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"OFFICIAL" Pioneer MCACC thread - Page 55

post #1621 of 4097
12/30/10 at 10:08pm
2 questions

1. I have tried so many options with the mcacc inc gamelovers instructions and get great results except>> My center channel always seems so hard to hear. Does anyone else find this? If so how can i fix this?

2. My ears seem to get sore aswell when listening to music.

Im using sc-25 polk rtia7s csia6 and svspc13 ultra
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post #1622 of 4097
12/31/10 at 4:42am
Got a question my MCACC buds...If I want to see how the 92TXH would sound without any proccessing other than leaving Dolby do it's thing just to see what is being changed when applying MCACC, what should I use within the 92's proccessing...Pure Direct or MCACC Off?
I have been noticing lack of umph in gunshots and other mid-bass sounds and I followed most of the info on proper setup of MCACC...I also have 2 HSU subs and crossover at 80hz...speakers are all small (which still bothers me but it's the industry standard I guess (roll-eyes)...
If this helps..I will again spill out what I got to see if any help can be given...as in anyones wishes...I want the most umph outta the system...

VSX92TXH

Klipsch throughout

RF82 (LR) FR-33Hz-23kHz +/- 3db

RC62 (C) FR-57Hz-23kHz +/- 3db

RS42 x's 4 (S) FR-52Hz-23kHz +/- 3db
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post #1623 of 4097
12/31/10 at 2:01pm
Direct keeps MCACC processing but virtually nothing else (no effects proccessing).
Pure Direct turns off MCACC as well as all other processing.

With small speakers it's hard to get good mid-bass... I would try moving the subs around, perhaps a little closer, and check/tweak the MCACC settings manually to dial things in if desired.
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post #1624 of 4097
12/31/10 at 4:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonH50 View Post

Direct keeps MCACC processing but virtually nothing else (no effects proccessing).
Pure Direct turns off MCACC as well as all other processing.

With small speakers it's hard to get good mid-bass... I would try moving the subs around, perhaps a little closer, and check/tweak the MCACC settings manually to dial things in if desired.

I really didn't think the RF82's were small since they are floor standers. The subs are fine, I just think the midbass from the speakers should be a tad more..I'll have to play with the EQ. I hate the 80Hz crossover but for HT that's the norm!
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post #1625 of 4097
12/31/10 at 4:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by StuBerger View Post

Got a question my MCACC buds...If I want to see how the 92TXH would sound without any proccessing other than leaving Dolby do it's thing just to see what is being changed when applying MCACC, what should I use within the 92's proccessing...Pure Direct or MCACC Off?
I have been noticing lack of umph in gunshots and other mid-bass sounds and I followed most of the info on proper setup of MCACC...I also have 2 HSU subs and crossover at 80hz...speakers are all small (which still bothers me but it's the industry standard I guess (roll-eyes)...
If this helps..I will again spill out what I got to see if any help can be given...as in anyones wishes...I want the most umph outta the system...

VSX92TXH

Klipsch throughout

RF82 (LR) FR-33Hz-23kHz +/- 3db

RC62 (C) FR-57Hz-23kHz +/- 3db

RS42 x's 4 (S) FR-52Hz-23kHz +/- 3db

After trying countless variations with MCACC, I found that I can get a big variation in gunshot sounds, ranging from a penny cracker sound to a sharp crack/explosive sound..using the same scene in a particular movie..

The variation in gunshot sounds (along with other explosive sounds) is achieved by how MCACC is setup..and where the mic. is positioned..

This is what I did for my final set up to get that loud crack/explosion sound from gunshots..

Firstly, the mic was placed on top of a tripod and positioned with the tripod on the centre seat, with the mic. near the back and the mic.was raised about 6" above the back rest..

The MCACC settings I used were
ALL CH ADJUST
Spks. Small
Xover. 80Htz.
THX..Yes (even though my speakers are not THX)

Then all front speakers were calibrated to 75dB. and the surrounds to 78dB. (dipoles)..
With EQ..I reduced the 4K levels by 2dB. for the L&R speakers..and increased the same frequency by the same amount for the surrounds..
I also reduced the standing wave setting for the 103Hz position to 4.5dB...but that may only be for my room acoustics..
It did however produce a better projection of voices..which may have something to do with better gunshot sounds..

The end result gave me explosive gunshot sounds, where you could almost feel the percussion from the guns in the opening scene in Qantum of Solace..

In Indiana Jones "Kingdom of the Crystal Skull"..in the scene where he's being shot at as he runs across rafters in the warehouse, the shots have a distinctive crack to them..

I'm now very happy for the first time with the settings for MCACC with a very dramatic overall sound quality..

I hope that helps your problem..
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post #1626 of 4097
12/31/10 at 4:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmoney76 View Post

2 questions

1. I have tried so many options with the mcacc inc gamelovers instructions and get great results except>> My center channel always seems so hard to hear. Does anyone else find this? If so how can i fix this?



1) Fix this by turning up the channel level for the center channel. Go to the MCACC menu and look for the channel levels setting.
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post #1627 of 4097
12/31/10 at 4:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdk33 View Post

1) Fix this by turning up the channel level for the center channel. Go to the MCACC menu and look for the channel levels setting.

Turning up the center is a band-aid, not a fix. The problem that needs fixed is either center speaker placement, center speaker quality, or most likely room acoustics.
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post #1628 of 4097
12/31/10 at 4:32pm
+1...

likely a combination of all three...
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post #1629 of 4097
12/31/10 at 4:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. View Post


After trying countless variations with MCACC, I found that I can get a big variation in gunshot sounds, ranging from a penny cracker sound to a sharp crack/explosive sound..using the same scene in a particular movie..

The variation in gunshot sounds (along with other explosive sounds) is achieved by how MCACC is setup..and where the mic. is positioned..

This is what I did for my final set up to get that loud crack/explosion sound from gunshots..

Firstly, the mic was placed on top of a tripod and positioned with the tripod on the centre seat, with the mic. near the back and the mic.was raised about 6" above the back rest..

The MCACC settings I used were
ALL CH ADJUST
Spks. Small
Xover. 80Htz.
THX..Yes (even though my speakers are not THX)

Then all front speakers were calibrated to 75dB. and the surrounds to 78dB. (dipoles)..
With EQ..I reduced the 4K levels by 2dB. for the L&R speakers..and increased the same frequency by the same amount for the surrounds..
I also reduced the standing wave setting for the 103Hz position to 4.5dB...but that may only be for my room acoustics..
It did however produce a better projection of voices..which may have something to do with better gunshot sounds..

The end result gave me explosive gunshot sounds, where you could almost feel the percussion from the guns in the opening scene in Qantum of Solace..

In Indiana Jones "Kingdom of the Crystal Skull"..in the scene where he's being shot at as he runs across rafters in the warehouse, the shots have a distinctive crack to them..

I'm now very happy for the first time with the settings for MCACC with a very dramatic overall sound quality..

I hope that helps your problem..

Doesn't using the THX on a non-THX speaker config cause a wrong crossover for regular speakers?
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post #1630 of 4097
12/31/10 at 4:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. View Post


After trying countless variations with MCACC, I found that I can get a big variation in gunshot sounds, ranging from a penny cracker sound to a sharp crack/explosive sound..using the same scene in a particular movie..

The variation in gunshot sounds (along with other explosive sounds) is achieved by how MCACC is setup..and where the mic. is positioned..

This is what I did for my final set up to get that loud crack/explosion sound from gunshots..

Firstly, the mic was placed on top of a tripod and positioned with the tripod on the centre seat, with the mic. near the back and the mic.was raised about 6" above the back rest..

The MCACC settings I used were
ALL CH ADJUST
Spks. Small
Xover. 80Htz.
THX..Yes (even though my speakers are not THX)

Then all front speakers were calibrated to 75dB. and the surrounds to 78dB. (dipoles)..
With EQ..I reduced the 4K levels by 2dB. for the L&R speakers..and increased the same frequency by the same amount for the surrounds..
I also reduced the standing wave setting for the 103Hz position to 4.5dB...but that may only be for my room acoustics..
It did however produce a better projection of voices..which may have something to do with better gunshot sounds..

The end result gave me explosive gunshot sounds, where you could almost feel the percussion from the guns in the opening scene in Qantum of Solace..

In Indiana Jones "Kingdom of the Crystal Skull"..in the scene where he's being shot at as he runs across rafters in the warehouse, the shots have a distinctive crack to them..

I'm now very happy for the first time with the settings for MCACC with a very dramatic overall sound quality..

I hope that helps your problem..

Also, why did you increase the 4 in the surrounds...does this need to be done for a reason...
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post #1631 of 4097
1/1/11 at 11:44am
This might be a stupid question, but that's never scared me from asking in the past...

I just upgraded to a VSX-1325 ( U.S. equivalent VSX-33) so this is my first experience with MCACC.

I have quite a large fish tank in the same room as my theater which does emit some noise, a low hum from pumps running inside a cabinet. When running the MCACC set-up would it be best to shut the tank down to eliminate all noise during calibration or leave it running as that's the norm when watching movies?

Thanks.
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post #1632 of 4097
1/1/11 at 11:49am
^^^

shut it down... you want to eliminate as much ambient noise as possible while running the mcacc test...
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post #1633 of 4097
1/1/11 at 12:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

^^^

shut it down... you want to eliminate as much ambient noise as possible while running the mcacc test...

I thought you wanted the room to be in the same condition it would be in when watching movies.

If the fish tank is on when using the receiver, why not have it on when running MCACC?

If a projector makes a big of noise (or amp, or DVR), would you shut those off when running MCACC too? Even if they're always on when the room is being used?
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post #1634 of 4097
1/1/11 at 1:26pm
Not for calibration; you want that in a quiet room so it properly sets up the speakers. Ambent noise will then be added to the sound. For example, if the aquarium (or projector) has a 120 Hz buzz from the air pump or power supply, the calibration routine would likely turn down that frequency band. You don't want that band notched when you listen to music or watch a movie; you want it to come through "normally" even though there is noise present.

That said, MCACC does record the background noise for reference when performing calibration. However, I would still turn off everything possible when calibrating.

FWIWFM, YMMV, etc. - Don
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post #1635 of 4097
1/1/11 at 2:47pm
Great "not so stupid" question.

I have wondered the same thing. I'll turn stuff off and run mine again.
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post #1636 of 4097
1/1/11 at 3:16pm
hey don, happy new year my friend...

@stew... what don said... you want mcacc to measure your room/speakers, not what else is making sound in the room (or in other rooms in the house, or outside, etc.)...

some people i know have ocd about this, and have been known to shut down everything in the house before running autocal...

edit: and nope, it wasn't a "stupid question" at all... it's always better to ask and know for sure...
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post #1637 of 4097
1/1/11 at 3:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by StuBerger View Post

Doesn't using the THX on a non-THX speaker config cause a wrong crossover for regular speakers?

There has been some talk about this and I suppose it depends to some degree on the individual speakers..
I'm using Behringer monitors and I haven't noticed any problems at the xover point..

Quote:
Originally Posted by StuBerger View Post

Also, why did you increase the 4 in the surrounds...does this need to be done for a reason...

I increased the 4K level on the surrounds because MCACC had set them very low, which tended to make them sound a bit lifeless for my liking..
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post #1638 of 4097
1/1/11 at 3:40pm
Happy New Year to you too, Chris!

I am NOT obsessive, just prefer to do it when the rest of the fam's gone and can't complain when every thing's shut down...

On the other topic, I am not an LFE expert, but the 80 Hz setting is what THX recommends. My subs cross over around 40 - 45 Hz to provide the smoothest FR with my mains. There is some debate about how different AVRs handle the sound when a different crossover setting is used but IIRC the consensus is that it is properly routed on virtually all modern (within the past 5+ years) AVRs. I have an older AVR that has problems dealing with LFE and bass management in general, but all of my more recent (5 - 10 yo) manage fine.
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post #1639 of 4097
1/1/11 at 3:56pm
Yes..I think if use the max. crossover position on the sub. and set the AVR to crossover at 80Hz. there shouldn't be a problem with using the THX setting..
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post #1640 of 4097
1/1/11 at 4:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. View Post

Yes..I think if use the max. crossover position on the sub. and set the AVR to crossover at 80Hz. there shouldn't be a problem with using the THX setting..

The VTF's have a option for bypassing the subs crossover so as to let the receiver handle the bass management...that's what I have it set at!
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post #1641 of 4097
1/1/11 at 4:58pm
Shouldn't be a problem then using the THX setting..if your AVR is set to crossover at 80Hz.
When the sub is set to cossover at max. 130 -150 hz. You're virtually bi-passing the subs crossover anyway!
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post #1642 of 4097
1/1/11 at 8:36pm
Many subs have an LFE input that lets the AVR handle the crossover (and everything else).
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post #1643 of 4097
1/1/11 at 9:05pm
Ok, so I'm confused about THX.

I have an 1120.

There are 2 settings. THX speakers, and Crossover setting. I set the crossover to 80hz already.

I do not have THX speakers, but it's suggested to set them to THX anyway?

Does setting the speakers to THX do something to the speakers besides set the X-over point to 80Hz?

Oh and my Sub (PL-200) has a toggle switch that says Crossover: Out or In (out being external or In being internal) Mine is set at Out.
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post #1644 of 4097
1/2/11 at 10:48am
THX usually tweaks other settings like frequency response for the THX "experience". You can try it and see if you like it -- it won't hurt anything. Some like it, some don't.

If the AVR is handling bass management, which is almost certainly the case, "out" is the proper stting on your sub.
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post #1645 of 4097
1/2/11 at 11:29am
Just wondering if anyone can suggest a solution or tip. I have 7.1 setup and both my surrounds and surround backs are dipole. my surround backs are on my rear wall directly behind my couch and my couch is against the wall. i have lowered the levels to about -10db so that they wont be too overpowering but i was wondering if i should tweak something else? i have the elite sc-35 fyi.

cheers
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post #1646 of 4097
1/2/11 at 3:14pm
The first thing you should tweak is to move your couch away from the wall, if possible..
It should be at least 2' from the back wall to get a good balanced surround sound..
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post #1647 of 4097
1/2/11 at 6:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. View Post

The first thing you should tweak is to move your couch away from the wall, if possible..
It should be at least 2' from the back wall to get a good balanced surround sound..

would if i could but i can't so i won't. unfortunately thats not an option which is why i'm trying to figure out some receiver tweaks. thanks
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post #1648 of 4097
1/2/11 at 6:36pm
I would either ceiling-mount the rears or (more likely) go to a 5.1 system.
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post #1649 of 4097
1/2/11 at 9:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonH50 View Post

THX usually tweaks other settings like frequency response for the THX "experience". You can try it and see if you like it -- it won't hurt anything. Some like it, some don't.

If the AVR is handling bass management, which is almost certainly the case, "out" is the proper stting on your sub.


I don't think setting speakers to 'THX speakers' in Pioneer receivers during setup does anything except force them to be seen as 'SMALL' and force the crossover to be 80 Hz, for purposes of MCACC.

Using a THX playback mode, however, does do some extra EQ, regardless of what your speakers are set to.
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post #1650 of 4097
1/2/11 at 10:05pm
Oops, I was thinking of the processing (playback) setting, not speaker setting. You may be right, I do not know.
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