Subtitles in Letterbox

There are plenty BDs that have subtitles above lower black bar thus the subs is in the picture frame,this will get most advantage of cinemascope screen.The studios support ths issue are FOX UNIVERSAL PARAMOUNTwith DREAMWORK LUCAS'S FILM.SONY and WARNER should change the subtitles issue like most of studios,just my humble opinion.

Personally, it wrecks my head having the subs in the bar area. I'd rather have it in the image everytime. Ooooooooh, controversy!!!

This is one of Blu-ray's disappointments to me. This is supposed to be the next generation format, yet we're still stuck with standardized subtitles.

There's no reason that viewers shouldn't have control of both subtitle font size and placement. The needs of someone watching a movie on a 42" screen vary from one watching on a 120" screen, yet they're both stuck with the same subtitle presentation.

It's sad that they're not taking advantage of the format the way they could on most (if not all) titles.

Scott

Are we talking about subtitles that were part of the theatrical presentation of a film (eg, foreign languages being translated within an English-language film), or about encoded titles (eg, English subtitles for a foreign-language film)?

IMO, the former should be left alone while the latter should be user-controllable.

Blu-ray is a step backward from DVDs in this regard. There are DVD players, (e.g. Samsung EzyView and Theater Tek sw player) capable of repositioning subtitles. However, so-called protected video path of blu-ray does not allow the manufactures to interfere with the video path and reposition raster-image based subtitles (unless BDA/Sony develops certified code to achieve this). The movable ascii based subs do not work consistently on all blu-ray players (probably due to some screw-up in the BD-J subtitle specs). Therefore Studios do not use ascii based subs.

It is really a shame on the developers of blu-ray specs that this trivial issue of subtitle repositioning ended up like this.

This impacts millions of zoomers/blackbar-haters in non-English-speaking countries and I do not understand the reasons that BDA/Sony and Studios do not solve this major issue.

Passive movie watching is a proven business for decades. The major focus of the Studios should be to provide best movie watching experience to everybody and shift people to watch more movies rather than them reading magazines or watch sports. It appears that they have lost the focus on the main game and concentrating on trivial aspects such as BD-Live!

Go to the link below my signature. It is far from definitive but with everyone's help, it will grow

Anybody else prefer white subtitles as opposed to yellow?

Pretty much any foreign film from Sony Pictures Home Entertainment puts the subtitles in the bottom letterbox bar of the 2.40:1 frame (Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon, Kung Fu Hustle, 2046). I use mattes to cover the black bars and the practice of putting subtitles below the picture area pisses me off.

I still have 2 Samsung upconverting SD players that have the 'EZ View' feature as part of my scope setup for watching foreign language films. There are several foreign BD's that I've held back on purchasing because of the subtitle issue: 'Black Box', 'La Femme Nikita' (not interested in the english dubbed audio track), and 'Shinobi', to name a few. Thank God that 'The Orphanage' is the rare BD title that does have the entire subs within the image area.

Yes. I'm watching The Last Exile on DVD at the moment, and the yellow subs are like a moth to a flame.

Subtitles in the black borders are awesome.

Otherwise useless frames now having a use? Yes please!

Wish to find out whether you are watching long foreign movies with subtitles.

When watching blackbar subtitles for a moderate length of time, it becomes tiring and difficult to concentrate on the movie and start reading subtitles rather than watching the movie. When the subs are within the frame it is seamless and could read subtitles without moving eyes outside the picture frame and subtitles become an integral part of the movie/picture. If subtitles are read only for short durations it is hard to understand this problem.

Blackbar-subtitles is a nightmare of the blackbar haters because subtitles appears on the black void which shouldn't be there as it is not part of the movie. Unfortunately Sony and WB do not understand this.

IIRC, wasn't BD originally advertised as supporting movable subtitles?
A Java feature?

The simple solution to this is two subtitle tracks, one positioned in-frame and one in-letterbox-area, selectable from the menu. This really should be standard on all BDs.

At least, all BDs with aspect ratios wider than 16:9.

That's what I thought, too.

Resizable, positionable, color-selectable, font-selectable subtitles: A film-watcher's dream come true.

Maybe in the next video format.

Scott

Wow how do you ever watch 1.78 AR movies that fill up the whole screen if you can't focus on black bar area and the picture?


We already have it... it's called .mkv...

syncguy's post covered this. Bitmap subtitles can't be repositioned (because they're part of the protected video path) and ASCII subtitles (which can be repositioned, resized and otherwise tinkered with) aren't used because some players don't support them properly. The format supports them on paper, but not consistently enough for distributors to actually implement them.

The argument is useless. Nothing can be done to prevent the studios from being stupid. People going 2.35:1 with their screens are pretty much guaranteeing themselves a massive headache.

Yes, it sucks, but it is what it is and it won't change unless someone like Spielberg goes all postal about it and what are the odds of that happening? Hmmm.... ZERO

Any Michael Bay movies with some subtitled dialogue? He goes postal at the drop of a hat.

So it's a copyright issue why they dont let us reposistion the subs?

It depends on the movie, i feel different ways about where I like my subs. I'm more of a fan of keeping it in the black bar area since I'm watching movies on a projector, and I like the image to be untouched and the black bars to have some use. But I can understand how it can be tiring sometimes to always read it so far below.

Yellow subs are fugly.

I think yellow subs help in black and white films, in which white subs may blend into the background.

Sony and Warner Please change your policy about subs,it should be on the picture frame especially in 2.35:1 such title as TDK.

Or, better yet, give both options. I think an ideal solution might be to offer 'in-letterbox' subs as the default stream when subtitles are selected from the language menu, but also provide a stream of 'in-picture' subs selectable from an 'advanced set-up' menu. This way, the techie nerds with CIH set-ups can easily find their option, but the less-informed general consumer doesn't have to be confused by being confronted with two options for subtitles in the language of their choice.

Then you have Man on Fire where the translation subs are all over the place. Good use of them, btw.