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Official LaserVue Owners thread - Page 6

post #151 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by buckscountyguy View Post

Sorry for the confusion. That sales manager laughed at the 60,000 hour (marketing hype)comment. He said his experience with 2-3 year old plasmas show fading when they come in for repair. They get to compare to new plasmas. Us using plasma with no comparison in the same room might not notice it. I loved my 7 year old Samsung DLP then when I brought this LaserVue in I couldn't believe how bad the Samsung looked! This LaserVue with High Def with Verizon FIOS seems hard to beat. Just my opionion.

Seven year old Samsung? I only thought Samsung was producing DLP sets for about 5 years with the earliest model the HLM series. I had the Samsung HLN617 and I recently upgraded to the new LED based Samsung (LH61A750) The biggest difference is the contrast ratio and 1080p resolution due to the more advanced DLP chip. Also having three variable light sources and no color wheel makes a big difference. I hope Mitsubishi DLP model are successful since the DLP technology is great!
post #152 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulGo View Post

Seven year old Samsung? I only thought Samsung was producing DLP sets for about 5 years with the earliest model the HLM series.

We bought our HLM 507 in Oct 2002 and it had been available for maybe six months so seven years old is not impossible. But, we digress.
post #153 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by buckscountyguy View Post

Sorry for the confusion. That sales manager laughed at the 60,000 hour (marketing hype)comment. He said his experience with 2-3 year old plasmas show fading when they come in for repair. They get to compare to new plasmas. Us using plasma with no comparison in the same room might not notice it. I loved my 7 year old Samsung DLP then when I brought this LaserVue in I couldn't believe how bad the Samsung looked! This LaserVue with High Def with Verizon FIOS seems hard to beat. Just my opionion.

Comparing an old plasma with old tech to a new plasma with new tech is not a valid comparison either, regardless of its hours of use...
post #154 of 2625
When does the 73 come out? Sony has abandoned RPTV leaving me with only Mitsu to go to, it appears. It will be this or the Diamond DLP 73 for my next set, likely, as I don't care much to take the downward step in quality in LCD and I don't think there are any 70"+ 1080p plasmas that wouldn't annihilate my bank account.
post #155 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaldorfSalad View Post

We bought our HLM 507 in Oct 2002 and it had been available for maybe six months so seven years old is not impossible. But, we digress.

Not that long before you bought yours. I don't remember any being delivered (based on AVS reports) before I registered at AVS. At the time, I was looking for any DLP information that I could find.

Panasonic and Mitsubishi had very expensive versions much before that time -- $10k-$20k. Samsung was the DLP for the rest of us.
post #156 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by UxiSXRD View Post

When does the 73 come out? Sony has abandoned RPTV leaving me with only Mitsu to go to, it appears. It will be this or the Diamond DLP 73 for my next set, likely, as I don't care much to take the downward step in quality in LCD and I don't think there are any 70"+ 1080p plasmas that wouldn't annihilate my bank account.

seems it's TBD, as mits has halted production of the laservue for now but says it should be back in early 2009. (they better get on it to meet that timeline)

http://www.electronichouse.com/artic..._laservue_tvs/

suggest you check into that Diamond 73" till it's determined if mits can even get the laservue back on track.
post #157 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by egrady View Post

See my post #76. The Laservue I demo'd had a similar problem, but not as severe. It makes no difference what Mits says, if the problem bothers you return it. Especially when they are reluctant to even admit the possibility that the first generation of a new technology may have a bug.

I understand the problem Mits was having was inefficiency in the laser assembly. I don't know if the original process in making and installing it was simply to expensive or if the problem was to many didn't make it past quality control. In any event, that is the reason why production was halted. The set will return, this year, with the 65" coming first and then larger screens.

If returning the set leaves you with no big screen, perhaps your dealer would agree to give you a grace period. If they, or Mits, can't, or won't, do anything to address your problem by X day, they'll allow you to return it for full store credit.

I just saw this problem at the local Electronics Expo. I was actually auditioning speakers, but the Laservue was part of the setup. I saw the light at the bottom while watching a movie with bars and you could see it shining rather brightly too. It was rather distracting. I bet this is the main reason they pulled these sets off the market, especially since several have seen this on different sets.
post #158 of 2625
Thread Starter 
There goes plasma check this out [url]http://www.popsci.com/entertainment-amp-gaming/article/2009-02/plasma-going-way-romans. There goes the KURO and that was a great TV
post #159 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by buckscountyguy View Post

There goes plasma check this out http://www.popsci.com/entertainment-...ing-way-romans. There goes the KURO and that was a great TV

The Eastern Roman Empire actually survived for many centuries after the fall in the West...

Grief over Kuro, but carry on Panasonic Neo-Plasma!
post #160 of 2625
Update:

First, I will state for the record that the LaserVue I purchased was a floor model. As I am sure some of you know, the TV is completely unavailable right now. Yes, the deal was a sweet one.

Andersons offered to swap the set with another floor model nearby which I had gotten a (short) opportunity to view and did not see the bottom center light blur while inspecting it.
I accepted and the TV's were swapped out.

Once the sun had set, the blur returned, EXACTLY as before, with the exact same secondary spot of light off to the left.
Andersons is now looking into a rep from Mits to come out and have a look.
In the meantime, I picked up a Samsung BDP2500 blu-ray player.
While waiting for a disc to be loaded, the samsung goes into screensaver mode, where a white circle samsung logo jumps from spot to spot on the screen. The laservue displayed this like the old Bat Signal. The light shot out from the bottom center up to where the circle was displayed.

Perhaps these symptoms are normal for a set that has been turned on for 12 hours a day for a couple months.
Perhaps owners of brand new boxed laservue sets will not see this problem for 6-12 months.

The HD Guru reviewed this set saying that "with lights out a 0 IRE black screen was jet black.

On my set, with lights out, the screen glows with the bright bottom center. It is not jet black and there is no mistaking that the set is turned on.

Otherwise, I totally love this set.
That is the status thus far.
post #161 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevEB View Post

Update:

First, I will state for the record that the LaserVue I purchased was a floor model. As I am sure some of you know, the TV is completely unavailable right now. Yes, the deal was a sweet one.

Andersons offered to swap the set with another floor model nearby which I had gotten a (short) opportunity to view and did not see the bottom center light blur while inspecting it.
I accepted and the TV's were swapped out.

Once the sun had set, the blur returned, EXACTLY as before, with the exact same secondary spot of light off to the left.
Andersons is now looking into a rep from Mits to come out and have a look.
In the meantime, I picked up a Samsung BDP2500 blu-ray player.
While waiting for a disc to be loaded, the samsung goes into screensaver mode, where a white circle samsung logo jumps from spot to spot on the screen. The laservue displayed this like the old Bat Signal. The light shot out from the bottom center up to where the circle was displayed.

Perhaps these symptoms are normal for a set that has been turned on for 12 hours a day for a couple months.
Perhaps owners of brand new boxed laservue sets will not see this problem for 6-12 months.

The HD Guru reviewed this set saying that "with lights out a 0 IRE black screen was jet black.

On my set, with lights out, the screen glows with the bright bottom center. It is not jet black and there is no mistaking that the set is turned on.

Otherwise, I totally love this set.
That is the status thus far.

Thanks for your honesty.
post #162 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by umr View Post

It is rude to do display comparisons in an owners thread.

I also do not provide comparisons on the forum. It just upsets people to hear the deficiencies of their product.

Understood, but all of the reviewers seem to have ignored the comparison as well. When you are talking 3 times or more purchase price, there better be significant advantage to laser. Has anybody seen any review site compare LED vs. Laser? Maybe when availability improves (but by then LED may be gone, which might be what Mits is counting on).
post #163 of 2625
I just don't see why anyone is worried about justifying price comparisons on a limited production, first generation product that was never intended to be anything but a first attempt at getting the technology to market. It is not a production like product at this point. When, if, the second generation product shows up, and it is mass produced and mass marketed, then these comparisons will make more sense.

When the first PDP, LCD, LCOS, or even big CRT sets first came out they were ridiculously priced. Likewise, price/value relationship was not a significant factor in the decision to bring this product to market at a given price.
post #164 of 2625
I guess it depends whether you see it as something truly new or just another flavor of DLP.

(Personally, I'm certainly still rooting for it whatever the case may be...)
post #165 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by lcaillo View Post

I just don't see why anyone is worried about justifying price comparisons on a limited production, first generation product . . .
When the first PDP, LCD, LCOS, or even big CRT sets first came out they were ridiculously priced. Likewise, price/value relationship was not a significant factor in the decision to bring this product to market at a given price.

Quote:
Originally Posted by S. Hiller View Post

I guess it depends whether you see it as something truly new or just another flavor of DLP.

I'm looking at it compared to pricing of LED when it came out (which was a small premium but nothing like this). And yes I consider it just another flavor--unless there is some justification in engineering or parts expense vs. LED when it came out.

Oh well, this is an owner's thread, but I just thought it was screwy that when Mits rolled this out with their big demo when they compared to plasma, etc. they didn't compare to LED, and it just seems that the reviewers have seemed to continue to let them off the hook on that important comparison.

Back to your regular schedule. . .
post #166 of 2625
Still wobulated?
post #167 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by UxiSXRD View Post

Still wobulated?

Who cares if it achieves 1080P drawing half the pixels at a time like DLP does or one pixel at a time like CRT?

Video is sharp and test patterns come up clean and full 1080P. (At least on a Samsung with its electronic overscan switched off...)
post #168 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by S. Hiller View Post

Who cares if it achieves 1080P drawing half the pixels at a time like DLP does or one pixel at a time like CRT?

Video is sharp and test patterns come up clean and full 1080P. (At least on a Samsung with its electronic overscan switched off...)

Anyone who wants a big 70" + set capable of something other than 60hz (and thus capable of getting rid of telecine judder). The 3 chip front projectors can... but apparently not the other Mitsu "120hz" sets.
post #169 of 2625
So... would all of the owners of Laservue TVs here conclude that the issues I am having with mine are because it is a floor model? Is this some kind of glitch that appears when the TV is turned on every day for 12 hours a day for 2 months? One person commented seeing the blur at a convention display booth. Another TV left on for hours on end.
Why would Mitsubishi's Premier Laservue Tech support claim that it was normal?
Please only comment if you actually own the set.
post #170 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevEB View Post

So... would all of the owners of Laservue TVs here conclude that the issues I am having with mine are because it is a floor model? Is this some kind of glitch that appears when the TV is turned on every day for 12 hours a day for 2 months? One person commented seeing the blur at a convention display booth. Another TV left on for hours on end.
Why would Mitsubishi's Premier Laservue Tech support claim that it was normal?
Please only comment if you actually own the set.

First off, I don't own a Laservue - and I quite frankly have no idea why that should preclude me from commenting on this - you're presumably looking for a solution to your problem and it shouldn't matter where that solution comes from. The problem you're having is either a specific problem with the 2 samples you've had or is an inherent design problem that surfaces after some amount of use. A floor model on a product this new has not been around long enough that simply being a floor model should be a serious problem.

Their tech support is most likely claiming that it's normal simply because they have no idea how to fix it or because it is indeed working within the designed parameters.

At this point I think you need to decide if you can live with the problem or not. If you cannot live with the problem, your options are to raise hell within Mitsubishi's support organization until you get someone who will admit there's a problem that needs to be fixed or explore returning the set for a refund and purchase something else. Normally a third option of getting another exchange would be viable, but given that there aren't any available, you can't go this route right now.

If it were me, I would not want to live with the problem (regardless of cost - this wouldn't be acceptable to me if the TV only cost $1000) and would probably opt to get a refund and go with another option.
post #171 of 2625
I would suggest nobody purchase this TV. They have stopped production.
post #172 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucifer1977 View Post

I would suggest nobody purchase this TV. They have stopped production.

Link? Its just now getting magazine reviews, and Mits has stuck with Laser this long (plus just pushing it at CES 2 months ago)--why would they quit already?

http://www.slashgear.com/mitsubishis...orary-1133927/

I think "temporary" because of a manufacturing problem would be a good detail to emphasize. Sounds to me like Mits needs to come out with some tried and true LED tech until they figure this out
post #173 of 2625
There is a vertical line of light that projects from the right side of the lens mounted at the base of the TV and hits the inside of the cabinet. That line travels from the base to just above the edge of the bottom of the screen. That explains the second dot of light that is to the bottom left center. Why it is there and can it be stopped, I do not know.

The glow that comes from the bottom center of screen is in fact light coming from the equipment below. Why it is so bright, I cannot explain.
How the HD Guru could not have seen this boggles the mind.
LL
post #174 of 2625
As I stated in an earlier post, the demo I saw at Electronics Expo had the same light coming from the lower center part of the screen too. During dark scenes it was distracting. It reminds me of bad LCD sets with backlight leakage. For any set it is inexcusable, but for a 7K set, definitely not acceptable.

I think this is one of the reasons they pulled the set as this is clearly a defect several have reported. Just hope if they bring this set back they fix this. Hell.... it was distracting and I was just auditioning the speakers near it.
post #175 of 2625
Mixdoctor: thanks for your reply.
As far as I know, only you and I have reported this problem.
Egrady noticed it but said is was far dimmer then it is on mine.
If you have seen other reports, please link to them.
The other 2 owners of Laservue sets in this thread do not claim to have the problem.
post #176 of 2625
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1137453

Perhaps a couple of owners got lucky. Maybe the caps are not consistent, or they changed manufacturers. The set that the HD-Guru reviewed must have been tweaked in order for them to claim "0 ire jet black"

After ample opportunity, I've given up on Mitsubishi. They have held firm that the conditions I've pictured are normal. Who am I to argue at this point. So back it goes. Next stop, Kuro.
post #177 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by john stephens View Post

No, I can't share those numbers. Besides, I think each of us should have the Natural Mode at Low Temp Calibrated Once. And select your Calibrator with care.

I know that AV junkies act like they have a Skull & Bones membership, but if you're hanging out on a forum it does imply that you're also into 'share-and-share' alike. Or you should be anyway...

So enough of silly games. Unless you're in a position to lose money, why not fess up calibration details? Subjective statements don't carry much weight, and even less so when they are used as substitute for known hard data.

The cynic in me thinks that not much Laservue's correction was possible or desirable. Perhaps a certain professional is loathe to state as much, lest he lose professional credibility and/or future business?

In the absence of data, and given the Laservue's digital processing chain and inherent accuracy of laser color, I would actually be skeptical of any claims to anything more than a subjective improvement. Should we conclude that the discerning buyer will get a Laservue, accept the color for what it is, and forget the calibration?

P.S. Somebody needs to throw stones in this glass house of AV nuts. I say that as a professional AV designer myself.
post #178 of 2625
I am really attracted to the form factor of this set. I was able to view one of these at a local dealer and liked what I saw on the Natural setting, except for a loss of screen resolution whenever the camera made a pan on the screen. Details disappeared during the pan, but then re-emerged once the camera settled down. There was no digital breakup, the picture just went soft during the pan. The dealer blamed this on his feed, but a friend and I are not so certain that this could be. Do any of you who own this set notice this, or was it the fault of the dealer's source?

Thanks.
post #179 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Dickerso View Post

I am really attracted to the form factor of this set. I was able to view one of these at a local dealer and liked what I saw on the Natural setting, except for a loss of screen resolution whenever the camera made a pan on the screen. Details disappeared during the pan, but then re-emerged once the camera settled down. There was no digital breakup, the picture just went soft during the pan. The dealer blamed this on his feed, but a friend and I are not so certain that this could be. Do any of you who own this set notice this, or was it the fault of the dealer's source?

Thanks.

I would tend to agree with the dealer -- this really sounds a feed issue. What was the source? Was it satellite, or cable, or something local to the store? I'm guessing that it was either satellite or cable at this point, and if so, the re-compression that this type of source goes through is going to cause the exact issue you saw -- loss of detail during pans, which take a lot more bandwidth due to the constantly changing image. The effect is particularly bad with some satellite channels.

I honestly don't see why a laser-based dlp would cause this issue. The speed at which the image can change/update is determined by the dlp chip, and this effect is definitely not something that dlp chips are known for. In other words, the image reproduction system itself is fast enough to display each individual frame on the screen without any degradation, so any loss of detail in pans would have to be due to the source.

Note that I haven't seen this set, however, so I don't have any personal opinions about this image quality of this set.

Larry
post #180 of 2625
Doesn't seem to be much feedback from buyers here. Are they selling?

Has anyone had their's professionally calibrated? Are the blacks as weak as the Sound and Vision review noted?

Thanks. I like the narrow bezel and size factor. Hoping that it turns into a viable option.
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