 60hz (judder). FRIGGIN TRY IT.

1080i@96 ROCKS!!! End of Story

It is the best resolution on my XG by far. Better than 1080p@48, not as soft as 1080p@60

No judder, smooth and sharp, TRY IT. Otherwise end the thread, it's a waste of time

Mark & Myself have tried basically everythihg and i@96 is the way to go

The only thing better would be 1080p@72, but to much for my XG
Reply
Reply
post #72 of 105
1/15/09 at 5:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark_A_W View Post

I can't believe all the misinformation and plain ******** that is now being spread in this thread...

1080i 96hz works. Just try it.

There are no jagged circles. There is no loss in resolution. There is "line dancing" on 1:1 test patterns, but they don't happen in movies.

It is better than 1080p 48 hz (no flicker), and better than 1080p 60hz (judder). FRIGGIN TRY IT.

I agree ....

Cheers....
Reply
Reply
post #73 of 105
1/21/09 at 12:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnHWman View Post

Hi Rajdude,
I can say that 1080p48 with reduced porches is OK on G70

Try these parameters in Powerstrip:
Freq.H = 53.946KHz
Sync.V = 47.952Hz
Pixel rate = 118.681MHz
Syncs = H+/V+
Hsize=1920
Vsize=1080

Porchs values :
H_Front=88
H_sync=44
H_Back=148
-----------
V_Front=4
V_sync=5
V_back=36

With these parameters while watching HD, it's very difficult to see the 48Hz flicker at 1080p48. On Windows desktop, it's flickering, yes, but almost no flicker when playing HD...
1080p48 @ 118MHz is really delivering a very sharp picture (because pixelclock is under 120MHz) and judderfree. Thanks to the reduced video porches setting that reduce the flicker very well ...

I've been using this setting on G70 (and now on my G90) for years to watch HD-DVD or BR material

John

Hi, I am glad to find this thread about HTPC and G70, I am using HTPC and G70 as well!

I wonder how do you solve the "no sound over hdmi" problem after using the Powerstrip? It puzzles me for quite some time and I have to stick to to out of box ATI resolution, i.e. 1080p@60Hz!

Also my G70 is using ROM ver. 1.03, I didn't even know there is new rom version. Could someone kind enough to tell / PM me a link to download new ROM upgrade? Many thanks.

WF
Reply
Reply
post #74 of 105
1/21/09 at 1:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by doubleuf View Post

I wonder how do you solve the "no sound over hdmi" problem after using the Powerstrip? It puzzles me for quite some time and I have to stick to to out of box ATI resolution, i.e. 1080p@60Hz!

WF

I use Analogue 5.1 outputs. They work really well. Sound great, and they JUST WORK.

HDMI is a nightmare.


Quote:
Originally Posted by doubleuf View Post


Also my G70 is using ROM ver. 1.03, I didn't even know there is new rom version. Could someone kind enough to tell / PM me a link to download new ROM upgrade? Many thanks.

WF

It doesn't work that way. You have to burn a handful of EPROMS in a EPROM burner, and change them manually.

It's not worth it. You get better memory management (more like a NEC, nyak, nyak), but you lose G2 adjustment. I'd rather have G2.
Reply
Reply
post #75 of 105
1/21/09 at 2:28am
Yeah Aaron Rigg Told me the same thing you just said Mark, that the early firmware Ver is more desirable than the later firmware for the G70 in his opinion.....

Cheers....
Reply
Reply
post #76 of 105
1/21/09 at 6:29am
Thread Starter 
Hey, if you have a G70, can you please try the 1080p@48Hz with reduced porches? (as described here)

Does it flicker?

Mine never used to was smooooooth as butter, until I upgraded my nVidia drivers

Quote:
Originally Posted by doubleuf View Post

Hi, I am glad to find this thread about HTPC and G70, I am using HTPC and G70 as well!

I wonder how do you solve the "no sound over hdmi" problem after using the Powerstrip? It puzzles me for quite some time and I have to stick to to out of box ATI resolution, i.e. 1080p@60Hz!

Also my G70 is using ROM ver. 1.03, I didn't even know there is new rom version. Could someone kind enough to tell / PM me a link to download new ROM upgrade? Many thanks.

WF
Reply
Reply
post #77 of 105
1/21/09 at 6:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark_A_W View Post

I use Analogue 5.1 outputs. They work really well. Sound great, and they JUST WORK.

HDMI is a nightmare.

But using HDMI sounds better when it connects to a nice AV amp. Also a HDMI cable is much cheaper than 6 nice audio cables.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark_A_W View Post

It doesn't work that way. You have to burn a handful of EPROMS in a EPROM burner, and change them manually.

It's not worth it. You get better memory management (more like a NEC, nyak, nyak), but you lose G2 adjustment. I'd rather have G2.

Thank you!
WF
Reply
Reply
post #78 of 105
1/21/09 at 7:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rajdude View Post

Hey, if you have a G70, can you please try the 1080p@48Hz with reduced porches? (as described here)

Does it flicker?

Mine never used to was smooooooth as butter, until I upgraded my nVidia drivers

I tried the exact same setting using PowerStrip and played with PowerDVD, the video didn't play smooth and had split screens every now and then. Also the audio through HDMI was gone after enabling the PowerStrip.

WF
Reply
Reply
post #79 of 105
1/21/09 at 8:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by doubleuf View Post

But using HDMI sounds better when it connects to a nice AV amp. Also a HDMI cable is much cheaper than 6 nice audio cables.


That's a bit of a broad generalisation.

Analogue 5.1 from a quality soundcard to a decent pre-processor sounds very nice, thank you.
Reply
Reply
post #80 of 105
1/21/09 at 8:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark_A_W View Post

That's a bit of a broad generalisation.

Analogue 5.1 from a quality soundcard to a decent pre-processor sounds very nice, thank you.

I agree, but not from a HTPC, my LG BH100 analouge outs sound awesome to my adcom pre/pro 830.

Athanasios
Reply
Reply
post #81 of 105
1/23/09 at 8:13pm
Yes IMO PCs are not in the same league as standalone Dont bite my head off, Been there done that running powerstrip Even with reclock there was judder, I use The BD30 outputing 24p into Onkyo PRE-PRO HDMI pass through, into VP50pro outputing custom 1920x800 @48 hz into Moome HDMI internal card the picture produced is smooth as silk & no fliker what so ever and sharp as A tack With this combo....

Cheers....
Reply
Reply
post #82 of 105
1/24/09 at 1:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rajdude View Post

Hey, if you have a G70, can you please try the 1080p@48Hz with reduced porches? (as described here)

Does it flicker?

@48Hz YES!
Porchs values :
H_Front=88
H_sync=40
H_Back=152
-----------
V_Front=4
V_sync=5
V_back=36

@50Hz Slightly probably watchable.
1080i @96Hz NO! not at all, gets my vote.

Question to G70 owners. When you tried these higher bandwidth resolutions did you run out of vertical shift control?
Reply
Reply
post #83 of 105
1/24/09 at 4:55pm
When setting up A CRT projector for best results its best to try and keep as close as possible to the midpoint of the registration adjustment scale of any Brand CRT projector...IMO This has 2 main benefits....
1,less drift....
2,less strain on the Projectors electronics....

When I set up my custom 720p @75hz for SD DVD and Custom 1920x800 @48hz for BLU-RAY with the G70, I center the raster on the tube face then center internal pattern on raster....
Once I do that I have my "RGB shift set at 128" (center point) and use the "VP50pro's Adjustable timing parameters" adjusting the horizontal shift untill the SD DVD/BLU-RAY picture is center in the raster and adjust Horizontal front & back porch's so as to use as much of the raster as safe ....

You can do the same with powerstrip on A PC, but its A good idea to set up powerstrip (center the picture) on A Highend CRT multi scan monitor first then make miner adjustments once connected to the G70......

Hope this helps..
Cheers....
Reply
Reply
post #84 of 105
1/24/09 at 6:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AFryia View Post

@48Hz YES!
Porchs values :
H_Front=88
H_sync=40
H_Back=152
-----------
V_Front=4
V_sync=5
V_back=36

@50Hz Slightly probably watchable.
1080i @96Hz NO! not at all, gets my vote.

Question to G70 owners. When you tried these higher bandwidth resolutions did you run out of vertical shift control?

From what I have heard and tried myself you should have the front numbers match the back numbers, so in your prch setting you should either lower the back porch to be 128=88=40 or increas your H_frot and H_sync up to 152, so maybe got H_Front 100 and H_sync 52. Tjis should reduce flicker as I dont see it with my marquee.

Athanasios
Reply
Reply
post #85 of 105
1/25/09 at 9:06am
Athanasios,

Even though I've been using PowerStrip for years I'm still a beginner when it comes to detailed custom timings.

I was surprised to see such a difference between 48 and 50Hz.

I'd like to give it another try but I'm not quite understanding what you mean by having the numbers match. Can you provide more detail?
Reply
Reply
post #86 of 105
1/25/09 at 8:38pm
When I set up my custom timing for Blu-Ray film based (24p) playback1920x800 @48hz for my G70 my Horizontal front and back porch's dont match but the Horizontal shift/and back porch do match Check it out ...

Digital 1920 X 800p @ 48hz.. profile 2..Film Based 24p frame rate

Horizontal shift.... 230
Horizontal size.... 1920
Horizontal front porch....108
Horizontal sync ..... 44
Horizontal Back porch... 230
Horizontal total .... 1920
Sync type H- V-

Hope this helps....

Cheers....
Reply
Reply
post #87 of 105
1/25/09 at 8:45pm
The horizontal back porch should be bigger (much bigger), to allow the beam time to settle after retrace.

Otherwise you get raster ringing bars appearing on the LH side.


(What on earth is Horizontal Shift??? That's something specific to that device - suspiciously the same as the Back Porch).

(And if you run out of Vertical Shift/Position, then add more Vertical Porch Pixels.)
Reply
Reply
post #88 of 105
1/25/09 at 11:43pm
try this calculator, you'll see that your Hfront and Hsync will = Hback
And your V blank lines will equal Vfront+Vsync+Vback.


Nashou

 

CVTd6r1.xls.zip 24.345703125k . file
Reply
Reply
post #89 of 105
1/26/09 at 2:39am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark_A_W View Post

The horizontal back porch should be bigger (much bigger), to allow the beam time to settle after retrace.

Otherwise you get raster ringing bars appearing on the LH side.


(What on earth is Horizontal Shift??? That's something specific to that device - suspiciously the same as the Back Porch).

(And if you run out of Vertical Shift/Position, then add more Vertical Porch Pixels.)

Are you refering to my Custom timing Mark_A_W or AFryia's post in regards to the Back porch needing to be bigger ....

Yes the Horizontal/Vertical Shift must be pacific to The DVDO VP series VP's....

Cheers....
Reply
Reply
post #90 of 105
1/26/09 at 1:09pm
Setting Horizontal/Vertical Shift corresponds to setting both front and back porches.

As an example, changing the value of H-shift on a DVDO VP is the same as changing both H-front and H-back.

H-Shift (+1) = H-front (-1) / H-back (+1)

In other words, the same thing as clicking the position arrows in Powerstrip (Advanced timing options).
Reply
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: CRT Projectors

AVS Top Picks

AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › CRT Projectors › Do you display 1080p on your Sony G70?