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APC H15 Power Conditioner - review - Page 3

post #61 of 297
Quote:
Originally Posted by B&W700guy View Post

Again, It is snake oil Keep on selling them Audioholics with your $100.00 HDMI cables

Since you continue to cast a negative shadow on power conditioning products, please enlighten us. Technically speaking why are the APC's, Panamax's, etc of the world "snake oil"?

Do you feel the manufacturers are deceiving their customers and could potentially be exposed to a class action lawsuit for selling a product that fails to deliver as advertised?
post #62 of 297
Quote:
Originally Posted by toca View Post

Since you continue to cast a negative shadow on power conditioning products, please enlighten us. Technically speaking why are the APC's, Panamax's, etc of the world "snake oil"?

Do you feel the manufacturers are deceiving their customers and could potentially be exposed to a class action lawsuit for selling a product that fails to deliver as advertised?

Toca,

I have, go back and read my posts on the h15. What bothers me is Audioholics...the Truth is out there...Please, not on there website. All they care about is money, not truth. Which is ok, but I am just calling them out on it Now, on Law Suits, Let the buyer beware If you have any question...just post them
post #63 of 297
I have been thinking about buying the h15 but need to know if it is enough protection for my equipment. I have a denon 3808 reciever, denon 2500 blu ray, direct tv hd. I know it is enough for all of this but I am about to add a rotel 1095 amp that uses a lot of juice. any thoughts or suggestions? thanks
post #64 of 297
Quote:
Originally Posted by briaetz View Post

I have been thinking about buying the h15 but need to know if it is enough protection for my equipment. I have a denon 3808 reciever, denon 2500 blu ray, direct tv hd. I know it is enough for all of this but I am about to add a rotel 1095 amp that uses a lot of juice. any thoughts or suggestions? thanks

It's rated at 1440 watts (80% of a 15 amp circuit). Add up the wattages of your equipment, and you'll have your answer.
post #65 of 297
Quote:
Originally Posted by 55sss View Post

I have Directv and have a problem using the CATV/Modem inputs of the H15. I contacted APC and they sent a replacement but I'm having the same problem. I have one of the dish downleads connected to the SAT/Ant input and it seems to work fine with both SD and HD channels but I don't get any signal through the CATV/Modem input. I guess I'll send another email to APC.

Hello 55sss:

I have gone ahead and ordered a Panamax M5300-EX, which only has AVM, not AVR. But it still looks as though the silver APC H15 is still available through Audioholics, so I'm thinking that I may order that also; I have another system that I could use that for.

One big issue in my mind was the problem that you and others here experienced with the Cable/Modem circuit. You got one replacement from APC, but that seemed to work the same way as the original. You say here that you were going to email APC again.

Could you share with us the results of your latest communication with APC regarding this issue?

Thanks
post #66 of 297
Thread Starter 
Quote:
One big issue in my mind was the problem that you and others here experienced with the Cable/Modem circuit. You got one replacement from APC, but that seemed to work the same way as the original. You say here that you were going to email APC again.

Could you share with us the results of your latest communication with APC regarding this issue?

The customer service person at APC basically said he wasn't sure and suggested I call one of their distributors, which I thought was strange. I posted the problem in another forum and was told the Directv used bi-communication and high band. Another reply thought that since the CATV/MODEM jack has a splitter that could be causing the problem. Not sure exactly what all that means but assume/concluded that there is a difference between the two coaxial jacks where one marked SAT/ANT will pass the signal but the CATV/MODEM will not. I suppose I could call APC and ask to talk to a technical person but haven't done so.

Long story short, after thinking about it, I decided not to use the coaxial jacks. I realize that I'm not as protected as I'd like. However, I also think that a lightening hit to my dish would be required to cause a problem and the odds of that happening are far less than something happening to the power lines which are now protected by the H15. All in all, I'm very happy with the unit. It is serving my primary purchase of power surge protection, 12 volt trigger outlet, and power monitoring and regulation; all at a reasonable cost IMO.

If you end up using both units, posting your comparison might be helpful for those that haven't gone one way or the other.
post #67 of 297
How would you compare with the J10/J15 that have backup built in? I was just going to get a UPS from APC and their chat support says the regular backups are not recommended for tvs (may damage and not liable for tv damamge) and are only for IT equip. Something to do with the type of power sine wave put out?

What would warrant getting the J15 over J10? the amount of equip plugged in? Would you get more backup time?
post #68 of 297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Tomaskovic View Post

How would you compare with the J10/J15 that have backup built in? I was just going to get a UPS from APC and their chat support says the regular backups are not recommended for tvs (may damage and not liable for tv damamge) and are only for IT equip. Something to do with the type of power sine wave put out?

What would warrant getting the J15 over J10? the amount of equip plugged in? Would you get more backup time?


Hello Phil:

Regarding what you were told about APC's "regular" UPS (and that of many other manufacturers, for that matter):

Cheaper UPSs use a "stepped approximation" of a sine wave output when running on battery power. Instead of the output AC waveform being a smooth sinusoidal waveform, it will look like a series of "steps" or "stairs", going up and then down and then up again. Some devices do not like this kind of AC power, and either may not function properly or could even conceivably be damaged by it. That's probably the reason for chat support's comments. These are typically the lower priced units that you find in many computer stores.

Most of these kind of UPSs are "standby" UPSs, meaning that they only use the battery when the AC power fails. When AC power is present, the inverter portion is in standby mode, and they pass through the AC that they are getting from your household power.

Better models of power conditioners may incorporate AVR (Automatic Voltage Regulation). This enables them to buck or boost the incoming AC to a steady 120 V or so. They may do this by way of a multitap transformer, still using the incoming AC for power, but lowering or raising the output AC voltage via their transformer to keep the AC near 120v. The H model APCs are like this. However, they do not have any battery backup. If incoming AC goes too far out of range, they will simply disconnect your devices from the household AC.

Other units may incorporate a battery and switch to battery power when the AC voltage goes out of range. From a quick look at APC's manual for the J and S series, it looks as though these units may take this approach. I don't know just how clean the AC output is on these units, nor could I find any specifications during my quick search of their site. Others here may have first hand knowledge. It really just depends on the quality of the inverter units that they use. I also don't know if the the S series has a better inverter than the J series. However, APC has an excellent reputation, and if they specify that these units are for audio-visual use, then I'm certain that the output quality would be more than adequate.

The most expensive UPSs use a "double conversion" approach. In this type, the batteries are always "on line", so to speak. They are part of a double conversion, pure sine wave inverter circuit. In these models, the components connected to the UPS never "see" the actual household or line AC; rather, the AC gets completely converted to DC, which then goes through a high quality pure sine wave inverter to produce a very clean and stable 120V RMS AC sine wave output. Hence the name "double conversion", meaning the power goes from AC to DC and back to AC again, all of the time. These units will actually be able to "clean up" degraded power line voltage, by producing an output that may be of higher quality than the incoming AC, due to this "double conversion" approach. These type are often used in critical commercial or research applications.

*************************************************

In answer to your question about the J15 versus the J10: the only difference that I could see was the higher output power that it can supply.
post #69 of 297
Just picked me up the h15. Best deal I have seen to date.

http://www.amazon.com/APC-H15-Theate...7034573&sr=1-2
post #70 of 297
I personally think it is one hell of a good deal. I noticed it actually helped trim my voltage (115 VAC) I suspect due to this horrible weather we are having.

A nice gentleman on this forum traded me my silver one for a new black one. They look decent enough:

post #71 of 297
^^ looks nice!!

GoLakers I too just ordered from amazon...
post #72 of 297
Add me to the list of those who got a silver one from Amazon for a little over $100. I wish the black was discounted 70+% like this one, but I'll live.

I'm curious, what will be the appropriate outlet to connect my Pioneer Elite vsx-82txs a/v receiver and Plasma TV into? I understand the remaining components I have (xbox, tivo, dvd, bd) will go into the digital outlets, and my sub will go into the high current outlet.

Also, would it be wise to connect my OTA digital antenna (indoors, not on roof) into this unit prior to my Tivo? Will it cause issues with signal or HD reception?

Thanks, can't wait for the big brown truck!

--Nolan
post #73 of 297
The amazon deal seems great but I think I really want a battery backup. Recently I had the power go on & off twice within a few minutes. The tivo seemed to get hung when it got the second power hit while it was rebooting after the first outage. I had to unplug it and restart to get it going again.

I assume the H15 won't help with this situation? I see B&H has the J10 for $349 plus shipping (~$50). Is this a better solution?
post #74 of 297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Tomaskovic View Post

The amazon deal seems great but I think I really want a battery backup. Recently I had the power go on & off twice within a few minutes. The tivo seemed to get hung when it got the second power hit while it was rebooting after the first outage. I had to unplug it and restart to get it going again.

I assume the H15 won't help with this situation? I see B&H has the J10 for $349 plus shipping (~$50). Is this a better solution?

The H15 won't help with Power outages. When you spend $3,000 on a plasma $100 power conditioner is small price to pay. Even some of basic home theatre surge protectors cost as much.
post #75 of 297
Thread Starter 
Quote:


I'm curious, what will be the appropriate outlet to connect my Pioneer Elite vsx-82txs a/v receiver and Plasma TV into? I understand the remaining components I have (xbox, tivo, dvd, bd) will go into the digital outlets, and my sub will go into the high current outlet.

Also, would it be wise to connect my OTA digital antenna (indoors, not on roof) into this unit prior to my Tivo? Will it cause issues with signal or HD reception?

The AVR can be plugged into the high current outlet along with the sub or the audio outlet. I have my plasma plugged into the video outlet. The signal from the attic/indoor antenna should not be de-graded by plugging it into the coaxial jacks and would protect all the other devices.
post #76 of 297
I just installed the H-15 that I bought from Audioholics.

A couple of questions.
1. I have my Sharp 37" LCD Monitor LC-37D90U plugged into the "Monitor" outlet on the back of the H-15. Should it be plugged in here, or in the "TV" outlet?

2. I have my Velodyne 1512 Subwoofer plugged into the "Subwoofer" outlet in the "Delayed" group of outlets. How much of a delay (if any) should I program into the H-15? If it makes any difference, the AVR that my Subwoofer is connected to is a Pioneer Elite VSX36TX.

Thanks for any assistance.
Mark
post #77 of 297
My H-15 showed up today from amazon.. seems to be a rather stout piece!!

I took the cover off to look at further dis-assembly (thinking of painting mine black) and i noticed on the ac line filtering side there was a molex connector loose.
It was jumper J110.. It appears to be the power for the relay coil of the Delayed outlets.. I noticed that the l.e.d. on the front panel will illuminate
even if the connector isn't plugged in.

So I checked the outlets and low and behold they do not work w/o J110 connected.. With it connected you can hear the relay kick on.

So in summary if your sub/amplifier outlets have no juice check J110 first..
the front panel l.e.d. isn't a good indicator if it's working......the cable is rather snug in the cabinet I can see how it pulled out...

Other then that for $100 its a nice piece
post #78 of 297
I'm pleased with mine, I had a mounting screw in mine "rolling around" in there, so I cracked it open to fix it, and looks like a stout piece. First time I've bought something more robust for power conditioning in my house (bought MUCH beefier stuff at work )and so far I'm pleased.
post #79 of 297
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoingOK View Post

I personally think it is one hell of a good deal. I noticed it actually helped trim my voltage (115 VAC) I suspect due to this horrible weather we are having.

A nice gentleman on this forum traded me my silver one for a new black one. They look decent enough:


I really like your rack. Can you tell me where you purchased it from,
or where I can find one like it?

If anyone else want's to trade a black for a silver let me know. My
equipment is black and I would trade my silver one for a black one.
post #80 of 297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joewee View Post

I really like your rack. Can you tell me where you purchased it from,
or where I can find one like it?

If anyone else want's to trade a black for a silver let me know. My
equipment is black and I would trade my silver one for a black one.

It is from a company in Sweden called Solid Tech. It is about $1600 so buyer beware. Thanks.

Rich
post #81 of 297
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoingOK View Post

It is from a company in Sweden called Solid Tech. It is about $1600 so buyer beware. Thanks.

Rich

$1600 a mere pittance. I just got my A.I.G. bonus so I
am good to go.
post #82 of 297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joewee View Post

$1600 a mere pittance. I just got my A.I.G. bonus so I
am good to go.

Well then, you should go ahead and grab two.
post #83 of 297
Received my H15 from Amazon (tigerdirect actually) a few days ago. I have a bunch of their UPS stuff at work.

Anyways, I notice a buzzing noise coming from the inside of the unit. Is this normal? I don't remember hearing this when I first plugged it in a few days ago.
post #84 of 297
I decided to take the $99 APC H15 silver unit and paint it black. Pretty easy to take apart and I just threw on the first coat of Rustoleum Satin Black texture paint. Looks good so far:



First of two coats:

post #85 of 297
looks good so far... keep us posted with your progress!
post #86 of 297
I want to do the same thing when i get mine tomorrow, ill be content with just the black faceplate.
post #87 of 297
Quote:
Originally Posted by tractng View Post

I think they are. I just bought one. It is worth every penny.

Thanks to AVS forum I just grabbed one of these from TigerDirect. Sweet!

Thought I'd take a look inside the case before I set it up... took some pictures. very impressive. Posted here: Pictures of inside of APC H15.

I took a bunch but here's one:



One thing I was hoping for was a notification if my power went bad while I was away. It doesn't seem to do that. Do any of them?

Edit: out of the box I had no issues. It looked like a never-opened box to me, I always check that.
post #88 of 297
Received my TigerDirect unit today.

My unit seems to have two issues - serial number doesn't show up, and the plastic faceplate that houses the receptacles will pull free if you try to remove a cable.

Maybe someone could check their unit to see if their serial no. is displayed. The second issue I can take care of when I paint the faceplate black.

Even though I have a 200A breaker box the lights in my house dim momentarily when the central AC kicks on. This unit is doing something as I hear it click each time the AC starts up.
post #89 of 297
Quote:
Originally Posted by oscartheclimber View Post

Received my TigerDirect unit today.

My unit seems to have two issues - serial number doesn't show up, and the plastic faceplate that houses the receptacles will pull free if you try to remove a cable.

Mine from Tiger Direct arrived Tuesday and I also had a problem with the top of the faceplate pulling free if removed a cable. I put a couple drops of super glue on it and seemed to solve it. I was bit concerned at first, but mine only pulled out a half-inch or less so do not think it is a problem.

By the way, I see the price from Tiger Direct through Amazon is now up to $199. I am sure glad I jumped when I did.
post #90 of 297
I also am looking to get a Power Conditioner with Battery Backup, but mostly because I have a front projector. The APC H series seem to simply clean the power for the each item plugged it, to a maximum wattage of power the wall plug can provide. But the APC J battery backup seems to only provide enough juice for 1 or 2 pieces of equipement. Unless you go to the S which provide the same power as the H series. Am I correct in assuming that if I go say get the APC J 600 watt Power Conditioner with Battery Backup, all I could plug in is items the sum up to 600 watt consumption? So here is a list of equipement I have and watts they use:

PS3 - 380 Watts
Projector - 280 Watts
Receiver - 600 Watts
Sub - 300 Watts

Does it mean I can really only have a max 1 or 2 of these items plugged into this unit? To get all of them plugged in I would need a much more expensive APC S unit?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yardman 49 View Post

Hello Phil:

Regarding what you were told about APC's "regular" UPS (and that of many other manufacturers, for that matter):

Cheaper UPSs use a "stepped approximation" of a sine wave output when running on battery power. Instead of the output AC waveform being a smooth sinusoidal waveform, it will look like a series of "steps" or "stairs", going up and then down and then up again. Some devices do not like this kind of AC power, and either may not function properly or could even conceivably be damaged by it. That's probably the reason for chat support's comments. These are typically the lower priced units that you find in many computer stores.

Most of these kind of UPSs are "standby" UPSs, meaning that they only use the battery when the AC power fails. When AC power is present, the inverter portion is in standby mode, and they pass through the AC that they are getting from your household power.

Better models of power conditioners may incorporate AVR (Automatic Voltage Regulation). This enables them to buck or boost the incoming AC to a steady 120 V or so. They may do this by way of a multitap transformer, still using the incoming AC for power, but lowering or raising the output AC voltage via their transformer to keep the AC near 120v. The H model APCs are like this. However, they do not have any battery backup. If incoming AC goes too far out of range, they will simply disconnect your devices from the household AC.

Other units may incorporate a battery and switch to battery power when the AC voltage goes out of range. From a quick look at APC's manual for the J and S series, it looks as though these units may take this approach. I don't know just how clean the AC output is on these units, nor could I find any specifications during my quick search of their site. Others here may have first hand knowledge. It really just depends on the quality of the inverter units that they use. I also don't know if the the S series has a better inverter than the J series. However, APC has an excellent reputation, and if they specify that these units are for audio-visual use, then I'm certain that the output quality would be more than adequate.

The most expensive UPSs use a "double conversion" approach. In this type, the batteries are always "on line", so to speak. They are part of a double conversion, pure sine wave inverter circuit. In these models, the components connected to the UPS never "see" the actual household or line AC; rather, the AC gets completely converted to DC, which then goes through a high quality pure sine wave inverter to produce a very clean and stable 120V RMS AC sine wave output. Hence the name "double conversion", meaning the power goes from AC to DC and back to AC again, all of the time. These units will actually be able to "clean up" degraded power line voltage, by producing an output that may be of higher quality than the incoming AC, due to this "double conversion" approach. These type are often used in critical commercial or research applications.

*************************************************

In answer to your question about the J15 versus the J10: the only difference that I could see was the higher output power that it can supply.
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