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Official LaserVue Owners thread - Page 4

post #91 of 2625
What you have there may be “normal” for a Laservue, but it’s definitely not normal or acceptable on other RPTV’s.
I have owned two CRT based RPTV’s and an SXRD, none had issues like that. My 57” Hitachi had blacks so good a Pioneer Kuro would be insane with jealousy and the SXRD had a very faint glow over the entire screen, like all digital TV’s. After modification the glow was reduced 70% putting it at or below Kuro levels.
The SXRD suffers less from lens flair then the CRT based units because in has a single high quality lens rather then the three giant low grade lenses in a CRT RPTV.
Laservue is also a single lens system so lens flair should not be a significant problem unless the optics are of poor quality.


It looks to me like there is a light leak from the optical block; this stray white light is shining onto the lower area of the screen producing the pattern you see, totally unacceptable IMHO.
I hope its just a fault with your set and not a design flaw.
post #92 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpenceJT View Post

I see similar internal reflection within my CRT RPTV (Mitsubishi WS-65907). This is only noticeable during credits, and similar situations where the majority of the screen is black, with high contrast images displayed. The reflection in my case, will have a rolling effect when credits scroll on the screen.

Sounds like your TV had dirty optics; there is some light scatter in CRT RPTV’s but nothing even close to as bad as the Laservue on a good example.



Quote:
Originally Posted by SpenceJT View Post

I was able to reduce (not eliminate this) by lining all non-reflective areas within my television with duvatyne (sp). Given the nature of the LaserView's construction, and the inherent danger in opening one, I doubt there will be a DIY type solution.

Perhaps future generations will work to reduce internal reflection?

There may well be a DIY fix or partial fix for the problem and personally I would have no hesitation in opening up the set to take a look. The laser light source is diffused not a concentrated beam, I would be more worried about looking into the lens of a front projector. Even a typical UHP lamp powered RPTV is significantly brighter then Laservue.

If you are worry about safety use suitable eye protection when running with the screen removed.
post #93 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wasabi Shiba View Post

Actually, the correct spelling is Duvetyne.

Thanks, I was too lazy to look it up.
post #94 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevEB View Post

The first two pictures I sent to Mitsubitshi were diagnosed as;
"normal for rear projection tv"
"glow of light instruments below"
"normal viewing patterns not effected"

I've sent these photos in yesterday and await a reply.

If any of you could manage a few pictures that show the Laservue not having this issue, that would be most appreciated. Since this television is nowhere to be found right now, I have no way of comparing.

The IronMan image was a 1080p download from DirecTV.

Attaching photos is easy. Just choose "go advanced" below "quick reply" and click the paperclip to attach and image.

Why are you dealing with Mitsubishi? Assuming you purchased from a local dealer, don't let them pass you off to Mits and simply count your money. If they say this is a service issue and your only recourse with with Mits service, return it and get your money back.

This is the exact reason to purchase a large item, where shipping is difficult, from a local dealer. If they don't immediately step up and help you, what purpose do they service? They can't charge bricks and morter prices and then avoid service entanglements. You can go on line if price is your only concern.
post #95 of 2625
Do not try to open the set and fix it! The laser intensity can be very dangerous.
post #96 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevEB View Post

According to Mitsubishi, these issues are NORMAL. Mitsubishi then reports to Andersons and Andersons then reports to me.

Andersons is willing to take the TV back if I am dissatisfied, so that is good.

I just can't believe that none of the reviewers thus far would have notice this. Am I really that observant or snobby? There is one more floor model nearby which I will go and inspect. Otherwise I have to wait until the next shipment shows up in March and new floor models hit the floors.

As for opening the set up and fixing it myself. Yeah, I could do that. I'm just not in the habit of opening up brand new 7k televisions to fix design flaws. I usually wait a couple years before I go diving in to clear out the spiderwebs.

Help me out new owners. If your screen isn't showing what mine is showing, take a picture and post it.

If I were you, I would return the TV - the consensus here is that something isn't right regardless of what Mitsubishi says. You can always try again in a few months when new stock comes in, though it's probably more likely that you'd go with another option so you'll have something to watch. Let us know what you end up doing.
post #97 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevEB View Post

According to Mitsubishi, these issues are NORMAL. Mitsubishi then reports to Andersons and Andersons then reports to me.

Andersons is willing to take the TV back if I am dissatisfied, so that is good.

I just can't believe that none of the reviewers thus far would have notice this. Am I really that observant or snobby? There is one more floor model nearby which I will go and inspect. Otherwise I have to wait until the next shipment shows up in March and new floor models hit the floors.

As for opening the set up and fixing it myself. Yeah, I could do that. I'm just not in the habit of opening up brand new 7k televisions to fix design flaws. I usually wait a couple years before I go diving in to clear out the spiderwebs.

Help me out new owners. If your screen isn't showing what mine is showing, take a picture and post it.

I asked the question I did in my previous post, because my LCD RPTV show some of the same charachteristics of that light when it is set above eye level when looking at the center. Another words if your eyes are level with the bottom of the screen the issue is apparent.
post #98 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hughmc View Post

I asked the question I did in my previous post, because my LCD RPTV show some of the same charachteristics of that light when it is set above eye level when looking at the center. Another words if your eyes are level with the bottom of the screen the issue is apparent.

Agreed, if I look at my own lamp based Mits DLP with my eyes level with the bottom of the screen, I also get a similar type of effect as what these pictures show. It disappears though if my eyes are level with the center of the screen.
post #99 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevEB View Post

As for opening the set up and fixing it myself. Yeah, I could do that. I'm just not in the habit of opening up brand new 7k televisions to fix design flaws. I usually wait a couple years before I go diving in to clear out the spiderwebs.

I opened up a brand new $6.5k TV to improve its performance, but the magnitude of the design flaw was no where near what you have there and I knew what I want to do would work.
I can fully understand why you would not want to take the risk of disassembling a new TV with the hope of addressing a major problem that should not have been there to begin with. Best idea it to return it for a refund and re-evaluate your options.
post #100 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by lcaillo View Post

Do not try to open the set and fix it! The laser intensity can be very dangerous.

Lasers are only dangerous because they concentrate light onto a very small area, when that light is diffused over a 65 screen the light per given area is very low, in fact lower then most lamp based RPTV's, and insignificant compare to a sunny day.
post #101 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by LanceTX View Post

Agreed, if I look at my own lamp based Mits DLP with my eyes level with the bottom of the screen, I also get a similar type of effect as what these pictures show. It disappears though if my eyes are level with the center of the screen.

And those pics look like it is at least a foot too high on that stand and eye level is at the bottom of the set instead of the middle.
post #102 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hughmc View Post

And those pics look like it is at least a foot too high on that stand and eye level is at the bottom of the set instead of the middle.

Yes, at least the camera angle in every shot seems to be vertically in line with the bottom of the screen rather than at the center. Not saying that's the only issue here in this particular case, but any RPTV that is on a stand too tall for your eye level to be at the center of the screen vertically will have issues at least similar to this.
post #103 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevEB View Post

According to Mitsubishi, these issues are NORMAL. Mitsubishi then reports to Andersons and Andersons then reports to me.

Andersons is willing to take the TV back if I am dissatisfied, so that is good.

I just can't believe that none of the reviewers thus far would have notice this. Am I really that observant or snobby? There is one more floor model nearby which I will go and inspect. Otherwise I have to wait until the next shipment shows up in March and new floor models hit the floors.

As for opening the set up and fixing it myself. Yeah, I could do that. I'm just not in the habit of opening up brand new 7k televisions to fix design flaws. I usually wait a couple years before I go diving in to clear out the spiderwebs.

Help me out new owners. If your screen isn't showing what mine is showing, take a picture and post it.

See my post #76. The Laservue I demo'd had a similar problem, but not as severe. It makes no difference what Mits says, if the problem bothers you return it. Especially when they are reluctant to even admit the possibility that the first generation of a new technology may have a bug.

I understand the problem Mits was having was inefficiency in the laser assembly. I don't know if the original process in making and installing it was simply to expensive or if the problem was to many didn't make it past quality control. In any event, that is the reason why production was halted. The set will return, this year, with the 65" coming first and then larger screens.

If returning the set leaves you with no big screen, perhaps your dealer would agree to give you a grace period. If they, or Mits, can't, or won't, do anything to address your problem by X day, they'll allow you to return it for full store credit.
post #104 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Owen View Post

Lasers are only dangerous because they concentrate light onto a very small area, when that light is diffused over a 65 screen the light per given area is very low...

I agree that the dangers of the lasers once past the light engine are overhyped, but personally, *I* wouldn't want to take that set apart simply due to that micro-vibrating screen. At least not without knowing any details about how it's assembeled and operates.

As far as the TV, I would definitely take it back. My <$2k 73" lamp based Mits doesn't do that. I certainly wouldn't accept that from a $7k display. Mitsubishi's reply is BS. If that's how they're going to treat customers who are essentially supporting them in their beta program, then I say get out while you can.
post #105 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darin View Post

I agree that the dangers of the lasers once past the light engine are overhyped, but personally, *I* wouldn't want to take that set apart simply due to that micro-vibrating screen. At least not without knowing any details about how it's assembeled and operates.

As far as the TV, I would definitely take it back. My <$2k 73" lamp based Mits doesn't do that. I certainly wouldn't accept that from a $7k display. Mitsubishi's reply is BS. If that's how they're going to treat customers who are essentially supporting them in their beta program, then I say get out while you can.

+1.

My Diamond doesn't do that and if it did, regardless of the cost (and I paid a lot less than 7k), then back it would go.

Seggers
post #106 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darin View Post

. If that's how they're going to treat customers who are essentially supporting them in their beta program, then I say get out while you can.

Beta program? Ouch!
post #107 of 2625
Maybe that came across more harshly than intended. But I do think it's fair to say that it's bleeding edge technology that hasn't yet been fully refined. Does that sound better?
post #108 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Owen View Post

Lasers are only dangerous because they concentrate light onto a very small area, when that light is diffused over a 65 screen the light per given area is very low, in fact lower then most lamp based RPTV's, and insignificant compare to a sunny day.

more of this?

There is a reason lasers have saftey classifications. This TV has a powerful laser incorporated inside.
Those lasers output the highest saftey classification that the FDA has.

don't open your laser TV no matter what anyone on some internet forum tells you.

Even if mitsubishi is wrong in their understanding of lasers and random posters on public internet forums knows more than them, dont take a chance with damage to your eye. Its not really a replaceable part
post #109 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevEB View Post

Some nice pics. All via OTA HDTV

If those pictures are even close to a true representation of the picture you have, you really need to look into getting that calibrated. Are you running it in brilliant mode?
post #110 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hipnotiq View Post

more of this?

There is a reason lasers have saftey classifications. This TV has a powerful laser incorporated inside.
Those lasers output the highest saftey classification that the FDA has.

don't open your laser TV no matter what anyone on some internet forum tells you.

Even if mitsubishi is wrong in their understanding of lasers and random posters on public internet forums knows more than them, dont take a chance with damage to your eye. Its not really a replaceable part

Taking the screen off is not in the least dangerous if the TV is off, and not likely to be much of a risk with it is running. However taking a running light engine apart most certainly would be dangerous (hence the laser warning lables) and only a fool would contemplate it.

Like I said, if you want to be absolutely sure use suitable eye protection when operating the TV without the screen, not that I expect any owner will ever do so.
post #111 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevEB View Post

Some nice pics. All via OTA HDTV

If these photos, (esp 4.jpg) are indicative of what a properly calibrated LaserVue set is capable of, all I can say is wow! Kevin Miller calibrated my Mits 65831 to a virtually flat line 6500K. HD is beautiful --- but if this is a sample of what LV can do...there will be an 831 for sale, come March/April.
post #112 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by ninthdragon View Post

If these photos, (esp 4.jpg) are indicative of what a properly calibrated LaserVue set is capable of, all I can say is wow! Kevin Miller calibrated my Mits 65831 to a virtually flat line 6500K. HD is beautiful --- but if this is a sample of what LV can do...there will be an 831 for sale, come March/April.

I can tell you for sure that there is no way that's a calibrated pic. It's not even close to the standard. Especially the colors. My guess is brilliant mode.
post #113 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by ninthdragon View Post

If these photos, (esp 4.jpg) are indicative of what a properly calibrated LaserVue set is capable of, all I can say is wow! Kevin Miller calibrated my Mits 65831 to a virtually flat line 6500K. HD is beautiful --- but if this is a sample of what LV can do...there will be an 831 for sale, come March/April.

There are much cheaper sets that will do incorrect colors via wide gamut if that is what you want.
post #114 of 2625
I truly hope the Laservue looks NOTHING like those screen shots because they are nothing short of dreadful, and not even remotely accurate.
post #115 of 2625
Appear to have a massive red push...
post #116 of 2625
Personally, I think it's a waste of time trying trying to come to any conclusions about a TV viewing snapshots from a camera. You have no idea how, or if, the TV has been calibrated, and the camera and monitor you're viewing it on can have just as many issues as the display.
post #117 of 2625
when should we expect prices to drop?
post #118 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darin View Post

Personally, I think it's a waste of time trying trying to come to any conclusions about a TV viewing snapshots from a camera. You have no idea how, or if, the TV has been calibrated, and the camera and monitor you're viewing it on can have just as many issues as the display.

I don't think anybody would regard such a thing as conclusive...
post #119 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicholc2 View Post

I can tell you for sure that there is no way that's a calibrated pic. It's not even close to the standard. Especially the colors. My guess is brilliant mode.

Sorry that I was ambiguous in my previous post. Yes, the set is obviously uncalibrated, but look at the vest of the female character. Sometimes, all it takes is a decent glimpse of what a set can really do to understand a mental picture of the whole. An understanding of what any given set is capable of has served me well (at least as far as my video wants and needs go) for quite some time now. I am very fast building the opinion that a properly set up and calibrated LV will keep me a "happy camper" until something better comes along (5-7 years for OLED? I'm a XXL kind of guy.).
post #120 of 2625
Quote:
Originally Posted by ninthdragon View Post

Sorry that I was ambiguous in my previous post. Yes, the set is obviously uncalibrated, but look at the vest of the female character. Sometimes, all it takes is a decent glimpse of what a set can really do to understand a mental picture of the whole.

And a little understanding of correct color space and gamut goes a long way as well if your mental picture is to be correct.

That green vest is incorrect when it comes to color - which is wowing you. Of course, if you walked outside and everything looked like the Simpons in Springfield, you would probably be wowed as well - though again, it would not be correct.

Once properly calibrated, the green would conform to REC 709 and would look proper. That can easily be seen in post #8 and gamut here http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attac...8&d=1232339633

Ted Turner colorized black and white movies - which was essentially guesses as to what color and shades went where. He was vilified by most all for that. This is nothing different - wild stabs at colors and shades which are incorrect. You might like the wider gamut better because of the diversity of colors, but that still does not make it correct.

Again, if you want wider color gamut with incorrect colors, including the green that is off the scale, there are much cheaper sets that will give you that.
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