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Media HTPC IR and RF keyboards - Page 3

post #61 of 105
12/4/09 at 5:47am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rgb View Post

Good to know there are other low cost alternatives- I assume the guy at pckeyboards tested both the keyboard *and* mouse capability with those PS2 adapters.

He actually only tried both keyboard and mouse. He thought that you HAD to plug in both to the adapter to make it work, although it didn't sound like he actually tried anything different. And under normal conditions why would you!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rgb View Post

Good to know the serial-USB method works, too. Which distro did you use to test the serial-USB method? Did you have to manually enable serial mouse support?

I am using ubuntu 9.04 and didn't have do do anything manual. Connected the serial end first then shoved it in the USB port and the mouse just worked.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rgb View Post

re: no scroll wheel- that's what PgUp and PgDown and arrow keys were invented for

Good to know! I will probably stick with this workaround for now, nice and easy for me.
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post #62 of 105
12/5/09 at 8:13am
Quote:
Originally Posted by northbear View Post

I am using ubuntu 9.04 and didn't have do do anything manual. Connected the serial end first then shoved it in the USB port and the mouse just worked.

.

Just to verify- you connected the IR receiver DB9 serial connector to a USB-DB9 serial adapter, right? (i.e. not with a PS2 connector)
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post #63 of 105
12/5/09 at 11:07am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rgb View Post

Just to verify- you connected the IR receiver DB9 serial connector to a USB-DB9 serial adapter, right? (i.e. not with a PS2 connector)

That is correct!
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post #64 of 105
12/5/09 at 11:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by northbear View Post

That is correct!

Awesome! It appears Ubuntu 9.04 recognizes serial mice, per your testing. Looks like the manual xorg editing may not be needed any longer...
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post #65 of 105
12/5/09 at 12:18pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rgb View Post

Awesome! It appears Ubuntu 9.04 recognizes serial mice, per your testing. Looks like the manual xorg editing may not be needed any longer...

Not sure about that... To try and confirm this, today on my current computer I used the available serial port and restarted with the SK-7500 plugged into the serial port and it did not automatically recognize it. I then unplugged from the serial port without rebooting (yeah yeah I know your not *supposed* to do that) and then plugged in the serial to USB adapter and it worked immediately. I didn't try at all to get the direct serial connection to work or to verify that the hardware is still working but I do know it did work at one time (used it with an old Garmin GPS quite a while back)

Not sure what magic is in the adapter but somehow that works and directly to the serial port does not (at least for me and my computer)
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post #66 of 105
12/5/09 at 12:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by northbear View Post

but I do know it did work at one time (used it with an old Garmin GPS quite a while back)

Not sure what magic is in the adapter but somehow that works and directly to the serial port does not (at least for me and my computer)

Open a terminal and type

lsusb

and report the results with the serial-USB adapter you a re using. I want to see the exact model/chip details.
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post #67 of 105
12/5/09 at 2:07pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rgb View Post

Open a terminal and type

lsusb

and report the results with the serial-USB adapter you a re using. I want to see the exact model/chip details.

Code:
northbear@northbear-desktop:~$ lsusb
Bus 002 Device 002: ID 0711:0230 Magic Control Technology Corp. MCT-232 Serial Port
Bus 002 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Obviously the adapter is the first line. This is without the SK-7500 plugged in.
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post #68 of 105
12/5/09 at 9:53pm
Thread Starter 
Ordered the serial adapter from monoprice

http://www.monoprice.com/products/pr...seq=1&format=2

Will let you all know how it works when I receive it!
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post #69 of 105
12/6/09 at 6:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by northbear View Post

Ordered the serial adapter from monoprice

http://www.monoprice.com/products/pr...seq=1&format=2

Will let you all know how it works when I receive it!

Do a dmesg in a terminal with the USB-serial adapter and report output- should be something like this

serial support registered for FTDI USB Serial Device
[67681.419686] ftdi_sio 2-5:1.0: FTDI USB Serial Device converter detected
[67681.419703] /build/buildd/linux-2.6.24/drivers/usb/serial/ftdi_sio.c: Detected FT8U232AM
[67681.419777] usb 2-5: FTDI USB Serial Device converter now attached to ttyUSB0
[67681.419785] usbcore: registered new interface driver ftdi_sio
[67681.419788] /build/buildd/linux-2.6.24/drivers/usb/serial/ftdi_sio.c: v1.4.3:USB FTDI Serial Converters Driver
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post #70 of 105
12/8/09 at 5:38am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by northbear View Post

3) For some reason my mind wants the upper right most key (pause/break) to be the delete key. Probably just a personal problem

Figured out what the issue is here. My wife's laptop has the delete key in the upper right corner so I am sure that is my "problem"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rgb View Post

Do a dmesg in a terminal with the USB-serial adapter and report output- should be something like this

serial support registered for FTDI USB Serial Device
[67681.419686] ftdi_sio 2-5:1.0: FTDI USB Serial Device converter detected
[67681.419703] /build/buildd/linux-2.6.24/drivers/usb/serial/ftdi_sio.c: Detected FT8U232AM
[67681.419777] usb 2-5: FTDI USB Serial Device converter now attached to ttyUSB0
[67681.419785] usbcore: registered new interface driver ftdi_sio
[67681.419788] /build/buildd/linux-2.6.24/drivers/usb/serial/ftdi_sio.c: v1.4.3:USB FTDI Serial Converters Driver

Will do when I receive it!
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post #71 of 105
12/11/09 at 5:48pm
Thread Starter 
OK here is the dmesg for the original working usb serial adapter
Code:
[ 1872.820029] usb 2-1: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 9
[ 1873.779942] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 1873.788330] input: MCT Corp. Serial Mouse Adaptor as /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:02.3/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input9
[ 1873.832249] generic-usb 0003:0711:0231.0005: input,hidraw1: USB HID v1.10 Mouse [MCT Corp. Serial Mouse Adaptor] on usb-0000:00:02.3-1/input0
So far the new one from Monoprice doesn't seem to work

lsusb gives

Code:
Bus 002 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Bus 001 Device 003: ID 0461:4d03 Primax Electronics, Ltd Kensington Mouse-in-a-box
Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
and dmesg gives

Code:
[ 1147.812022] usb 2-1: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 8
[ 1148.025081] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 1148.056842] pl2303 2-1:1.0: pl2303 converter detected
[ 1148.118073] usb 2-1: pl2303 converter now attached to ttyUSB0

If I plug in the MCT adaptor without it being plugged into the SK-7500 dmesg gives:

Code:
[ 2350.000083] usb 2-1: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 10
[ 2350.964346] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 2350.965879] mct_u232 2-1:1.0: MCT U232 converter detected
[ 2350.965997] usb 2-1: MCT U232 converter now attached to ttyUSB0
and if I try to plug the SK-7500 it does not seem to work.

Unplug the usb and plug back in (with SK-7500 connected) it works again. dmesg gives

Code:
[ 2463.319830] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 10
[ 2463.322575] mct_u232 ttyUSB0: MCT U232 converter now disconnected from ttyUSB0
[ 2463.322597] mct_u232 2-1:1.0: device disconnected
[ 2472.260042] usb 2-1: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 11
[ 2473.215527] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 2473.223263] input: MCT Corp. Serial Mouse Adaptor as /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:02.3/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input10
[ 2473.268201] generic-usb 0003:0711:0231.0006: input,hidraw1: USB HID v1.10 Mouse [MCT Corp. Serial Mouse Adaptor] on usb-0000:00:02.3-1/input0

Looking at this (and keep in mind I have no idea what I am talking about ) Looks like the MCT has a "USB HID v1.10 Mouse [MCT Corp. Serial Mouse Adaptor]" built into it which is why it automagicly works?!?

I think I could probably get the monoprice adaptor to work via the standard serial mouse method, but it is not automatic like the MCT adaptor.

Sorry for the rambling post. I am posting as I am testing

**Edit** the adaptor sold by monoprice is iocrest sy-ada15006
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post #72 of 105
12/12/09 at 12:19am
Quote:
Originally Posted by northbear View Post


Looking at this (and keep in mind I have no idea what I am talking about ) Looks like the MCT has a "USB HID v1.10 Mouse [MCT Corp. Serial Mouse Adaptor]" built into it which is why it automagicly works?!?

I think I could probably get the monoprice adaptor to work via the standard serial mouse method, but it is not automatic like the MCT adaptor.

Sorry for the rambling post. I am posting as I am testing

**Edit** the adaptor sold by monoprice is iocrest sy-ada15006

This is what I suspected, that the non-monoprice serial adapter had HID-compliant mouse conversion built in.

Let us know if the standard serial mouse method works, using the Ubuntu serial mouse HOWTO, using the ttyUSB0 port.
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post #73 of 105
12/15/09 at 5:43am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rgb View Post

This is what I suspected, that the non-monoprice serial adapter had HID-compliant mouse conversion built in.

Let us know if the standard serial mouse method works, using the Ubuntu serial mouse HOWTO, using the ttyUSB0 port.

If I get a chance I will do so. Right now it is lower on the priority list as I am busy with other (non htpc) items. Also I am able to borrow the other cable indefinitely at this point, so there are other challenges to tackle before this. That being said I don't see why it wouldn't work.
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post #74 of 105
5/19/10 at 7:17am
Kewl new (to me) Lenovo mini HTPC keybaord/trackball-

http://shop.lenovo.com/SEUILibrary/c..._menu_area=yes


...could be a game changer if functionality is there, given it's price, though the lack of F1-F12 keys is a liability
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post #75 of 105
5/19/10 at 8:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rgb View Post

Kewl new Lenovo mini HTPC keybaord/trackball-

http://shop.lenovo.com/SEUILibrary/c..._menu_area=yes


...could be a game changer if functionality is there, given it's price, though the lack of F1-F12 keys is a liability

This looks like a decent option, though the lack of backlight might be a sticking point for some. I've seen this consistently as low as $36 over the last few months, so keep an eye out for a bargain.
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post #76 of 105
5/19/10 at 9:01am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jstarling82 View Post

This looks like a decent option, though the lack of backlight might be a sticking point for some. I've seen this consistently as low as $36 over the last few months, so keep an eye out for a bargain.

Does this Lenovo media keyboard have right/left mouse buttons under the index finger when grasped, i.e. the underside of the unit?

If the only mouse buttons are on top, then another strike against it, but for $36, I'd prolly give it a whirl...
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post #77 of 105
5/19/10 at 11:30am
The reviews I've read indicate that it doesn't, though I've yet to try it in person. One user indicated that it's a bit of a pain having to position the trackball and then move his thumb to click.

For the price and functionality, though, I'm just waiting for a deal to come back around. Ergonomically, it seems to be flawed, but it does what it should, and I haven't seen overwhelmingly bad reviews. Plus, I'm easier to please than most.

I have a link to some discussion, but it's on a deals site, so I'm not sure it would be appropriate to post here.
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post #78 of 105
5/20/10 at 4:02am
To follow up, apply coupon code USPCMY36336 to get this for $36.
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post #79 of 105
5/20/10 at 4:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jstarling82 View Post

To follow up, apply coupon code USPCMY36336 to get this for $36.

Which deal site and/or store- just names, no need for linx...
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post #80 of 105
5/20/10 at 6:23am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rgb View Post

Which deal site and/or store- just names, no need for linx...

That coupon can be applied at the link you provided to the Lenovo site.

There is considerable discussion of this product taking place right now at Slickdeals.net
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post #81 of 105
5/20/10 at 6:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jstarling82 View Post

This looks like a decent option, though the lack of backlight might be a sticking point for some. I've seen this consistently as low as $36 over the last few months, so keep an eye out for a bargain.

count me as someone that would jump if it was backlit, but actually managing to resist a new gadget without.

It has been on sale very frequently lately. (edit: I keep hoping that's so they can clear stock to make way for the backlit version )
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post #82 of 105
5/20/10 at 7:08am
Quote:
Originally Posted by zim2dive View Post

. (edit: I keep hoping that's so they can clear stock to make way for the backlit version )


...with index finger "trigger" mouse buttons and F-keys
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post #83 of 105
5/20/10 at 11:29am
YAMMC (Yet another mini media keyboard)-

http://www.deal-cool.com/Product/24G...FQ8MDQod5DajHw

Interesting, good price, backlit.

But only F1-F8!? And goofy trackpad with badly placed mouse buttons?

/rant on
It seems every promising mini media keyboard has one or more fatal flaws- cost, no F-keys, nobacklight, bad ergonomic design. When will SOMEONE get it right!!!
/rant off

This unit could be great if it had F1-F12 and a trackball on the right and mouse buttons with scroll wheel on the left...
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post #84 of 105
5/20/10 at 12:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rgb View Post

YAMMC (Yet another mini media keyboard)-

http://www.deal-cool.com/Product/24G...FQ8MDQod5DajHw

Interesting, good price, backlit.

But only F1-F8!? And goofy trackpad with badly placed mouse buttons?

/rant on
It seems every promising mini media keyboard has one or more fatal flaws- cost, no F-keys, nobacklight, bad ergonomic design. When will SOMEONE get it right!!!
/rant off

This unit could be great if it had F1-F12 and a trackball on the right and mouse buttons with scroll wheel on the left...

yeah, this one hit slickdeals a few months ago... it was odd.. it seems some "name" company picked it up and started selling (rebranded) but the old noname was still out there, but LOL, they all jacked their prices up within 2-3 days to match

I waffled and probably would've bought in at ~$40, but it shot up to ~$70 and now back to mid $50s.

But I find it more compelling (but alas also more expensive) than the Lenovo one (it has backlight and I hate trackballs)

EDIT: I still am ashamed for having allowed the thought of "I don't really need this" to have delayed my purchase.

EDIT2: tomtop is the place that had the no name version.. they also have this beastie: http://www.tomtop.com/portable-2-4g-...ll_p11377.html
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post #85 of 105
5/21/10 at 6:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by zim2dive View Post

EDIT2: tomtop is the place that had the no name version.. they also have this beastie: http://www.tomtop.com/portable-2-4g-...ll_p11377.html

That Tom Tom site keyboard one looks really interesting, but the F11 and F12 are hidden on the F1, F2 keys, and the PgUp/Dn keys are also hidden on the arrown keys, all requiring the Fn key to use. PgUp/Dn are important for page navigation when the scroll wheel doesn't suit.

It sounds like we are afflicted with the same gadet-itis

We like to try out this stuff, with the unfortunate side effect of accumulating an excess over time, and sometimes getting burned with bad designs

I keep going back to my trusty SK7500 IR board- it still has the best battery life, reliability and versatility of any RF/IR board I've tried.

However, for certain cases I'd like an RF board (range, non-line of sight, trackball and scroll wheel capabilities), so I bought the IO Gear 2.4Ghz with optical trackball and scroll wheel months ago-

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002H0BOBA/?tag=mall02-20

I like optical trackballs, and wanted a real mouse scroll wheel. Also great price on the IO Gear, and respected brand.

Build quality is generally good, but the side rubber "bumper" trim adhesive let go recently due to simple heat from my hands over time. No big deal, but bad design choice. Also, battery life appears short vs the SK7500, though I beleive it's the batteries that were in the box but I'll have to double check.

This IO Gear appears functionally equivalent to the Adesso optical/scroll wheel RF board-

http://www.amazon.com/Wireless-Multi.../dp/B000JJM7S0

but costs less. I'd like to try the Adesso now that I 've held it in my hands at a local retailer- better ergonomics/grip and no trim to fall off
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post #86 of 105
5/21/10 at 6:20am
MSI's Mini HTPC Keyboard with Motion Sensing Mousing

http://www.everythingusb.com/msi-air...ard-18533.html

Interesting, but I don't agree with the accelerometer concept, requiring constant tilting of the whole keyboard to navigate with the mouse.

However, it's the form factor, size and ergonomic design I've been looking for, but...

NO F-keys! Backlight? Optical trackball+scrollwheel or pointer stick+scroll wheel?

...all these mfg's keep dancing around the *perfect* design and NEVER getting it right!?
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post #87 of 105
5/21/10 at 12:16pm
...another version of that MSI accelerometer board with better pictures:

Cideko Air Keyboard Wireless Media Keyboard & Gyro Mouse for HTPC, PC, Mac & PS3

http://www.amazon.com/Cideko-Keyboar.../dp/B0030UJK2G

I would buy it yesterday if it had a trackball+scroll wheel or pointer stick+scroll wheel, F-keys and backlighting.
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post #88 of 105
5/21/10 at 12:22pm
...at least it appears the mini HTPC keyboard market is heating up, thanks in part to Logitech's diNovo Mini kinda kick starting it.

Hopefully more designs and IR options will hit the streets, so at least *one* should hit my "secret formula"
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post #89 of 105
5/25/10 at 9:20pm
What illuminated back lite wireless keyboard options are available out there ?
I"m having a hard time finding any
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post #90 of 105
5/26/10 at 4:35am
Quote:
Originally Posted by kram1 View Post

What illuminated back lite wireless keyboard options are available out there ?
I"m having a hard time finding any

Join the club

I've been on that Quest for over a decade. I think it's coming soon.

At the moment, one of the only options is the Logitech diNono mini-
http://www.logitech.com/en-us/keyboa...d/devices/3848

however, it's too pricey, missing F-keys, and has other issues- a recent Google search tells me a lot of people are abandoning it after using it for some time.

I think ~$50-$80 mini wireless keyboards with backlight will finally hit late this year or early next. It appears the market for mini wireless keyboards is finally heating up.
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