Sub bottoms out only with Blurays?

Have you calibrated the sub volume using a test tone and radio shack sound meter?

More significantly, did you run Audyssey and/or change the sub levels afterwards?

There are quite a few people on this forum (myself included) who really disliked what Audyssey did to the sound of their setups. Like you, I began to notice my sub bottoming out during movies where it didn't before, as well as a rolling off of the highs from my other speakers. I disabled Audyssey and level-matched the speakers and sub manually with an SPL meter and am much happier.

I'm using the Onkyo 805 and there's talk that the hockey-puck Audyssey mic included with the x05 models is creating measurement issues. I don't know if this same mic is included with the x06 models, but I'd be willing to bet your sound issues are related to Audyssey. Try running it a few more times to see if you get better results, or turn it off to see if you get any improvement.

Same here...I ended buying a bigger sub. Works great!

Ah. I do know that 2EQ does not provide any EQ for the subwoofer channel but, I guess, it does do level/distance settings. Might simply be an overload due to program content on the un-EQ-ed sub.

Your sub may not have the low-end extension that Audyssey wants to see, so it boosts those lowest frequencies in an attempt to achieve the "ideal" response. Your sub is then overloaded by high-wattage at frequencies where it has already fallen off, with bottoming out as the consequence.

Lee

Audyssey does not do this, in any implementation, and, specifically, 2EQ does not EQ the sub at all.

This was a major issue because of the puck mic. With the new modles (I just got the 876) it has the new mic design that definetly alleviates this issue. I'm not saying Audyssey is perfect but the new mic really does help. The sucky part is that the new mic will not wortk for the older modles =(

If it was the auto-setup in the receiver it would be doing that with DD as well, not just Blu-ray.

Do you watch both BDs and regular DVDs on the PS3? Do you have the volume adjustment in the PS3 turned to anything besides 0/neutral?

When you're watching something, press Triangle on the remote or controller. One of the options is volume. It should always be set to the 0/netural position.

I too am having some issues with my subwoofer bottoming out on a new setup where it previously hasn't. In my old setup I was using an ARCAM AVP700 processor and PS3 as my blu-ray player with an Aerial Acoustics SW12 subwoofer. My new setup is an Onkyo Pro 886P with a Samsung BD-P2500 connected via bitstream. Additionally I did a speaker setup using the Audyssey setup provided via the Onkyo. The sound quality prior to the Audyssey setup was just ok but improved significantly after the Audyssey setup. The only negative is that my subwoofer does seem to bottom out where I get a clip/crackle distortion on very heavy bass. Doesn't happen often.

My Audyssey setup was done with the subwoofer level setup a 0 (halfway point). The low pass was bypassed by setting it to it's highest level. Audyssey after it's setup had the level for the subwoofer at +1db. Any ideas on what tweaks I can make to the low end of the Audyssey setup without giving it all up or changes I can make to the subwoofer SW12 settings to prevent it from bottoming out?

Do these AVR have anything intelligent about them? What no independent way of adjusting each audio/video mode 1 2 3 4 and so on. Trimming levels for the different formats would be easier to prevent these issues.

I use DCX2496 so if and when I can be asked to buy bluray thingy it would be almost impossible to clip my sound system or bottom out my JBL 4645 now then.

Having actual measurements would be nice, to help see exactly whats going on and at what frequencies. I'm fairly certain that Kal is right, 2EQ does not apply bass equalization to the LFE channel. Assuming that the main speakers are set to small, and the processor is sending the LF's of the mains to the LFE channel as well, is it possible that some bass equalization is being applied and send to the sub? It was my understanding that was not the case, but if it is, that could be a big problem.

More likely, it is the fault of the way BR discs are being mixed. There is the potential for greater dynamic range in the new format, which could be one issue. More likely culprit in my opinion is that BR's are being engineered in a way that enhances the bass to make the new format's sound seem even better than it really is. By adding more information than was originally intended to be there, the average consumer/user will "think" it's superior. It could also be that most BR's are newer movies, and it does seem that more recent movies have more bass than older ones, more LF effects. I'm assuming you are comparing the same movie in standard DVD and BR when you mention this problem.

As an aside, while equalization in the bass can be a good thing, boost is not. It's very common for the room modes to cause very large peaks and nulls. If you apply boost to overcome that null (forgetting the fact that it's only going to be good at one location), you also massively increase the load on the sub. The amplifier needs to produce many times more power to achieve that, the woofer must move much more than it was before, and so, you reach the limits much faster. Most automated bass equalizers know this and apply little or no boost. Subtract all you want, from an amp and speaker standpoint, it's great, but boost is different.

Auto-setups are good, but most of the time they set speakers to Large even when they should be set to small (most speakers). So you have to go in and re-set to Small after it sets up the distance and levels.

Yep, the Audyssey auto-setup through the Onkyo pre-amp setup my LR front speakers to Large with side and rear surrounds set to small. I could try in both ways but wouldn't think this would have anything to do with the clipping of my subwoofer.

As far as nulls in the room for the subwoofer. Most of my microphone positions were close to my seating position and there are no nulls as far as I can tell from this position for the low frequencies.

woodmaster87,

You sound a little unsure that it doesn't do this with your stardard definition DVD player.

Recheck that because if it isn't, then your problem is likely in how your PS3 is setup.

Wouldn't the cure for a sub bottoming out, be get a sub that can handle the low frequency's being decoded from the blue ray disk or don't play Blue Ray movies. My 12" 180 watt 200 dollar sony sub won't go any lower than 40 Hz with out distorting so I have the same problem with Blue Ray movies when played at near reference (-10 to 0) on the volume. I never thought it was the fault of Audyssey, just the fact my sub is a pos.

This is exactly why I ordered a new sub.

I've been considering a new sub but it's not like I don't already have a good one. It's hard to believe for what I spent on my sub that it can't handle it. The one I've been eyeing if I replace is the JL Audio F113. It's got high marks but I've read a number of posts that would seem to imply my Aerial SW12 sub is in the same league. The JL sub has several differences one of the being a sealed sub versus my SW12 is ported. The JL also has it's version of Audyssey for setup via microphone.


JimP,
I never noticed my sub ever bottoming out on any standard def movies or blu-ray movies played via the PS3 through my old preamp. I haven't tried the PS3 with my new Onkyo, guess I could try and see what I get. The PS3 doesn't output bitstream so I'm not sure it's a good comparison since the PS3 would be doing the decoding versus the Onkyo with my Samsung doing TrueHD decoding.

Rereading all the post and responses, it comes back to the sub is probably set too high. If you haven't checked it with an SPL meter, then you need to.

Check out page 69 of the Onkyo owners manual where it explains "using the late night Function". This kind of sounds like what you may be experiencing. Dolby TrueHD is set one way and Dolby Digital is set another. See what they're set to and let us know.

Since I've declared this to be my mission in life until its resolved (quit laughing) which brand of DVD player are you using for your standard def DVDs and how do you have the audio hooked up.

Some early SW12's had a problem with the surround adhesive letting go of the woofer cone. That made crackling sounds with heavy bass. Aerial will replace the driver.

Kal is usually right. I actually think most newer BR HD codecs have LESS bass amplification than standard DolbyDigital. The newer codecs seem to be a more accurate and true representation of the original recording....not with enhanced sound effects like DD.

Like you said, I think the lower bass extension found in movies is more commonly found in the ones released in the last 5 years thanks to newer and better digital technology.


+1


I totally agree. I have an Onkyo 605 and I think Audyssey did a great job in calibrating my room. I think that your sub (OP) is the the one to blame with your bottoming out issue. If the sub driver can't physically reach a lower extension, the subwoofer should not allow it to. I don't think that Audyssey or the 605 is to blame.

So far my sub couldn't handle parts of iron man and transformers blu Ray