AVS › AVS Forum › Home Entertainment & Theater Builder › Dedicated Theater Design & Construction › Yes Dear, I'm down here working on your craft room!!
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Yes Dear, I'm down here working on your craft room!! - Page 19

post #541 of 698
7/29/11 at 3:44am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moggie View Post


... or if you are like me, sit there thinking

Mostly I just sit there....

Brad.. Thanks for the link.. What ever happened to "Point and Click"?
Reply
Reply

AVS Top Picks

post #542 of 698
7/31/11 at 6:59pm
A bit late in the build, but sub!
Reply
Reply
post #543 of 698
8/5/11 at 2:34am
Very awesome work! Really appreciate all the time you put into sharing it with others.
Reply
Reply
post #544 of 698
8/5/11 at 4:08am
Quote:
Originally Posted by KNKKNK View Post

On a side note... if anybody has any pointers for taking decent pictures in a dark room I'd like to hear em.. I see alot of great looking screen shots and other pics that I am not able to get close to. Wifes got a decent Sony camera so Im pretty sure I'm just missing some basics on which setting to use..

Brad

Hi Brad - What type of digital camera do you have? I can certainly help you getting your exposure settings correct but I will say that you will need two things regardless of what type of camera you have. First a decent tripod and second, a remote control or trigger to actually take the picture so you actually don't have to touch the camera and push the button. Most of the better digital cameras will come with a tiny remote control when new. If you are like me you immediately exclaimed "What the Hell will I EVER need this for?" only to spend an entire Saturday afternoon on an electronic archaeology dig to locate it. And of course the battery will be dead, necessitating an immediate trip to Wal-Mart for a replacement. (LOL!)

Let me know your camera model number and I'll get back to you. Thanks and keep up the GREAT work!
Reply
Reply
post #545 of 698
8/5/11 at 5:16am
TM, I'll be following your input here too! I'm using a D60 and have a remote. Awaiting the next step.
Reply
Reply
post #546 of 698
8/5/11 at 6:41am
Thread Starter 
Thanks for the offer TMcG.. I'm trying to work with the Sony Cyber-shot DSC-H2, I have a tripod but no remote/trigger.

I did a couple of searches today, unfortunately what I remembered as an above average camera @6.2 mega pixels when I purchased it 5 years ago, is fairly lack luster by todays standards and can now be had for ~ 150

still not as bad as the .35 megapixel Fuji DS-7 I purchased for ~ 900 in 96

That'll teach me to buy a camera before the room is finished..

Seriously though, any tips/pointers would be appreciated... If this camera wont cut the mustard, is there another you would recommend.

Brad
Reply
Reply
post #547 of 698
8/5/11 at 12:14pm
First of all, you have a very nice point and shoot camera for its time, but there is one inherent problem that will limit your picture-taking ability with this unit - and that is you cannot switch lenses. The fastest your lens will go is f2.8. An f1.8 lens doesn't sound like much, but it will make a big, big difference in low-light photography. For your next camera I would recommend a digital SLR with minimum 8 Megapixel and an ideal of 12+ Megapixel. The digital SLR should also have much higher ISO settings available for you - 1600+ a the minimum.

Now, to take the best picture with what you've got without overcomplicating the matter with complicated photography techno-jargon:
1. Use your tripod
2. Put your camera in manual mode
3. Shoot in RAW, if possible (greater data resolution for digital editing)
4. Turn the flash off
5. Use your highest ISO setting (1000 on your camera)
6. Decrease your lens aperture to the lowest setting and go up from there (f-stop). Start at f2.8 and go upward with the same settings until you see what you like and get a feel for the differences in the settings. You may have to use an aperture priority mode, fyi.
7. Turn on image stabilization since you do not have a shutter control cable or remote control
8. Practice, practice, practice.
9. Use image processing software to soften / eliminate grain from the image due to the higher ISO setting. In general, the higher the ISO the more grain. I say "in general" because there are some digital cameras that produce almost no grain even at ISO3200 settings!

One word of advice, if you are trying to get a screen shot while having some low lights on in the theater - don't. One trick all the pros use is to set up their camera, adjust the settings for the lights to be on and take a picture. Then the lights are turned out 100% and another photo is taken of the picture on the screen. Try to touch the camera as little as possible so to not adjust your physical settings. These two images are then composited together in photoshop or another software program to get the brilliant image in a well-lit theater.

I hope these tricks help. Let me know if you have any other questions, but I cannot stress enough how important it is to practice with the different manual features of your camera. Not only will you start taking better pictures of your home theater, but family vacation photos will begin to dazzle!!!

Best of luck!
Reply
Reply
post #548 of 698
8/5/11 at 1:01pm
You don't need a shutter control cable or a remote if you have a built-in delay. I'm not sure if your camera has it, but almost every one does now. Turn on the delay, click the picture to lock in the zoom, etc, wait a few seconds and it will snap the picture. I'm sure we've all done this routine trying to run around and jump onto the couch without knocking over the Christmas tree to get that perfect family photo.
Reply
Reply
post #549 of 698
8/5/11 at 1:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMcG View Post

First of all, you have a very nice point and shoot camera for its time, but there is one inherent problem that will limit your picture-taking ability with this unit - and that is you cannot switch lenses. The fastest your lens will go is f2.8. An f1.8 lens doesn't sound like much, but it will make a big, big difference in low-light photography. For your next camera I would recommend a digital SLR with minimum 8 Megapixel and an ideal of 12+ Megapixel. The digital SLR should also have much higher ISO settings available for you - 1600+ a the minimum.

Now, to take the best picture with what you've got without overcomplicating the matter with complicated photography techno-jargon:
1. Use your tripod
2. Put your camera in manual mode
3. Shoot in RAW, if possible (greater data resolution for digital editing)
4. Turn the flash off
5. Use your highest ISO setting (1000 on your camera)
6. Decrease your lens aperture to the lowest setting and go up from there (f-stop). Start at f2.8 and go upward with the same settings until you see what you like and get a feel for the differences in the settings. You may have to use an aperture priority mode, fyi.
7. Turn on image stabilization since you do not have a shutter control cable or remote control
8. Practice, practice, practice.
9. Use image processing software to soften / eliminate grain from the image due to the higher ISO setting. In general, the higher the ISO the more grain. I say "in general" because there are some digital cameras that produce almost no grain even at ISO3200 settings!

One word of advice, if you are trying to get a screen shot while having some low lights on in the theater - don't. One trick all the pros use is to set up their camera, adjust the settings for the lights to be on and take a picture. Then the lights are turned out 100% and another photo is taken of the picture on the screen. Try to touch the camera as little as possible so to not adjust your physical settings. These two images are then composited together in photoshop or another software program to get the brilliant image in a well-lit theater.

I hope these tricks help. Let me know if you have any other questions, but I cannot stress enough how important it is to practice with the different manual features of your camera. Not only will you start taking better pictures of your home theater, but family vacation photos will begin to dazzle!!!

Best of luck!

Wow TMcG - thanks a ton for that very informative post! I'm a complete camera novice but that gives a great and easy starting point.
Reply
Reply
post #550 of 698
8/5/11 at 1:16pm
@tmhouse: Good point! I always forget about that stupid (and yet conveniently brilliant) setting!
Reply
Reply
post #551 of 698
8/5/11 at 2:52pm
I have to disagree on one point: I would recommend using the camera's LOWEST ISO setting, not the highest - that way you have no grain to deal with.

And ditto to the use of the delayed shutter setting (the one cameras provide so you can push the button, and then run over to get in the picture before it snaps).
Reply
Reply
post #552 of 698
8/5/11 at 4:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Horstkotte View Post

I have to disagree on one point: I would recommend using the camera's LOWEST ISO setting, not the highest - that way you have no grain to deal with.

And ditto to the use of the delayed shutter setting (the one cameras provide so you can push the button, and then run over to get in the picture before it snaps).

The amount of grain you get by boosting the ISO setting is directly related to the quality of camera you have. I personally never go higher than 800 for extremely low light on my point-and-shoot digital for this reason. On my digital SLR (Canon 7D), I could really see no appreciable difference between ISO settings until I go beyond 2400. Shooting in the RAW format will also allow for greater manipulation by the software to eliminate any potential graining should any occur. Plus, let's face it, once a high-resolution raw file is converted to a jpg for publication or posting on the web, any lack of resolution will all but disappear since the actual image is being greatly condensed.
Reply
Reply
post #553 of 698
8/6/11 at 12:08am
You should just take a few pics at different ISO settings. Different cameras handle it to different degrees, but for the end user it's no more complicated than changing 1 setting and taking an additional photo. Find the amount of grain balanced with clarity that you like best.
Reply
Reply
post #554 of 698
8/6/11 at 4:12am
Thread Starter 
Thanks everyone for the tips.

TMcG your post is greatly appreciated, I think many others will find it very informative also.

I studied the camera more and found most of the settings you detailed.


Quote:
Originally Posted by TMcG View Post


3. Shoot in RAW, if possible (greater data resolution for digital editing)

I'm not sure what is meant by "Shoot in the raw"


Quote:
Originally Posted by TMcG View Post


One word of advice, if you are trying to get a screen shot while having some low lights on in the theater - don't. One trick all the pros use is to set up their camera, adjust the settings for the lights to be on and take a picture. Then the lights are turned out 100% and another photo is taken of the picture on the screen. Try to touch the camera as little as possible so to not adjust your physical settings. These two images are then composited together in photoshop or another software program to get the brilliant image in a well-lit theater.

Thanks for the tips particullarly on the screen shots.. I kinda figured some of the images I see of the theaters (particullarly on EH) were composites becasue of the way the stair ceilings etc were showing up in fully lit rooms.

I'll practice with this camera to get a better feel for how the manual settings impact the picture (and with the shutter timer).. we'll see if there is an improvement in my next update.

It sounds like the wife will be getting a new SLR for christmas, she'll really like it!!, probably more than the bosch table saw I was planning on giving her...

Brad
Reply
Reply
post #555 of 698
8/6/11 at 6:58am
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMcG View Post

First of all, you have a very nice point and shoot camera for its time, but there is one inherent problem that will limit your picture-taking ability with this unit - and that is you cannot switch lenses. The fastest your lens will go is f2.8. An f1.8 lens doesn't sound like much, but it will make a big, big difference in low-light photography. For your next camera I would recommend a digital SLR with minimum 8 Megapixel and an ideal of 12+ Megapixel. The digital SLR should also have much higher ISO settings available for you - 1600+ a the minimum.

Now, to take the best picture with what you've got without overcomplicating the matter with complicated photography techno-jargon:
1. Use your tripod
2. Put your camera in manual mode
3. Shoot in RAW, if possible (greater data resolution for digital editing)
4. Turn the flash off
5. Use your highest ISO setting (1000 on your camera)
6. Decrease your lens aperture to the lowest setting and go up from there (f-stop). Start at f2.8 and go upward with the same settings until you see what you like and get a feel for the differences in the settings. You may have to use an aperture priority mode, fyi.
7. Turn on image stabilization since you do not have a shutter control cable or remote control
8. Practice, practice, practice.
9. Use image processing software to soften / eliminate grain from the image due to the higher ISO setting. In general, the higher the ISO the more grain. I say "in general" because there are some digital cameras that produce almost no grain even at ISO3200 settings!

If you're on a tripod, then you want image stabilization OFF. It's not going anywhere so there's nothing to stabilize. Also, some implementations of IS will freak out when on a tripod trying to find something to stabilize, it's not pretty I don't recommend it.

A fast aperture doesn't matter if you're on a tripod. If it takes 2 minutes to gather the light for the shot with the depth of field you need, so be it. Also, lenses are generally sharpest a few stops up from wide open. If you're got a f/1.8 lens (in particular that Canon 50mm) then things are pretty blurry until you're past f/2.8 anyway. Besides for proper DoF on a room shot in a fairly normal-sized house you probably want to be at f/8, or possibly higher.

50mm on a crop body is somewhat of a telephoto anyway. On an SLR you're not going to have a terribly wide lens at f/1.8 without dropping major cash. Odds are the kit zoom is gonna be the widest thing you've got, and there's no way it's going anywhere near f/1.8.
Reply
Reply
post #556 of 698
8/6/11 at 7:13am
Quote:
Originally Posted by KNKKNK View Post

It sounds like the wife will be getting a new SLR for christmas, she'll really like it!!, probably more than the bosch table saw I was planning on giving her...

Brad

Before you give her a Bosch 4100-09, be sure to check out the Ridgid R4510. I was initially looking at the 4100 until I saw the R4510 and Bosch immediately got dropped from my list. The Ridgid looks comparable or better in all aspects and is $100 cheaper. It definitely has a better fence, though I'm not much for the tape measure rail markings. The Ridgid also has a lifetime warranty.

Don't forget, Home Depot will take competitors coupons, specifically a 20% Harbor Freight coupon. You'll have a very tough time applying it to anything you have to order, but the cashiers will apply competitors coupons without dismay about "holding the line".

I actually wound up with the R4512 which is a completely different creature, but managed to get it for $375+tax with a HF Fourth of July 25% coupon. It's the same thing as the Craftsman 21833 + some bonuses. You're not going to find a better saw for your wife for under $900. Even then said option has all the same core anyway.

Biggest hassle with the R4512 is finding a HD with one in stock. Few HDs actually carry the thing as your average HD shopper isn't looking at anything on that end of the range.
Reply
Reply
post #557 of 698
8/6/11 at 8:27am
I just bought a Canon s95 which is one of the best pocketable cameras out right now. It does well in low light with a f2 lens. It gets great reviews and you will take more pictures out of your house because it is easy to take with you...otherwise a dslr is the next step up.
Reply
Reply
post #558 of 698
8/6/11 at 8:49am
@ the geek - I totally agree that the image stabilization should be off IF he uses the timed delay and no remote trigger. Suggesting to keep the stabilization on was only to counteract the physical movement of the camera if he was actually going to push the button on the camera to take the picture (another reason for a faster aperture setting).

My suggestions were only to give a starting point to take a decent low-light level picture vs. using the fully automatic settings of a point-and-shoot. Essentially a few first baby steps into using manual controls on a mid-range point-and-shoot which are probably being used for the first time. Entire books are written on the careful interplay between aperture and ISO which take years to truly master with the right equipment.

@ KNKKNK - Here is a link I found on the web with a nice description of the RAW image format: http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/a...y_use_raw.html

Good luck and let's all see some posts as you experiment with your ISO and aperture settings!
Reply
Reply
post #559 of 698
8/13/11 at 9:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by KNKKNK View Post

~ 18 months in..

Front wall treatment - All surfaces behind screen wall covered with 2 layers of 1" Insulshield with 3 mil poly in between.

Shot of the poly covering the first layer.. (sorry for the blurry pic, its hard to take pictures of black with the exposure time and I couldnt find the tripod)



Found the tripod ...



Brad

Hi Brad. I'm going to be using the same approach behind my screen wall, as well as behind framed stretch fabric panels between columns on my left/right/rear walls (will be using Linacoustic instead of InsulShield due to availability/cost). I have a few questions on the details if you can remember:
  • What length button cap nails did you use, and were they different for the first and second layers?
  • It looks like you may have tacked the first layer of InsulShield and the poly down with a minimum number of nails and then secured all through the second layer of InsulShield, is that correct?
  • What nail pattern/spacing did you use?

Thanks,
DD
Reply
Reply
post #560 of 698
8/16/11 at 5:31am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeaconDan View Post

  • What length button cap nails did you use, and were they different for the first and second layers?
  • It looks like you may have tacked the first layer of InsulShield and the poly down with a minimum number of nails and then secured all through the second layer of InsulShield, is that correct?
  • What nail pattern/spacing did you use?

Thanks,
DD

Hi Dan, apologies for the delayed response, Just returned from a week in Disneyworld (Walked ~3000 miles, need a vacation now).

I used the plastic cap roofing nails, the local menards had 2" ones in stock so I used these for both layers, they cause the second layer to "pucker" a little around the cap heads. (they make a 2 1/2" also. but these were not stocked)

I did tack the first layer with a minimun number just to hold it up. I also spotted the first layer and the poly with spray adhesive as I went, this worked well to help hold it up (particullarly the poly) until I put the second layer on.

The spacing is ~ 2 1/2' sq with a cap head in the middle, (like a 5 on a die face) . I held back about 8" or so from the edge of each strip to reduce the "pucker"

Lastly I added a black furring strip around the edge, I think this probably would have been enough to hold everything in place with just a couple of the cap heads and the spray adhesive. If you were closer Id give you the cap heads, I have ~ 1900 left out of the box of 2000 ...

Just an FYI.. The corner traps are frames with 2-1" layers with poly between also, and some fluffy fiberglass stuffed behind.

_________________________________________

On another note.. I no longer need to worry about the previous camera. It was mistakenly left in the seat pocket on the Disney safari ride. I picked up a new cyber shot to capture the rest of the trip. This one is far better than the previous one, with 14.1 mp, and it has a cool panoramic feature that automatically stitches the pictures together as you pan.



I'll still be in the market for a good SLR when I get the chance.

TheGeek.. Thanks for the suggestion on the Rigid, I never thought about HD accepting HF coupons.. I found the 20% off coupon online and Ill see if any of the local HD's have one of the saws in stock.

Brad
Reply
Reply
post #561 of 698
8/16/11 at 6:46am
^^walked 3000 miles and how long did you stand in line for...3000 hours....!
Reply
Reply
post #562 of 698
8/16/11 at 7:23pm
Thanks a lot for the detailed breakdown Brad. Wow, you got the bucket pack! I think I can get 2 1/2 button caps locally. What you put together is too neat to cover up with a screen

Re Disney, we took our 3 1/2 year old daughter on her first trip in mid May. It was a blast! The crowd was small and the temp was mostly in the 80's. My biggest surprises were how much she liked the character autographs and her demanding to ride the Tower of Terror (and liking it).

DD
Reply
Reply
post #563 of 698
8/17/11 at 4:35am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tbraden32 View Post

^^walked 3000 miles and how long did you stand in line for...3000 hours....!

With the exception of the water parks, the most we waited in one line was probably 15 min, we used the fast passes and traded waiting for walking from one side of the park to the other.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeaconDan View Post

Re Disney, we took our 3 1/2 year old daughter on her first trip in mid May. It was a blast! The crowd was small and the temp was mostly in the 80's. My biggest surprises were how much she liked the character autographs and her demanding to ride the Tower of Terror (and liking it).

DD

Disneyworld is truly a magical place, and the level of customer service from the staff is world class.

Hats off to ya for doing Disney with a toddler, those can be tough times on occasion. I'm glad my boys are teen/pre-teen now, the only downside is thier refusal to order from the Kids menu still, but another year or two and they can push me around the parks in a stroller!

P.S.The picture they snapped of me on the T of T this year was far from flattering.. ..
Reply
Reply
post #564 of 698
8/18/11 at 6:13am
"Demanding to ride the Tower of Terror (and liking it)"

This brought back a funny memory for me. Many years ago we took our youngest son to "WallyWorld (he is now 16). The tower of terror lived up to it's name. Weeks later after returning home - he was explaining his ride on the ToT with his grandmother. She asked if he was ever scared?

His response:
"I wasn't scared - but I wanted to scream"

Now back to our regularly scheduled discussions ....
Reply
Reply
post #565 of 698
8/21/11 at 1:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by KNKKNK View Post

I used the plastic cap roofing nails, the local menards had 2" ones in stock so I used these for both layers, they cause the second layer to "pucker" a little around the cap heads. (they make a 2 1/2" also. but these were not stocked)

I did tack the first layer with a minimun number just to hold it up. I also spotted the first layer and the poly with spray adhesive as I went, this worked well to help hold it up (particullarly the poly) until I put the second layer on.

The spacing is ~ 2 1/2' sq with a cap head in the middle, (like a 5 on a die face) . I held back about 8" or so from the edge of each strip to reduce the "pucker"

Lastly I added a black furring strip around the edge, I think this probably would have been enough to hold everything in place with just a couple of the cap heads and the spray adhesive. If you were closer Id give you the cap heads, I have ~ 1900 left out of the box of 2000 ...

Brad

Brad, one additional question -- did you cut out Insulshield where your speaker shelves contact the wall, or put on top and compress?

On the button caps, 1 3/4" is the longest that is stocked in my area. So I've resorted to buying 2 1/2" ring shank nails and 1 3/4" button caps, pulling the caps off the 1 3/4", and putting them on the 2 1/2" nails. Don't have time to order to stay on track with trades that are already scheduled.

Thanks,
DD
Reply
Reply
post #566 of 698
8/22/11 at 3:56am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeaconDan View Post

Brad, one additional question -- did you cut out Insulshield where your speaker shelves contact the wall, or put on top and compress?

DD

I cut out for the speaker shelves and mounted directly to the wall.

Brad
Reply
Reply
post #567 of 698
9/22/11 at 12:43am
any updates?
Reply
Reply
post #568 of 698
9/22/11 at 10:29am
Thread Starter 
Thanks for checkin Chase.. I finished building the last panel for the rear wall last night. Now I need to put the finish on all of the rear panels and mount them. Then on to the bottom of the soffits....which shouldn't take too long. So hopefully more pics in a week or so.

Pondering carpet and chairs.. it time to order but I'm waffling on design choices. Looked at all the manufacturers and sat in all the chairs at Cedia.. leaning towards fortress or elite.

For carpet.. I found one I like doing a google image search.. but it was a random picture in a blog that didn't have any reference to a manufacturer and I've not been able to locate it anywhere


Anyone see a carpet like this anywhere?


Brad
Reply
Reply
post #569 of 698
9/24/11 at 6:01pm
i spent a 1/2 hour bouncing around the net. no luck. BUT ! i would save image an send request to so called HT pro stores or go around town an see. I like that design. good luck,
Reply
Reply
post #570 of 698
9/24/11 at 10:24pm
Interesting carpet pattern. Have you considered going with more of a monochrome base carpet then laying a large (maybe 8'X10' or larger) Persian rug over top in front of the screen? The beautiful patterns available in a separate rug may tie in with the wonderful ornate finishing you have in store. REALLY looking forward to how this all comes together. Any chance you could step up the progress a little?
Reply
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home

AVS Top Picks

AVS › AVS Forum › Home Entertainment & Theater Builder › Dedicated Theater Design & Construction › Yes Dear, I'm down here working on your craft room!!