"OFFICIAL" Pioneer MCACC thread - Page 30

Dan,
Thanks for the reply, sounds easy enough.

Was watching Transformers 2 on blu-ray last night and happened to noticed the advanced MCACC red light on the front of the receiver wasn't lit up. I had the ps3 slim bitstreaming the audio. When I paused the movie the red light lit up showing I was using advanced MCACC but when I'd start the movie back up it would go off. I switched the ps3 to PCM and after that the MCACC light was lit up the whole time. The red light is always lit up when watching tv as well. Does this receiver not apply your MCACC settings if you bitstream??? I couldn't find anything on it in the manual.

Also, when using the ps3 slim to bitstream to this receiver most of the time when starting a movie or skipping to a different scene there is no audio just a hum from speakers and I have to hit pause anywhere from 1-5 times to actually get th

I feel that the Bass is pretty thin. My equipments are
Pioneer VSX-21TXH
Emptek EF30C for front and surround. (60Hz-20kHz ±3dB, 89db)
Polk CS2 for center (55Hz - 25kH, 90db)
TSC ASW-8 subwoofer (33-150Hz +/- 3dB)

I have set the crossover at 100. My room is medium sized rectangular shaped room. I have placed the subwoofer in the corner. I have kept the volume of subwoofer at 50%. If i increase more than that, MCAAC complaints that the sub woofer volume is high.

Should i change the MCAAC settings and modify the -6.5db provided for sub? or increase the volume on sub? or is my sub is just a cheap crap and should i get a replacement?

You can certainly get a better sub. It's pretty crap and also very low on power. There are many options from the super value subs like the Premier Acoustics PA-120 or the powerful deep dipping Elemental Designs A2-300.

That being said, there's nothing wrong with modifying the settings that the MCAAC has given you. It set my sub at a very low level too and I just upped it because I wanted more bass. Modify it to your liking as long as your sub isn't distorting or clipping.

I would get a better sub. An 8 inch sub in a med room will not do the job and from what you have posted on hz, it only goes down to 33 hz. Home Theater subs should go down to 25 to low (16 hz) in order to be effective. Go to this site on setting up a HT & Subwoofers: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=824554.

Bill

Thanks for the tip. I am not interested in too much Bass. That is why i did not plan for decent subwoofer. I'll try to increase the volume up and see if that helps. Else, i would just RMA the unit and spend the money on something more useful.

Bill, the link is really really useful. Thanks a ton. Not sure how i have missed that before.
BTW, your speaker collection is just awesome.

I have a PS3 slim and also bitstream and the MCACC lisght is on all the time.

You didn't finish the sentence, but I've seen this before and know where you are going. It also sounds like you are having an HDMI handshake issue due to the way you described the having to hit pause several times probably to ge tthe signal to lock. There is an firmware upgrade available from Pioneer that will solve your problems.

Hello All.... Great forum... It's hard to get a handle on all this customization!! I've got a very junior question. I have the Klipsch Quintet III surround system with a Klipsch Synergy 12 Sub... Since the frequency response of the speakers is 120 hz - 23 khz, should I set the crossover for my Sub at 120 hz to pick up what the speakers can't handle and also set my crossover in the MCACC at 120??? (or whatever is closest)... If I set the crossover to 100 hz, am I missing the 100 hz - 120 hz range that isn't accounted for by either the Sub or the speakers???

Thanks!!!

You wouldn't be "missing the 100Hz - 120Hz range," you would only experience a slight dip in that relatively narrow range. Speaker response doesn't stop abruptly at the specified +/-3dB point, it just rolls off. Most speakers will have another octave or so of "usable" response below that point (manufacturer speak for "faint-but-audible" ). The same applies to the crossover. It isn't a brick wall. Both speakers and sub are active in the other's range.

In most rooms you not likely to detect the dip by ear, as there are dips throughout the audio spectrum of similar magnitude brought on by the speakers' positioning and interaction with the room itself, to say nothing of the speaker's internal crossovers. They don't bother people because they don't know about them. And most people find dips far less audibly offensive than peaks.

I'm not sure I have this right, but as I understand the Klipsch Quintet III, the 120Hz +/- 3dB point only applies to the surrounds; the fronts go to 80Hz. If true, that makes it even less of a concern, as the surrounds seldom carry qualitatively critical information. You have more latitude with them than with the fronts. Plus, MCACC may help smooth out the dip a little. I had surrounds that had a 120Hz rating in my system for several years. I used an 80Hz crossover, and never noticed anything amiss.

On the other hand, if it bothers you, you can always experiment. If the subwoofer is centered and/or near the mains, you might find a 150Hz crossover workable, although that does carry some risk of localization.

What receiver are you using? I tried it out last night and the light still doesn't light up but what I did find was it seemed like I was still getting my MCACC with the DTS-HDMA track bitstreamed because while watching I toggled between of and on with MCACC and it did make a difference in the sound if I had it on. Also, when I hit status it showed I was using MCACC memory 1 even though the light wasn't lit up on the receiver. Do you think the ps3 slim is causing the light to not light up on this? Don't you have to send off or take a pioneer receiver to a repair shop to get the firmware updates though?

I'm using a 92txh. If you can turn off MCACC and you can also switch to memory 1 then you are using MCACC. Sounds like your model has a bug with the light when bitstreamed, but is working fine. Yes you do have to send it off for a firmware update.

Thanks for all the info!!! Just an FYI, the Quintet III system says (via Klipsch website) that all the speakers except the center channel are 120 hz low end, the center channel being 125 hz... my Sub is close to my Mains... I have the Gain set at 50% and the crossover at 100 hz... When I run the MCACC it says my Sub is set too loud and I should have my crossover at 80 hz. If I make that change and lower my Sub Gain and set the crossover to 80 hz, am I "de-localizing" the bass sound??? Is the system sending more of the low end frequencies to the surround/center channels that they really aren't designed/proficient at handling???

Thanks for your insight...

I originally just did a quick check on the first listing that came up on Google (Vann's, I think) which gave the numbers I mentioned. Obviously, the Klipsch site is a more authoritative source.

MCACC doesn't recommend a crossover, it just defaults to the 80Hz THX recommendation unless you choose something else. But to answer your question, yes, with a lower crossover, localization is less of a factor. And having the sub gain too high effectively raises the crossover point, so bringing the gain down where it belongs will also reduce localization.

Does Klipsch make a crossover recommendation in an owners manual or on their website? If so, I'd start with that. If not, I'd be inclined try the 100Hz crossover with your speakers and the location of your sub. If that sounds "thin" in the upper bass (e.g. male voices), I'd give the 150Hz crossover a try. You can always go back. (You don't have to rerun MCACC each time you change the crossover.)


Yes, but it's not going to harm anything. We've been doing that for years in conventional stereo setups. Very few stereo speakers can reproduce the very lowest musical notes (~30Hz), but they aren't harmed by them.

A few months ago I replaced my old Sony speakers with 2 DefTech BP7006's and a CLR 2300 center speaker but I kept my 12" sub, to be replaced later. Prior to this, MCACC did a great job calibrating my old speaker system. I was specifically impressed with how MCACC brought the sub in line with the rest of the system. Like many of us, I had my sub running way too hot but after a few weeks of listening to the corrected levels, I came to really enjoy hearing the system without overcooked subwoofer levels. It's amazing how clear dialog becomes when your system is balanced correctly.

However, after installing these DefTech speakers, I ran into a problem. I re-ran MCACC and the results were rather odd. Although MCACC got the speaker distances correct, the channel levels of the 7006's were very different from each other, even though they are placed in the same position as my old speakers. I have to guess that MCACC is having difficulty with the bi-polar nature of these speakers and I'm not sure how to resolve this. My SPL meter gave me much better results. Also, my SPL meter verified that the speakers were calibrated to 70db per the internal test tones, not 75db as I thought it would.

Now here's the real kicker. I never touched the gain on the sub so you'd think that MCACC would have given me the same results but it didn't. In fact, it raised the sub level a whopping 5db. I decided to see if it sounded correct but you could instantly tell the sub was way too loud. Now, If I bring the sub trim back down 5db, it sounds correct.

So, my question is this. Should I run MCACC and then adjust the trims with my SPL meter? If I want the system calibrated to 75 db, is it ok to bump up the trims 5db?

Ok, I am not as savvy as y'all, so bear with me...

I have klipsch quintet SL's and the sub-12 with my vsx-21. I ran full auto-mccac and seems like I get no sound from reciever. I have to crank it up from -80 db to about -25 db for sound to start.

I also find that when watching TV, the audio levels vary greatly where one channel is suddenly louder, I don't have a cable box, just ota cable and HD, I have optical out from TV to opt-1 in VSX-21.

Please advise. Thanks much, gang!

seems normal to me on my VSX-01...best sound is from -25db to -30db depending on source and channel

Tried Version 2.2 and it didn't work. any suggestions?

Thanx, Bill

When is pioneer going to fix the bitstreaming issue with the PS3 slim? do they even know about it?

^^^

it's ps3 slim issue, not an avr issue...

clicky...

While we are on the subject of MCACC and EQ, do most of you apply any X-Curve at all? If so, how much? Currently I am liking -1.0dB for my room. This is basically a question for the folks that keep the EQ portion of the MCACC mode engaged (All CH Adjust, Symmetry and Front Align). Also, this of course would not apply to folks who using THX post processing.

By the way, my room is about 16 X 18 wide open to a kitchen about the same size. The room is also open to a fairly large foyer.

^^^^ As I mentioned in the other thread, I use a 0.5dB rolloff in my smaller, but reflective room. I'd probably do what you are doing with your room.

Of course, as you suggest, it isn't applied with THX, but I don't use THX all of the time.

What kind of problem, bsoko2?
Installing or getting it to communicate?

As far as the software for 2.2.. here is the system requirements:

Requirements for using the application on your PC
The computer must be a PC functioning with one of the following operating systems: Microsoft®
Windows® Vista Home Basic/Home Premium/Ultimate SP1, Windows® XP Professional/Home Edition
SP3 or Windows® 2000 Professional SP4.
The monitor must have a display resolution of 800 x 600 dots (SVGA) or greater.
An RS-232C port connector is necessary for graphical output. Refer to the PC's operating instructions
and/or the PC manufacturer for more information on making the proper port settings.

Good info on here!

Bsoko2,


I am having the exact same problem. Illegal file size. All the trouble shooting tips don't seem to correct the problem. I was using Vista and 2.2 on a SC-9540 (Canadian Market SC-25).

The application loads fine but it will not transfer data from the 9540. Tried all com ports and both hard and soft resets of computer and 9540. Still nothing.

Anyone else run into this problem?

Wow, great thread a lot of great stuff in here. I've searched and think I've found the answer, but want to double check to make sure I've got this correct. I have a new Pioneer 919 and I want to make sure my Sub is setup correct.

I have a Yamaha SW 90 and it has a High Cut (freq) knob from 50Hz - 150Hz and a volume knob from 0 - 10. From what I gather, before I run the MCACC, do I want to turn the High Cut all the way up to 150Hz and leave it? Then keep the volume knob at 9:00 - 10:00?

I'm new to all this and appreciate the help.

Thanks

Correct, although, depending on your room, the volume knob may have to be adjusted and MCACC run again. Ideally, MCACC should set the sub channel somewhere between -5 and 0 if the volume knob is correct. (Don't be paranoid about it if it is slightly outside those boundaries, though.)

They do if they filed my case properly. To date roughly 99% of affected receivers are Pioneer so I tend to think Pioneer isn't completely off the hook. Hopefully it won't turn out like Dolby Digital Plus. I was about to upgrade from a SC-07 to a SC-27 and because of the issue I passed.

So.....it is a AVR issue not a PS3 issue as ccotenj states...who is correct here?

well... although the problem occurs primarily with pioneer avr's, since the avr was out in the wild first, i'm inclined to blame the ps3 and expect sony to fix it...

however, it's probably not the correct thread for the discussion...

How do you choose the cross over point? Is it based on the speaker specs? Or based on how it sounds? I tried to follow the FAQs, but it did not sound like english to me

Mine is a 33Hz - 20kHz system. L/R - 60Hz, Center - 55Hz, Sub - 33Hz. Can i choose my crossover based on these numbers?