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Need advice: Samsung pn50a450 vs. Panasonic tc-p50x1

post #1 of 63
2/18/09 at 10:42pm
Thread Starter 
Need advice: Samsung pn50a450 vs. Panasonic tc-p50x1 (initially posted it as tc-p50x10)

Both are 720p plasmas, and while the Panny is the newer 09 model, all I see different (from the Sammy or the older Panny PX model) is the 600MHz processor. Spec-wise the newer Panny has a dynamic contrast of 2,000,000 vs. 1,000,000 for Sammy, but since they are different manufacturers it's kinda useless. Native contrast on paper is the same (30k).

I can get the Sammy for around $790 and the Panny for $850. Which should I get ? Cannot do side-by-side comparisons anywhere, and no review for the newer Panny are up yet...

Not that is matters too much but my upconverting DVD player is Sammy, which means the remotes would work better with the Sammy tv.
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post #2 of 63
2/19/09 at 7:54am
Well, I would take the '08 Panny over the pna450, so I would definitely take the '09 model over it as well.
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post #3 of 63
2/19/09 at 8:38am
Bought my daughter the 50" PX80 & the BIGGEST reason I went with the Panny over the Sammy A450 was that the Panny has much better parts & build quality to it than the Samsung's.

The parts from Korea are getting better & better but as far as I'm concerned the parts from Japan are still the ones to beat when it comes to electronics.
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post #4 of 63
2/19/09 at 9:00am
Neither has real contrast ratios anywhere near 30,000:1. The Panasonic will have much, much better blacks than the Samsung, but the color probably won't be as accurate.

I'd take the Panasonic.
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post #5 of 63
2/19/09 at 10:27am
Panasonic would be my choice in this case, simply because both TVs are entry level, however the Panasonic is newer technology. Panasonic also has a slightly better track record. I don't have any other information to base this choice on so it's just my opinion.
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post #6 of 63
2/19/09 at 12:42pm
Thread Starter 
I'm a little wary since nobody seems to have bought the newer X1 from Panny...
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post #7 of 63
2/19/09 at 1:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by otherda View Post

I'm a little wary since nobody seems to have bought the newer X1 from Panny...

Wait a week or two and user reviews will start to come in. D-Nice is buying one and I'm sure he'll give a very thorough review.
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post #8 of 63
2/19/09 at 1:34pm
I saw the X series today and the picture looked virtually identical to the 2008 model.
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post #9 of 63
2/19/09 at 1:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post

I saw the X series today and the picture looked virtually identical to the 2008 model.

I actually thought that the X series WAS supposed to be basically identical to the PX80 without any significant improvements, but it seems like over the past few days people have been saying that the blacks are better, motion resolution is better, etc.
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post #10 of 63
2/19/09 at 4:00pm
Thread Starter 
I think the biggest difference on the Panny X1 is the faster 600 MHz processor. Spec-wise the contrast is double (15k -> 30k) but the rest seems identical. Oh, I read the Prog Out is no longer available.
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post #11 of 63
2/19/09 at 4:06pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill1313 View Post

The parts from Korea are getting better & better but as far as I'm concerned the parts from Japan are still the ones to beat when it comes to electronics.

Maybe I'm unaware, but are these made in Japan and S.Korea, respectively ???! I thought nowadays everything's made in China...
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post #12 of 63
2/19/09 at 5:15pm
All are put together in Mexico with the parts coming from Japan & S. korea.
Don't know about the new 2009 models but I think the Panny's parts are still coming from Japan.
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post #13 of 63
2/19/09 at 6:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by otherda View Post

I think the biggest difference on the Panny X1 is the faster 600 MHz processor. Spec-wise the contrast is double (15k -> 30k) but the rest seems identical. Oh, I read the Prog Out is no longer available.

Doesn't mean anything. It's a bogus spec.
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post #14 of 63
2/19/09 at 6:22pm
I just ordered the Panny.

I can post some impressions.

Should be here Tuesday.
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post #15 of 63
2/19/09 at 6:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisherbert View Post

I actually thought that the X series WAS supposed to be basically identical to the PX80 without any significant improvements, but it seems like over the past few days people have been saying that the blacks are better, motion resolution is better, etc.

They're probably just excited, without proper measurement we won't know. ALL the 2008 models including the 720p sets measured between .009 and .015, with the 2009 NEO sets rumored at .006. That leaves very little room for improvement as you can see from the math.
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post #16 of 63
2/20/09 at 8:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post

They're probably just excited, without proper measurement we won't know. ALL the 2008 models including the 720p sets measured between .009 and .015, with the 2009 NEO sets rumored at .006. That leaves very little room for improvement as you can see from the math.

It may not look like too much on paper but that's actually a pretty major improvement in black level. Anyway, we'll find out when the reviews start coming.
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post #17 of 63
2/20/09 at 8:35am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post

30k->15k Doesn't mean anything. It's a bogus spec.

I'd think that since it's coming from the same manufacturer it means that the newer X1 model is better at contrast than the outgoing PX model. I agree you can't really compare if they are coming from different manufacturers (which why I posted the thread).
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post #18 of 63
2/20/09 at 8:35am
Quote:
Originally Posted by otherda View Post

I'd think that since it's coming from the same manufacturer it means that the newer X1 model is better at contrast than the outgoing PX model. I agree you can't really compare if they are coming from different manufacturers (which why I posted the thread).

They don't mean anything even within Panasonic models.
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post #19 of 63
2/20/09 at 12:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by otherda View Post

I'd think that since it's coming from the same manufacturer it means that the newer X1 model is better at contrast than the outgoing PX model. I agree you can't really compare if they are coming from different manufacturers (which why I posted the thread).

Nope, if the X series was really DOUBLE the contrast from the px series than the black level would be .004-.007 which it isn't. We also know the contrast was measured at only around 2000:1 when the specs said 15000:1. It's all bogus marketing man. It actually is a great set and I would choose it over the Samsung, but go by what your eyes see and not what the spec sheet says.
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post #20 of 63
2/20/09 at 12:55pm
Going from a ~ 0.012 fl 11G Panasonic to a solid 0.006 fl NeoPDP will be a VERY noticeable improvement in black levels. Moreover the extra brightness will help blacks look even deeper. The only question is whether the X1 models will measure 0.006 fl.
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post #21 of 63
2/20/09 at 1:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by H_Prestige View Post

The only question is whether the X1 models will measure 0.006 fl.

Not likely...
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post #22 of 63
2/20/09 at 3:41pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post

Nope, if the X series was really DOUBLE the contrast from the px series than the black level would be .004-.007 which it isn't. We also know the contrast was measured at only around 2000:1 when the specs said 15000:1. It's all bogus marketing man. It actually is a great set and I would choose it over the Samsung, but go by what your eyes see and not what the spec sheet says.

I agree with the numbers being bogus, but I think there should a relative relationship when they come from the same manufacturer. It should mean the contrast on the new model is much better than on the old one. Since there are no recognized measuring standards the numbers are meaningless, but on the overall they should have a relative meaning.

I agree the best is to go with what your eyes tell you. I wish I could go by what I see. Can't find a store to have both on display. And actually, even I would find one, given that I cannot control the settings on both makes it really hard to compare (one of them in torch mode would make a significant difference with the other in normal). Stores don't even seem to know if their signal is 1080p or 720p...

That's why I trust people's feedback on forums more than even what stores have displayed. It looks like Panny has an slight edge over Sammy here on AVS, that could be the difference I was looking for (and which is news to me). Now all I need is some reviews of the X1, since newer doesn't necessarily mean better then the outgoing model.
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post #23 of 63
2/20/09 at 3:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by otherda View Post

I agree with the numbers being bogus, but I think there should a relative relationship when they come from the same manufacturer. It should mean the contrast on the new model is much better than on the old one. Since there are no recognized measuring standards the numbers are meaningless, but on the overall they should have a relative meaning.

Unfortunately, they do not even have a relative meaning. Panasonic will claim that more expensive sets have higher contrast ratios than less expensive sets even when they use the same panel and therefore have the same contrast ratio (pz80 vs pz85, for example).
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post #24 of 63
2/24/09 at 2:24pm
Thread Starter 
Waiting for a review on the tc-p50x1... somebody post one yet !
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post #25 of 63
2/24/09 at 10:29pm
The Specifications pages in the owner's manuals list, under "Maximum Power Consumption," 497 watts for the PX80 and 399 watts for the P50X1.

That's quite a difference -- something's going on (or off).
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post #26 of 63
2/25/09 at 11:04am
I don't see a point in a standalone review of X1 (because it will look like exactly like a last year's review of PX80, I even see phrases like "X1 black levels are great but not on the same level as NeoPDP" - last year it was "PX80 black levels are great but not on the same level as PZ80"), or its comparison to s1, 5020, or whatever, we need a straightforward comparison of X1 to px80 (or 720p Samsungs) with measurements of black levels, contrast and so on, nothing more nothing less, and I suspect we'll never see such a thing.

People who want to buy X1 know that they want to buy a 720p set, they already made such a decision and all that they care of is how that set looks in comparison to other 720p sets, and not in comparison with 1080p sets or coffee machines. Why all the magazines fail to understand this is a mystery to me.
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post #27 of 63
2/25/09 at 12:02pm
It would not surprise me to see that the X1 black level is very much equal to neoPDP. We need to see actual measurements in a controlled environment to be sure, as unfortunately you cannot determine this in a store which is where most people are making their conclusions. No one has seen the NeoPDP in their home yet so any comparisons with NeoPDP is purely guessing at this point.

Did anyone actually compare the PX and PZ series at their home in a darkened room? You cannot determine black levels in the store under bright lights
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post #28 of 63
2/25/09 at 12:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoodlum View Post

It would not surprise me to see that the X1 black level is very much equal to neoPDP.

.006 for the X1? I'll bet you my life that is not the case.
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post #29 of 63
2/25/09 at 1:19pm
is there any point in paying the 350 bucks sears service plan? is there a manufacturers warrenty for the p50x1?
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post #30 of 63
2/25/09 at 1:35pm
I'd never buy a warranty that was 1/3 the price of the tv. If it breaks in 3 years I'll just buy a new one. You get 1 year, 2 if you use Amex.
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